Review Good bad ugly vs Collingwood - Rd 12, 2021

[displacedaussie]

I see that as dropping the ball. He tried to push off tackler and got tackled and dropped the ball while being tackled (was a weird tackle)

Ah, so the ball got dislodged during that weird tackle?

These are the 2021 laws of the game:

18.6.3 Free Kicks - Holding the Ball:
Incorrect Disposal Where a Player in Possession of the Football has not had Prior Opportunity, a field Umpire shall award a Free Kick if that Player elects to Incorrectly Dispose of the football when Legally Tackled.

For the avoidance of doubt, a Player does not elect to Incorrectly Dispose of the football when:
(a) the Player genuinely attempts to Correctly Dispose of the football;
(b) the Legal Tackle causes the football to be dislodged from the Player’s possession.

The only way this is holding the ball is if the umpire decides that push constitutes prior opportunity, which is bullshit as it's the same motion that causes the ball to be dislodged.

 

[Murray2503]

I still laugh at the Club saying Dusty didn't suit our culture .....when he was clearly available to us

Dusty doesn't suit our culture. He's a winner.

 

[skittlebrew]

I still laugh at the Club saying Dusty didn't suit our culture .....when he was clearly available to us

Was he ever clearly available to us?

We probably just trotted out the 'didn't suit our culture' line after he rejected our offer. Rather than admitting we couldn't get the deal done.

 

[BlackGun1]

I see everyone on here has turned on Keays already. Its hard when you basically have clones of each other style wise (Keays and Laird) getting the bulk of the ball with very little class/elite ball use around them outside of Seedsman. Keays is a distributor, he will be much better when he can play his natural game of unlocking others. Watched him closely on the weekend and his first instinct seems to be to look for the runner and 9/10 times it wasn't on.

Agreed he needs to find a right foot though. Will go a long way in getting him to an even better level. But dont knock the guy, 10th in the league in disposals at the moment, you cant teach that ability to find the footy.

 

[Vader]

Ah, so the ball got dislodged during that weird tackle?

These are the 2021 laws of the game:



The only way this is holding the ball is if the umpire decides that push constitutes prior opportunity, which is bullshit as it's the same motion that causes the ball to be dislodged.

Attempting to fend off a tackler counts as prior opportunity.

 

[jackster83]

Attempting to fend off a tackler counts as prior opportunity.

Unless you are a VFL lovechild.

 

[FR0GGY]

Attempting to fend off a tackler counts as prior opportunity.

That’s a dumb rule, would the AFL rather he get tackled and hold it in?
I can understand the successful fend off and then be tackled as holding the ball, but the ball spilled out in the fend/tackle that occurred immediately after he picked up the ball.

 

[MRB37]

Was he ever clearly available to us?

We probably just trotted out the 'didn't suit our culture' line after he rejected our offer. Rather than admitting we couldn't get the deal done.

We supposedly threw $11 million over 7 years at him and his manager admitted that he'd make still make more money staying in Melbourne on a lesser salary.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I see everyone on here has turned on Keays already. Its hard when you basically have clones of each other style wise (Keays and Laird) getting the bulk of the ball with very little class/elite ball use around them outside of Seedsman. Keays is a distributor, he will be much better when he can play his natural game of unlocking others. Watched him closely on the weekend and his first instinct seems to be to look for the runner and 9/10 times it wasn't on.

Agreed he needs to find a right foot though. Will go a long way in getting him to an even better level. But dont knock the guy, 10th in the league in disposals at the moment, you cant teach that ability to find the footy.

No-One should be having a go at Keayes ......been a fantastic player for us this year, gives 100% every week

He's entitled to be tired after all his gut busting efforts ....the Bye will freshen him up

 

[Mutineer]

I see everyone on here has turned on Keays already. Its hard when you basically have clones of each other style wise (Keays and Laird) getting the bulk of the ball with very little class/elite ball use around them outside of Seedsman. Keays is a distributor, he will be much better when he can play his natural game of unlocking others. Watched him closely on the weekend and his first instinct seems to be to look for the runner and 9/10 times it wasn't on.

Agreed he needs to find a right foot though. Will go a long way in getting him to an even better level. But dont knock the guy, 10th in the league in disposals at the moment, you cant teach that ability to find the footy.

Normal Adelaide board reaction, look for the negatives and forget about all the numerous positives Ben has brought to the team both off and on the field. We are much better off from his recruiting, end of story.

 

[Betts are off]

I see everyone on here has turned on Keays already. Its hard when you basically have clones of each other style wise (Keays and Laird) getting the bulk of the ball with very little class/elite ball use around them outside of Seedsman. Keays is a distributor, he will be much better when he can play his natural game of unlocking others. Watched him closely on the weekend and his first instinct seems to be to look for the runner and 9/10 times it wasn't on.

Agreed he needs to find a right foot though. Will go a long way in getting him to an even better level. But dont knock the guy, 10th in the league in disposals at the moment, you cant teach that ability to find the footy.

I think you'll find if you go through all the post game threads 95% of the Keays comments are very positive this year. He would clearly be top 3 in our B&F count at the midpoint of the season, probably even leading it.

No-one has any illusions that he will ever rival Darren Jarman for skills, but we all also understand that he's never once left anything on the park. At the end of the day he's so far from our biggest problem that he doesn't even need defending. His play has done that for him already in spades

 

[SugarShane]

i seem to remember the same

our offer was bigger than richmonds
but their list manager or head of football or something, said hell receive a sh*t tonne more outside the salary cap in Melbourne than he would in Adelaide

I think our offer was after 2017, when he was already established. Not back when he was being "shopped around".

But yes. In a very obvious admission to what we are up against, his manager said he convinced Dusty to stay by telling him about all the money he could make outside of football at Richmond.

 

[displacedaussie]

That’s a dumb rule, would the AFL rather he get tackled and hold it in?
I can understand the successful fend off and then be tackled as holding the ball, but the ball spilled out in the fend/tackle that occurred immediately after he picked up the ball.

This is my frustration with the rule. If the tackle had been better and wrapped Keays up properly, then it's not holding the ball if the ball spills out (maybe. probably.)

It's only paid here because it was a bad tackle.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Didn't it recently come out that you made him a massive offer but he decided to stay?

Yep, Ricciuto from memory was the one who mentioned it

Pretty good choice on Dusty's part

 

[subaru]

Bit of a concern that a 20 minute barrage in Q1 and then a 5 minute flourish in Q3 was enough to sink us though. They flicked a switch twice and made hay, meanwhile we dominated 75% of the match and couldn't convert. They kicked 4 goals outside of Q1 and their Q3 red time fiesta.

When we leak we leak bad, and yet it's such a struggle to convert our dominance. Hopefully they look into ways to stem those flows instead of just giving it the "kick straight and we win" treatment.

How many pies goals were Coast to Coast ?
I haven’t watched the replay yet but I recall they got over our defence pretty easily

 

[Interloperer]

Can anyone explain how this was "holding the ball"?



I know the AFL has the following interpretations:

* If a player drops the ball while being tackled / about to be tackled, play-on
* If the ball gets knocked out in an exaggerated fashion during a tackle, holding-the-ball

But there was no real tackle here and the ball was just fumbled.

Tries the fend-off, fails, prior opportunity, ball is dropped, holding the ball

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Tries the fend-off, fails, prior opportunity, ball is dropped, holding the ball

No tackle laid

Play on

 

[Interloperer]

No tackle laid

Play on

Has Keays by the front of his jumper the whole time.

 

[1970crow]

Can anyone explain how this was "holding the ball"?



I know the AFL has the following interpretations:

* If a player drops the ball while being tackled / about to be tackled, play-on
* If the ball gets knocked out in an exaggerated fashion during a tackle, holding-the-ball

But there was no real tackle here and the ball was just fumbled.

I'd say that the umpire considered he was being tackled and getting his arms free counted as prior opportunity so he then has a duty to dispose properly. HTB is a total s**t show these days.

 

[Golumless]

I see everyone on here has turned on Keays already. Its hard when you basically have clones of each other style wise (Keays and Laird) getting the bulk of the ball with very little class/elite ball use around them outside of Seedsman. Keays is a distributor, he will be much better when he can play his natural game of unlocking others. Watched him closely on the weekend and his first instinct seems to be to look for the runner and 9/10 times it wasn't on.

Agreed he needs to find a right foot though. Will go a long way in getting him to an even better level. But dont knock the guy, 10th in the league in disposals at the moment, you cant teach that ability to find the footy.

The kicking is rough, but he's done well.

Hopefully he finds a bit of composure, but he looks like he'll be here for a long time yet.

 

[1970crow]

Ah, so the ball got dislodged during that weird tackle?

These are the 2021 laws of the game:



The only way this is holding the ball is if the umpire decides that push constitutes prior opportunity, which is bullshit as it's the same motion that causes the ball to be dislodged.

you need the interpretation as to when it is deemed the tackle caused the ball to dislodge. As an example, would getting a finger on the back of a guernsey in a chase be considered the tackle causing the ball to dislodge? I don't th8nk it's meant to be interpreted that a tackle is always the cause.

 

[1970crow]

Normal Adelaide board reaction, look for the negatives and forget about all the numerous positives Ben has brought to the team both off and on the field. We are much better off from his recruiting, end of story.

The problem is that he's part of a midfield of 3 that struggles to provide quality delivery forward. Him and Laird are both going as well as could be hoped, but they're cogs in a failed wheel.

 

[1970crow]

No tackle laid

Play on

do you need to be getting tackled to be pinged for incorrect disposal?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

do you need to be getting tackled to be pinged for incorrect disposal?

Not throws but yes for holding the ball

 

[SugarShane]

That’s a dumb rule, would the AFL rather he get tackled and hold it in?

Yes. As long as he then commences the ridiculous pantomime of flopping around like a carp on the riverbank to appropriately simulate "genuine attempt" to the umpire's satisfaction.