Analysis Which team out of Essendon, Adelaide, North and Hawthorn has the better youth?

[Strapping Young Lad]

Take it from a fan of a club that used to post rubbish like this....

3rd year kids cannot compete against fully grown men without senior support. You will have to wait at least 5 - 6 years until the current crop of draftees becone consistent afl players.

Hawthorn are a mile off it. This is rock bottom.

Goes without saying that Carlton being trash at drafting and development for years doesn’t mean other clubs will be trash for years also.

 

[Blackhawk42]

Take it from a fan of a club that used to post rubbish like this....

3rd year kids cannot compete against fully grown men without senior support. You will have to wait at least 5 - 6 years until the current crop of draftees becone consistent afl players.

Hawthorn are a mile off it. This is rock bottom.

I'm not bringing up those 3 young players to suggest their improvement will result in us playing finals immediately.

In relation to the question posed in the thread title, I believe Ward, Butler and Macdonald will all improve in 2023 (regardless of whether we finish 9th, 13th or 18th) and our youth as a result will be looked at more favourably by opposition supporters who currently don't rate us in that area.

Also, I really do hope this our rock bottom, because 15 wins and 2 draws in our last two seasons is a strong version of such a claim.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Take it from a fan of a club that used to post rubbish like this....

3rd year kids cannot compete against fully grown men without senior support. You will have to wait at least 5 - 6 years until the current crop of draftees becone consistent afl players.

Hawthorn are a mile off it. This is rock bottom.

Yes, 2023 will be our most inexperienced version for the forseeable future (as well as the most inexperienced in the AFL and would be up there as one of the least experienced ever?). So, 2023 should indeed be the lowest we fall before the climb begins. Nearly every Hawthorn supporter is under no illusions about the expectations of immediate on field success (and are interested in the development of our youth and our build toward our next premiership contending team).

I don't necessarily agree it will take 6 years for us to be competitive again. Yes, that's what happened for Carlton but there are other examples of clubs that bottomed out and became competitive more quickly than that. I acknowledge, however, that A LOT has to go right.

I'm particularly interested to see just how it unfolds in 2023 because many in here seem to be earmarking Hawthorn as comfortably having the worst youth. Yet, in 2022, Hawthorn finished above all 3 sides (depite being favourites on here for the spoon). In Adelaide and North's case, we've finished higher every year of the rebuild thus far. If the reasoning is simply we had the best senior players (contentious IMO) then we should comfortably be the worst performed in 2023 - given we easily have the least senior bodies at the moment (in fact, of our current list of 36 players, 30 are younger than Blake Hardwick, who is 25 ).

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

clearly the crows board/coaching team rate the list with trading out of the draft (was the plan) but imo these players are just not long term players imo

jones, mcasey,worrell (body wise has talent) mchenry, hately,schoenberg, gollant, murphy,hinge,pedlar

in saying that i thinkv soligo looks elite, berry looks a 250 gamer,cook the same, rachele hip injury would be a concern long term fingers crossed its nothing,

sum up nicks needs to win games next year or the heat will come not sure that talent makes them rise above a essendon,

We traded out of the draft to land Rankine & MM as father & son... & have very limited list spots available.

Yes, confident we rate our list more than you.

 

[eth-dog]

clearly the crows board/coaching team rate the list with trading out of the draft (was the plan) but imo these players are just not long term players imo

jones, mcasey,worrell (body wise has talent) mchenry, hately,schoenberg, gollant, murphy,hinge,pedlar

in saying that i thinkv soligo looks elite, berry looks a 250 gamer,cook the same, rachele hip injury would be a concern long term fingers crossed its nothing,

sum up nicks needs to win games next year or the heat will come not sure that talent makes them rise above a essendon,

They're already ahead of us.

 

[Psicosis]

Harsh very harsh on Seamus

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Getting rookied, has clear talent and was a decently high pick. Not “gone”.

 

[VinnieB]

I'm not bringing up those 3 young players to suggest their improvement will result in us playing finals immediately.

In relation to the question posed in the thread title, I believe Ward, Butler and Macdonald will all improve in 2023 (regardless of whether we finish 9th, 13th or 18th) and our youth as a result will be looked at more favourably by opposition supporters who currently don't rate us in that area.

Also, I really do hope this our rock bottom, because 15 wins and 2 draws in our last two seasons is a strong version of such a claim.

That’s the same (improvement) for every team. But if you have strong senior leaders on the field, it’s probably even more likely.

 

[Yoda_]

Who is each teams top 5 players under 22?

Essendon's are probably - Nic Martin, Sam Durham, Ben Hobbs, Archie Perkins and a battle between Nic Cox, Zac Reid &/or Harrison Jones

 

[HeHateMe]

Top 3 would be Newcombe, Day, Ward

It then becomes harder to split Maginness, Stephens, DGB, Kosi, Blanck, Macdonald.

Some people might even include Jeka, Ramsden, Butler, Brockman.

We have a pretty young list.

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Another way to compare these teams would be to ranked each section of the ground into a 1 - 4 with the smallest number being the best.
I'd rank them:

Def: Haw, Ess, Nrth, Adl
Mid: Ess, Nrth, Adl, Haw
Fwd: Adl, Haw, Nrth, Ess

Ess: 7
Haw: 7
North: 8
Adl: 8

Adelaide’s defence is better than Norths

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

Rehashing the old thread is but if a waste imo.

Talent is subjective and hard to measure and 3/4 of the other thread turned into a circle jerk.

I think a better question would be which team make top 4 first or something, as gives something to measure against.

 

[The Nostradamus]

Adelaide’s defence is better than Norths

disagree I’d take our KPD of McKay and Logue with Corr the third tall

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

disagree I’d take our KPD of McKay and Logue with Corr the third tall

Corr? He’s 28, he’s not part of the discussion mate

 

[eth-dog]

Corr? He’s 28, he’s not part of the discussion mate

And he's s**t too

 

[harper2bastinac]

For top 5 under 22 probably tt, Paul Curtis, b scott, Powell and Phillips

 

[The Nostradamus]

Corr? He’s 28, he’s not part of the discussion mate

well ill take our KPD duo of Mckay and Logue over all teams KPD pairings in here

 

[eth-dog]

If I were ranking them on areas of ground:

Def: Hawthorne, Adelaide, Essendon, North
Mid: Essendon, North, Adelaide, Hawthorne
Fwd: Adelaide, Hawthorne, Essendon, North

well ill take our KPD duo of Mckay and Logue over all teams KPD pairings in here

McKay turns 25 in a month and Logue the same next year. Not old but definitely not counted as youth anymore. I'd say anyone born in 2000 or after counts as youth as it stands, maybe 99 at a stretch

 

[Makeshift Park]

If I were ranking them on areas of ground:

Def: Hawthorne, Adelaide, Essendon, North
Mid: Essendon, North, Adelaide, Hawthorne
Fwd: Adelaide, Hawthorne, Essendon, North

McKay turns 25 in a month and Logue the same next year. Not old but definitely not counted as youth anymore. I'd say anyone born in 2000 or after counts as youth as it stands, maybe 99 at a stretch

Okay, if we go from '99, here's our top four for each position (not including Wardlaw and Sheezel):

DEF: Scott, Perez, Young, Goater
MID: LDU, TT, Powell, Phillips
FWD: TT, Paul Curtis, Sleevo, Taylor

Who are you putting forward?

 

[HairyO]

Yes, 2023 will be our most inexperienced version for the forseeable future (as well as the most inexperienced in the AFL and would be up there as one of the least experienced ever?). So, 2023 should indeed be the lowest we fall before the climb begins. Nearly every Hawthorn supporter is under no illusions about the expectations of immediate on field success (and are interested in the development of our youth and our build toward our next premiership contending team).

I don't necessarily agree it will take 6 years for us to be competitive again. Yes, that's what happened for Carlton but there are other examples of clubs that bottomed out and became competitive more quickly than that. I acknowledge, however, that A LOT has to go right.

I'm particularly interested to see just how it unfolds in 2023 because many in here seem to be earmarking Hawthorn as comfortably having the worst youth. Yet, in 2022, Hawthorn finished above all 3 sides (depite being favourites on here for the spoon). In Adelaide and North's case, we've finished higher every year of the rebuild thus far. If the reasoning is simply we had the best senior players (contentious IMO) then we should comfortably be the worst performed in 2023 - given we easily have the least senior bodies at the moment (in fact, of our current list of 36 players, 30 are younger than Blake Hardwick, who is 25 ).

We will find out if Mitchell wants to tank and take pick 1 next year - which will be a challenge because Eagles and Roos are going to also be struggling, or if he really wants to push the list he has to see how they go.

We will know within the 1st month I assume.

But also, we will still beat Geelong on Easter Monday.

 

[eth-dog]

Okay, if we go from '99, here's our top four for each position (not including Wardlaw and Sheezel):

DEF: Scott, Perez, Young, Goater
MID: LDU, TT, Powell, Phillips
FWD: TT, Paul Curtis, Sleevo, Taylor

Who are you putting forward?

Def: Reid, D'Ambrosio, Cox, McBride
Mid: Caldwell, Martin, Durham, Hobbs
Fwd: Jones, Perkins, Menzie, Baldwin

 

[HairyO]

For top 5 under 22 probably tt, Paul Curtis, b scott, Powell and Phillips

Thomas isnt under 22. He will be 23 when the 2023 season starts.

 

[The Nostradamus]

Let’s do this after nov 28 also

As we will be improving our list more than the others in this thread with picks 2,3 and 23

 

[eth-dog]

Let’s do this after nov 28 also

As we will be improving our list more than the others in this thread with picks 2,3 and 23

On paper maybe. We won't know until the kids actually start playing footy.

Who's to say picks 3, 4 and 26 (after F/S) will be better than 5, 15-25 and Davey? They're more likely to be, sure, but we won't know.

 

[harper2bastinac]

Thomas isnt under 22. He will be 23 when the 2023 season starts.

Sorry should have mentioned as of now in the last post.