Hot Topic Michael Voss - Coaching in 2026. Should he remain beyond that?

[Juice030103]

Good chance hes gone i think

 

[jj1978]

If he comes and coaches I'd be scared as hell to know how the club made that happen....

you know considering he is currently not living....

Yes I know.

 

[Juice030103]

Who are good assistants at the moment? History has shown second time coaches in the modern era don’t work. Best way to go is get a young coach

 

[CarmenSandiego]

Voss did inherit this list when the top end talent was entering/in their peak though...

Teague had it too, which is why he was sacked for 'underperforming'.

Our list isn't and never has been good enough for a coach to waltz in and take us to contention every year. The comp is even, everyone's got the same salary cap.

Our top end talent are in their prime, and have been for a while, but the rest of the squad has always been questionable.

Do I think Voss should've taken us to a flag by now? Honestly, probably not - there are some ****ing good teams & lists around. Injuries haven't helped.

Do I think he could've coached better though? Absolutely.

I could be wrong, they might sack him. But I repeat, on paper, looking at it logically, he's had 1 really poor year (assuming 2025 continues this way). The decision will be made based on that, not an angry 'we demand excellence & take no prisoners' feel.

 

[JustaBattler]

I agree with you it’s the fundamentals but I think it’s the players failure to execute basic fundementals rather than not having them drilled into them by the coaches. Any system would look overworked and tired when we make the mistakes we do.

A few plays that IMO sum this core group of players up to a tee happened last night.
- SOS dropping a chest mark which would have resulted in a set shot 40 metres out directly in front, instead has to find it on the ground and snap hurriedly on his wrong foot almost miraculously kicking the goal only for it to be touched on the line
- Weitering and TDK trying to take a pack mark inside D50 instead of spoiling the Hawks forward resulting a set shot goal for the Hawks
- Docherty dropping a sitter that would have been a set shot for goal before 3 quarter time

If those 3 basic errors were avoided we have a live game. Couple this with the number of game we have lost over the years due to poor goal kicking by primarily Harry and Charlie and for me these errors are a hallmark of this group. We may have to accept the players are not capable of executing.

pretty obvious by now I wouda thought

itsa middling list with some ageing overpaid plodders and some aversge hardworking sometimes role players and some injured overpaid stars

 

[Stamos]

Who said anything about taking it easy?

Sure, train the fundamentals, focus on kicking - does it not stand to reason that you're going to be a better kick if you're starting from a higher base skill-wise before that training?

They train it more than we do.
It is a bigger focus from the top than it is for us.

There's not one way to win a game/season of footy.
Undoubtedly elite kicking helps, but the main thing is to maximise your performance. Improving fundamentals across your list is going to have a bigger impact on being successful than recruiting in some better kicks.

 

[Jatz]

Who are good assistants at the moment? History has shown second time coaches in the modern era don’t work. Best way to go is get a young coach

Won't matter, we've tried that as well.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Teague had it too, which is why he was sacked for 'underperforming'.

Our list isn't and never has been good enough for a coach to waltz in and take us to contention every year. The comp is even, everyone's got the same salary cap.

Our top end talent are in their prime, and have been for a while, but the rest of the squad has always been questionable.

Do I think Voss should've taken us to a flag by now? Honestly, probably not - there are some ****ing good teams & lists around. Injuries haven't helped.

Do I think he could've coached better though? Absolutely.

I could be wrong, they might sack him. But I repeat, on paper, looking at it logically, he's had 1 really poor year (assuming 2025 continues this way). The decision will be made based on that, not an angry 'we demand excellence & take no prisoners' feel.

Teague didn't have a peak Charlie Curnow... nor did he have a clue how to coach either.

The expectations with Voss have shifted drastically compared to when we had Teague. We went from expecting to make finals in 2021, to expecting top 4 in 2025 (as we should given the stature of the list)

A lot will depend how the year plays out, but if we miss finals or struggle to make the 8 again and bow out without a whisper in the finals then it will be very difficult for Voss to retain. It won't be a re-sign for 1 year deal... it'll be 3 years if they decide to stick fat with him...

 

[Stamos]

I agree with you it’s the fundamentals but I think it’s the players failure to execute basic fundementals rather than not having them drilled into them by the coaches. Any system would look overworked and tired when we make the mistakes we do.

A few plays that IMO sum this core group of players up to a tee happened last night.
- SOS dropping a chest mark which would have resulted in a set shot 40 metres out directly in front, instead has to find it on the ground and snap hurriedly on his wrong foot almost miraculously kicking the goal only for it to be touched on the line
- Weitering and TDK trying to take a pack mark inside D50 instead of spoiling the Hawks forward resulting a set shot goal for the Hawks
- Docherty dropping a sitter that would have been a set shot for goal before 3 quarter time

If those 3 basic errors were avoided we have a live game. Couple this with the number of game we have lost over the years due to poor goal kicking by primarily Harry and Charlie and for me these errors are a hallmark of this group. We may have to accept the players are not capable of executing.

It's not about 3 basic errors that could have gone the other way.
It's about a base percentage improvement across the whole list, whatever their ability, across the whole season. It would make a huge difference.

 

[bourbons]

They train it more than we do.
It is a bigger focus from the top than it is for us.

Do they?

Says who?

 

[CarmenSandiego]

Teague didn't have a peak Charlie Curnow... nor did he have a clue how to coach either.

The expectations with Voss have shifted drastically compared to when we had Teague. We went from expecting to make finals in 2021, to expecting top 4 in 2025 (as we should given the stature of the list)

were those the clubs expectations? i had us missing the 8. our playing list got worse in the off season, not better. i reckon voss knew it too which is why he doesn't look that surprised right now.

A lot will depend how the year plays out, but if we miss finals or struggle to make the 8 again and bow out without a whisper in the finals then it will be very difficult for Voss to retain. It won't be a re-sign for 1 year deal... it'll be 3 years if they decide to stick fat with him...

i really struggle to see it - if we do, the industry will lay into us. our list simply isn't good enough to be sacking our coach after 1 really poor year.

he's contracted for next year, imo they'll leave him there, get him a senior figure to help & refresh the assistants.

unless there's a player mutiny, scandal or a review finds astoundingly poor results, i can't see them sacking him.

 

[Juice030103]

Won't matter, we've tried that as well.

Nah one day it will work. Hold the faith. We really aren’t that far away we just need to change a few things

 

[Stamos]

Do they?

Says who?

Their coaches.
Have heard it from McRae and Mitchell.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Who said anything about taking it easy?

Sure, train the fundamentals, focus on kicking - does it not stand to reason that you're going to be a better kick if you're starting from a higher base skill-wise before that training?

Cerra was considered one of the more talented kicks playing football when he arrived...

 

[HarryFlashman]

Cerra was considered one of the more talented kicks playing football when he arrived...

He’s had that coached out of him in a hurry, must have been considered a poor talent to have as it makes others look bad

 

[JustaBattler]

Cerra was considered one of the more talented kicks playing football when he arrived...

Hawthorn beat Carlton yesterday by outrunning the outside players at Carlton - their kicking game was totally nullified by good coaching and prep.

Carlton LOST the game yesterday because senior players dropped marks and missed goals- these are the facts.

It is a middling list which means sometimes good stuff is strung together and is good enough to get a win by a few goals or less and sometimes crap happens and you lose games by a few goals.

Judged against better opposition: Cottrell Fogarty Williams and Motlop dont even get a game in firsts now add Docherty, Young and Haynes to that list.

It is a scrubby list with too many players that you cant count on in a clinch - liek McGovern and Harry McKay

On top of which you have unfit Charlie and a half broken Walsh as cherries on top.

Vos's total game style is built around a few players he can trust to perform and fingers crossed the rest arent having a collective bad day ( as in Richmond) or arent beaten easy due to their limitations ( liek Hawthorn did yesterday).

Embrace reality mate - it makes it more fun and interesting.

 

[CarmenSandiego]

It is a middling list which means sometimes good stuff is strung together and is good enough to get a win by a few goals or less and sometimes crap happens and you lose games by a few goals.

yep .

Judged against better opposition: Cottrell Fogarty Williams and Motlop dont even get a game in firsts now add Docherty, Young and Haynes to that list.

what's up with the motlop hate today? thought he was good last night, barring a couple of errors.

It is a scrubby list with too many players that you cant count on in a clinch - liek McGovern and Harry McKay

yep

Embrace reality mate - it makes it more fun and interesting.

agreed. i've accepted the list is middling, and am excited to see some kids come on this year with some changes in the off-season. we don't need a rebuild - just some fresh players & ideas, in exchange for a few of our old ones (both players & ideas).

 

[bourbons]

Their coaches.
Have heard it from McRae and Mitchell.

Personally? Or reported - do you have a link?

Not having a go, I'd just find it mind blowing if we're not already doing the basic building blocks/fundamentals stuff that other more successful teams are doing, that beggars belief (which isn't to say its not true, knowing us )

 

[bourbons]

Cerra was considered one of the more talented kicks playing football when he arrived...

Carlton'd

verb

to reduce an individual's skills and value via contact with the Carlton Football Club



Seriously though - if we're not doing the basics in training that other more successful clubs are doing thats absolutely bananas

 

[Stamos]

Personally? Or reported - do you have a link?

Not having a go, I'd just find it mind blowing if we're not already doing the basic building blocks/fundamentals stuff that other more successful teams are doing, that beggars belief (which isn't to say its not true, knowing us )

In interviews.
I've heard McRae say it multiple times. Absolutely emphasised that Fundamentals is the most important thing.

Mitchell I think it was on 360 last week.

Never heard it from Voss.
Some posters have said that he's said the opposite.
Training watchers have said it's not our focus.

 

[bourbons]

In interviews.
I've heard McRae say it multiple times. Absolutely emphasised that Fundamentals is the most important thing.

Mitchell I think it was on 360 last week.

Never heard it from Voss.
Some posters have said that he's said the opposite.
Training watchers have said it's not our focus.

Hmm

Fair enough

 

[blue healer]

My thoughts are above on sacking Voss, I don't think the club will do it. So, my wish list is:

- A senior mentor for Voss - Longmire, Simpson or similar. Senior coaches absolutely HATE this because they think the club doesn't have faith in them or are gearing up to knife them. But Voss won't be in a position to make demands, if he doesn't like it, he can resign.

- Just take the ****ing tactics off him. This was meant to be the deal from the start, I've got no idea what's happened. Coach from the bench, monitor the players mindset & coach the fundamentals, keep him away from strategy & tactics.

- I've got NFI about the assistant situation - apparently Hansen is a gun tactician and senior coach in waiting? Is that all bullshit? Is he being ignored by Voss? I don't know enough, so I can't really comment. But a shake up of assistants is probably required.

- Several list changes, that I'll share in the relevant thread.

If you have to keep the head coach away from strategy and tactics what reason is there to keep him around?

I see a lot who believe that Voss is a great motivator but, honestly, I see no evidence of this when I watch us play.

I've said before that I believe that he is a big chance of ruining what should be a very good list. Sadly I suspect that may have already happened. Struggling to name one player who I think is better now than they were 1,2,3 or 4 years ago, perhaps TDK but I don't see Voss as being responsible for that,

 

[De Iulio2Wiggins]

Agree with the principle, but who would those 3 kids coming in be?

I've got 1, Moir.

Binns and Wilson last night, I'd rather see kids with upside have terrible games than players who are past it or never had it. Binns was not terrible in cameos last year.

Campo B and Carroll as suggested by others.

 

[SolGoodman]

Our biggest problem is that we have the worst combo of weaknesses, poor kicking skills and super slow.

Usually the slow players are the elite kickers, but not at Carlton, at Carlton you get both... [emoji854]

Sent from my V2405A using Tapatalk

 

[katmanblue]

In WA? They are still making the transition to 3G over there.

Good enough. Can coach with the help of this advanced technology.



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