Analysis 2021 draft thread

[Section 5]

There were some Lohmann highlights on the AFL website's coverage when he was announced, to memory. So they must have something.

Yes their were as i saw that also
But from memory we are talking 20 to 30 second at most.
But it was at least something

 

[Dalions]

Difficult trying to find something on-line ...... but:
Found a highlight video of St Pats Ballarat covering their Grand final win in 2021.
Not a lot of football highlights, but I have cut those involving Kai (don't blink), as well as some non playing glimpses as well.
(Credit to the creator of the original - Kade Towk)

Love the fend.

 

[twhowler]

I got my stats from FootyWire, i.e. https://www.footywire.com/afl/club/player-biography/3954.html. Howard was a 1 cm round up because there was a clear gap between him and the 197 cm and smaller brigade.



No doubt. There's also

1. a lot more people who fit that description,
2. a lot more value seen in key forwards than key defenders for players above that height, and
3. a lot more value seen in key forwards than rucks for players above that height.

Defenders are basically the bottom rung for tall players these days, which is why you see players regularly giving up 5-10 cm on their opponent.



I think in OUR case, they all pretty much fit into #2 or #3 above. If Andrews didn't end up as an AA-standard defender and we didn't already have Hipwood and McStay, he would've been moved around to see if he can play forward too. Hell, there were plenty of calls for exactly that this year.

Most of the guys I mentioned didn't start as a defender - look at Moore (forward), Roughead (ruck), Pearce (forward), Howard (forward) as initial Googles of what they were considered coming into the draft.

As such, we could easily see someone like Smith move down back if he doesn't put it together anywhere else. In most cases they didn't know they'd be any good until tried (and no doubt others just failed down back too, and washed out of the league).

I fundamentally disagree about why defenders are shorter. I think they need to have mobility and pace because they have to make sure they don’t give up uncontested possessions close to goal. They can’t have a weakness so they tend to be better all-rounders. Some giants manage this but not many.

Forwards can afford to have weaknesses as long as they have a killer strength like height (eg mason cox) or repeat efforts (riewoldt / brown).

I agree backs can end up being less skillful, basically failed forwards, because stopping is easier than creating.

i think the 7 talls i mentioned would struggle as backs as they are far from all rounders.

But that’s just my view on a footy forum. Hope i am wrong and Henry Smith is an impenetrable centre half back

 

[dlanod]

Hope i am wrong and Henry Smith is an impenetrable centre half back

Pessimist. I'm hoping for the next Paul Salmon.

 

[briztoon]

An early look at next year’s KPP stocks.

KPF RANKINGS
1 - Harry Lemmey 199cm
2 - Isaac Keeler 197cm
3 - Oliver Northam 195cm
4 - Matthew Jefferson 194cm
5 - Tom Scully 201cm
6 - Jasper Scaife 195cm
7 - Damon Pitt 195cm
8 - Luke Brown 199cm
9 - Billy King 199cm

KPD RANKINGS
1 - Jedd Busslinger 196cm
2 - Koby Cockshell 196cm
3 - Lewis Hayes 195cm
4 - Max Michaelanny 192cm
5 - Dayne Posthuma 197cm

 

[Quigley]

Anyone remember where we had Johnson on our board?

 

[mpal6]

Anyone remember where we had Johnson on our board?

I remember a post saying 21/22. Johnson and Goater back to back.

 

[briztoon]

Anyone remember where we had Johnson on our board?

We weren’t told at the Brisbane function.

 

[David C]

Tom Joyce is understood to be in consideration for a training invitation from West Coast.

 

[Dalions]

Tom Joyce is understood to be in consideration for a training invitation from West Coast.

A bit of a victim of circumstance here at the Lions.
So I think I speak for everyone here by saying I wish him all the best.

 

[David C]

A bit of a victim of circumstance here at the Lions.
So I think I speak for everyone here by saying I wish him all the best.

WC have just the one rookie spot at this stage. They are also looking at Dittmar and Josh Browne. Jack Redden just had shoulder surgery and could be out for 3 months. Sheppard has reportedly battled ongoing concussion symptoms and could retire. A few spots might open up there to give him a better chance.

 

[briztoon]

WC have just the one rookie spot at this stage. They are also looking at Dittmar and Josh Browne. Jack Redden just had shoulder surgery and could be out for 3 months. Sheppard has reportedly battled ongoing concussion symptoms and could retire. A few spots might open up there to give him a better chance.

I believe Joyce offers more than Browne. Dittmar is much more an in vogue style of player, and I was a little surprised he wasn’t drafted.

 

[M Malice]

The Tigers/Kangaroos were keen on Kai Lohmann as well >

https://www.afl.com.au/news/689980/...nsion-tactics-and-trades-that-didn-t-come-off

Brisbane jumped on Wilmot once its turn came, targeting and finding an attacking half-back with pace and competitiveness, before the Tigers chose Brown to add to their talented defensive group and as a partner to Gibcus in an exciting young backline. Eye-catching forward Kai Lohmann was also in the Tigers' mix.

The Tigers remained active, seeing if they could package picks in the 20s to nab Brisbane's final pick of the first round, but the Lions stuck with it and drafted Lohmann, who had also been a chance for North Melbourne's early second-round choice.

 

[SizeMatters]

The Tigers/Kangaroos were keen on Kai Lohmann as well >

https://www.afl.com.au/news/689980/...nsion-tactics-and-trades-that-didn-t-come-off

Brisbane jumped on Wilmot once its turn came, targeting and finding an attacking half-back with pace and competitiveness, before the Tigers chose Brown to add to their talented defensive group and as a partner to Gibcus in an exciting young backline. Eye-catching forward Kai Lohmann was also in the Tigers' mix.

The Tigers remained active, seeing if they could package picks in the 20s to nab Brisbane's final pick of the first round, but the Lions stuck with it and drafted Lohmann, who had also been a chance for North Melbourne's early second-round choice.

Just makes a few posters comments on draft night laughable. Zero chance we were picking Lohmann with pick 41. Seems our draft intel is top notch.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

The Tigers/Kangaroos were keen on Kai Lohmann as well >

https://www.afl.com.au/news/689980/...nsion-tactics-and-trades-that-didn-t-come-off

Brisbane jumped on Wilmot once its turn came, targeting and finding an attacking half-back with pace and competitiveness, before the Tigers chose Brown to add to their talented defensive group and as a partner to Gibcus in an exciting young backline. Eye-catching forward Kai Lohmann was also in the Tigers' mix.

The Tigers remained active, seeing if they could package picks in the 20s to nab Brisbane's final pick of the first round, but the Lions stuck with it and drafted Lohmann, who had also been a chance for North Melbourne's early second-round choice.

Sydney too it seems, even if they went for Sheldrick in the end.

Interesting also that Sydney and Melbourne were both trying to get Wilmot. I'm not surprised the Giants turned down Melbourne's offer if Twomey has reported it accurately, since pick 39 was a chance of being eaten up by a bid on Fahey. He got bid on later than that, but the Giants weren't to know at the time.

 

[M Malice]

Just makes a few posters comments on draft night laughable. Zero chance we were picking Lohmann with pick 41. Seems our draft intel is top notch.

I haven't seen jack around since the draft, he may have been a bit embarrassed by his over the top vitriol..... come back jack we still love you.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I haven't seen jack around since the draft, he may have been a bit embarrassed by his over the top vitriol..... come back jack we still love you.

scoman is still kicking about, although if I remember correctly, they admitted they could have been wrong and didn't continue to sulk.

 

[scoman]

scoman is still kicking about, although if I remember correctly, they admitted they could have been wrong and didn't continue to sulk.

Still kicking around. Hope that's ok with you.
I maintain my major gripe was with the 2-3 years of poor (putting it nicely) pick trading that culminated in the pick we used on Lohmann. To then use it on a player not expected to go at that point in the draft was a pretty tough pill to swallow.

Hopefully it works out and he becomes a best 22 player in time. I will certainly be supporting him as I have with every player in Lions colours.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Still kicking around. Hope that's ok with you.

No. You must pay for your crimes by being exiled to the Carlton board!

 

[POBT]

The Tigers/Kangaroos were keen on Kai Lohmann as well >

https://www.afl.com.au/news/689980/...nsion-tactics-and-trades-that-didn-t-come-off

Brisbane jumped on Wilmot once its turn came, targeting and finding an attacking half-back with pace and competitiveness, before the Tigers chose Brown to add to their talented defensive group and as a partner to Gibcus in an exciting young backline. Eye-catching forward Kai Lohmann was also in the Tigers' mix.

The Tigers remained active, seeing if they could package picks in the 20s to nab Brisbane's final pick of the first round, but the Lions stuck with it and drafted Lohmann, who had also been a chance for North Melbourne's early second-round choice.

Great article. A few observations:

1. Let's not assume in the future that a lack of draft night moves is due to want of trying. We were clearly playing the game - even if our execution was ultimately unsuccessful (although trading up to get Wilmot would have been a mistake, in hindsight, given we got him anyway).

2. As good as the draft watchers can be, there is always divergence between what they think and what the clubs think. Lohmann now looks like he was picked at exactly the right part of the draft, with our assessment franked by several clubs in the same area of the draft.

3. Our decision to knock back a couple of picks in the 20s to keep pick 20 and 41 says to me that we were high on Lohmann and maybe Tunstill. On the face of it, I would normally do a trade like 28+29 for 20+41, unless we really liked a player at #20. I think the info that we knocked back the Tigers offer for #20 reinforces the intel coming out of the club draft night events about our keenness for Lohmann.

 

[Pns_blister]

Still kicking around. Hope that's ok with you.
I maintain my major gripe was with the 2-3 years of poor (putting it nicely) pick trading that culminated in the pick we used on Lohmann. To then use it on a player not expected to go at that point in the draft was a pretty tough pill to swallow.

Hopefully it works out and he becomes a best 22 player in time. I will certainly be supporting him as I have with every player in Lions colours.

Yeah i'm not sure why others on here feel the need to single out reactions of individual posters. It's a forum about football that should encourage difference of opinion. People are allowed to be critical of the club, whether you agree with it or not.

No need to keep bringing it up and harping on it and playing a game of I told you so, or my opinion has more merit than yours. I get that there's not much going on in the offseason, but surely there is more interesting things to post about.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Yeah i'm not sure why others on here feel the need to single out reactions of individual posters. It's a forum about football that should encourage difference of opinion. People are allowed to be critical of the club, whether you agree with it or not.

No need to keep bringing it up and harping on it and playing a game of I told you so, or my opinion has more merit than yours. I get that there's not much going on in the offseason, but surely there is more interesting things to post about.

The point was to show someone who had that reaction initially, but was humble enough to not be stubborn about it. But if you'd like to get offended on behalf of others, I guess that's your choice.

 

[POBT]

Yeah i'm not sure why others on here feel the need to single out reactions of individual posters. It's a forum about football that should encourage difference of opinion. People are allowed to be critical of the club, whether you agree with it or not.

No need to keep bringing it up and harping on it and playing a game of I told you so, or my opinion has more merit than yours. I get that there's not much going on in the offseason, but surely there is more interesting things to post about.

I think if you are going to criticise the club we all love, on a board which is for Lions supporters, you'd want to do so in a rational and informed way. If you don't, then I think the same freedom of opinion applies to those who wish to defend the club. Further, if in hindsight a strident criticism doesn't hold weight, then I think it's fair for that to be pointed out.

I do object to people who expressed quite nuanced criticisms being lumped in together with those who were, to be frank, quite hysterical at the time and assumed the worst. Considered criticism shouldn't be equated with hysterical venting.

People might say that footy is emotional and people should be entitled to vent. I agree with that - but it also means others are entitled to be just as passionate in defending the club. If you say something that I think is unfair about my club, I'm probably going to point that out.

 

[Pns_blister]

I think if you are going to criticise the club we all love, on a board which is for Lions supporters, you'd want to do so in a rational and informed way. If you don't, then I think the same freedom of opinion applies to those who wish to defend the club. Further, if in hindsight a strident criticism doesn't hold weight, then I think it's fair for that to be pointed out.

I do object to people who expressed quite nuanced criticisms being lumped in together with those who were, to be frank, quite hysterical at the time and assumed the worst. Considered criticism shouldn't be equated with hysterical venting.

People might say that footy is emotional and people should be entitled to vent. I agree with that - but it also means others are entitled to be just as passionate in defending the club. If you say something that I think is unfair about my club, I'm probably going to point that out.

Draft was a week ago? Not sure why people are still bringing it up? It's a one-way road at the moment. None of the posters who were critical at the time are still here being critical, yet others keep bringing up their names trying to shame them.

 

[Pns_blister]

The point was to show someone who had that reaction initially, but was humble enough to not be stubborn about it. But if you'd like to get offended on behalf of others, I guess that's your choice.

Not offended in the slightest, just making an observation. I've got no attachment to the topic at all, apart from observing the conduct of people around the topic. Which has been a little tiresome, as the draft was over a week ago and people are still talking about individual poster reactions. Move on with life already and bring some positivity.