Autopsy Round 21 = Hawthorn 97-78 Collingwood

[Scritchyscroony]

Still don't know why we got rid of Ceglar

From what I've heard he was an early casualty of the Buckley-Pert culture war. Might've liked a night out now and then or something. It's either that or we just had NFI when it came to identifying player potential.

 

[JLC]

Elliott was 1 versus two or 3 all day. The big banana we get is going to have to be better than any other big banana running around for any team at the moment.

the support cast is decent - today we were very predictable and out of ideas for the most part.

once we eventually recruit a proper tall forwards,I still want our ruckman to also push forward. Really stretch the opposition defence. Ginnivan, McCreery and hopefully Dib would make a good small fleet.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Outcoached
Outplayed
Ceglar is a damm good ruckman. Handed it to Grundy today.

Ceglar is terrible.

 

[anshell]

Elliott was 1 versus two or 3 all day. The big banana we get is going to have to be better than any other big banana running around for any team at the moment.

I agree.Hopefully the next coach,whoever that is,will value key forwards more than Buckley and Hine have for the past ten years or so.Not having a key forward has really cruelled the development of this side in recent years.

 

[sr36]

the support cast is decent - today we were very predictable and out of ideas for the most part.

once we eventually recruit a proper tall forwards,I still want our ruckman to also push forward. Really stretch the opposition defence. Ginnivan, McCreery and hopefully Dib would make a good small fleet.

Sounds good. But I think being outnumbered is more about running patterns and game style than individual players.

 

[JLC]

Sounds good. But I think being outnumbered is more about running patterns and game style than individual players.

being out numbered is because we are so damn predictable And slow with the ball movement. You pretty much can predict where the long kick is going lol

 

[Maggie5]

Anyone who thinks Buckley would have made a difference today has clearly wiped the last 10 years from their mind.

Clarkson owned Buckley and leads the head to head 10-2.

What is MM's record against the Hawks?

 

[Sticky Daics Pudding]

so how would he have shown interest in the job?

I haven't thought that far ahead. Interpretative dance?

 

[Everybody Panic]

I'm not one of the Grundy Haters but Ceglar was clearly the better ruckman today imv. Grundy gives his all has has great stats but this often doesn't translate to any significant advantage to our side. There's an ongoing Grundy issue that needs working out... it wont just go away.

In what way? Pies were completely dominant around stoppages based of his tap work. The problem was that our mids were kicking shit and the forwards had a mare. He got directly involved in scoring chains. Covered defensively and took marks. He also tackled really hard, all the while getting very little help.

It's not Grundy's fault that Sidebottom, Adams and Degoey didn't take advantage of the centre clearances. Also not his fault our team structure did nothing to stop their uncontested marks and our mids bombed straight to their talks inside 50.

 

[Mukesh]

Depressing outing... the boys didn't seem to turn up to work at all in the first half. Crispy had a very, very rare off day, especially early. If nothing else, today just underlines why we desperately need a(nother) key forward... Ginnivan is gonna piss off opposition fans big time, it will be fun to watch...

 

[gouki88]

In what way? Pies were completely dominant around stoppages based of his tap work. The problem was that our mids were kicking sh*t and the forwards had a mare. He got directly involved in scoring chains. Covered defensively and took marks. He also tackled really hard, all the while getting very little help.

It's not Grundy's fault that Sidebottom, Adams and Degoey didn't take advantage of the centre clearances. Also not his fault our team structure did nothing to stop their uncontested marks and our mids bombed straight to their talks inside 50.

People are clutching at absolutely anything to blame Grundy for. It's genuinely quite absurd. He was far from perfect, particularly in the first half, but somehow all our flaws are his fault

 

[stormskye]

Just read hawks average 88 marks a game, they had 87 at halftime. We caught the eagles witches hat virus

 

[TradeDraft]

Just read hawks average 88 marks a game, they had 87 at halftime. We caught the eagles witches hat virus

We had Big Heads going into the Game

 

[Scritchyscroony]

In what way? Pies were completely dominant around stoppages based of his tap work. The problem was that our mids were kicking sh*t and the forwards had a mare. He got directly involved in scoring chains. Covered defensively and took marks. He also tackled really hard, all the while getting very little help.

It's not Grundy's fault that Sidebottom, Adams and Degoey didn't take advantage of the centre clearances. Also not his fault our team structure did nothing to stop their uncontested marks and our mids bombed straight to their talks inside 50.

Pies were completely dominant around stoppages based on Grundy's tap work you say?
In what way? a non-statistical magic way?

Tot Clearances: Haw 39 Coll 33
Ctr clearances: Haw 12 Coll 15
stoppage clearance: Haw 27 Coll 18

 

[Jen2310]

They suffocated us basically.
Couldn't get our hands on the ball in that first half. Didn't help when we did get it, we kicked to 1 v 3/4 contests amongst players and our skill execution was horrible.
2nd half was better. But coming from 7 goals down was always gonna be some miracle.

Ginni our best goal scorer.
But loved getting more experience in Macrae.

I thought our defence struggled more than I had seen in a while. But overall, did as well as to be expected. They were always under a lot of pressure.

Our first few goals came from 2020 draftees: Ginni, Ollie and Macrae.
Good look to the future.

 

[domus]

On a number of occasions we’ve gotten belted to sh*te this season only to come back when our opponent flicks off the switch - Eagles in Perth, Geelong, St Kilda and now Hawthorn today are four examples where the margin seriously flattered us. Unfortunately we’re not as close as the margins often suggest.

Why don't these teams flick off the switch against other teams? There have been a number of monumental flogging this year. Gold Coast lost by 98 points last week and they are considered an up and coming team. Please explain.

 

[Robroy22]

If Clarko and his pre planning wasn't worth 5+ goals out there today I'll go heeeee.
We were out-coached from the beginning and were never in it.
By the end we'd worked out how to get it deep enough into our forward line to score....but the horse had bolted! They tagged JDG (Shields), Mitchell killed Tay and they double teamed Grundy and our forwards. They scored on our errors.
Those sorts of coaching structures (tagging our dangerous ball winners, clogging defences and run from behind to score) kill us everytime and Clarko has been orchestrating that stuff against us for years.
Our players were out played....but our coaches had their pants pulled down.

 

[barrackers]

Ginnivan is gonna piss off opposition fans big time, it will be fun to watch...

On today's showing I'd add opposition players to that.

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

If Clarko and his pre planning wasn't worth 5+ goals out there today I'll go heeeee.
We were out-coached from the beginning and were never in it.
By the end we'd worked out how to get it deep enough into our forward line to score....but the horse had bolted! They tagged JDG (Shields), Mitchell killed Tay and they double teamed Grundy and our forwards. They scored on our errors.
Those sorts of coaching structures (tagging our dangerous ball winners, clogging defences and run from behind to score) kill us everytime and Clarko has been orchestrating that stuff against us for years.
Our players were out played....but our coaches had their pants pulled down.

Agree. I don't think today was an effort-based issue.

Hawthorn just came prepared and shut us down through the corridor, and we were clueless to counter that.

 

[Maggie5]

9 wins, 11 losses.

Against Clarkson, it was 6 wins, 6 losses.

Just checked AFL Tables and it shows against Clarkson H 15 us 7
From 2005 to now.

 

[TradeDraft]

Agree. I don't think today was an effort-based issue.

Hawthorn just came prepared and shut us down through the corridor, and we were clueless to counter that.

They studied us and knew we just look to go thru the Corridor and they stopped us.

We almost had to go back to Bucks game plan by Going Wide and Backwards

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

You sure it was 6 and 6, heard otherwise.

I've botched the count.

Malthouse's overall record against Hawthorn as Collingwood coach (2000-2011) was 9 wins, 10 losses.

His record against Clarkson as Collingwood coach was 6 wins, 5 losses.

1. Round 10 2005 = Collingwood by 28
2. Round 2 2006 = Collingwood by 35
3. Round 17 2006 = Collingwood by 45
4. Round 13 2007 = Hawthorn by 8
5. Round 7 2008 = Hawthorn by 65
6. Round 18 2008 = Hawthorn by 54
7. Round 16 2009 = Hawthorn by 45
8. Round 4 2010 = Collingwood by 64
9. Round 22 2010 = Hawthorn by 3
10. Round 15 2011 = Collingwood by 41
11. Prelim Final 2011 = Collingwood by 3

 

[Robroy22]

Agree. I don't think today was an effort-based issue.

Hawthorn just came prepared and shut us down through the corridor, and we were clueless to counter that.

Exactly....and the more we gave up goals, the more confidence sagged and we went sideways and backwards again.

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

How many of today’s 22 played against Hawthorn 6 years ago?

6 players.

1. Taylor Adams
2. Jack Crisp
3. Jordan De Goey
4. Jamie Elliott
5. Brayden Maynard (debut game was against Hawthorn 6 years ago)
6. Steele Sidebottom

 

[Copeland]

They all need a Massive Kick up the ass after that Disgraceful Effort.

Hardly Trying and Skills are not even up to Auskick Level

Hope Madgen and Thomas never play for Collingwood AFL team again

I do no longer Care IF we Finish last or not.

Players seem not to Care

Madgen was far from the worst, what about Quaynor? While we need some height in the back, he must stay.