Young Talent

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Thought these might be better in here.

SM said:
I mean, sure, but there's dozens of 'bright prospects'. It seemed as if you were naming 3 of the best.
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Foden is clear number 1 for me (of the English talents). Not sure who would follow.

jod23 said:
You not counting Mbappe as a youngster anymore?
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Nah he is 22, turning 23 this year.

If I was he's obviously at the top.
 

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United are starting to accumulate a few promising youngsters having invested a fair bit over the last two seasons in the academy. Greenwood the standout but Mejbri and Shoretire will join him in the first team squad this season. Mejbri recently made his senior international debut, albeit for Tunisia. The club have high hopes for James Garner who was excellent on loan at Forest and will probably get a loan to a lower level Prem team.

Amad should get more of a run this season too. Very lightweight but has all the tricks and dominates in training apparently.
 
Bojan KantKick said:
United are starting to accumulate a few promising youngsters having invested a fair bit over the last two seasons in the academy. Greenwood the standout but Mejbri and Shoretire will join him in the first team squad this season. Mejbri recently made his senior international debut, albeit for Tunisia. The club have high hopes for James Garner who was excellent on loan at Forest and will probably get a loan to a lower level Prem team.

Amad should get more of a run this season too. Very lightweight but has all the tricks and dominates in training apparently.
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Do you think it's realistic that any really break through and play PL games this season? Obviously Greenwood has broken through, I mean the others.

We are not going too well for youngsters. Jones has broken through and will play a lot for us this coming season, I'm hoping we dont loan out Harvey Elliott to see what he can do. He was fantastic on loan last season but I guess we will know in the next month or so whether he is part of the first team plans for Klopp. The only other youngster who has big wraps on him is 17 year old Mateusz Musialowski who tore up our U18's this past season. I'd expect him to bump up to our U23's this season to see how he gets on.
 

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jod23 said:
Do you think it's realistic that any really break through and play PL games this season? Obviously Greenwood has broken through, I mean the others.

We are not going too well for youngsters. Jones has broken through and will play a lot for us this coming season, I'm hoping we dont loan out Harvey Elliott to see what he can do. He was fantastic on loan last season but I guess we will know in the next month or so whether he is part of the first team plans for Klopp. The only other youngster who has big wraps on him is 17 year old Mateusz Musialowski who tore up our U18's this past season. I'd expect him to bump up to our U23's this season to see how he gets on.
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I'd expect Mejbri and Shoretire to play cup games this season and get some league games but mostly from the bench. If Amad doesn't get a decent run then questions will be asked as to why we signed him in the first place. He is a right winger and can rotate with Sancho. Ideally Greenwood plays more centrally this season as he is a centre forward.

We have a couple of 17 year old strikers who have been banging goals in Joe Hugill (looks like Peter Crouch) and Charlie McNeill. After thinking that James Wilson and Will Keane would be excellent prem strikers I'll reserve judgement on them!
 
Bojan KantKick said:
I'd expect Mejbri and Shoretire to play cup games this season and get some league games but mostly from the bench. If Amad doesn't get a decent run then questions will be asked as to why we signed him in the first place. He is a right winger and can rotate with Sancho. Ideally Greenwood plays more centrally this season as he is a centre forward.

We have a couple of 17 year old strikers who have been banging goals in Joe Hugill (looks like Peter Crouch) and Charlie McNeill. After thinking that James Wilson and Will Keane would be excellent prem strikers I'll reserve judgement on them!
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Surely you loan out Amad right? You already have Rashford, Cavani, Martial, Greenwood and now Sancho in attacking positions. The opportunities surely wont be there for him you would think.

I dont know anything about Hugill and McNeill but I swear it has to be something to do with defenders at a young age. I feel like defenders take a lot longer to develop and learn to play the game at an elite level so defending in youth setup, particularly as a unit just give up goals. It's easier for a good young forward to prey on these opportunities and get big numbers. That's my take on it as you see so many young gun forward banging them in at junior level then when they make the step up and they have to beat blokes like Dias or VVD or Silva etc they are left wanting.

Not saying that will happen with the two young blokes you mentioned but it's happened at Liverpool countless times. Young kids knocking them in for fun then they make the step up and are just nowhere near good enough to play for our first team.
 
jod23 said:
I dont know anything about Hugill and McNeill but I swear it has to be something to do with defenders at a young age. I feel like defenders take a lot longer to develop and learn to play the game at an elite level so defending in youth setup, particularly as a unit just give up goals. It's easier for a good young forward to prey on these opportunities and get big numbers. That's my take on it as you see so many young gun forward banging them in at junior level then when they make the step up and they have to beat blokes like Dias or VVD or Silva etc they are left wanting.

Not saying that will happen with the two young blokes you mentioned but it's happened at Liverpool countless times. Young kids knocking them in for fun then they make the step up and are just nowhere near good enough to play for our first team.
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Thats why it is so important to get them loans where they play regularly nice and early.

We've seen it with Kane. Bang them in at youth level but it was his often barren loan spells that have made him work to improve. Similar thing happened with Troy Parrott with us this year. Better than a goal a game 1.5 years prior to this season, many of us wanted to see him get mins up front when we had literally no fit STs but it wasn't to be. Was sent out to Millwall and Ipswich last season 20+ games for 2 goals. He'll come back a better player for it than smashing youth sides all year again.
 
jd2010 said:
Thats why it is so important to get them loans where they play regularly nice and early.

We've seen it with Kane. Bang them in at youth level but it was his often barren loan spells that have made him work to improve. Similar thing happened with Troy Parrott with us this year. Better than a goal a game 1.5 years prior to this season, many of us wanted to see him get mins up front when we had literally no fit STs but it wasn't to be. Was sent out to Millwall and Ipswich last season 20+ games for 2 goals. He'll come back a better player for it than smashing youth sides all year again.
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Yeah absolutely. The loan system is great in that regard, not only for improving young players but also finding out if they are good enough. It can be a tough science too as correct me if I'm wrong but Kane's loans didnt go so well but then he became one of the best strikers in the world.
 
jod23 said:
Yeah absolutely. The loan system is great in that regard, not only for improving young players but also finding out if they are good enough. It can be a tough science too as correct me if I'm wrong but Kane's loans didnt go so well but then he became one of the best strikers in the world.
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They were hit and miss. Won player of the year at Leyton Orient and did well at Millwall. But struggled at Norwich and Leicester.

Think sometimes clubs want them to have a tough struggle experience in there to learn from. You can see the similarities in location between the 2 that worked and where Spurs are based, but sending a kid out away from home at 17-19 can be a great learning experience even if the goals don't flow.

Ryan Mason had a similar experience at Lorient in France. Played about 8 times over 6 months but reckons he got more out of that than any other 6 month block in his development.
 
jd2010 said:
They were hit and miss. Won player of the year at Leyton Orient and did well at Millwall. But struggled at Norwich and Leicester.

Think sometimes clubs want them to have a tough struggle experience in there to learn from. You can see the similarities in location between the 2 that worked and where Spurs are based, but sending a kid out away from home at 17-19 can be a great learning experience even if the goals don't flow.

Ryan Mason had a similar experience at Lorient in France. Played about 8 times over 6 months but reckons he got more out of that than any other 6 month block in his development.
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Can go both way too, depends a lot on the kids mentality. A bad loan spell can devour young kids and their confidence and set them back whereas other players take a bad loan spell as a learning curve etc.

I dont know, it's a lost science. Brewster had big wraps, had a great loan spell at Swansea then was sold for big money and couldnt score in a brothel for Sheffield United.

Must be so hard to figure out who is gonna make it and who isnt.
 
jod23 said:
Surely you loan out Amad right? You already have Rashford, Cavani, Martial, Greenwood and now Sancho in attacking positions. The opportunities surely wont be there for him you would think.

I dont know anything about Hugill and McNeill but I swear it has to be something to do with defenders at a young age. I feel like defenders take a lot longer to develop and learn to play the game at an elite level so defending in youth setup, particularly as a unit just give up goals. It's easier for a good young forward to prey on these opportunities and get big numbers. That's my take on it as you see so many young gun forward banging them in at junior level then when they make the step up and they have to beat blokes like Dias or VVD or Silva etc they are left wanting.

Not saying that will happen with the two young blokes you mentioned but it's happened at Liverpool countless times. Young kids knocking them in for fun then they make the step up and are just nowhere near good enough to play for our first team.
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Not sure on Amad. In theory we have 6 players now to play in the front 3 positions. Rashford and Martial on the LW, Cavani and Greenwood through the middle, and Sancho, Amad on the right. With the top 4 playing 50-60 games per season there should be an opportunity for everyone and City have shown that you need 2 very good players in every position so would be happy to keep Amad as long as Ole gives him decent minutes.

Good call on defenders, keepers are pretty average at the lower levels too. Charlie McNeil scored 4 in a game against City last season and only one of them would have been a goal at the senior level imo.

Kids also need an extended run in the first team. Martial gets injured in the warm up against Midgetland and LVG has to play 17 year old Marcus Rashford. He scores 2 tap ins on debut, scores 2 the next game against Arsenal and scores against City. If Martial hadn't been injured, he probably finds himself on loan in the championship or stays in the u18's due to his age. If he hadn't had that opportunity his career could be very different. If you guys had a gun RB then TAA would still be good but not as advanced as he is now and may not even be at Liverpool.

I remember Neil Mellor making his debut for Liverpool. He had huge wraps on him at the time.
 
Bojan KantKick said:
Not sure on Amad. In theory we have 6 players now to play in the front 3 positions. Rashford and Martial on the LW, Cavani and Greenwood through the middle, and Sancho, Amad on the right. With the top 4 playing 50-60 games per season there should be an opportunity for everyone and City have shown that you need 2 very good players in every position so would be happy to keep Amad as long as Ole gives him decent minutes.

Good call on defenders, keepers are pretty average at the lower levels too. Charlie McNeil scored 4 in a game against City last season and only one of them would have been a goal at the senior level imo.

Kids also need an extended run in the first team. Martial gets injured in the warm up against Midgetland and LVG has to play 17 year old Marcus Rashford. He scores 2 tap ins on debut, scores 2 the next game against Arsenal and scores against City. If Martial hadn't been injured, he probably finds himself on loan in the championship or stays in the u18's due to his age. If he hadn't had that opportunity his career could be very different. If you guys had a gun RB then TAA would still be good but not as advanced as he is now and may not even be at Liverpool.

I remember Neil Mellor making his debut for Liverpool. He had huge wraps on him at the time.
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That's an impressive 6 attacking players, well 5 at least, Amad is just a youngster. That's where we fall off. Mane, Salah, Bobby and Jota, then it's a cliff for players who can be effective in a front three. Sure we have players who can play there like Minamino, Shaq, Ox, Origi but none have particularly excelled. I dont know how City does it having so many great players and keeping them all happy with playing time.

Midgetland 😂

Thank god we didnt have a gun RB but I feel TAA is such a special player he would have pushed his way in regardless to be honest. Do you remember Neil Mellor's cracking last minute winner against Arsenal. Amazing goal. He was another one of a long line of young forwards who just bang them in at junior level and then dont work out at senior level.
 
Bradesmaen said:
From an Everton perspective I'm excited about Thierry Small. He's already wanted by big clubs, made his debut and is scoring goals as a left back. I just hope that he doesn't get his head turned like all our other excellent juniors and head off to the "big clubs".
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probably best for him to stay at a Small club then 😉
 
jod23 said:
Can go both way too, depends a lot on the kids mentality. A bad loan spell can devour young kids and their confidence and set them back whereas other players take a bad loan spell as a learning curve etc.

I dont know, it's a lost science. Brewster had big wraps, had a great loan spell at Swansea then was sold for big money and couldnt score in a brothel for Sheffield United.

Must be so hard to figure out who is gonna make it and who isnt.
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Brewster and your guys sold to Bournemouth are perfect examples of what should be struggling but learning experiences on loan.

Idiotic purchases by both clubs with their top flight status so risky.

20 PL appearances on loan without a goal is something Brewster can grow from. Being a bust 20m signing is putting his career on the line far too soon imo
 
jd2010 said:
Brewster and your guys sold to Bournemouth are perfect examples of what should be struggling but learning experiences on loan.

Idiotic purchases by both clubs with their top flight status so risky.

20 PL appearances on loan without a goal is something Brewster can grow from. Being a bust 20m signing is putting his career on the line far too soon imo
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Yeah for sure but we aint knocking back all that money for kids who arent gonna make it.
 
jod23 said:
Yeah for sure but we aint knocking back all that money for kids who arent gonna make it.
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Yeah becomes a tough one for the academy/club.

The people around the academy would say it's bad for Brewster's career and development. But the club would say its 20m take it.

Brewster's own people should be advising him against the move
 
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