Past #37: Kyron Hayden - delisted end '22 - 12 NM games/ 0 NM goals - thanks Ronny

[Jasemon]

Reminds me of the fawning over Declan "Dec" Mountford.

Still maintain that under a coach that was capable of developing players and was willing to play youth over favourites, regardless of form that would only keep us mid table at best, that someone like Mountford could have been a real player.

 

[hellas_johnny]

we have boner atu and young all fighting for that position add him in the mix and thats 4 very medicore options. Need something else id especially prefer walker being given a go in the backline. Finds the ball well and can kick also. Haydens awareness is shocking, yes he has some awesome attributes such as his strength however makes too many mistakes and they cannot be afforded especially now back

 

[Devington]

we have boner atu and young all fighting for that position add him in the mix and thats 4 very medicore options. Need something else id especially prefer walker being given a go in the backline. Finds the ball well and can kick also. Haydens awareness is shocking, yes he has some awesome attributes such as his strength however makes too many mistakes and they cannot be afforded especially now back

It's 4 relatively young but mostly inexperienced options, with a wide array of attributes. They might seem poor or mediocre now but that doesn't mean they will stay that way.

In 12 months time, if their bodies allow continuity, Bonar might have that insane acceleration and strength that sees him make mediums disappear, Kyron might handle pressure better and find some new kicking boots, Young's understanding of positioning and the speed of the game might see him making the same inside kicks but without the opposition player being in prime position to intercept it halfway, Atu's attentiveness and ability to defend might develop strongly to go hand in hand with his offensive game.

Obviously none of that is guaranteed, but I think we have a good young pool of potential there and most of them are probably capable of playing in other positions. Bonar and Kyron in midfield rotations (thought I think Bonar being more reactive than most might see him consigned to defensive roles where that is far far less of an issue), Kyron tagging, Atu forward again, Young on the wing. Will all four make it? Almost definitely not, but I'd give decent odds that at least one will forge a career.

Push came to shove and we needed list spots then Kyron and maybe another (if not for contracts) would be in high danger, but I'm not really sure we'll be needing too many more open spots this offseason. Might be wrong though, and I did originally think we'd be making close to another 10 changes but as the year went on I was much more buoyed by our prospects.

 

[King Corey]

I thought he had good attributes. Quick, strong as an ox and his disposal was neat enough. Really didn't give a proper crack at it, but his numbers at the lower levels probably justify the delisting.

I reckon we've all just got those unfounded feelings about certain players that did or didn't make it thanks for a butterfly wing flap / sliding doors moment somewhere in the world.

Declan struck me as a really team-oriented, ripping kid with neat skills and elite work ethic, competitiveness and athletic attributes. Maybe had fate landed him in a well balanced, very attacking midfield in a gameplan that demanded hard running - he'd have thrived.

Ditto Jeremy Clayton. Had the attributes to be a top level small forward to me, a Phil Matera type. Smart player, competitive and great vision. Played a lone hand to almost fell a strong West Coast outfit in Perth.

Fell out with Laidley, dominated the SANFL then got badly injured just as his opportunity to return via Richmond surfaced. Was never to be.

 

[Le Grille]

I reckon we've all just got those unfounded feelings about certain players that did or didn't make it thanks for a butterfly wing flap / sliding doors moment somewhere in the world.

Declan struck me as a really team-oriented, ripping kid with neat skills and elite work ethic, competitiveness and athletic attributes. Maybe had fate landed him in a well balanced, very attacking midfield in a gameplan that demanded hard running - he'd have thrived.

Ditto Jeremy Clayton. Had the attributes to be a top level small forward to me, a Phil Matera type. Smart player, competitive and great vision. Played a lone hand to almost fell a strong West Coast outfit in Perth.

Fell out with Laidley, dominated the SANFL then got badly injured just as his opportunity to return via Richmond surfaced. Was never to be.

Mate I was the biggest Jeremy Clayton stan

 

[Reginald0]

Still maintain that under a coach that was capable of developing players and was willing to play youth over favourites, regardless of form that would only keep us mid table at best, that someone like Mountford could have been a real player.

Well maintain away
he plays for Claremont
he is 24 and presumably not invisible to the other 17 clubs
why would you blame a coach, rather than saying the player is not AFL level
scott had all the faults you mention, but if the player never gets picked up, and geez I would love that list of all the players who went on to bigger and brighter things after not being developed

who are these players that Scott did not develop?

 

[Passmore]

Guilty. I thought the kid had something.

I didn't dislike him, I just thought we got a bit carried away with his capabilities. We were pretty skinny with young prospects back then.

Since we delisted him, 17 other teams have overlooked him continuously. And it's not like he's been hidden away playing WAFL.

Ayden Kennedy was another. There's probably someone on the list now that we thing is going to be a player that just fades away.

 

[Reginald0]

Great minds think alike

 

[Mixed Results]

Still maintain that under a coach that was capable of developing players and was willing to play youth over favourites, regardless of form that would only keep us mid table at best, that someone like Mountford could have been a real player.

I think it's very telling of Brad Scott's apathy towards youth development in his later years that we moved on so quickly from Mountford, Hibberd, Clarke, Preuss, Nielson and Wagner. Sure none of them ended up making us pay for it, but there's no way that a better development system couldn't have at least turned some of those guys into handy players.

 

[hotchilli]

Personally thought he was in real strife to get another year. Hope his body treats him well so he get's a proper crack at it.

 

[RossHenshaw]

Personally thought he was in real strife to get another year. Hope his body treats him well so he get's a proper crack at it.

 

[pupstar]

Still maintain that under a coach that was capable of developing players and was willing to play youth over favourites, regardless of form that would only keep us mid table at best, that someone like Mountford could have been a real player.

Yet did not make it on another AFL list.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Well maintain away
he plays for Claremont
he is 24 and presumably not invisible to the other 17 clubs
why would you blame a coach, rather than saying the player is not AFL level
scott had all the faults you mention, but if the player never gets picked up, and geez I would love that list of all the players who went on to bigger and brighter things after not being developed

who are these players that Scott did not develop?

Well, yes, except everything that happens could relate back to development or lack of development early on. Makes it hard to get onto bigger and better things if you don’t get developed well in the first place.

 

[pupstar]

Well, yes, except everything that happens could relate back to development or lack of development early on. Makes it hard to get onto bigger and better things if you don’t get developed well in the first place.

Its not just a North thing though every team has the same thing happen with players.I dont think it is just a development thing with us.

 

[Merlin007]

The problem with the 'North are sh*te at player development' thesis is that it fails to explain successful player development. Goldy had hardly played the game and got taken at 37 and turned out alright; likewise Lindsay Thomas taken in the 50s (not to mention now Zurhaar as a rookie and Larkey in the 70s). Got much more to do with succcesful talent identification at the draft stage IMO

 

[the flying ham]

The problem with the 'North are sh*te at player development' thesis is that it fails to explain successful player development. Goldy had hardly played the game and got taken at 37 and turned out alright; likewise Lindsay Thomas taken in the 50s (not to mention now Zurhaar as a rookie and Larkey in the 70s). Got much more to do with succcesful talent identification at the draft stage IMO

Selecting at age 18 means it is still a lottery. Raise the draft age and there probably be more hits than misses. Some guys are great juniors, but dont develop physically and transition. The draft is and always will be speculative

On SM-G950F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[pupstar]

Selecting at age 18 means it is still a lottery. Raise the draft age and there probably be more hits than misses. Some guys are great juniors, but dont develop physically and transition. The draft is and always will be speculative

On SM-G950F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Could be wrong but i can never see the AFL upping the draft age. I think they would be to worried about losing them to other sports. EG Basketball Cricket just to name 2

 

[zoomba23]

Obviously he didn't get much of a shot at it this season but my lasting memory of him is spinning out of trouble at d50 and hoofing it straight down the middle against the Dogs when they smashed us last year. I thought to myself then that we had someone who could turn into a very handy player for us. It was one of the few instances in that game (shitfest might be a better word) where one of our players actively took the game on. Such a shame that he's not gonna be part of our future

 

[Heaps of fun]

I think it's very telling of Brad Scott's apathy towards youth development in his later years that we moved on so quickly from Mountford, Hibberd, Clarke, Preuss, Nielson and Wagner. Sure none of them ended up making us pay for it, but there's no way that a better development system couldn't have at least turned some of those guys into handy players.

Player development was such a big issue for years. Not convinced we got the best out of guys like Black, Atley, Wright, Ziebell, Bastinac, Hansen, Mullett, Wood, McKenzie etc. Physical and aerobic development was really terrible back at the start of the 2010s too. It felt like it took Brad Scott and the rest of the footy department the best part of five years just to get a team fit enough to run out games.

What I've seen guys like Simpkin, Thomas, LDU, Larkey, Zurhaar and co do over the last couple of years gives me more hope for the future than anything. You could argue we've even improved developing our senior players like Hall and Ziebell.

At the end of last year after we appointed Noble and he started gathering up assistant coaches his emphasis in pretty much every interview was about improving people and teaching the finer arts of football. The assistants he hired echoed a lot of the same sort mantras regarding development. I found Heath Younie's interviews particularly convincing towards the fact that we had a clear vision for how we would build our club back up on-field.

 

[Ether]

Player development was such a big issue for years. Not convinced we got the best out of guys like Black, Atley, Wright, Ziebell, Bastinac, Hansen, Mullett, Wood, McKenzie etc. Physical and aerobic development was really terrible back at the start of the 2010s too. It felt like it took Brad Scott and the rest of the footy department the best part of five years just to get a team fit enough to run out games.

What I've seen guys like Simpkin, Thomas, LDU, Larkey, Zurhaar and co do over the last couple of years gives me more hope for the future than anything. You could argue we've even improved developing our senior players like Hall and Ziebell.

At the end of last year after we appointed Noble and he started gathering up assistant coaches his emphasis in pretty much every interview was about improving people and teaching the finer arts of football. The assistants he hired echoed a lot of the same sort mantras regarding development. I found Heath Younie's interviews particularly convincing towards the fact that we had a clear vision for how we would build our club back up on-field.

Every club would have hits and misses with development. Even Hawthorn in its successful years had misses with some high draft picks. The question is whether our success rate was lower than others. (I couldn't say as I don't follow other clubs closely.)

 

[DrZaius]

Selecting at age 18 means it is still a lottery. Raise the draft age and there probably be more hits than misses. Some guys are great juniors, but dont develop physically and transition. The draft is and always will be speculative

On SM-G950F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Draft players at 20/21 y/o and you'd probably find the draft order would become much more accurate.
The problem is that will never happen.

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

FWIW I haven’t given up on Callum Urch

Callum Urch

Age

39

Ht

185cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.9

2star

K

4.9

2star

HB

2.0

2star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

7.2

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

2.0

2star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.6

5star

just yet.

 

[DesertRoo]

FWIW I haven’t given up on Callum Urch just yet.

Forgot to get a gun licence too?

 

[LB2Snake]

Obviously he didn't get much of a shot at it this season but my lasting memory of him is spinning out of trouble at d50 and hoofing it straight down the middle against the Dogs when they smashed us last year. I thought to myself then that we had someone who could turn into a very handy player for us. It was one of the few instances in that game (shitfest might be a better word) where one of our players actively took the game on. Such a shame that he's not gonna be part of our future

I’m a bit confused by your last sentence……hasn’t he signed on for another year?

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

I’m a bit confused by your last sentence……hasn’t he signed on for another year?

lol I read through the previous 3 pages looking for confirmation he was gone.