List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[St Neil]

makes me sick people criticising bassats rant. This is exactly why it’s not fair. And you’re an absolute idiot if think it’s fair

These academies are just zoning with a different label.

It’s obscene.

It’s why the achievements of these Northern clubs will be forever tainted.

 

[SaintsofSteel]

All academies continue to grow and become more productive, perhaps the AFL should cap the amount of academy players any team can take each year eg 1 X academy & 1 X father son or 2 total bid on in top 30.

Collingwood this year are going to access to 2 or 3 FS and a number of academy players. Gold Coast & Brisbane could have as many as 3 top 20 players.

The top 30 is going to be that comprised this year it will make the draft a mockery. We also saw how many clubs wanted to trade out of this draft last year and the number of linked players has only grown.

 

[The Punter]

All academies continue to grow and become more productive, perhaps the AFL should cap the amount of academy players any team can take each year eg 1 X academy & 1 X father son or 2 total bid on in top 30.

Collingwood this year are going to access to 2 or 3 FS and a number of academy players. Gold Coast & Brisbane could have as many as 3 top 20 players.

The top 30 is going to be that comprised this year it will make the draft a mockery. We also saw how many clubs wanted to trade out of this draft last year and the number of linked players has only grown.

It's been a mockery since automatic priorities picks were abolished. They were an excellent makeweight against the father-son rule.

 

[ScrappyDo]

.
Bigger question is if we land TDK do we consider trading Marshall I think a ruthless club would do it. I really worry how they are going to work as a pair. Marshall is turning 30 but probably has 5 years left but not sure he is going to want to be our 2nd ruck / forward for those 5 years. Would be a tough call given how much he has given to the club but if the offers are good enough it is probably the smart move.

Chances of trading Marshall are near zero.
As demonstrated we have no KPP cover at all right now. In 2-3 years that will look different but during that time it will be Marshall that fills that need.
We'll also have no genuine ruck depth for the same period.

 

[Nutsngum]

These academies are just zoning with a different label.

It’s obscene.

It’s why the achievements of these Northern clubs will be forever tainted.

I dont think anyone is going to care in the future. No one now gives an iota of a **** that Hawthorn lobbied, and got, the zones freezed that allowed them to select sides that won 5 premierships in the 80s. Zones that were meant to be transferred to St Kilda.

If I had my way I'd burn that club and the tip its squatting on to the ground and dump the remains on Glenferrie oval.

 

[PoppedCorn]

I dont think anyone is going to care in the future. No one now gives an iota of a **** that Hawthorn lobbied, and got, the zones freezed that allowed them to select sides that won 5 premierships in the 80s. Zones that were meant to be transferred to St Kilda.
If I had my way I'd burn that club and the tip its squatting on to the ground and dump the remains on Glenferrie oval.

 

[Sarcoidevo]

But they get to keep the best ones. C'mon, Joff, you and I both know this can't endure.

I understand the game development aspect of the northern academies, which is why I would tolerate one selection outside the draft per season. Everyone else just goes into the draft.

Clubs should only be allowed to match one selection from their academy per draft ..... any others then become available to any other club that picks them

You could even go a step further and add Father-Son draftees to the mix

So in the case of Brisbane last year ... their first matched bid was Levi Ashcroft ..... after that then they wouldn't be allowed to match any other Academy or F-S that another club picked .... or if you don't incl. F-S players to the mix then they would have been able to match Sam Marshall (Sydney pick) but not Ty Gallop (Geelong pick) later on

 

[StCicatriz]

Thought it was just about the money..
Go on....

Unhappy with how they're going...

 

[Joffaboy]

Unhappy with how they're going...

Sure, that is a fair speculation, I haven't seen anything reported.
Only thing I have seen reported is that he wanted to stay at the Blues but the offer was life changing.
The fact that he has not let things linger and put talks on hold with Carlton may well give what you say some legs though.

 

[PoppedCorn]

can we offer naz and tdk the same?
reckon we have enough coin?

front end naz so he can buy a massive place and then family can travel all the time to watch him play if need be
must retain him at a minimum to free agecy

 

[ScrappyDo]

Clubs should only be allowed to match one selection from their academy per draft ..... any others then become available to any other club that picks them

You could even go a step further and add Father-Son draftees to the mix

So in the case of Brisbane last year ... their first matched bid was Levi Ashcroft ..... after that then they wouldn't be allowed to match any other Academy or F-S that another club picked .... or if you don't incl. F-S players to the mix then they would have been able to match Sam Marshall (Sydney pick) but not Ty Gallop (Geelong pick) later on

The philosophical question is how do you make fair something that is fundamentally designed to be unfair.

Developing AFL pathways in rugby territory is the primary goal. In reality there's very few prospective junior players that would be in the junior rugby system that could be swayed to AFL, mostly because of physical make up. By the same token there are many more that can't make it in rugby for the same reason. Those players and every other kid are the targets which leans toward omitting elite juniors from the bidding system, or simply put: no bids in the 1st round.

On the surface that works, but supporting the franchise clubs requires them to get some extra elite talent.

In reality the best system was the initial one. Let the franchise teams have a slightly bigger list and a bit more SC. It's the cowardice of the AFL that let the whole thing get perverted and they have now painted themselves into a corner, however the massive size of the northern academy zones is doing exactly what they want.

To me the answer is to:
1. Give those clubs say an extra 4 cat B places specifically to sift through local non-drafted talent..
2. Introduce trading of the draftee on the night, prior to the selection announcement. No more priority access or discounts.
3. This is the tough one. Openly support the franchise clubs with an extra 1stRDP immediately after their natural pick.
4. AFL to take control of the Northern Academies, and all other NGAcademies be abolished.

Would the league have the balls to do this? Not a chance.

 

[jumperfan]

I think the best solution to the academy issue is to just remove any priority access in the first round whether it be NGA, Academy or Father/Son. This ensures the best talent ends up at the clubs that most need it but also allows clubs pretty generous access to talent that they have developed.

 

[The_Steadier]

Perhaps even more relevant is Nasiah’s own IG version of the story

If only it were forbidden to live interstate from your siblings...

 

[triggering bro]

We should investigate the contract status of Jake Bowey.
Grew up a big Saints fan and would be perfect replacement for Webster.

For some reason I cannot like this guy. Red headed mutant, no thanks.

 

[ScrappyDo]

For some reason I cannot like this guy. Red headed mutant, no thanks.

Agreed. Not a fan at the best of times but you wouldn't let one in just as things are starting to go good. Madness.

 

[Yawkey way]

Chances of trading Marshall are near zero.
As demonstrated we have no KPP cover at all right now. In 2-3 years that will look different but during that time it will be Marshall that fills that need.
We'll also have no genuine ruck depth for the same period.

Too late value is gone, he’s worth more at the club.

 

[Yawkey way]

For some reason I cannot like this guy. Red headed mutant, no thanks.

Too small

 

[saintbill]

Max King

Multiple players found. Use birthday to differentiate. eg [PLAYERCARD="23/11/1962"]Joe Smith[/PLAYERCARD]

won't play again in 2025. That will be 2 years on a list where he hasn't played. 2 crap years where he played half a year and was ordinary trying to regain form, 1 year establishing himself, and I good but not great year.

6 years and 1 good year of footy. Looking like we have a bust on our hands to me. We have to stop taking about him becoming a gun of the AFL now. His body is cooked, and he looks anxious every time he is out there.

Regardless he has huge flaws in his game and the game is passing him by. His value has plummeted in the open market.

Giving him a contract to 2032 is one of the dumbest list management decisions I have seen from any club. The worst was giving Hanners a long term deal.

If we want to be taken seriously as a club we have got to stop doing such idiotic things.

We need to find a key forward ffs and stop seeing King as the saviour. Passed on 200cm Whitlock last draft. Got absolutely no backup for a bloke that never plays, nor are we even developing one.

Relying on Max King

Multiple players found. Use birthday to differentiate. eg [PLAYERCARD="23/11/1962"]Joe Smith[/PLAYERCARD]

to be something he will never be is killing us.

 

[jumperfan]

Max King won't play again in 2025. That will be 2 years on a list where he hasn't played. 2 crap years where he played half a year and was ordinary trying to regain form, 1 year establishing himself, and I good but not great year.

6 years and 1 good year of footy. Looking like we have a bust on our hands to me. We have to stop taking about him becoming a gun of the AFL now. His body is cooked, and he looks anxious every time he is out there.

Regardless he has huge flaws in his game and the game is passing him by. His value has plummeted in the open market.

Giving him a contract to 2032 is one of the dumbest list management decisions I have seen from any club. The worst was giving Hanners a long term deal.

If we want to be taken seriously as a club we have got to stop doing such idiotic things.

We need to find a key forward ffs and stop seeing King as the saviour. Passed on 200cm Whitlock last draft. Got absolutely no backup for a bloke that never plays, nor are we even developing one.

Relying on Max King to be something he will never be is killing us.

 

[saintbill]

A contract this stupid deserves a melt. What club would give a bloke a 8 year contract that never plays and form has actually regressed since 2022?

Could have waited 12-18 months to see how his form is. Nah, not necessary at the big brain Saints. Let's just throw cash and a long term deal at him now.

We will never learn.

 

[Sir Owens]

I think the best solution to the academy issue is to just remove any priority access in the first round whether it be NGA, Academy or Father/Son. This ensures the best talent ends up at the clubs that most need it but also allows clubs pretty generous access to talent that they have developed.

100% this or at the very least if a player is bid on in the first round, clubs have to use a first-round draft pick.

Such a rort that clubs can land gun players with picks in the late 30’s and mid 40’s.

 

[ThomasR]

100% this or at the very least if a player is bid on in the first round, clubs have to use a first-round draft pick.

Such a rort that clubs can land gun players with picks in the late 30’s and mid 40’s.

Not perfect by any means but the new DVI this year will make it a lot harder for clubs to accumulate late picks to match bids

Last year Brisbane for example matched Ashcroft at pick 5 with picks 40,42,43,46

This year those picks would only be sufficient to match pick 16

Will be interesting to see how clubs with multiple linked prospects go about it

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

if only we had some visionary, nostradamus-esque poster on here that could have predicted this abysmal king timeline and called to trade him for mids in 2022, we very well could have been sitting pretty with 2 extra A grade mids or first round picks..

obviously easy to make such calls on here with no skin in the game, but sometimes it feels like we don't have the cut throat analytical mindset needed when it comes to list management

anyway he'll probs get up for the flag in 2026

 

[Saints43]

Sure, that is a fair speculation, I haven't seen anything reported.
Only thing I have seen reported is that he wanted to stay at the Blues but the offer was life changing.

I feel like that's the narrative that the Big 4 promotional departments like Fox Footy and the Herald Sun are running with because we can't have St Kilda being preferred to the mighty Carlton.
I don't think there have been any quotes from TDK or his manager to that effect.

TDK must be looking at their last 20 matches, coming up to a full season now, with only wins against north and the eagles.

And his manager must be looking at a club that hasn't selected a really good coach since David Parkin.

Why would you stay there would surely be as much of a question as why would you join St Kilda. And that's before you factor in the money.

 

[botts]

I feel like that's the narrative that the Big 4 promotional departments like Fox Footy and the Herald Sun are running with because we can't have St Kilda being preferred to the mighty Carlton.
I don't think there have been any quotes from TDK or his manager to that effect.

TDK must be looking at their last 20 matches, coming up to a full season now, with only wins against north and the eagles.

And his manager must be looking at a club that hasn't selected a really good coach since David Parkin.

Why would you stay there would surely be as much of a question as why would you join St Kilda. And that's before you factor in the money.

Voss is a couple of bad loses away from being sacked. They have one good kid coming through Walsh has gone backwards through injury, Cripps is 30 and his body is beaten up. Why would you stay. Come play with an exciting young team and one of the best coaches going around. Pretty easy sell to be honest