Discussion 2021 General AFL Discussion

[gringo2011]

Do you seriously think the actual issue is about taking or not taking a vaccine?

We should be advocating for people to make their own decisions and do what they want to do without being coerced. If you worry about your own health, you take it.

J wasn't comparing him to Muhammad Ali, he was just giving a damn good example of someone who stood for what they believed in, in the face of public scrutiny & pressure. Good on Liam Jones, it takes courage and a fair amount of strength to do what he's done. I commend him for it.

Why take any vaccines then or obey any laws. * em, if it feels good just do it. Burn the neighbour's house down and turn up to work naked. Only sheep do what they're told.

 

[George]

Why take any vaccines then or obey any laws. fu** em, if it feels good just do it. Burn the neighbour's house down and turn up to work naked. Only sheep do what they're told.

You do know that people actually do cooperate with one another if left to their own devices. They've fed you well though, obviously lol.

 

[gringo2011]

I don't think this kind of rhetoric is helpful. It's dehumanizing and really just skips over the many (legitimate) reasons people are wary of getting a vaccine that didn't exist 2 years ago. Not to mention, it's a new type of vaccine that has no long term data yet. I'm not against it, I've gotten it. I just think it's important to remember the person on the other end of the abuse.
For all we know, he knows someone who has had heart issues since getting the vaccine, we don't know.

Having some concerns doesn't make someone brainless.

One of my father in law's mates dad back in Croatia died because his grandson was an anti-vax nutter that took it home to his immune compromised grand pa. Now he is ostracised from his family who think he's a campaigner. He probably thought he was just making his own decisions too.

It's not just about his choices. Polio, smallpox etc are all mandatory. Do we let everyone choose so that they make a comeback?

 

[gringo2011]

You do know that people actually do cooperate with one another if left to their own devices. They've fed you well though, obviously lol.

Yep, I'm just a sheep. You are the only ones with your eyes open.

 

[Joffaboy]

There's a reason it's been mandated. Because a LOT less people would get it if it wasn't and then a lot more people would die.

I'm sure there are reasons not to have it. You don't like injections. You read on a website that it's bad for you. You are morally opposed to sharp things. But it saves lives having it.

I guess I feel sorry for him that he can't see that and he has given up his career for it.

Many people are vaccine hesitant more than committed anti vaxxers. I read an article where doctors and pharmacists talk the facts to people and it can take up to 6 consultations before they come around. Most people are sensible when given the medical facts
I certainly wasn't overjoyed to get vaxxed. I need to get the flu shot every year and need a whooping cough vax because I had a grandchild. I can understand vaccine hesitancy, it is not a cult like anti vaxxers and we should be careful not to label everyone who has not been vaxxed one of those extremists.

I do agree with lewdogs about it being selfish, I know of vax hesitant people getting it as they don't want to give it to their grandparents or others in the community. They should be thanked not condemned.

 

[George]

Now there’s a mandate I can get behind.
3 initial jabs, with boosters every few days forever.

100% double jab in record time

What, you think a couple of jabs from calcium deficient halfwits like you two is going to derail my greatness?

Take a look and make a mental note. It's going to take a hell of a lot more than that to get my attention, champions.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Didn’t take long for this to devolve into a *reeeeeeeee* fest of the malnourished amongst us

 

[Dard Ball Get]

One of my father in law's mates dad back in Croatia died because his grandson was an anti-vax nutter that took it home to his immune compromised grand pa. Now he is ostracised from his family who think he's a campaigner. He probably thought he was just making his own decisions too.

It's not just about his choices. Polio, smallpox etc are all mandatory. Do we let everyone choose so that they make a comeback?

One of your best anecdotes yet

 

[George]

Yep, I'm just a sheep. You are the only ones with your eyes open.

Never said either of those things actually, but if that's how you feel that's not my problem.

I thought it was pretty much common knowledge by now that people band together in times of struggle. Not the made up fairytales about anarchy that you believe in.

Facing Hazards and Disasters: Understanding Human Dimensions | The National Academies Press

Download a PDF of "Facing Hazards and Disasters" by the National Research Council for free.

www.nap.edu

 

[Joffaboy]

Why take any vaccines then or obey any laws. fu** em, if it feels good just do it. Burn the neighbour's house down and turn up to work naked. Only sheep do what they're told.

A construction worker wore thongs, no hard hat, no high viz or harness at work. Was outraged his freedoms were infringed up and disgusted he wasn't paid because he didn't follow OH&S rules.
True story bro

 

[George]

One of your best anecdotes yet

Yeah well my brothers mother in law's ex husband from the Netherlands, his postman actually said something one day so now that means everyone is like that.

 

[gringo2011]

One of your best anecdotes yet

Sadly a true story.

 

[gringo2011]

Never said either of those things actually, but if that's how you feel that's not my problem.

I thought it was pretty much common knowledge by now that people band together in times of struggle. Not the made up fairytales about anarchy that you believe in.

Facing Hazards and Disasters: Understanding Human Dimensions | The National Academies Press

Download a PDF of "Facing Hazards and Disasters" by the National Research Council for free.

www.nap.edu

What so you get together for a cuddle when the plague hits and because you are together it goes next door?

 

[Joffaboy]

One of your best anecdotes yet

Find it hard to believe you would find any mirth in an older person dying by drowning in their own fluid due to covid but it takes all kinds I suppose.
Anyway lads will leave you to it, I have read this story before.

 

[kernelT]

I don't think this kind of rhetoric is helpful. It's dehumanizing and really just skips over the many (legitimate) reasons…

Not productive.

He's a human, just apparently extremely dumb or selfish, possibly both… I don't find those kind of people very helpful or productive in the middle of a pandemic.

I feel sorry for Liam because he has been influenced by some conspiracy theorists to the point of throwing away half a million dollars.

 

[George]

What so you get together for a cuddle when the plague hits and because you are together it goes next door?

You do a tremendous job of deliberately taking comments out of context. Either that or completely missing the point. This is what you said because a person should be able to make their own decisions.

Why take any vaccines then or obey any laws. fu** em, if it feels good just do it. Burn the neighbour's house down and turn up to work naked. Only sheep do what they're told.

You actually think that's what will happen if people are left to their own devices. Lol, fairytales.

 

[George]

He's a human, just apparently extremely dumb or selfish, possibly both… I don't find those kind of people very helpful or productive in the middle of a pandemic.

I feel sorry for Liam because he has been influenced by some conspiracy theorists to the point of throwing away half a million dollars.

What's conspiratorial about the possibility that he doesn't want to abide by the AFL's mandate because of his concern for the overbearing authoritarian nature of our leaders?

The worrying thing is how he is being perceived and treated in public. This is not helpful.

 

[kernelT]

What's conspiratorial about the possibility that he doesn't want to abide by the AFL's mandate because of his concern for the overbearing authoritarian nature of our leaders?

The worrying thing is how he is being perceived and treated in public. This is not helpful.

"authoritarian nature of our leaders?"

Sounds like conspiratorial crazy talk already mate…

The science and numbers to support the vaccines are unbelievably good, if you want reject that on the basis of some tin foil Orwellian anti authoratiran tangent then people are going to assume you are a stubby short of six pack… make of that what you will.

Good on Liam for standing up for his beliefs… but his beliefs in this case are cringe-worthy. All power to him.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

What's conspiratorial about the possibility that he doesn't want to abide by the AFL's mandate because of his concern for the overbearing authoritarian nature of our leaders?

The worrying thing is how he is being perceived and treated in public. This is not helpful.

My Nan’s hairdresser knows someone at the club, and they reckon it’s really because they’re putting chemicals in the water to turn frogs gay and Liam ain’t happy about it because his girlfriend is amphibious.

 

[kernelT]

My Nan’s hairdresser knows someone at the club, and they reckon it’s really because they’re putting chemicals in the water to turn frogs gay and Liam ain’t happy about it because his girlfriend is amphibious.

Can confirm.

 

[George]

"authoritarian nature of our leaders?"

Sounds like conspiratorial crazy talk already mate…

The science and numbers to support the vaccines are unbelievably good, if you want reject that on the basis of some tin foil Orwellian anti authoratiran tangent then people are going to assume you are a stubby short of six pack… make of that what you will.

Good on Liam for standing up for his beliefs… but his beliefs in this case are cringe-worthy. All power to him.

Why don't you want to take the genuine concerns of people that may disagree with you seriously? For many people, including possibly Liam, it's not about just the vaccine. But I know you are smart enough to know that, you seem to just want to ignore it. I couldn't really care less how that is perceived. That is the reality. You either address it genuinely or you don't. Mocking and belittling others for believing something different to you is not healthy.

If you want to live in a democracy you need to stand up for people's rights to believe in things that you don't. Just brushing them aside or not taking them seriously is exactly the type of authoritarianism I am speaking of. Liam is exercising his right to do that, and good on him. It takes courage to do what he's done knowing the kind of commentary that follows - your posts a prime example.

 

[George]

My Nan’s hairdresser knows someone at the club, and they reckon it’s really because they’re putting chemicals in the water to turn frogs gay and Liam ain’t happy about it because his girlfriend is amphibious.

Always thought Liam looked a bit like a frog. It's the eyes that do it for me.

 

[kernelT]

Why don't you want to take the genuine concerns of people that may disagree with you seriously? For many people, including possibly Liam, it's not about just the vaccine. But I know you are smart enough to know that, you seem to just want to ignore it. I couldn't really care less how that is perceived. That is the reality. You either address it genuinely or you don't. Mocking and belittling others for believing something different to you is not healthy.

If you want to live in a democracy you need to stand up for people's rights to believe in things that you don't. Just brushing them aside or not taking them seriously is exactly the type of authoritarianism I am speaking of.

Because the only reasons for abstaining I have heard so far are based in selfishness or debunked conspiracies so unless Liam comes out publicly with some incredible new data then he’s in either or both of those camps...

The authoritarian schtick is also sad, we have rules in society... they change in extreme times like war and global pandemics, we’ve had vaccine mandates for decades. I’m genuinely surprised at the number of people who apparently have the personal freedom concepts of a twelve year old.

 

[Saints43]

Why don't you want to take the genuine concerns of people that may disagree with you seriously?

People who have concerns about the vaccine can go and see their GP for referral to VicSIS.
Once referred they can speak to someone who has done eight years of general medicine training, a further four years of specialist training, years of clinical practice and further training on top of that. That specialist will assess the patient for underlying issues and answer any questions they are asked. They will provide an exemption if warranted.
It's fine to be concerned, but concern shouldn't make decisions, expertise should.

 

[George]

Because the only reasons for abstaining I have heard so far are based in selfishness or debunked conspiracies so unless Liam comes out publicly with some incredible new data then he’s in either or both of those camps...

The authoritarian schtick is also sad, we have rules in society... they change in extreme times like war and global pandemics, we’ve had vaccine mandates for decades. I’m genuinely surprised at the number of people who apparently have the personal freedom concepts of a twelve year old.

If that's all you've heard I would suggest you do some more research.

We obviously have different views so for the sake of this topic I will agree to disagree, it is obvious to me that you don't want to listen to genuine concerns from people who think differently to you and some bloke on a forum is not going to change that. Your rhetoric is regressive and does not help in improving these situations unfortunately. I would hope you find a better balance so you can deal with opposing views without the need to attack people on a personal level. Cheers