Welcome to East Germany Carlton and Collingwood - who finishes higher in 2023? Collingwood Ofcourse

[PieLebo87]

Mainly here so we can enjoy the LOLs afterwards at the end of 2023, but also an interesting discussion point.

I’m in genuine two minds and can’t call it, but who do you see finishing higher in 2023?

Who is positioned better from a list/team perspective?

Let the games begin…

 

[PerthBoy86]

Carlton. Collingwood surely can't repeat their freakish run again. Carlton will finish 4-5 and Collingwood 8-9.

 

[Robertio]

Carlton. Collingwood surely can't repeat their freakish run again. Carlton will finish 4-5 and Collingwood 8-9.

I reckon you're on the money mate what do you think Fadge ?

 

[Fadge]

Is this a serious question?

In before it gets moved to the Bay.

 

[JyeDye]

The team I support will be above the team I dislike.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Looking at the teams on paper, you would think the answer is Carlton, but the game is not played on paper and Carlton is Carlton, so the answer is Collingwood.

 

[Fadge]

Looking at the teams on paper, you would think the answer is Carlton, but the game is not played on paper and Carlton is Carlton, so the answer is Collingwood.

Really?!?

I would say if you looked at a list of each team's top 5 players it would be Carlton.

By any other objective and rational analysis, the answer is clearly Collingwood.

We're playing football, not basketball.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Really?!?

I would say if you looked at a list of each team's top 5 players it would be Carlton.

By any other objective and rational analysis, the answer is clearly Collingwood.

We're playing football, not basketball.

The top players at Carlton talent wise are up there with the best in the league.

But they have shown how good they are, yet can't seem to win the clutch games that matter, so leadership qualities are lacking, Collingwood on the other hand, don't have that top end talent Carlton have but seem to ooze with leadership qualities, so when it matters, Collingwood for me.

 

[Sky]

Carlton top 4
Pies lucky if they make the 8

 

[PieLebo87]

Arr0w and WalshistheGOAT I didn’t want to make it a Pies v Blues thing in the other thread, so thought I’d get your views on below here.

I reckon this would make a good thread discussion on its own (Best 25 and under group) if it was possible for it to be kept civilised between the two supporter groups.

I still believe you’ve got a better list/list position than the Pies as Wright and co are still working on correcting the balance/blend of ours to boost that 23-27 year old batch.

The sub 25 list though I reckon we just pip you.

Carlton’s best ones (I’ll need to be corrected) are - Weitering, Silvagni, McKay, Setterfield, Fisher, Young, TDK, O’Brien, Cerra, Cottrell, Walsh, Durdin and Motlop.

Collingwood’s best ones are - Johnson, Lipinski, J Daicos, Kreuger, Murphy, Carmichael, Quaynor, Bianco, McCreery, Henry, Ginnivan and N Daicos.

The absolute standouts amongst the groups are McKay, Weitering, Walsh, Cerra, J Daicos, Lipinski, Ginnivan and N Daicos. Carlton with the superior standouts but then when looking at the remainder of each group, I think Collingwood’s remainder players have contributed more.

As mentioned above, would be a good topic to flesh out further, but not as clear cut as you would think that Carlton’s group is better.

 

[PieLebo87]

The team I support will be above the team I dislike.

1st - Collingwood

Relegated to the VFL - Carlton and Richmond.

 

[JyeDye]

Arr0w and WalshistheGOAT I didn’t want to make it a Pies v Blues thing in the other thread, so thought I’d get your views on below here.

McKay, Walsh, Weitering, and Curnow is also only 25 already beat everyone else you put there for Collingwood. All of those players are AA level already, the only Collingwood player in that list I see nearing that level is N. Daicos.

 

[PieLebo87]

This will really fire up the natives mate

Tipping both sides will finish in a similar position

We’ll experience the best of both worlds - the ultimate trolling and some quality conversations.

Either way, some great potential for embarrassing bumps!

 

[PieLebo87]

McKay, Walsh, Weitering, and Curnow is also only 25 already beat everyone else you put there for Collingwood. All of those players are AA level already, the only Collingwood player in that list I see nearing that level is N. Daicos.

With those 4 already firing, Carlton wasn’t able to get into the top 8.

Looking at the last encounter between the two sides, 4/7 of Collingwood’s best were 25 and under -

 

[footyfan1978]

Carlton top 4
Pies lucky if they make the 8

Pies rode their luck but also had very experienced veterans and probably finished above expectations but also excellent coach for year one.
No reason they cannot make top 8 unless a couple of Pendles, Siidebottom or Howe retire which I do not think any of them are.
I'd probably think they finish around 7th, just inside 8.

Think we should see our 23 to 27 year olds take another step forward so sky the limit especially if do not have the injuries we had in middle of season. Second year of Voss coach should see the style of play tweaked and defensive structure improve.

 

[PieLebo87]

The sub 25 list I reckon we just pip you.

Carlton’s best ones (I’ll need to be corrected) are - Weitering, Silvagni, McKay, Setterfield, Fisher, Young, TDK, O’Brien, Cerra, Cottrell, Walsh, Durdin and Motlop.

Collingwood’s best ones are - Johnson, Lipinski, J Daicos, Kreuger, Murphy, Carmichael, Quaynor, Bianco, McCreery, Henry, Ginnivan and N Daicos.

The absolute standouts amongst the groups are McKay, Weitering, Walsh, Cerra, J Daicos, Lipinski, Ginnivan and N Daicos. Carlton with the superior standouts but then when looking at the remainder of each group, I think Collingwood’s remainder players have contributed more.

 

[bradfisher14]

I think we'll both be around the 5-8 range.

Factors at play for Carringbush to slide slightly: top 4 draw, teams going to work on how to beat you, and Pendles regression (not heaps, but he has to be less influential eventually).

Factors at play for Carlton to lift slightly: anger.

 

[beerbandit]

Well seems though Collingwood will win next years premiership. Clearly Collingwood

 

[TheUnicorn]

It’s 50/50 for me, Carlton’s list should perform better than they did, and probably better than Collingwood next year. Collingwoods mentality is heads and shoulders above though.


If you could combine Collingwoods belief and determination and Carlton’s list you would win a premiership easily IMO. Still not sold on Voss either, McRae seems like a gem thus far.

 

[footyfan1978]

The sub 25 list I reckon we just pip you.

Carlton’s best ones (I’ll need to be corrected) are - Weitering, Silvagni, McKay, Setterfield, Fisher, Young, TDK, O’Brien, Cerra, Cottrell, Walsh, Durdin and Motlop.

I not sure the exact age of most of these. All about the mark, but looks like you missed Charlie Curnow and David Cuningham that all from same draft as Weitering, McKay and Silvagni. Cuningham did his knee in 2021 so missed all of this season. Hopefully he back in 2023 and makes an excellent recovery like Curnow and Docherty did this season.

 

[PieLebo87]

I not sure the exact age of most of these. All about the mark, but looks like you missed Charlie Curnow and David Cuningham that all from same draft as Weitering, McKay and Silvagni. Cuningham did his knee in 2021 so missed all of this season. Hopefully he back in 2023 and makes an excellent recovery like Curnow and Docherty did this season.

I’m fairly certain they’re all from 24 years and younger from oldest to youngest when responding to someone about the sub 25 list of both clubs.

 

[JyeDye]

With those 4 already firing, Carlton wasn’t able to get into the top 8.

Looking at the last encounter between the two sides, 4/7 of Collingwood’s best were 25 and under -


View attachment 1515644

There's nothing to suggest that they will slow down. I actually don't think out of that list anyone other then Curnow had their best season at all. So there's plenty of room for improvement there.

 

[PieLebo87]

There's nothing to suggest that they will slow down. I actually don't think out of that list anyone other then Curnow had their best season at all. So there's plenty of room for improvement there.

Not necessarily slow down, but they’re playing unbelievably at the moment, thus the individual accolades. I can’t see the baggers expelling anymore out of these guys.

I’ve said it previously, your chances of a top 8 berth rest in the hands of the bottom 6 of your selected 22. You’ve always had quality top liners, and it’s always been a lack of leadership from the experience/contribution from your bottom 6 to follow the top liners that has been your demise.

Next year will be reliant on both those top players continuing to have bloody great seasons whilst also getting more out of the 16th to 22nd player on the ground. It’s not an easy challenge for Voss.

Pies best polled 11 Brownlow votes by comparison in a side that won 16 H&A wins which indicates the spread of the load is far more even, and far less is left to the top few. Roughead played just 1 game, Grundy played 6 games, Adams missed 7 games, Elliott and JDG missed 6 games each - all previously integral to our successes.

Everyone fixates on Collingwood’s winning margins/percentage but it means SFA because it’s incredibly unlikely we’ll get that many close games again next season. Plus, we’ve technically gone 10-8 in close games over the ‘21-‘22 seasons so it’s not like 2022 was the outlier - we had our fair share, and results didn’t go our way in 2021.

 

[Robertio]

Is this a serious question?

In before it gets moved to the Bay.

Thanks for the quick response mate, you could've kept me hanging all day.

 

[JyeDye]

Not necessarily slow down, but they’re playing unbelievably at the moment, thus the individual accolades. I can’t see the baggers expelling anymore out of these guys.

I’ve said it previously, your chances of a top 8 berth rest in the hands of the bottom 6 of your selected 22. You’ve always had quality top liners, and it’s always been a lack of leadership from the experience/contribution from your bottom 6 to follow the top liners that has been your demise.

Next year will be reliant on both those top players continuing to have bloody great seasons whilst also getting more out of the 16th to 22nd player on the ground. It’s not an easy challenge for Voss.

Pies best polled 11 Brownlow votes by comparison in a side that won 16 H&A wins which indicates the spread of the load is far more even, and far less is left to the top few. Roughead played just 1 game, Grundy played 6 games, Adams missed 7 games, Elliott and JDG missed 6 games each - all previously integral to our successes.

Everyone fixates on Collingwood’s winning margins/percentage but it means SFA because it’s incredibly unlikely we’ll get that many close games again next season. Plus, we’ve technically gone 10-8 in close games over the ‘21-‘22 seasons so it’s not like 2022 was the outlier - we had our fair share, and results didn’t go our way in 2021.

Bottom 6 is being fixed but is reliant on injuries. Instead of having most of the season playing Newnes and Plowman we instead have Marchbank, McGovern, Williams. Instead of LOB or Cottrell we bring in Acres next year. Instead of Owies we get more out of Honey, Durdin or Motlop. Instead of Setterfield or Dow we have Hewett or Kennedy. There is heaps of options there to improve that bottom 6 if the youth step up a little and we stop getting smashed with injuries. We were 0.6% out of the eight, I'm not saying these players are the difference to us finishing 1st but they definitely make us 0.6% better.

Only Cripps, Saad and Docherty would have played near their peak this year. Curnow was unreal but if him and McKay can learn to kick straighter they can be even better. Walsh and Weitering were down on previous years. Our starting back six barely played more then one game all together. We had a coach in his first year. We should have made the 8, but if people can't see how we will improve they just simply don't want to.