Recruiting AFL Trade & Free Agency XII - 💰💰💰

[ghostdog]

Yeah I don’t think it’s an issue, the issue is who he trusts.

He’s got enough of a track record now at Essendon to show that he doesn’t necessarily trust the kids as he should, and if we do a bit of a cull, he’ll have to.

The young player that he’s placed the most genuine trust in to play a key role is Reid at CHB. Reid has basically gone straight into the seniors whenever he’s available.

I think the trust issues were also compounded by the fact that we were winning. He was reluctant to change a winning side, and when we were losing, many of the players he kept playing had done enough for him to think they'd steer us back.

I'd hope that our poor finish to the season now gives him the evidence he needs to accept that we may need to go backwards before finding improvement.

I'm hoping that we cull reasonably deeply, start finding youngsters and actually develop and play them.

I do agree though that one mature key back could be very helpful. Melican?

 

[Highly Evolved]

X factor? you mean someone who shows up once in every 10 games or so and has no clutch factor about him at all. I go to the footy to watch good players play like Langford (when he's not clearly injured), not someone who's a downhill skier.

Pretty much that to be honest. People like the 1 in 10 and if you're bottoming out, then you still need supporters and members.

Regardless of how unreliable Stringer is, he is and always will be a greater drawcard than someone as laconic as Langford.

For a while, I avoided watching players like Langford who looked like they didn't want the footy or contact. He's gotten better, but even when he isn't hurt, he's still not that flash at times.

Either Langford or Stringer are easily replaceable. Langford will get us the better return and to be perfectly honest, he poses more of a risk to list management in my eyes. We're just as likely to give him a 6-year deal at some point like we gave Pidge because he's an "Essendon man".

At the very least, Stringer has at best, probably two years of football and then the decision makes itself.

 

[div12ressie]

is Gresham tradeable? Another soft player that wont take us anywhere imo

 

[andleanback]

Pretty much that to be honest. People like the 1 in 10 and if you're bottoming out, then you still need supporters and members.

Regardless of how unreliable Stringer is, he is and always will be a greater drawcard than someone as laconic as Langford.

For a while, I avoided watching players like Langford who looked like they didn't want the footy or contact. He's gotten better, but even when he isn't hurt, he's still not that flash at times.

Either Langford or Stringer are easily replaceable. Langford will get us the better return and to be perfectly honest, he poses more of a risk to list management in my eyes. We're just as likely to give him a 6-year deal at some point like we gave Pidge because he's an "Essendon man".

At the very least, Stringer has at best, probably two years of football and then the decision makes itself.

Not sure we’d be offering Langford a further 6 considering he’s contracted for another 3

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Talking about exactly what we have been

This group is not good enough. Period.

We need to get Stringer and Shiel out of the way. Get whatever we can for them now.

We need elite talent. We have to trade what we can most afford to let go, and that will land us something in return.

Parish - we have a glut of mids and he’s now slipped behind Caldwell and Durham. And we need to play Hobbs and Tsatas.

Ridley - we thought McKay was a monster 1 on 1 player. He’s not. He’s an interceptor. He can cover Ridley’s position to about 75% - 80% effectiveness. In McKay and Ridley we have far too much money and trade capital locked up in intercept defenders, who really aren’t that hard to find anyway (relatively). It’s the most unaccountable role on the ground.

Parish and Ridley will earn decent trade return.

 

[yodellinhank]

I think the trust issues were also compounded by the fact that we were winning. He was reluctant to change a winning side, and when we were losing, many of the players he kept playing had done enough for him to think they'd steer us back.

I'd hope that our poor finish to the season now gives him the evidence he needs to accept that we may need to go backwards before finding improvement.

I'm hoping that we cull reasonably deeply, start finding youngsters and actually develop and play them.

I do agree though that one mature key back could be very helpful. Melican?

The cold remains of what began with a passionate start.

 

[nipst@r]

More interested in what we trade out or let walk than trade in. We need to keep going to the draft.

Roberts and caddy showed that.

Shiel - trade for cheap
Stringer - let walk
Goldy - let walk

Parish - see what offers or advise may have to play some 2s

Tsatas and hobbs - listen to offers and trade 1. We don't seem to want to just pump games into them despite finishing 10/11

Byran - keep but if he wants to go we just need get a really good return. Future 1st rounder

Baldwin, weideman, wanganeen, davey, heppel - delist

Should see a fair bit of list turnover this year but we will see what actually happens.

Call it rebuild or re-juvenate

 

[ant555]

Come on man. What were the injuries that kept Goldy, Heppell and Kelly in the side?

You can not like it, but those 3 were unquestionably in Scott’s best 22

No injury reasons for Kelly. Only reason he keeps getting a game is there are no AFL, listed guys playing back pocket in the VFL.

 

[Zach Package]

I do agree though that one mature key back

I’d probably go small defender, not key defender to be honest, we’ve got the cattle in key tall backs and seem to find them quite easily. Not a sexy play at all but I’d try to dangle one mid ish pick at Brisbane and try to bring over Noah Answerth and Jaxon Prior given they need points to bring in yet more academy players.

Ridley - we thought McKay was a monster 1 on 1 player. He’s not. He’s an interceptor. He can cover Ridley’s position to about 75% - 80% effectiveness. In McKay and Ridley we have far too much money and trade capital locked up in intercept defenders, who really aren’t that hard to find anyway (relatively). It’s the most unaccountable role on the ground.

Parish and Ridley will earn decent trade return.

All I’ll say about this is that it’s very strange. McKay has conceded more than 3 goals once this year, is second in the AFL in intercept posessions and second for contested marks amongst defenders and in the corresponding game last year Jesse Hogan kicked 9 on Zerk-Thatcher. No one has got a hold of McKay this year.

If he’s overvalued now he’s only overvalued for another week and then he’s worth far less per annum and it becomes a great buy.

Ridley doesn’t play unaccountable anyway, he regularly plays on a dangerous key forward, if he actually played another big key back and we let him off the chain then we’d actually be getting somewhere.

 

[ghostdog]

I’d probably go small defender, not key defender to be honest, we’ve got the cattle in key tall backs and seem to find them quite easily. Not a sexy play at all but I’d try to dangle one mid ish pick at Brisbane and try to bring over Noah Answerth and Jaxon Prior given they need points to bring in yet more academy players.



All I’ll say about this is that it’s very strange. McKay has conceded more than 3 goals once this year, is second in the AFL in intercept posessions and second for contested marks amongst defenders and in the corresponding game last year Jesse Hogan kicked 9 on Zerk-Thatcher. No one has got a hold of McKay this year.

If he’s overvalued now he’s only overvalued for another week and then he’s worth far less per annum and it becomes a great buy.

Ridley doesn’t play unaccountable anyway, he regularly plays on a dangerous key forward, if he actually played another big key back and we let him off the chain then we’d actually be getting somewhere.

A mature small? I'm just thinking of a big body that can take hits. Pick 1267 from the East of nowhere league.

 

[Yoda_]

I’d probably go small defender, not key defender to be honest, we’ve got the cattle in key tall backs and seem to find them quite easily. Not a sexy play at all but I’d try to dangle one mid ish pick at Brisbane and try to bring over Noah Answerth and Jaxon Prior given they need points to bring in yet more academy players.

Harry Sharp and James Tunstill two others. I like the Jaxon Prior one. I suggested him earlier in the year. Has proven he can play at AFL level.

All I’ll say about this is that it’s very strange. McKay has conceded more than 3 goals once this year, is second in the AFL in intercept posessions and second for contested marks amongst defenders and in the corresponding game last year Jesse Hogan kicked 9 on Zerk-Thatcher. No one has got a hold of McKay this year.

If he’s overvalued now he’s only overvalued for another week and then he’s worth far less per annum and it becomes a great buy.

Ridley doesn’t play unaccountable anyway, he regularly plays on a dangerous key forward, if he actually played another big key back and we let him off the chain then we’d actually be getting somewhere.

We have no problem finding key defenders, we just have trouble keeping them on the park and then developing them into something more than passable AFL players.

Ideally next year, if everyone is fit should see the key back situation like this;

KPD1; Ben McKay
KPD2; Zac Reid

KPD3; Jayden Laverde

KPD4; Lewis Hayes

Then we have to decide if we want to push Laverde down the pecking order and go for depth or go for youth and pad out the bottom of this list. With the injury history to Reid,I agree that a mature option is more likely


Is Ridley ever going to be "let off the chain" ? he is 7 years in and we are still saying this. when does it happen? Numerous coaches and they all do the same thing with Jordan

 

[Zach Package]

A mature small? I'm just thinking of a big body that can take hits. Pick 1267 from the East of nowhere league.

Could well be, or a 19 year old from the TAC cup but think it needs to be someone that can play pretty immediately.

I would love to see Tex get a crack and see whether he can make it in that role but we’re either not going to know or it’ll have to be next year.

Lual is a multi year project, which is fine, but we kinda need one that’s immediately selectable.

 

[Yoda_]

Could well be, or a 19 year old from the TAC cup but think it needs to be someone that can play pretty immediately.

I would love to see Tex get a crack and see whether he can make it in that role but we’re either not going to know or it’ll have to be next year.

Lual is a multi year project, which is fine, but we kinda need one that’s immediately selectable.

Matt Foley has lots of tools but probably cant have he and Andy McGrath as below par kicks in the back 6

 

[faible]

Is Ridley ever going to be "let off the chain" ? he is 7 years in and we are still saying this. when does it happen? Numerous coaches and they all do the same thing with Jordan

Either you’ve got a very selective memory or don’t know what ‘let off the chain’ looks like.

Check his games this year, most of them have been playing as a 3rd tall defender, in a couple of games he’s been given roles on very specific guys like Curnow who are (on paper) not a good matchup for McKay or Laverde.

If you want him to dominate, you need to have pressure through the midfield so that he can actually intercept and not be chasing tail as the ball comes flying back in at a million miles an hour.

This is the exact same reason all our defenders look shit. Take McKay or Ridley and play them at Geelong or Sydney and they’ll look like superstars.

 

[jdstorm]

Either you’ve got a very selective memory or don’t know what ‘let off the chain’ looks like.

Check his games this year, most of them have been playing as a 3rd tall defender, in a couple of games he’s been given roles on very specific guys like Curnow who are (on paper) not a good matchup for McKay or Laverde.

If you want him to dominate, you need to have pressure through the midfield so that he can actually intercept and not be chasing tail as the ball comes flying back in at a million miles an hour.

This is the exact same reason all our defenders look shit. Take McKay or Ridley and play them at Geelong or Sydney and they’ll look like superstars.

Also Ridley has also been extra accountable as 2nd tall because they haven’t rated Cox/Hayes as ready to take that role.

 

[ghostdog]

Could well be, or a 19 year old from the TAC cup but think it needs to be someone that can play pretty immediately.

I would love to see Tex get a crack and see whether he can make it in that role but we’re either not going to know or it’ll have to be next year.

Lual is a multi year project, which is fine, but we kinda need one that’s immediately selectable.

I'd forgotten about Tex. It would be great to have a choice between him, Roberts and another small. Not confident about Lual as people have been talking about his inconsistent ball use all year. I thought JDavey had been talked about as a hb option as well?

 

[ghostdog]

Harry Sharp and James Tunstill two others. I like the Jaxon Prior one. I suggested him earlier in the year. Has proven he can play at AFL level.



We have no problem finding key defenders, we just have trouble keeping them on the park and then developing them into something more than passable AFL players.

Ideally next year, if everyone is fit should see the key back situation like this;

KPD1; Ben McKay
KPD2; Zac Reid

KPD3; Jayden Laverde

KPD4; Lewis Hayes

Then we have to decide if we want to push Laverde down the pecking order and go for depth or go for youth and pad out the bottom of this list. With the injury history to Reid,I agree that a mature option is more likely


Is Ridley ever going to be "let off the chain" ? he is 7 years in and we are still saying this. when does it happen? Numerous coaches and they all do the same thing with Jordan

Soz, no. Ideally, if everyone is fit, Laverde is either playing VFL or gone, replaced by Balders.

Unfortunately I don't think either will happen, but the description you've given definitely isn't the ideal.

 

[Yoda_]

Soz, no. Ideally, if everyone is fit, Laverde is either playing VFL or gone, replaced by Balders.

Unfortunately I don't think either will happen, but the description you've given definitely isn't the ideal.

we currently have an oversupply of key backs as it is..

McKay, Laverde (Ridley) play AFL

Weidemann, Reid (Cox) play VFL

Hayes in the wings as well

I think that is too top heavy whilst the underlined are failed forwards or should be there (in Cox's case)

 

[Corleone]

It is not just an excuse. It is simply reality. It is a totally different situation. We have to do what Richmond or Melbourne did and fix the problem of years and years of poor everything before we can say why can we not be like the Hawks. You are in the housing industry . The comparison is you can not build a good house on crap foundations. The Hawks have the foundations. The just had to renovate the house. We have a knock down and build again that has had some bodgy renovations attempted along the way.
The simple fact is too many mistakes have been made.
We now pretty much have a new team to try and fix it but like life there are no guarantees.
It is really only 1 season with all the key players we have now looking to fix the problem.
Do not want to sound like I am saying these guys will get it done. It took Richmond 37 years to get it done. The only thing that is different is we have gone with an all new team and not just had a couple of people come in with all the usual suspects. For now that is all we can do. If they get it wrong then all we can do is start with another new team.
That is our lot.
We are not Hawthorn because we have not built the culture or had anything close to success to build on . We are probably not even the Tigers in Hardwicke's first year as we have no Dusty or Riewodlt and co.

Posts like this are the reason we should be able to "like" multiple times. Spot on.

 

[Zach Package]

Is Ridley ever going to be "let off the chain" ? he is 7 years in and we are still saying this. when does it happen? Numerous coaches and they all do the same thing with Jordan

Dumb coaches that haven’t got it right.

If you built a 3rd man up intercept marking loose defender from the ground up it would look like Ridley.

 

[bomberlegend2007]

Talking about exactly what we have been

This group is not good enough. Period.

We need to get Stringer and Shiel out of the way. Get whatever we can for them now.

We need elite talent. We have to trade what we can most afford to let go, and that will land us something in return.

Parish - we have a glut of mids and he’s now slipped behind Caldwell and Durham. And we need to play Hobbs and Tsatas.

Ridley - we thought McKay was a monster 1 on 1 player. He’s not. He’s an interceptor. He can cover Ridley’s position to about 75% - 80% effectiveness. In McKay and Ridley we have far too much money and trade capital locked up in intercept defenders, who really aren’t that hard to find anyway (relatively). It’s the most unaccountable role on the ground.

Parish and Ridley will earn decent trade return.

Again, it just shows how reactionary some supporters and media are in this day and age.

Tsatas being a miss? He is two years into the system. That is a laughable comment from GW.

Hawthorn at the start of the year and when they were 0-5 were being questioned about their talent and list build.

Some in the media were talking up Essendon as flag contenders. How can the list be “in the mix for a flag” but also missing the boat?

 

[jdstorm]

Again, it just shows how reactionary some supporters and media are in this day and age.

Tsatas being a miss? He is two years into the system. That is a laughable comment from GW.

Hawthorn at the start of the year and when they were 0-5 were being questioned about their talent and list build.

Some in the media were talking up Essendon as flag contenders. How can the list be “in the mix for a flag” but also missing the boat?

To answer your final question

Good Talent that overlaps and leaves huge gaps in the list.

 

[Bjchan13]

Definitely should be in the market for a no frills small defender that can play now. If we can't get one in a trade id draft the most ready to go. Look in all the state leagues as well for a mature ish ager. Wouldn't hurt to train Guelfi purely as a small defender over the pre season

 

[bombreys]

Again, it just shows how reactionary some supporters and media are in this day and age.

Tsatas being a miss? He is two years into the system. That is a laughable comment from GW.

Hawthorn at the start of the year and when they were 0-5 were being questioned about their talent and list build.

Some in the media were talking up Essendon as flag contenders. How can the list be “in the mix for a flag” but also missing the boat?

He said ‘looks like’ a miss. Which right now, he absolutely does. He can’t kick and is stuck in the VFL unable to get a game for an 11th placed side, one game away from the end of his second season.

 

[bomberlegend2007]

He said ‘looks like’ a miss. Which right now, he absolutely does. He can’t kick and is stuck in the VFL unable to get a game for an 11th placed side, one game away from the end of his second season.

So, by your logic, Watson would have been a miss, two years into his career?

What happened to giving players time to develop?