Jimmy Bartel vs Simon Black

[Plugger46]

Tough one

two different players but I'd take Bartel just for the versatility

 

[Lingsface]

I think those top 3 -4 players in a team are as good as we have had.

Cousins Kerr Judd Cox very good

Ablett Bartel Johnson Scarlett

Gawn Petracca Oliver Viney

Hodge Mitchell Franklin Rioli

It’s very hard to choose the superior but I think Voss Aker Black and Brown are close to the best top 4 players in a side ever.
(Brisbane had Black Brown and White I just realised haha.)

 

[sleep]

Jimmy B a lot more damaging, more tools and a better big game player.

Not really close i would have thought.

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

I’d say it’s pretty even, both superb players who had fantastic careers, not much splits them imo.

Black was my fav player in the early 00’s when the cats were quite average.

 

[Bunnings]

Confucius say “ Geelong player, no win on polls board”

 

[Lingsface]

Jimmy B a lot more damaging, more tools and a better big game player.

Not really close i would have thought.

I don’t know about that black has one of the best grand final performances ever.

 

[Sttew]

Why do we have to decide one is better than the other. Both class acts who are legends of their respective clubs

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

I'd consider picking Black over Sam Mitchell, do this contest isn't even close.

IMO like Sam, Simon Black was incredibly underrated by the media and general public because his work didn't end up on the highlights reel.

 

[danster168]

lol all the cats fans just picking Bartel. Simon Black comfortably.

 

[Sky]

lol all the cats fans just picking Bartel. Simon Black comfortably.

In my case I had to. Black retired when I was 16 and the last time he played in a respectable team was the year I got into footy, 2004. Can’t pretend that I watched many Brisbane games in that timeframe since they sucked.

 

[Sky]

I'd consider picking Black over Sam Mitchell, do this contest isn't even close.

IMO like Sam, Simon Black was incredibly underrated by the media and general public because his work didn't end up on the highlights reel.

Sam Mitchell is on the same level as Selwood and Pendlebury in my opinion

 

[Sttew]

lol all the cats fans just picking Bartel. Simon Black comfortably.

See post 57.

 

[danster168]

See post 57.

So you go onto a polls board to say 'why do a poll?'.

That must be pretty tiring everytime you're on the polls thread. I have no issues with the poll. I just rate Simon Black higher. He had more class, more time with the ball and definitely better by hand.

 

[Sttew]

So you go onto a polls board to say 'why do a poll?'.

That must be pretty tiring everytime you're on the polls thread. I have no issues with the poll. I just rate Simon Black higher. He had more class, more time with the ball and definitely better by hand.

And you come on and make a sweeping statement that ALL Cats supporters picked Bartel when my post, 2 posts earlier, proves otherwise.

Black May have been classier, but Bartel was more versatile, and a better mark over head. He could play midfield, HBF or forward. You were probably too young to remember he turned momentum in Geelong’s way in the 2009 GF.

 

[Partridge]

Simon black. His accolades are better and although I didn’t see him live I’ve heard many people say he was the best or second best player of that lions team behind Voss. I’ll take their word for it. I don’t think Bartel is at that level.

Black.

For what it's worth I think Black was better than Voss as well, and miles better than Akermanis.

 

[danster168]

And you come on and make a sweeping statement that ALL Cats supporters picked Bartel when my post, 2 posts earlier, proves otherwise.

Black May have been classier, but Bartel was more versatile, and a better mark over head. He could play midfield, HBF or forward. You were probably too young to remember he turned momentum in Geelong’s way in the 2009 GF.

Usually I don't use the Brownlow medal as any sort of gauge but Bartel polled 37 votes in the last 7 years of his career. An average of 5.2 per game. Black polled 87. Destroying him. Black was much more consistent and had a bigger influence over games. And that's why he had 68 more Brownlow votes over his career. That is a monstrous difference.

And before you start saying, 'oh but he had to compete with Ablett, Corey, Stevie J etc.', Black had to compete with Voss, Aker, Lappin, Power and Brown.

 

[Sttew]

Usually I don't use the Brownlow medal as any sort of gauge but Bartel polled 37 votes in the last 7 years of his career. An average of 5.2 per game. Black polled 87. Destroying him. Black was much more consistent and had a bigger influence over games. And that's why he had 68 more Brownlow votes over his career. That is a monstrous difference.

And before you start saying, 'oh but he had to compete with Ablett, Corey, Stevie J etc.', Black had to compete with Voss, Aker, Lappin, Power and Brown.

In his last 7 years I think you'll find Bartel rarely if ever played in the midfield. It started in the 2009 GF. He was either a HBF or playing forward, and as we all know only midfielders poll votes. That's why its unfair to compare Bartel with Black. Comparing Bartel with, say, Hodge is more appropriate. Both started as midfielders and then moved into different roles.

 

[danster168]

In his last 7 years I think you'll find Bartel rarely if ever played in the midfield. It started in the 2009 GF. He was either a HBF or playing forward, and as we all know only midfielders poll votes. That's why its unfair to compare Bartel with Black. Comparing Bartel with, say, Hodge is more appropriate. Both started as midfielders and then moved into different roles.

The way I remember it is Bartel played majority midfield from from 2004 onwards. And definitely in his Brownlow year from 2007 onwards. He never played purely forward. in bartels first 9 years, he averaged 0.5 goals per game.

 

[Sttew]

The way I remember it is Bartel played majority midfield from from 2004 onwards. And definitely in his Brownlow year from 2007 onwards. He never played purely forward. in barrels first 9 years, he averaged 0.5 goals per game.

Well you recall different to reality. Bartel won his Brownlow as a midfielder, but he spent a fair whack on the HBF post 2010 and he won his Norm Smith in 2011 as a forward. As you pointed out in your post earlier Cats had Ablett (until 2010), Corey, Ling, Duncan, Selwood, Stevie J, and Kelly in the midfield

 

[danster168]

Well you recall different to reality. Bartel won his Brownlow as a midfielder, but he spent a fair whack on the HBF post 2010 and he won his Norm Smith in 2011 as a forward. As you pointed out in your post earlier Cats had Ablett (until 2010), Corey, Ling, Duncan, Selwood, Stevie J, and Kelly in the midfield

I think you love to say forward when it suits and midfield when it suits. if Bartel was forward, he was a half forward that pushed right into the middle like Josh Dunkley does today.

 

[Sttew]

I think you love to say forward when it suits and midfield when it suits. if Bartel was forward, he was a half forward that pushed right into the middle like Josh Dunkley does today.

Whatever! I think you love to be argumentative

 

[danster168]

Whatever! I think you love to be argumentative

if Bartel played forward, then how come he didn't kick goals?

 

[Sttew]

if Bartel played forward, then how come he didn't kick goals?

He played HBF too. Why are you making such a fuss? Anyone would think you think you know better. Jimmy Bartel was a midfielder for about 4 years and then became a true utility, playing HBF and forward. We didn’t need him in the midfield, particular given how strong an overhead mark he was.

This is what Wikipedia says:

“James Ross Bartel (born 4 December 1983) is a former Australian rules footballer who played for the Geelong Football Club in the Australian Football League (AFL). A utility, 1.87 m (6 ft 11⁄2 in) tall and weighing 89 kilograms (196 lb), Bartel contributed as a midfielder, forward, and defender.”

Footywire says:

Jimmy Bartel
Last played for Geelong in 2016
Born	:​	December 4, 1983
Playing Height	:​	187cm
Playing Weight	:​	87kg
Position	:​	Defender, Midfield

And finally,

“Jimmy obtains the nickname of "Jimmy Everywhere" (and "Jimmy you Superstar") from some of his fans for his ability to pop up on all parts of the ground. He is a very important playmaker for The Cats, creating important passages of play off Half Back, off The Wing, and at Half Forward either assisting goals or kicking the goals himself.”

Australian Football - Jimmy Bartel - Player Bio

australianfootball.com

Hopefully this will curtail your negativity

 

[My Tilly]

Black fairly comfortably and I am a big Jimmy Bartel fan.

Black, Akermanis & Voss would have to be the most brilliant trio we have seen in the modern era.
Lappin did alright too but not quite in the same league as those three.