List Mgmt. List Management 2022

[Blue1980]

But the Pies have had 2 years outside the 8, that's how you judge weakness and strength isn't it?

Last year you stated * and GWS were mentally strong

At what point will you actually realise that it's about the readiness of a healthy list

The cliches are getting tiresome Michael

Only one year, they played and won a final in 2020.

 

[Michael Jezz]

So we were mentally stronger than the Pies over last 60 years? GWS and * mentally stronger than us last year, but not this year?

We were 50% mentally stronger than last year?

The level of your analysis is based on a supposed culture, ruthlessness and mental strength, which is purely derived from week to week or within season results

Can already predict your response next year, when we make the 8, claiming we are mentally weak due to not finishing top 4

So we were mentally stronger than the Pies over last 60 years? GWS and * mentally stronger than us last year, but not this year?

We were 50% mentally stronger than last year?

The level of your analysis is based on a supposed culture, ruthlessness and mental strength, which is purely derived from week to week or within season results

Can already predict your response next year, when we make the 8, claiming we are mentally weak due to not finishing top 4

Yawn

You posed the question of the difference between Geeling and Collingwood v Carlton. I gave you my perspective. It is mental. If you do not like the answer do not ask the question. It seems convincing yourself that your view of the Carlton football Club is sacred is important to you. Arrow, read the emperor's new clothes before you go to sleep

 

[Blue1980]

You posed the question of the difference between Geeling and Collingwood v Carlton. I gave you my perspective. It is mental. If you do not like the answer do not ask the question. It seems convincing yourself that your view of the Carlton football Club is sacred is important to you. Arrow, read the emperor's new clothes before you go to sleep

Mental due to stability of playing list and leaders on and off the field.

We were a rudderless mess from a long time.

 

[bmaurizio]

Needs to combine his work between the forwards coach and Ruck coach...

Has the athleticism to be something else as a forward/ruck...
IMO, just needs to get stronger and needs to really knuckle down to learn both positions at AFL level...

IF he could become our ruck/forward, he could really be a game changer for us...
2x 200cm+ Athletic KPP (Harry and TDK)
1x Athletic 3rd tall (Curnow)

I think TDK needs a few seasons yet to become an AFL ready Ruck, perhaps he may not be one, could be support at intervals but not full game.
I’d try him out as KPD because he ain’t a fwd nor Ruckman yet.

 

[TENACIOUS]

I think TDK needs a few seasons yet to become an AFL ready Ruck, perhaps he may not be one, could be support at intervals but not full game.
I’d try him out as KPD because he ain’t a fwd nor Ruckman yet.

We need a KPF/R though...
Not sure, TDK as a defender replaces Weitering , Young or Durdin... So most likely doesn't get a game...

I'm not sure, anyone would be calling for him to become a defender if his brother wasn't one...

 

[Blues_1864]

Everyone is treating Collingwood like this year was an incredible rebuild/rebound and is a modern-day baby bombers*. It wasn't.

They are one of the oldest, most experienced sides out there every week.

Last year was the aberration. This year is back to normal.

They have introduced a nice group of youngsters in the last couple of years. They have had a great year, with a fresh coach, a clear gameplan, player buy-in, and a never give up attitude; not trying to downplay any of that.

But they still have the core of a team that has made it to the 2nd week of the finals 3/4 years prior to 2022.

PS - my post not aimed specifically at you I AM CARLTON, just raising the point in general.

Absolutely, it is the elephant in the room that no-one in the AFL media seems capable of even glancing at... how did Nathan Buckley manage to pilot this same group of players (minus Nick Daicos) to 17th?

I for one thank him for his service...

 

[Wickzki]

Just watching AFL360, where has the Dunkley to the Lions come from? I have no idea how a top 4 team with not much draft capital can find enough points/picks to take Ashcroft @1, Fletcher @20 and then find a top pock for Dunkley.

It was mentioned Lyons was on shaky ground, I don’t think we would be interested in his type but would he be cheap? Does he have any position other than inside mid?

His sister plays for the Queensland Firebirds in the Super Netball. His partner plays for Adelaide but reported to being linked to Queensland herself which is why he was linked heavily to Port.

He (or his sister) already owns a house in Noosa so Brisbane makes more sense than do the Suns.

 

[TENACIOUS]

The more I think about it, the more I lean this way.

He's certainly talented enough, and plays a position we need to address.

The ACL sucks, but we've nursed a few players through them in recent years so he'd absolutely have the right support around him to ensure he approaches it properly. He's looking at a solid 13-14 months recovery/rehab before his next preseason.

The odds of whoever we draft playing much senior footy in 2023 is slim anyway, we're drafting for impact in 2024-2032.

Take the point-of-difference player, can always trade in some solid citizen midfielders down the track if we need to.

If he's highly rated by Austin and Austin rates him higher than next years crop...
Why not try and nab him on draft night, if he goes late enough first round, with our Future 1st rounder...

Would be ready to go 2024 like a new recruit, but with a year in our system...

Then we could use pick 10 on someone else...

or even try and split pick 10 & 28 for Sydney's 2 x first rounders...
Pick 15 > Keeler
Pick 17 > George
Forward line set for next 10+ years

 

[ray8182]

If he's highly rated by Austin and Austin rates him higher than next years crop...
Why not try and nab him on draft night, if he goes late enough first round, with our Future 1st rounder...

Would be ready to go 2024 like a new recruit, but with a year in our system...

Then we could use pick 10 on someone else...

or even try and split pick 10 & 28 for Sydney's 2 x first rounders...
Pick 15 > Keeler
Pick 17 > George
Forward line set for next 10+ years

Saw some highlights of keeler. Wasn’t impressed based on that limited vision. Looked extremely laconic and didn’t seem to have any physicality.

Obviously need to see more of him as it’s a bit of an unfair judgement based on very little, but in general not keen on talls who play like touch footballers.


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[BlueTongue]

Carlton are mentally weak. That is the difference between 9th and collingwood's preliminary. You are comparing our 20 years of systemic failure to collingwood's 2 years of missed finals, 6 grand finals and a premiership over the same time frame. It is now mainly above the shoulders where we are lacking. If the list is the main issue why are we only taking acres and 3 draft pics. Are Acres and kids going to move the dial? If it is not about mental application why was stocker moved on? You need to base your arguments on reality of Carlton's performances- Carltob 9th and choking. Collingwood prelims and winning tight games. It is mainly above the shoulders

100% Above the shoulders. And despite our injuries this year and great effort throughout the first half of the season, the weight of that gets worse every tight loss and missed finals opportunity.

Getting experience in now instead of kids is really our best chance at shedding that stigma.

 

[thebluenewdeal]

I have a genuine question, interested to see peoples thoughts. It looks like Acres is the only addition to our team plus a couple of kids through the draft and who knows if they will be ready to play next season or not. But with that in mind is that a big enough improvement that will take us to the top 4 and challenging for the flag? Obviously there will be natural improvement with our players, but with all that mind is that required additions and improvements to our side that will makes that more better next season??

what will make us a better side is to embrace getting the ball back before it gets to the middle. We worked on contest method and clearances all preseason and we became so good that we started being okay with the oppo scoring goals because we assumed we’d just get the ball back in the middle and lock it in our forward half. I’m not blaming the players or coaches for this but I think it’s a natural thing when the coach’s strength is contest and clearance work. If I was vossy or Hansen I’d just make this group chase tail all preseason whilst simultaneously working on our d50 to f50 ball movement. Keep it as simple and fun as possible and base it on instinct. Run run run!!! Then when the season commences we can refine our contest work throughout it as we’ve already established it this season.
I think acres is a great get to emphasise this gameplay as well. Knows how to defend in live play very well. Get some young players that run super hard offensively to challenge our current 22 defensively. It could work…

 

[BlueTongue]

I think TDK needs a few seasons yet to become an AFL ready Ruck, perhaps he may not be one, could be support at intervals but not full game.
I’d try him out as KPD because he ain’t a fwd nor Ruckman yet.

He is already the prototype new breed of mobile Ruckman, who can go forward and kick goals if needed. But yes, I think he needs to play a bit in defence, to help him be that ruckman who knows how to drop back and plug holes in defence when the pressure is on, like Gawn does.

 

[Justnetime]

Acres will probably fall over leaving us with Cotts and Lob. would like to hear something in the next 24 to 48 hours.

Looking through Acres key stats he looked like he fitted easily into the top 8 wingers in the league in 2022. Our wingers don’t fit into the top 20…so a massive upgrade.

Love his tackling average which is just a bonus.

 

[macky99]

I think TDK needs a few seasons yet to become an AFL ready Ruck, perhaps he may not be one, could be support at intervals but not full game.
I’d try him out as KPD because he ain’t a fwd nor Ruckman yet.

TDk will not be tried as a key defender, we have Weitering & Young to fill those roles.
The commentary he is not Afl ready is not accurate, we lost Pittonet approx R5 and he carried our rucks on his own and did a good job until the last month, like others in the team some run out of legs .

Again top 4 teams do not have elite ruckman at all, they are competitive and that is what is required.

 

[Sheephead]

All the TDK isn’t up to it crap is starting to wear thin really.

Have a look at the last 4 teams.
GEE - Stanley
BRI - McInerney
COL - Cox
SYD - Hickey
Hardly scary or dominating.

Rucks are starting to become prehistoric. Where is Gawn, Grundy, Natanu? Hell RIC basically won a Premiership with Mitch Grigg. The actual reason we started to use JSOS.

If TDK can run around and make each contest and then also become a target I’m happy. He also can run down the occasional opponent, quite athletic for a big man. I’m good. He’s a bit of a unicorn.

FRE is said to be wanting to turn Jackson into a Kouta type if they get him, that’s TDK. Pittonet the Titanic is not that. I’ll keep TDK thanks and I think he’s Best 22.

 

[Burgers45]

Acres will probably fall over leaving us with Cotts and Lob. would like to hear something in the next 24 to 48 hours.

Looking through Acres key stats he looked like he fitted easily into the top 8 wingers in the league in 2022. Our wingers don’t fit into the top 20…so a massive upgrade.

Love his tackling average which is just a bonus.

According to 7 News last night, at his exit interview, asked Freo for trade and nominated us.

 

[Sheephead]

According to 7 News last night, at his exit interview, asked Freo for trade and nominated us.

It’s on Fox Footy website too.

 

[Arr0w]

You posed the question of the difference between Geeling and Collingwood v Carlton. I gave you my perspective. It is mental. If you do not like the answer do not ask the question. It seems convincing yourself that your view of the Carlton football Club is sacred is important to you. Arrow, read the emperor's new clothes before you go to sleep

New set of data, same analysis

Sacred, yeah, but not immune to analysis.

How anyone would know the mental capabilities of a player, group, organisation from high in the stands, is truly bewildering

You need a broader library Michael

 

[Coona Blues]

Anyone know whether Acres played wing while at Saints? His form couldn't have been too good if they let him go to Freo. His finals form has been excellent this year, don't know why freo lowballed him. What would we have to give up to make the trade? Really, I'm a bit wary this might be a bad trade.

Played a few games there, fair to say they were his best. Was moved all over the place back flank, wing, forward flank, mid, and the role he was lumped with most was pinch hitting ruck (at 189/190cm). Had him in fantasy footy for a while and had some great scoring games, role changes and then omissions and injuries. They had NFI where to play him. But like Jack, versatility not necessarily good for some players. Willing worker who found a regular role forward/ruck before his departure. It was pretty obvious his best role was going to be outside mid or half forward. Hill (and Hannebery) closed the door on the wing in theory and the acquired Ryder to share ruck duties with Marshall.

Saints “screwed him over”, I always thought he would thrive with Freo. He may be playing at his optimum, but I suggest there is a decent chance his game has further layers, particularly complementing our inside bulls and adding to connection. An excellent addition. Now we need LOB to realise his potential or find another elite kicking connector for the other side. We could use Walshy and others in primarily wing roles and may need to to fit them all in, but we would be best served with a point of difference runner hitting up our forwards.

 

[Post padding]

All the TDK isn’t up to it crap is starting to wear thin really.

Have a look at the last 4 teams.
GEE - Stanley
BRI - McInerney
COL - Cox
SYD - Hickey
Hardly scary or dominating.

Rucks are starting to become prehistoric. Where is Gawn, Grundy, Natanu? Hell RIC basically won a Premiership with Mitch Grigg. The actual reason we started to use JSOS.

If TDK can run around and make each contest and then also become a target I’m happy. He also can run down the occasional opponent, quite athletic for a big man. I’m good. He’s a bit of a unicorn.

FRE is said to be wanting to turn Jackson into a Kouta type if they get him, that’s TDK. Pittonet the Titanic is not that. I’ll keep TDK thanks and I think he’s Best 22.

Cameron goes alright. It’s why they want to ship out Grundy.


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[Uncle Fester]

Played a few games there, fair to say they were his best. Was moved all over the place back flank, wing, forward flank, mid, and the role he was lumped with most was pinch hitting ruck (at 189/199cm). Had him in fantasy footy for a while and had some great scoring games, role changes and then omissions and injuries. They had NFI where to play him. But like Jack, versatility not necessarily good for some players. Willing worker who found a regular role forward/ruck before his departure. It was pretty obvious his best role was going to be outside mid or half forward. Hill (and Hannebery) closed the door on the wing in theory and the acquired Ryder to share ruck duties with Marshall.

Saints “screwed him over”, I always thought he would thrive with Freo. He may be playing at his optimum, but I suggest there is a decent chance his game has further layers, particularly complementing our inside bulls and adding to connection. An excellent addition. Now we need LOB to realise his potential or find another elite kicking connector for the other side. We could use Walshy and others in primarily wing roles and may need to to fit them all in, but we would be best served with a point of difference runner hitting up our forwards.

Ive had him a way too many fantasy drafts. (We have 18 teams and we take 25 players each so we go deep so ive had him for at least 6 years as i like the upside). He’s capable of excellent football but can disappear from a game. Ie hes a winger

 

[Jeremias]

Acres will probably fall over leaving us with Cotts and Lob. would like to hear something in the next 24 to 48 hours.

What makes you think that?

 

[TENACIOUS]

New set of data, same analysis

Sacred, yeah, but not immune to analysis.

How anyone would know the mental capabilities of a player, group, organisation from high in the stands, is truly bewildering

You need a broader library Michael

Not getting involved with your ongoing feud...

However... Not really sure you know what sport psychology is...
a good sports psychologist will help players play train at their optimum level,
while helping them become calm and focused under pressure or duress during games...

It's an area we/ all AFL clubs use and have employees in, I'd love us to beef it up...

All athletes from Olympians to golfers to footballers would/ should work with one...
The AIS and VIS would provide this service to their athletes...

It has nothing to do with mental health or mental deficiencies... I hope you don't take it there again...

 

[teagueyubeauty]

It’s a bit like us bouncing back to being near the top 99-01 after down years 97-98. Got a few younger guys to compliment the older ones.

The cull Collingwood had at the end of 2020 was incredibly destabilising, Treloar was a very popular player within the group and what happened to him wouldn’t have been taken very well by all of his mates at the club.

Would have been a major impact on their performances last year


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[Arr0w]

Not getting involved with your ongoing feud...

However... Not really sure you know what sport psychology is...
a good sports psychologist will help players play train at their optimum level,
while helping them become calm and focused under pressure or duress during games...

It's an area we/ all AFL clubs use and have employees in, I'd love us to beef it up...

All athletes from Olympians to golfers to footballers would/ should work with one...
The AIS and VIS would provide this service to their athletes...

It has nothing to do with mental health or mental deficiencies... I hope you don't take it there again...

I wasn't the one claiming the players are mentally weak

My question to you and others, how do you know the players don't have access to a sports psychologist?

MJ clearly bases his opinion purely on sides that don't make the 8, are mentally weak, which we know is flawed when there are a myriad of factors that should be assessed

Essentially, it's guess analysis