First 23 in 2024

[Section 5]

From our GF side below i don't think there will be many changes injuries aside for the Blues round 1 game.
Payne in for Lester round 1 v Blues but it could easily be Gardiner.
I think Zorko and McCarthy are quite safe. Zorko the oldest but think he will be okay.

Robertson: Has that GF spot but will have challengers. Lyons GF sub, Tunstill GF emergency and untried Torrent, Depth is not great.
I see some positional changes because of our lack of midfield/wing depth but i am just guessing who that may be.
Possible midfield/wing positional player changes: Wilmot, Fletcher, Sharp, Answerth.

Ah Chee: Injury interrupted 2023 season. He apparently spoke to Fagan about preference being wing/forward role.
Back in AFL round 10 in that wing/forward role. Played quite well but i don't think his spot is safe.
Possible challenges could be one of the above midfield/wing players. Then we have Lohmann. Depth again is not great.

Unlikely but would Fagan try a 3 tall set up. If so, only Brandon Ryan (3 games) and Smith, Lloyd and Morris all yet to debut.
.................................................
At this very early stage i would just have 2 or 3 changes from the GF side.
Out Robertson in Tunstill.
Out Lester in Payne (keep Gardiner v Blues game)

The 3rd change is only if Sharp improves again with another preseason under his belt.
Out Ah Chee in Sharp (Fletcher to move into a wing/forward/midfield role)

LIONS 2023 GF side

B: Starcevich, Andrews, Gardiner

HB: McKenna, Lester, Coleman

C: Berry, Dunkley, Fletcher

HF: Cameron, Hipwood, Zorko

F: Rayner, Daniher, Bailey

FOL: McInerney, Neale, McCluggage

I/C: Robertson, McCarthy, Ah Chee, Wilmot - (Sub Lyons)

EMG: Tunstill, Fort, Payne
..........................................

 

[Mighty Lions]

From our GF side below i don't think there will be many changes injuries aside for the Blues round 1 game.
Payne in for Lester round 1 v Blues but it could easily be Gardiner.
I think Zorko and McCarthy are quite safe. Zorko the oldest but think he will be okay.

Robertson: Has that GF spot but will have challengers. Lyons GF sub, Tunstill GF emergency and untried Torrent, Depth is not great.
I see some positional changes because of our lack of midfield/wing depth but i am just guessing who that may be.
Possible midfield/wing positional player changes: Wilmot, Fletcher, Sharp, Answerth.

Ah Chee: Injury interrupted 2023 season. He apparently spoke to Fagan about preference being wing/forward role.
Back in AFL round 10 in that wing/forward role. Played quite well but i don't think his spot is safe.
Possible challenges could be one of the above midfield/wing players. Then we have Lohmann. Depth again is not great.

Unlikely but would Fagan try a 3 tall set up. If so, only Brandon Ryan (3 games) and Smith, Lloyd and Morris all yet to debut.
.................................................
At this very early stage i would just have 2 or 3 changes from the GF side.
Out Robertson in Tunstill.
Out Lester in Payne (keep Gardiner v Blues game)

The 3rd change is only if Sharp improves again with another preseason under his belt.
Out Ah Chee in Sharp (Fletcher to move into a wing/forward/midfield role)

LIONS 2023 GF side

B: Starcevich, Andrews, Gardiner

HB: McKenna, Lester, Coleman

C: Berry, Dunkley, Fletcher

HF: Cameron, Hipwood, Zorko

F: Rayner, Daniher, Bailey

FOL: McInerney, Neale, McCluggage

I/C: Robertson, McCarthy, Ah Chee, Wilmot - (Sub Lyons)

EMG: Tunstill, Fort, Payne
..........................................

There will be at least 3 spots in the first 23 that will be decided on pre-season form. (in my opinion)

 

[Elixuh]

There will be at least 3 spots in the first 23 that will be decided on pre-season form. (in my opinion)

The rd1 team intrigues me more than what I think we will take into finals (subject to availability). I think there will be 4-5 spots that will be driven by form for rd1.

Linc, Lester, Gardiner, Zorko, Dev.

 

[lionshine]

Possible 2024 Finals Team
B: Brandon Starcevich Harris Andrews Tom Doedee
HB: Conor McKenna Jack Payne Keidean Coleman
C: Hugh McCluggage Josh Dunkley Jaspa Fletcher
HF: Charlie Cameron Eric Hipwood Callum Ah Chee
F: Cameron Rayner Joe Daniher Zac Bailey
Foll: Oscar McInerney Lachie Neale Jarrod Berry
Int: Deven Robertson Lincoln McCarthy Will Ashcroft
Darcy Wilmot Dayne Zorko (sub)

Using this team as a foundation. I think the three spots that may be up for grabs are..Zorko (age/body/form dependent), Linc (whether someone like Kai pushes for his spot) and Dev (on the fringe based on 2023 form but has some low hanging fruit that could propel him in 2024, a wait and see. If the improvement doesn't come might be in and out again).

Before I get flamed. I am a big fan of Linc, Zorko and Dev, love their work.

The only other qualifier is if the AFL gets rid of the sub and increases the bench to 5. I think if they do, we will play 2 rucks with Fort.

That backline looks super strong on paper. In fact every line does.

 

[mpal6]

That backline looks super strong on paper. In fact every line does.

I've been watching Doedee videos, can't believe we got him as unrestricted.
That's a shrewd pickup if/when he returns to the old playing form.

 

[jfn]

2023 Grand Final Team
B: Brandon Starcevich Harris Andrews Darcy Gardiner
HB: Conor McKenna Ryan Lester Keidean Coleman
C: Hugh McCluggage Josh Dunkley Dayne Zorko
HF: Charlie Cameron Eric Hipwood Callum Ah Chee
F: Cameron Rayner Joe Daniher Zac Bailey
Foll: Oscar McInerney Lachie Neale Jarrod Berry
Int: Deven Robertson Lincoln McCarthy Jaspa Fletcher
Darcy Wilmot Jarryd Lyons (sub)

Possible 2024 Finals Team
B: Brandon Starcevich Harris Andrews Tom Doedee
HB: Conor McKenna Jack Payne Keidean Coleman
C: Hugh McCluggage Josh Dunkley Jaspa Fletcher
HF: Charlie Cameron Eric Hipwood Callum Ah Chee
F: Cameron Rayner Joe Daniher Zac Bailey
Foll: Oscar McInerney Lachie Neale Jarrod Berry
Int: Deven Robertson Lincoln McCarthy Will Ashcroft
Darcy Wilmot Dayne Zorko (sub)

Its certainly looking like a strong team, although as we know, we wont see this team until Doedee and Ashcroft return in the second half of the year.
I would like to see players rested a bit more this coming year, like Geelong did at their peak.
Zorko, McCarthy, Berry, and even Rayner and Starcevich have all looked flat at times as the past seasons have progressed.
I'd like to see Answerth get a few more games. He seemed to be finding the ball easily in the @s last season. Like his mongrel too. He's got a bit of Mitch about him.
Prior, Lohmann and possibly Tunstill will probably get a game or two especially if injuries to others occur.
I'd really like to see Torrent, Lloyd and Morris given a chance if the need arises. Particularly the two forwards. I think they could bring a different dynamic to the forward structure.
I really think that those under the pump to hold their spots in the team are Beery and AhChee.

 

[Section 5]

The rd1 team intrigues me more than what I think we will take into finals (subject to availability). I think there will be 4-5 spots that will be driven by form for rd1.

Linc, Lester, Gardiner, Zorko, Dev.

Agree R1 v Blues will be an interesting selection time.
Our round 1 form for a good side could be better.
Since 2018 we have lost 4 and won 2.
Three of the 4 losses were away to Power, Hawks & Saints.
Home games wins against Power, Eagles but a shock loss to Swans who finished 16th the year before.
However, Swans made the 8 that year so that shock loss ended up not looking so bad.

Last year we had 4 new players making their Lions debut in round 1. Dunkley, Ashcroft, McKenna & Gunston
Tunstill played wing and did not get another game till round 20 when subbed off. He was an emergency in the GF.
Prior was sub. He later played full games in round 4, 13, 21 & 22.

Just 2 that you could call surprises selections round 1 in 2023.
Unavailable players for round 1 in 2023: Zorko, Gardiner & Ah Chee

We have won our last 14 games at The Gabba so that run has to end at some stage.
The first 3 games are Blues, Pies and Cats.

 

[Elixuh]

Its certainly looking like a strong team, although as we know, we wont see this team until Doedee and Ashcroft return in the second half of the year.
I would like to see players rested a bit more this coming year, like Geelong did at their peak.
Zorko, McCarthy, Berry, and even Rayner and Starcevich have all looked flat at times as the past seasons have progressed.
I'd like to see Answerth get a few more games. He seemed to be finding the ball easily in the @s last season. Like his mongrel too. He's got a bit of Mitch about him.
Prior, Lohmann and possibly Tunstill will probably get a game or two especially if injuries to others occur.
I'd really like to see Torrent, Lloyd and Morris given a chance if the need arises. Particularly the two forwards. I think they could bring a different dynamic to the forward structure.
I really think that those under the pump to hold their spots in the team are Beery and AhChee.

Two of my biggest watches for 2024 are Rayner and Starce. I think they have significant untapped potential.

There should also be natural progression from some of the younger guys like fletch, Kai and motty

 

[Elixuh]

Agree R1 v Blues will be an interesting selection time.
Our round 1 form for a good side could be better.
Since 2018 we have lost 4 and won 2.
Three of the 4 losses were away to Power, Hawks & Saints.
Home games wins against Power, Eagles but a shock loss to Swans who finished 16th the year before.
However, Swans made the 8 that year so that shock loss ended up not looking so bad.

Last year we had 4 new players making their Lions debut in round 1. Dunkley, Ashcroft, McKenna & Gunston
Tunstill played wing and did not get another game till round 20 when subbed off. He was an emergency in the GF.
Prior was sub. He later played full games in round 4, 13, 21 & 22.

Just 2 that you could call surprises selections round 1 in 2023.
Unavailable players for round 1 in 2023: Zorko, Gardiner & Ah Chee

We have won our last 14 games at The Gabba so that run has to end at some stage.
The first 3 games are Blues, Pies and Cats.

I think the best you can hope for with rd1 is playing a top team from the previous season. 50/50 game and the players won’t underestimate their opponent or overestimate where they’re at after the preseason, like we saw again Port this year.

I also think our boys have had a few valuable lessons in rd1 the last few years which the coaching group will draw on.

So all in all, blues at the Gabba is a good rd1 matchup.

 

[Section 5]

I think the best you can hope for with rd1 is playing a top team from the previous season. 50/50 game and the players won’t underestimate their opponent or overestimate where they’re at after the preseason, like we saw again Port this year.

I also think our boys have had a few valuable lessons in rd1 the last few years which the coaching group will draw on.

So all in all, blues at the Gabba is a good rd1 matchup.

Agree playing the team we beat in the PF is a good round 1 matchup.
They will want revenge big time and we need to have a good start to the year.

The game should be a sellout even at the early Friday time of 6.40pm.

 

[mpal6]

Two of my biggest watches for 2024 are Rayner and Starce. I think they have significant untapped potential.

There should also be natural progression from some of the younger guys like fletch, Kai and motty

Starce felt like receded a bit last year. May be its due to him focusing more on lockdown and all creative work being taken over by Coleman, McKenna, Wilmot etc. 2024 will be an interesting year for him.

Rayner - my biggest bugbear is the amount of top end speed repeat sprints he's working on this off season. No question of what he can do with ball, its about how far he can push himself contest to contest and stay involved. Every time I read Gold Coast articles and how Rowell, Alex Davies are all talking about sprints training - I'll be like "I pray Rayner is doing this as well". Rayner can single-handedly become the biggest difference for us if he builds up on repeat sprints and endurance this off-season.

 

[Mighty Lions]

I've been watching Doedee videos, can't believe we got him as unrestricted.
That's a shrewd pickup if/when he returns to the old playing form.

In fairness, what highlight reel of any given player looks bad???

Tom (like other players before him) wanted to come to Brisbane which helps significantly in getting him...that speaks volumes of the club we support.

 

[Mighty Lions]

Two of my biggest watches for 2024 are Rayner and Starce. I think they have significant untapped potential.

There should also be natural progression from some of the younger guys like fletch, Kai and motty

I think there should be a natural progression from all players 26 years old or less which pretty much accounts for the majority of the list. Providing we have a relatively low injury toll, season 2024 will be a ripper.

 

[mpal6]

In fairness, what highlight reel of any given player looks bad???

Tom (like other players before him) wanted to come to Brisbane which helps significantly in getting him...that speaks volumes of the club we support.

Doedee's highlights showcase a skillset which is a level above (no disrespect) Lester and Gardiner. He can play as key position defender, goes for his pack marks with confidence and rebounds well. it's like we got another backline mainstay now next to Andrews.

I think we have a certain upgrade in our hands when he's ready to go along with Andrews and Payne.

 

[Mighty Lions]

Doedee's highlights showcase a skillset which is a level above (no disrespect) Lester and Gardiner. He can play as key position defender, goes for his pack marks with confidence and rebounds well. it's like we got another backline mainstay now next to Andrews.

I think we have a certain upgrade in our hands when he's ready to go along with Andrews and Payne.

Agree 100% providing he comes back as good as he was before the acl. Fingers & toes crossed he does.
In my opinion comparing Doedee to Lester or Gardner isnt a same same comparison but I get what you are saying....he will slot into our back 6 really really well providing his form returns.

 

[Royboy1961]

I think there should be a natural progression from all players 26 years old or less which pretty much accounts for the majority of the list. Providing we have a relatively low injury toll, season 2024 will be a ripper.

Totally agree with you Mighty Lions the players that were dropped off our list were helpful but really didn’t have an impact on our 1sts. We kept our two most developed reserves players and our list looks fabulous. Giving our reserves players an opportunity will be interesting for me especially if we are winning. We usually have around 4 new players coming into our team by finals time so let’s see who is healthy and playing well.

 

[Berrygood]

I reckon we'll see a big step up from Dev this year. I assume with his re-signing he's been told he'll be getting a consistent start in the best 22. Coming into a preseason without the stress of having to break into the team and the confidence of the coach and team behind him I reckon he'll grow another leg. Barring injury, a long run of games will see him really develop his role. Defensive inside mid and defensive fwd is his role, keep him off the wing.

I also reckon Fletcher will explode if there's no 2nd year blues. The work he does up n down the ground has been terrific and well above his years. Not only will he own a wing this year, he will change the way we play that position.

Starce had a bit of a drop off in 23, he'll bounce back I'm sure. That sm/med defender group of Starce, McKenna, Coleman and Wilmot will become tighter the more they play together. Maybe that adjustment was the reason for his slight drop off.

Round 1 team
Gardiner, Payne, Starce
McKenna, Andrews, Kiddy

Fletcher, Neale, Berry
Big O, Dunkley, Clugg

Linc, Hippy, Bailey
Charlie, Joe, Rayner

Wilmot, Dev, Zorks, definite bench.
Ahchee, Fort, horses for courses.

Finals team.
Doedee, Payne, Starce
McKenna, Andrews, Kiddy

Fletcher, Neale, Berry
Big O, Dunkley, Clugg

Linc, Hippy, Bailey
Charlie, Joe, Rayner

Ashcroft, Wilmot, Dev, definite bench.
Zorko, Ah Chee, Fort, Gardiner, Prior, Lohmann, take ya pick for last cpl of spots. I'm happy with any of them.

 

[Section 5]

Our list changes and who we got to replace them. AFL games in brackets

Adams (73)..... Darragh Joyce

41

Darragh Joyce

Age

28

Ht

195cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.4

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.4

3star

MG

207.6

3star

No current season stats available

D

11.4

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.6

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.4

4star

MG

207.6

4star

(18) Joyce played last year but the official change takes place in 2024.
Rich (275)...... Tom Doedee

12

Tom Doedee

Age

28

Ht

190cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.1

4star

K

8.5

3star

HB

8.6

5star

M

5.6

5star

T

2.6

4star

MG

228.8

4star

D

15.3

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

5.8

3star

M

6.3

5star

T

1.3

2star

MG

228.8

3star

D

19.8

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

9.4

5star

M

6.6

5star

T

1.4

4star

(82) Not available round 1.
Gunston (242). Brandon Ryan (3)
Mathieson (72). Reece Torrent (0)
Fullarton (19).. Logan Morris (0)
Cockatoo (49). Luke Lloyd (0) (a tall forward replacing a small forward)
B Coleman (0) Zane Z (0) (a tall defender replacing a small forward)

McDowell-White (0) Bruce Reville (0) Cat B Rookie

Net experience lost 627 games.
According to draft guru we are 4th in games experience going into 2024 behind Pies, Cats & Demons.
Also 4th in average player age behind the same 3 teams.
So, no real damage done in the experience we lost.

It is hard to get a balanced list, but we are in reasonably good shape.
In my opinion we are lacking a small forward depth wise. Only Lohmann really.
That last midfield spot and depth in that area also a concern especially if injury strikes.
Looking forward to seeing some new faces in that midfield/forward mix in the intraclub games.

Round 1 v Blues i don't see any of the new guys playing, but anything is possible if they show enough skills and team first attitude.

 

[Mighty Lions]

Totally agree with you Mighty Lions the players that were dropped off our list were helpful but really didn’t have an impact on our 1sts. We kept our two most developed reserves players and our list looks fabulous. Giving our reserves players an opportunity will be interesting for me especially if we are winning. We usually have around 4 new players coming into our team by finals time so let’s see who is healthy and playing well.

A bit too " Nunez fairy tale " positive for me but I concur 100%.

 

[Nunez]

A bit too " Nunez fairy tale " positive for me but I concur 100%.

Nothing says overly positive more than being bullish about our chances in 2024 off the back of a close GF loss and many younger players set to hit their prime

 

[Mighty Lions]

Nothing says overly positive more than being bullish about our chances in 2024 off the back of a close GF loss and many younger players set to hit their prime

Shoosh.

 

[Section 5]

We made the 2023 GF and have 17 players with under 20 AFL games experience.
On 2023 form two are best 22 being Ashcroft and Fletcher. Only Fletcher available early.
From the PF teams: Pies have 13, Blues 15, Giants 17

Who from our list of players with under 20 games could get a game in the first 6 rounds.


My first thoughts are no to these players:
Joyce, Madden are injury backup. Same for Lane.
Reville & Brain both Cat B rookies so one or both of Ashcroft & Doedee need to go on LTI list.
The three tall draftees in Lloyd, Morris & Zane Z. Will be very hard for young talls to break into a GF team side early.

Brandon Ryan & Henry Smith only a chance if Fagan decides to go back to his preferred 3 tall set up.
Will Fagan trial this?. I will say yes if the AFL decide to increase players to 23 on game day with no substitute.
This would then give Lloyd and Morris a look-in too.

Carter Michael: Bad injury run so hard to judge. Unlikely but the club re-signed him. Intraclub games a better guide.

Kai Lohmann possibly. I am not sure who he replaces though, unless someone form drops off. Kai should have natural improvement.

James Tunstill (M) and Harry Sharp (W/F/M). Natural improvement from them and i see a spot opening up in rounds 1-6.

Reece Torrent pick 64. More hope than anything else. I think we need another midfielder so let's hope he is a surprise packet in the intraclub games. More than likely the midfield spots will come from positional changes to other players. Or players like Bailey & Rayner spend a little more time in the midfield.

Other posters thoughts on who is a chance early from this inexperienced player list.

 

[Warwick]

We made the 2023 GF and have 17 players with under 20 AFL games experience.
On 2023 form two are best 22 being Ashcroft and Fletcher. Only Fletcher available early.
From the PF teams: Pies have 13, Blues 15, Giants 17

Who from our list of players with under 20 games could get a game in the first 6 rounds.

View attachment 1880340
My first thoughts are no to these players:
Joyce, Madden are injury backup. Same for Lane.
Reville & Brain both Cat B rookies so one or both of Ashcroft & Doedee need to go on LTI list.
The three tall draftees in Lloyd, Morris & Zane Z. Will be very hard for young talls to break into a GF team side early.

Brandon Ryan & Henry Smith only a chance if Fagan decides to go back to his preferred 3 tall set up.
Will Fagan trial this?. I will say yes if the AFL decide to increase players to 23 on game day with no substitute.
This would then give Lloyd and Morris a look-in too.

Carter Michael: Bad injury run so hard to judge. Unlikely but the club re-signed him. Intraclub games a better guide.

Kai Lohmann possibly. I am not sure who he replaces though, unless someone form drops off. Kai should have natural improvement.

James Tunstill (M) and Harry Sharp (W/F/M). Natural improvement from them and i see a spot opening up in rounds 1-6.

Reece Torrent pick 64. More hope than anything else. I think we need another midfielder so let's hope he is a surprise packet in the intraclub games. More than likely the midfield spots will come from positional changes to other players. Or players like Bailey & Rayner spend a little more time in the midfield.

Other posters thoughts on who is a chance early from this inexperienced player list.

If we are to avoid a drop off circa 2006–> we need approx. 6 of those players to make it IMO.

Ashcroft x 2, Fletcher, Wilmot will help but we need some return from that group.

 

[Section 5]

If we are to avoid a drop off circa 2006–> we need approx. 6 of those players to make it IMO.

Ashcroft x 2, Fletcher, Wilmot will help but we need some return from that group.

Excluding Ashcroft and Fletcher
Six is probably a reasonable number as only Lohmann was taken in the top 20 from that list. Next best 31 for Morris

I don't think the Lions have had much success with Cat B rookies in the last 10 years. Maybe Brain & Reville improve that record.
I think Madden and Carter Michael were originally taken as Cat B rookies too,

 

[mattsmob]

Agree 100% providing he comes back as good as he was before the acl. Fingers & toes crossed he does.
In my opinion comparing Doedee to Lester or Gardner isnt a same same comparison but I get what you are saying....he will slot into our back 6 really really well providing his form returns.

Just out of interest if Lester and Gardiner aren’t the same same comparison who would it be? Might be wrong but imo those are the three competing for the third tall defender spot.