Rumour 2024 Rumours and Speculation Part 3

[Mostyn]

What percentage of ruckmen are drafted by a club and become a success for that club, as compared to those who are traded in, or those who don't amount to anything at all?

And how does it compare to using that pick on another position of need?

That's a genuine question. At a glance, most successful clubs seem to have a high percentage of traded rucks. It does look like you only need them to be okay, and you can only play one.

That being said, Bicks list of late draft picks who could have been taken is pretty persuasive.

Our mids, small defenders and forwards and tall defenders and forwards all seem pretty strong. Maybe too much depth in small defenders and we should have traded that depth for another ruck.

 

[FR0GGY]

What percentage of ruckmen are drafted by a club and become a success for that club, as compared to those who are traded in, or those who don't amount to anything at all?

And how does it compare to using that pick on another position of need?

That's a genuine question. At a glance, most successful clubs seem to have a high percentage of traded rucks. It does look like you only need them to be okay, and you can only play one.

That being said, Bicks list of late draft picks who could have been taken is pretty persuasive.

Our mids, small defenders and forwards and tall defenders and forwards all seem pretty strong. Maybe too much depth in small defenders and we should have traded that depth for another ruck.

But had those rucks stayed at that club they may have been successful?

 

[Scorpus]

What percentage of ruckmen are drafted by a club and become a success for that club, as compared to those who are traded in, or those who don't amount to anything at all?

And how does it compare to using that pick on another position of need?

That's a genuine question. At a glance, most successful clubs seem to have a high percentage of traded rucks. It does look like you only need them to be okay, and you can only play one.

That being said, Bicks list of late draft picks who could have been taken is pretty persuasive.

Our mids, small defenders and forwards and tall defenders and forwards all seem pretty strong. Maybe too much depth in small defenders and we should have traded that depth for another ruck.

So of current number 1 rucks

Drafted: O'Brien (Adelaide), McInerney (Brisbane), De Koning (Carlton), Draper (Essendon), Darcy (Fremantle), Briggs (GWS), Gawn (Melbourne), Xerri (North Melbourne), Marshall (St Kilda), Williams (West Coast), English (Western Bulldogs)

Traded: Cameron (Collingwood), Jackson (Fremantle), Stanley (Geelong), Witts (Gold Coast), Meek (Hawthorn), Sweet (Port Adelaide), Nankervis (Richmond), Grundy (Sydney)

And of the backups

Drafted: Strachan (Adelaide), Smith (Brisbane), Cox (Collingwood), Bryan (Essendon), Conway (Geelong), Moyle (Gold Coast), Read (Gold Coast), Reeves (Hawthorn), Teakle (North Melbourne), Visentini (Port Adelaide), Ryan (Richmond), Heath (St Kilda), Boyd (St Kilda), Green (Sydney), Barnett (West Coast), Darcy (Western Bulldogs)

Traded: Fort (Brisbane), Pittonet (Carlton), Goldstein (Essendon), Keeffe (GWS), Fullarton (Melbourne), Campbell (Melbourne), Soldo (Port Adelaide), Ladhams (Sydney), Flynn (West Coast), Lobb (Western Bulldogs)

It looks to me like most of the premier ruckmen in the competition are drafted, but clubs with a ready to go backup have traded them in

 

[George CantStandYa]

What percentage of ruckmen are drafted by a club and become a success for that club, as compared to those who are traded in, or those who don't amount to anything at all?

And how does it compare to using that pick on another position of need?

That's a genuine question. At a glance, most successful clubs seem to have a high percentage of traded rucks. It does look like you only need them to be okay, and you can only play one.

That being said, Bicks list of late draft picks who could have been taken is pretty persuasive.

Our mids, small defenders and forwards and tall defenders and forwards all seem pretty strong. Maybe too much depth in small defenders and we should have traded that depth for another ruck.

Shouldn’t the question also include mids, forwards and defenders?

 

[Mostyn]

So of current number 1 rucks

Drafted: O'Brien (Adelaide), McInerney (Brisbane), De Koning (Carlton), Draper (Essendon), Darcy (Fremantle), Briggs (GWS), Gawn (Melbourne), Xerri (North Melbourne), Marshall (St Kilda), Williams (West Coast), English (Western Bulldogs)

Traded: Cameron (Collingwood), Jackson (Fremantle), Stanley (Geelong), Witts (Gold Coast), Meek (Hawthorn), Sweet (Port Adelaide), Nankervis (Richmond), Grundy (Sydney)

And of the backups

Drafted: Strachan (Adelaide), Smith (Brisbane), Cox (Collingwood), Bryan (Essendon), Conway (Geelong), Moyle (Gold Coast), Read (Gold Coast), Reeves (Hawthorn), Teakle (North Melbourne), Visentini (Port Adelaide), Ryan (Richmond), Heath (St Kilda), Boyd (St Kilda), Green (Sydney), Barnett (West Coast), Darcy (Western Bulldogs)

Traded: Fort (Brisbane), Pittonet (Carlton), Goldstein (Essendon), Keeffe (GWS), Fullarton (Melbourne), Campbell (Melbourne), Soldo (Port Adelaide), Ladhams (Sydney), Flynn (West Coast), Lobb (Western Bulldogs)

It looks to me like most of the premier ruckmen in the competition are drafted, but clubs with a ready to go backup have traded them in

That's a pretty good stat.

I wonder if it's the same for, say, key defenders?

Honestly, it probably is.

We should have drafted someone, I think that's clear. I think our current position isn't a disaster, though. We finally have most other areas covered, I think.

 

[George CantStandYa]

That's a pretty good stat.

I wonder if it's the same for, say, key defenders?

Honestly, it probably is.

We should have drafted someone, I think that's clear. I think our current position isn't a disaster, though. We finally have most other areas covered, I think.

You’ve been arguing for months now that we shouldn’t have drafted anyone and have supported the approach we’ve taken.

 

[GreyCrow]

You’ve been arguing for months now that we shouldn’t have drafted anyone and have supported the approach we’ve taken.

Its a big turning circle

Eventually end up into the we need Draper lets pay millions car park

 

[George CantStandYa]

Its a big turning circle

Eventually end up into the we need Draper lets pay millions car park

Without emotion

 

[Coopers]

Its a big turning circle

Eventually end up into the we need Draper lets pay millions car park

I still don't want him unless he has a good year.

In which case, stitching him up this early on will retrospectively be a good decision, whereas currently the concept seems baffling and I'd rather just have Izak run around holding a broom with a wig stapled to it for a similar effect.

 

[GameofSloanes]

The thing is - is that true? Clubs put terrible rucks in, and still do fine at clearances.

Honestly, I'm not sure. Logic says you're right - but does the evidence back it up?

I think for other clubs they can still win clearances because they have good midfields. Whereas the last few years ours has been awful. That is changing now so could potentially be less of a problem than it was if we didn't have a decent ruck

 

[DJ75]

Something that follows the ruck discussion.
I know the club spoke with a young guy at the end of last year who could be a longer term prospect and a Cat B recruit.
The lad is 19 I think, 6 foot 10 (and possibly still growing) and a basketballer. He played footy until U16's.
He's very skinny so couldn't play SANFL yet, but was definitely someone you could look at, train etc with an eye to bringing on board later. He is however starting to fill out. His dad is 6 foot 8 and built like an out house. He will be a very big 24 year old.

So anyway, we sent one of our guys to meet with him. They had a conversation and the club promised to be in contact once the trades and draft periods had been completed. We said late Nov/early Dec.

We have not made contact again. Nothing. Not a text message, not a phone call, nothing.

 

[Mutineer]

Something that follows the ruck discussion.
I know the club spoke with a young guy at the end of last year who could be a longer term prospect and a Cat B recruit.
The lad is 19 I think, 6 foot 10 (and possibly still growing) and a basketballer. He played footy until U16's.
He's very skinny so couldn't play SANFL yet, but was definitely someone you could look at, train etc with an eye to bringing on board later. He is however starting to fill out. His dad is 6 foot 8 and built like an out house. He will be a very big 24 year old.

So anyway, we sent one of our guys to meet with him. They had a conversation and the club promised to be in contact once the trades and draft periods had been completed. We said late Nov/early Dec.

We have not made contact again. Nothing. Not a text message, not a phone call, nothing.

It's good being 213cm but more importantly what are his athletic attributes?

 

[cleanhands]

Something that follows the ruck discussion.
I know the club spoke with a young guy at the end of last year who could be a longer term prospect and a Cat B recruit.
The lad is 19 I think, 6 foot 10 (and possibly still growing) and a basketballer. He played footy until U16's.
He's very skinny so couldn't play SANFL yet, but was definitely someone you could look at, train etc with an eye to bringing on board later. He is however starting to fill out. His dad is 6 foot 8 and built like an out house. He will be a very big 24 year old.

So anyway, we sent one of our guys to meet with him. They had a conversation and the club promised to be in contact once the trades and draft periods had been completed. We said late Nov/early Dec.

We have not made contact again. Nothing. Not a text message, not a phone call, nothing.

Great PR

 

[DJ75]

It's good being 213cm but more importantly what are his athletic attributes?

Shouldn't we find out? Get him down to the club, have him kick a ball around a few times?
If that goes ok, we could have him do some fitness work, see if he has the desire.
Surely we should at least look?

 

[Scorpus]

Shouldn't we find out? Get him down to the club, have him kick a ball around a few times?
If that goes ok, we could have him do some fitness work, see if he has the desire.
Surely we should at least look?

Well it's not even that. If we say to someone we'll contact them in the future, then never do, that alone is poor

 

[skam85]

You’ve been arguing for months now that we shouldn’t have drafted anyone and have supported the approach we’ve taken.

emotions get the better of us all sometimes

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

That's a pretty good stat.

I wonder if it's the same for, say, key defenders?

Honestly, it probably is.

We should have drafted someone, I think that's clear. I think our current position isn't a disaster, though. We finally have most other areas covered, I think.

It's not a disaster yet but could easily become one.

Consider our transition from Jacobs to ROB.
ROB overtook Jacobs in 2019, when Jacobs was only 31.
ROB turns 30 this year, if he follows a similar career timeline then we are running out time to find a replacement.
And unlike Jacobs ROB does not have the skills or footy IQ to compensate if he starts getting niggling injuries.

Given the lack of trade options, we're likely going to be forced to over pay for a mediocre Ruck like Draper, and this is probably the best case scenario.

If ROB gets an injury this season or we miss out on Draper, we are up the creek without a paddle.

 

[Mutineer]

Shouldn't we find out? Get him down to the club, have him kick a ball around a few times?
If that goes ok, we could have him do some fitness work, see if he has the desire.
Surely we should at least look?

Yeah fine by me, he'd be cat B rookie initially right?

Just don't understand the club's stand against drafting a young developing ruck, generally can be had for minimal draft capital or even as a rookie, especially given both our lead ruck and back up ruck are virtually the same age. Seems very strange to me given there have been plenty of "cheap" options available through the draft ever since Strachan was pulled from the Bendigo Football League.

 

[dogs105]

Seriously?

Does our midfield have a record of winning games regularly when getting smashed in the ruck?

How did we go when Strachan couldn't run out games...

Hopefully Strachan is fully recovered from his groin injury if he plays this year

 

[FR0GGY]

Shouldn't we find out? Get him down to the club, have him kick a ball around a few times?
If that goes ok, we could have him do some fitness work, see if he has the desire.
Surely we should at least look?

Why? They obviously didn’t do that with obrien.

 

[cleanhands]

Why? They obviously didn’t do that with obrien.

Nasty

 

[Cromulant]

Hopefully Strachan is fully recovered from his groin injury if he plays this year

Should worry about his foot first

 

[FR0GGY]

Yeah fine by me, he'd be cat Bafl cat B rookie initially right?

Just don't understand the club's stand against drafting a young developing ruck, generally can be had for minimal draft capital or even as a rookie, especially given both our lead ruck and back up ruck are virtually the same age. Seems very strange to me given there have been plenty of "cheap" options available through the draft ever since Strachan was pulled from the Bendigo Football League.

Exactly it’s just one spot on the list.

 

[AFC979810]

Yep could be, just like any mid, forward or defender could make it.

Correct. But it was more important to try and find quality at those positions over the past 5 years since we had ROB.

ROB is still just 29 years old. Realistically the plan would have been to have ROB until 2027/2028.

Draft someone, we have some common ground, that’s what some of us have stating for years, use one draft pick on a list of what 42 players, if they don’t look like making it cut them and go again.

As I said previously - more important to find other players especially since we were a non contending list.

So it looks like most of us agree though that the clubs approach, if it pans out that way and we recruit Draper on big money, is the wrong move. At least had we drafted a developing ruck we might not be in this position.

I would be over the moon if we managed to steal a ready made ruck for a 2nd or 3rd rounder and save the cash for elsewhere.

 

[Scorpus]

So we drafted ROB onto the list when Jacobs was just 26 years old, three years earlier than the position we are in now.

The equivalent would have been us drafting a developing ruck in 2021