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Team Mgmt. Talk about the makeup of our list - midfield balance, height profile, endurance runners

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Wouldn't mind Gunston for a throwaway pick if he got his body right to allow more Jakey midfield time
 
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Jobe Watson said:
Anyone who thinks we don't need to find another AFL standard key forward is dead set kidding themselves.
Click to expand...
I don't think anyone believes we don't need to find one. The question is whether we find that player on our list, or look for another.
We have key forwards who have barely played yet. And I don't think anyone expected Jones to have the season he's had, 12 months ago.
I'd be giving them more time personally.
 

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Towno78 said:
I don't think anyone believes we don't need to find one. The question is whether we find that player on our list, or look for another.
We have key forwards who have barely played yet. And I don't think anyone expected Jones to have the season he's had, 12 months ago.
I'd be giving them more time personally.
Click to expand...


110% this.

It's also a matter of what we should spend given the spread of issues with the list. The recent analysis seems to have just forgotten we're missing Harry Jones who we haven't replaced in the side with a marking forward. Bryan's going to take over the role as second ruck at some stage in the next 18 months too.

What is the list of "gettable" players who can play as key forwards and who match our recruiting profile? Ben King, Weideman, Chol, CCJ and Riccardi?

Can we really justify a price that starts with 2 first round picks on King assuming he is even gettable? With non-existent midfield depth, 2 running half backs and 1 small/mid forward who can cover the ground required of the role? We have 8 to 10 list spots to turn over.

As for the rest some of those players there are some potentially useful options there but they're not necessarily automatic best 22. None of them is the sort of contested marking beast we need. Stewart is closer to being that guy and the probability of turning someone like Ballenden or Lewis Young into a long term KPD is higher due to the relative ease with which tall athletic guys can become defenders (which is not to say I think Stewart is not a medium term option as a KPD).

I can understand why it's almost certainly being explored but I reckon it's 12 months early to use use up 2 first round picks on anyone. Things will take shape next year, particularly with another good crop of kids (and an astute free agent or 2). It also coincides with King coming out of contract.

All of this really boils down to whether you wait and risk King re-signing or throw the kitchen sink at him now.
 
Would have done this last night but ran out of time writing the preview:

2 years: Jayden Laverde
1 year: Tom Cutler, Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips, Cian McBride, Sam Durham?, Tom Hird

Delist: Martin Gleeson, Irving Mosquito, Lachlan Johnson, Dylan Clarke
Retire: David Zaharakis, Cale Hooker, Patrick Ambrose

Trades:

1. Matt Guelfi for future 3rd round pick (Freo/West Coast)
2. Pick 52 for Lewis Young and pick 73
3. Future 3rd for Charlie Constable
4. Aaron Francis for pick 21

Draft:

Pick 8: Josh Goater (190 cm/79 kg utility)
Pick 21: Darcy Wilmott (182 cm/70 kg small defender)
Pick 46: Dylan Thomas (187 cm/77 kg outside midfielder)
Pick 73: Nyawi Moore (183 cm/77 kg small forward)
Pick 84: Tex Wanganeen (175 cm/72 kg small forward)

RD 8: Inside midfielder of some kind

Which leaves us with a list of:

Defenders:

Key defenders: Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Zachary Reid, Josh Eyre (fwd), Cody Brand, Lewis Young (fwd)
Medium defenders: Tom Cutler (mid), Jordan Ridley, Jayden Laverde, Dyson Heppell (mid)
Small defenders: Nick Hind, Mason Redman, Darcy Wilmott

Midfielders:

Inside midfielders: Andrew McGrath (def), Darcy Parish (fwd), Jye Caldwell (fwd), Dylan Shiel, Josh Goater (def), Charlie Constable, RD8
Outside midfielders: Kyle Langford (fwd), Zachary Merrett, Nik Cox (fwd), Brayden Ham (fwd), Sam Durham (def), Dylan Thomas (fwd)
Rucks: Sam Draper, Nick Bryan, Andrew Phillips

Forwards:

Key forwards: James Stewart (def), Michael Hurley (def), Peter Wright (ruc), Harrison Jones, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride (def)
Medium forwards: Archie Perkins (mid), Jake Stringer (mid), Jake Waterman (mid)
Small forwards: Devon Smith (mid), Ned Cahill (mid), Will Snelling (mid), Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti, Tom Hird (def), Nyawi Moore, Tex Wanganeen

Seniors:

FB: Jayden Laverde - Lewis Young - Dyson Heppell
HB: Jordan Ridley - Zachary Reid - Mason Redman
MF: Kyle Langford - Dylan Shiel - Zachary Merrett
HF: Will Snelling - Harrison Jones - Jake Stringer
FF: Archie Perkins - Peter Wright - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti
OB: Sam Draper - Andrew McGrath - Darcy Parish
IC: Jye Caldwell - Charlie Constable - Nik Cox - Mason Redman
IS: Sam Durham

Reserves:

FB: Tom Cutler - Brandon Zerk-Thatcher - Josh Eyre
HB: Josh Goater - Cody Brand - Darcy Wilmott
MF: Dylan Thomas - Ned Cahill - Brayden Ham
HF: Michael Hurley - James Stewart - Tom Hird
FF: Nyawi Moore - Cian McBride - Kaine Baldwin
OB: Andrew Phillips - RD8 - Devon Smith
IC: Tex Wanganeen - Nick Bryan

The last few spots are tight there. Stewart absolutely the next in for any injury
 
Towno78 said:
I don't think anyone believes we don't need to find one. The question is whether we find that player on our list, or look for another.
We have key forwards who have barely played yet. And I don't think anyone expected Jones to have the season he's had, 12 months ago.
I'd be giving them more time personally.
Click to expand...
Pretty much. We aren't challenging for a few years yet so we can afford to give guys like McBride and Baldwin a chance to develop into something.

Peter Wright turns 25 in a few days and has been relatively injury free for most of his career. He's no superstar but he's a 30 goal a year forward, which is perfectly acceptable level for a team in our position
Jones, touch wood, looks like he could be a 40+ goal a year forward once he gets meat on his bones.

For now that's enough.
 
BrunoV said:
110% this.

It's also a matter of what we should spend given the spread of issues with the list. The recent analysis seems to have just forgotten we're missing Harry Jones who we haven't replaced in the side with a marking forward. Bryan's going to take over the role as second ruck at some stage in the next 18 months too.

What is the list of "gettable" players who can play as key forwards and who match our recruiting profile? Ben King, Weideman, Chol, CCJ and Riccardi?

Can we really justify a price that starts with 2 first round picks on King assuming he is even gettable? With non-existent midfield depth, 2 running half backs and 1 small/mid forward who can cover the ground required of the role? We have 8 to 10 list spots to turn over.

As for the rest some of those players there are some potentially useful options there but they're not necessarily automatic best 22. None of them is the sort of contested marking beast we need. Stewart is closer to being that guy and the probability of turning someone like Ballenden or Lewis Young into a long term KPD is higher due to the relative ease with which tall athletic guys can become defenders (which is not to say I think Stewart is not a medium term option as a KPD).

I can understand why it's almost certainly being explored but I reckon it's 12 months early to use use up 2 first round picks on anyone. Things will take shape next year, particularly with another good crop of kids (and an astute free agent or 2). It also coincides with King coming out of contract.

All of this really boils down to whether you wait and risk King re-signing or throw the kitchen sink at him now.
Click to expand...
Targeting a King, JUH, etc wouldn't be the approach i'd take. Though it is a traditional Essendon approach. Wouldn't surprise me if we approached Daniher again in a couple of years.....Or even Lobb.

Lower the eyes a little and look for a Bruce/Brown type signing & focus on building the side they can slide into.
As you mention, we need some midfield depth, we need some depth in the run from the flanks & we ideally need a FB to take the role from Stewart.

Outside Weideman & Ladhams, i'm not sure who else fits the profile.
It could be we spend another year nursing a rotation of Hooker & Hurley through whilst developing Baldwin & Eyre
Does McCartin get a look in?
Sadly we won't see what a three prong tall setup of Jones + Wright + Bryan could do this year, but it's something we could/should have explored.
 

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eth-dog said:
Would have done this last night but ran out of time writing the preview:

2 years: Jayden Laverde
1 year: Tom Cutler, Ned Cahill, Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Andrew Phillips, Cian McBride, Sam Durham?, Tom Hird

Delist: Martin Gleeson, Irving Mosquito, Lachlan Johnson, Dylan Clarke
Retire: David Zaharakis, Cale Hooker, Patrick Ambrose

Trades:

1. Matt Guelfi for future 3rd round pick (Freo/West Coast)
2. Pick 52 for Lewis Young and pick 73
3. Future 3rd for Charlie Constable
4. Aaron Francis for pick 21

Draft:

Pick 8: Josh Goater (190 cm/79 kg utility)
Pick 21: Darcy Wilmott (182 cm/70 kg small defender)
Pick 46: Dylan Thomas (187 cm/77 kg outside midfielder)
Pick 73: Nyawi Moore (183 cm/77 kg small forward)
Pick 84: Tex Wanganeen (175 cm/72 kg small forward)

RD 8: Inside midfielder of some kind

Which leaves us with a list of:

Defenders:

Key defenders: Brandon Zerk-Thatcher, Zachary Reid, Josh Eyre (fwd), Cody Brand, Lewis Young (fwd)
Medium defenders: Tom Cutler (mid), Jordan Ridley, Jayden Laverde, Dyson Heppell (mid)
Small defenders: Nick Hind, Mason Redman, Darcy Wilmott

Midfielders:

Inside midfielders: Andrew McGrath (def), Darcy Parish (fwd), Jye Caldwell (fwd), Dylan Shiel, Josh Goater (def), Charlie Constable, RD8
Outside midfielders: Kyle Langford (fwd), Zachary Merrett, Nik Cox (fwd), Brayden Ham (fwd), Sam Durham (def), Dylan Thomas (fwd)
Rucks: Sam Draper, Nick Bryan, Andrew Phillips

Forwards:

Key forwards: James Stewart (def), Michael Hurley (def), Peter Wright (ruc), Harrison Jones, Kaine Baldwin, Cian McBride (def)
Medium forwards: Archie Perkins (mid), Jake Stringer (mid), Jake Waterman (mid)
Small forwards: Devon Smith (mid), Ned Cahill (mid), Will Snelling (mid), Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti, Tom Hird (def), Nyawi Moore, Tex Wanganeen

Seniors:

FB: Jayden Laverde - Lewis Young - Dyson Heppell
HB: Jordan Ridley - Zachary Reid - Mason Redman
MF: Kyle Langford - Dylan Shiel - Zachary Merrett
HF: Will Snelling - Harrison Jones - Jake Stringer
FF: Archie Perkins - Peter Wright - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti
OB: Sam Draper - Andrew McGrath - Darcy Parish
IC: Jye Caldwell - Charlie Constable - Nik Cox - Mason Redman
IS: Sam Durham

Reserves:

FB: Tom Cutler - Brandon Zerk-Thatcher - Josh Eyre
HB: Josh Goater - Cody Brand - Darcy Wilmott
MF: Dylan Thomas - Ned Cahill - Brayden Ham
HF: Michael Hurley - James Stewart - Tom Hird
FF: Nyawi Moore - Cian McBride - Kaine Baldwin
OB: Andrew Phillips - RD8 - Devon Smith
IC: Tex Wanganeen - Nick Bryan

The last few spots are tight there. Stewart absolutely the next in for any injury
Click to expand...
I like it, although I think the Francis deal isn't too likely.

I'd seriously consider trading our first to a Brisbane/Richmond type who can stump up two late first round picks. It looks like this is a pretty talented draft.
 
Schnitzengruben said:
I like it, although I think the Francis deal isn't too likely.

I'd seriously consider trading our first to a Brisbane/Richmond type who can stump up two late first round picks. It looks like this is a pretty talented draft.
Click to expand...
I think we won't get it from Richmond. We may finish ahead of them still. And my preference is to stay high to make sure we get either Goater or Johnson than risk getting neither.
 
Towno78 said:
I don't think anyone believes we don't need to find one. The question is whether we find that player on our list, or look for another.
We have key forwards who have barely played yet. And I don't think anyone expected Jones to have the season he's had, 12 months ago.
I'd be giving them more time personally.
Click to expand...
I don't know if we can afford to just sit around and rely on Baldwin, McBride or Eyre coming good. They all have a lot of work to do to get to the level. Any of them turning into best 22 players should be viewed as a pleasant bonus I think. We don't need to sell the farm for anyone just yet but I do think finding another AFL-ready tall forward should be a top priority. We aren't as shit as we all thought and may only need another two drafts and some added depth before we're a finals team again, and our key forward stocks are definitely a weakness.
 
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Jobe Watson said:
Anyone who thinks we don't need to find another AFL standard key forward is dead set kidding themselves.
Click to expand...

Don’t worry, some are happy with the speculative 4 kids that with us..




I’m not one and completely agree


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
For me of the players on our list that our out of contract I'd delist/retire 5 ASAP;- Cahill, Zakka, Mozzie, Johnson & Ambrose

Gleeson & Cutler I'd keep - they've shown enough to prove they can be handy depth

Zerk is handy KPD depth so he stays, as is Hooker who is handy KPF depth, and even though he cant run & has his critics hes still kicked 33 goals this year so he's worth keeping - just put him on the rookie list along with Hird also

Guelfi and Francis (though contracted in 2022) may go - I'd try keep both or at least one, both have currency though so if we lose either (or both) we should get something in return

Phillips is a must keep, and I'd be keen to keep the rookies Clarke, McBride, Durham & Baldwin for 1 more year
 
Vass38 said:
For me of the players on our list that our out of contract I'd delist/retire 5 ASAP;- Cahill, Zakka, Mozzie, Johnson & Ambrose

Gleeson & Cutler I'd keep - they've shown enough to prove they can be handy depth

Zerk is handy KPD depth so he stays, as is Hooker who is handy KPF depth, and even though he cant run & has his critics hes still kicked 33 goals this year so he's worth keeping - just put him on the rookie list along with Hird also

Guelfi and Francis (though contracted in 2022) may go - I'd try keep both or at least one, both have currency though so if we lose either (or both) we should get something in return

Phillips is a must keep, and I'd be keen to keep the rookies Clarke, McBride, Durham & Baldwin for 1 more year
Click to expand...

why is phillips a must keep? Bryan filled in a few times this year and there is likely more ruck options in the offseason.
 
Yoda_ said:
Don’t worry, some are happy with the speculative 4 kids that with us..




I’m not one and completely agree


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

We need to look at what is there but in saying that we do not need to fall into the trap of getting in front of ourselves and thinking a new KPF will lift us by a lot.
We actually have to find some forward craft and learn to defend as a team before anything else. Lets face it we kicked 100 points last weekend and did not have a dominant KPF.
Need one yes but not as urgent or as quickly as some seem to think.
Jones will kick 50 goals if we give him a leading lane to work in.
 
Yoda_ said:
Don’t worry, some are happy with the speculative 4 kids that with us..




I’m not one and completely agree


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
No one is "happy" with 4 speculative kids. But many don't want to throw so many darts at finding a kpf, that we run out of darts for the numerous other glaring holes on our list.
 
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