Preview 2025 Rd 9 Carlton vs St Kilda Friday 9th May 7:40PM AEST @ MCG

[Aphrodite]

Over to the Game Day thread …

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/rnd-9-🏈-carlton-v-st-kilda-game-day-🏈.1395666/

 

[COBALT BLUE]

I'll be brutal here - if there isn't a huge response/better performance this week, Voss should go immediately.

(by which I mean a decent win, with the right effort levels..)

Enough excuses.

Who you bring in?
MM?

 

[Y Goat]

In: JSoS
Out: Don't care as there are multiple candidates.

Request...please stop running 2/3 Carlton players at the single opposition player to then be handballed over their head allowing opponents to break free in overlap. It's as stupid as it gets with this side.

After watching Weitering i now think it is JSoS that is the heart of the backline. What a gun, and literally the only player with a defensive mental profile i like in our side. You see it in the losses, not the wins.

Noticed the above aswell, we did it constantly vs Crows, but not as much when playing well vs Cats and North.

Seems players need a directive, to read situation & identify that if one teammate’s in there going after the guy with the ball, back teammate to tackle properly, and move toward the likely next target/recipient (anticipate) to shut down the Oppo’s release option

Is a huge factor in the difference between the results Crows v Cats/North.

 

[JustOneTime]

Noticed the above aswell, we did it constantly vs Crows, but not as much when playing well vs Cats and North.

Seems players need a directive, to read situation & identify that if one teammate’s in there going after the guy with the ball, back teammate to tackle properly, and move toward the likely next target/recipient (anticipate) to shut down the Oppo’s release option

Is a huge factor in the difference between the results Crows v Cats/North.

Agree with your point on Cats/North. I didnt see it in those games. But i think it is a pattern when our backs arent against the wall. It has been there for a couple of years 'on average'. It is something I see the Pies really good at annoyingly.

This is a small thing i think missed as detail by our coaching group.

 

[Soapy V]

Soapy V Can't agree that a win against the taints doesn't matter.

I never said it doesn't matter. I said in the scheme of things (big picture) it doesn't mean a lot. We should win but doesn't change the fact for me we are long way from where we should be

 

[bringdoullback]

I won't be watching Crows game. So have a q.

Did we play and extra at the stoppages? If so the game plan may have been to win the contest. And having 2 players hunt is part of the plan. It may be that the other mids didn't manage the outside players adequately or there was confusion on who stayed out.

Either way, we are a contested based footy team. Most weeks we win that battle and we five ourselves a chance. Sounds like on the weekend crows beat us at our core strength.

Saints game I expect us to continue contested game, and hopefully clean up a few things around the stoppages.

Agree Sos has been terrific down back, and he coming in makes a big difference.

Sub is a conundrum for us. We don't seem.to have the right types available or flex in team to adjust. Doc is the right player but his form means it's not working.

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Freo?

Port

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Agree with all that. I just can't currently justify his place in the team, other than a wing option.

That requires a high level of repeat endurance, unfortunately his not built for the wing role…

 

[sweethoney]

I won't be watching Crows game. So have a q.

Did we play and extra at the stoppages? If so the game plan may have been to win the contest. And having 2 players hunt is part of the plan. It may be that the other mids didn't manage the outside players adequately or there was confusion on who stayed out.

Either way, we are a contested based footy team. Most weeks we win that battle and we five ourselves a chance. Sounds like on the weekend crows beat us at our core strength.

Saints game I expect us to continue contested game, and hopefully clean up a few things around the stoppages.

Agree Sos has been terrific down back, and he coming in makes a big difference.

Sub is a conundrum for us. We don't seem.to have the right types available or flex in team to adjust. Doc is the right player but his form means it's not working.

Crows just played keeping’s off. Just kicked the ball around a lot and didn’t allow it to be played how we’d liked it to be played

 

[KnaveyBlue]

Did we play and extra at the stoppages? If so the game plan may have been to win the contest. And having 2 players hunt is part of the plan. It may be that the other mids didn't manage the outside players adequately or there was confusion on who stayed out.

All our players continually collapsed into the contest. Crows set up around the contest, usually with two loose on the defensive side. As soon as the ball spilled out of a contest we were dead in the water.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

Who you bring in?
MM?

Nic Newman to coach the team for rest of year.

Possibly only half joking!

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

INS: Silvagni Boyd Cowan Binns
OUT: Docherty Acres Lord Fogarty

Boyd Weitering Haynes
Carroll Silvagni Saad
Hollands Cripps Walsh
Elijah McKay White
McGovern Curnow Durdin

DeKoning Cerra Hewett

Young Motlop Binns Cowan (w/m)

Acres Lord Fogarty

Not much in the reserves that are at the required level of production & consistency yet, development needed with many whilst a few have been a little disappointing altogether…

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Crows just played keeping’s off. Just kicked the ball around a lot and didn’t allow it to be played how we’d liked it to be played

Which we far to easily allowed them too, pressure accountability positioning defensively team ethos was an absolute mess…

 

[passmark]

Crazy thing is if we won buy 5 goals we’re an outside chance of being 8th at the end of the round.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

Hopefully it is safe to return here after a very disappointing loss last week.

So far this year Carlton have;
averaged 67 tackles a game, on the weekend they laid 46 and still won the tackle count by 10.
averaged 142 contested possessions a game - last week we had just 112 (losing by 17)
averaged 41 clearances a game, last week we had just 30 (losing by 8)
The league best DE per game is 75.4% (the Crows have been averaging 73.1%) last week the Crows averaged 80% DE

Basically we got beaten at the contest & clearance and then the Crows were exceptional with their ball use which prevented us getting our game going (the crows had 255 uncontested possession while the league best average is 238 while also taking 120 marks while the league best average is 102).

I really think that it was much more a case of the Crows being exceptional than us being terrible and is we can get a big response from our on ball brigade at the clearance/contest this week we should be a massive chance against the Saints.

 

[Accidental genius]

Crazy thing is if we won buy 5 goals we’re an outside chance of being 8th at the end of the round.

We used to buy players but if there was a way to buy goals we'd be champions again

 

[JustaBattler]

INS: Silvagni Boyd Cowan Binns
OUT: Docherty Acres Lord Fogarty

Boyd Weitering Haynes
Carroll Silvagni Saad
Hollands Cripps Walsh
Elijah McKay White
McGovern Curnow Durdin

DeKoning Cerra Hewett

Young Motlop Binns Cowan (w/m)

Acres Lord Fogarty

Not much in the reserves that are at the required level of production & consistency yet, development needed with many whilst a few have been a little disappointing altogether…

I'd stick with the team that beat Geelong which means the only change I would make is for Cottrell who is a definite out.

IN: Silvagni (if available) Cowan
OUT: Young, Docherty
Sub: Lord

Binns isn't an AFL player and Boyd is showing very little in VFL possibly an alternative to Carrol if Carrol gets sore but we need to get games into hm and White. Hopefully Cincotta starts playing soon and we can get him ripe for after the bye. There is not much else in VFL to even talk about - based on form.You can see the difference between VFL and AFl eevn in a player like Docherty who had an enormous last quarter against Norths in VFL and when back in to AFL was ineffective ( again) Young is only a defender in break glass situation - much prefer him as a forward/ruck.

 

[JustaBattler]

Hopefully it is safe to return here after a very disappointing loss last week.

So far this year Carlton have;
averaged 67 tackles a game, on the weekend they laid 46 and still won the tackle count by 10.
averaged 142 contested possessions a game - last week we had just 112 (losing by 17)
averaged 41 clearances a game, last week we had just 30 (losing by 8)
The league best DE per game is 75.4% (the Crows have been averaging 73.1%) last week the Crows averaged 80% DE

Basically we got beaten at the contest & clearance and then the Crows were exceptional with their ball use which prevented us getting our game going (the crows had 255 uncontested possession while the league best average is 238 while also taking 120 marks while the league best average is 102).

I really think that it was much more a case of the Crows being exceptional than us being terrible and is we can get a big response from our on ball brigade at the clearance/contest this week we should be a massive chance against the Saints.

yep - the only 'caveat' on your analysis is opposition can only play their game as much as Carlton allows it to happen - the effort/execution was below par but Adelaide are also massively under rated - they should have beaten Geelong - like Carlton did.

St Kilda will be a willing at the contest team with less all ground ability and less forward line polish their playmakers are Wanganeen Millera, Sinclair, Hill and Wilson.

Win the contest and Carlton wins the game - simple as that.

 

[BJuddy]

Hopefully it is safe to return here after a very disappointing loss last week.

So far this year Carlton have;
averaged 67 tackles a game, on the weekend they laid 46 and still won the tackle count by 10.
averaged 142 contested possessions a game - last week we had just 112 (losing by 17)
averaged 41 clearances a game, last week we had just 30 (losing by 8)
The league best DE per game is 75.4% (the Crows have been averaging 73.1%) last week the Crows averaged 80% DE

Basically we got beaten at the contest & clearance and then the Crows were exceptional with their ball use which prevented us getting our game going (the crows had 255 uncontested possession while the league best average is 238 while also taking 120 marks while the league best average is 102).

I really think that it was much more a case of the Crows being exceptional than us being terrible and is we can get a big response from our on ball brigade at the clearance/contest this week we should be a massive chance against the Saints.

Great Summary JR... but my issue was more so that we let it happen without really firing a shot. That too me was what was so disappointing.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

Great Summary JR... but my issue was more so that we let it happen without really firing a shot. That too me was what was so disappointing.

Yeah we were off but the Crows did a great job of keeping the ball out of a contest - just 82 tackles for the game between both sides is roughly what Carlton usually lay themselves.

Adelaide's ability to retain the ball and rack up marks just denied the Blues the opportunity to exert the "effort" we have seen in the last month.

I would also ask how many times watching the game did you see the Crows take a kick into the middle that looked for all the world like the Blues would create the turnover only for the kick to be centimetre perfect? The Crows took risks that paid off massively on the weekend but on another day could have cost them.

 

[JimmyRabbit49]

I'd stick with the team that beat Geelong which means the only change I would make is for Cottrell who is a definite out.

IN: Silvagni (if available) Cowan
OUT: Young, Docherty
Sub: Lord

Binns isn't an AFL player and Boyd is showing very little in VFL possibly an alternative to Carrol if Carrol gets sore but we need to get games into hm and White. Hopefully Cincotta starts playing soon and we can get him ripe for after the bye. There is not much else in VFL to even talk about - based on form.You can see the difference between VFL and AFl eevn in a player like Docherty who had an enormous last quarter against Norths in VFL and when back in to AFL was ineffective ( again) Young is only a defender in break glass situation - much prefer him as a forward/ruck.

Silvagni in for Young is a massive change - Young wasn't terrible but is defence only and is slowness when in possession allows the opposition to set up, SOS gets the ball moving fast and provides a real bounce.

 

[RAPPA]

Silvagni in for Young is a massive change - Young wasn't terrible but is defence only and is slowness when in possession allows the opposition to set up, SOS gets the ball moving fast and provides a real bounce.

Young and Weitering just don't work. Young has shown promise forward of centre. But in the back half, we can't afford to carry an additional flaky player when we also have Gov and Haynes. This is where the backline depth is a problem. Hopefully JSOS is fit to play.

 

[JustaBattler]

Silvagni in for Young is a massive change - Young wasn't terrible but is defence only and is slowness when in possession allows the opposition to set up, SOS gets the ball moving fast and provides a real bounce.

Some player outs cost more than just a role player out .

eg take Dangerfield out of the Geelong V Collingwood game and Collingwood win Dangerfield ( literally carried Geelong team on his shoulders in one burst quarter )

 

[SurreyBlue]

Young and Weitering just don't work. Young has shown promise forward of centre. But in the back half, we can't afford to carry an additional flaky player when we also have Gov and Haynes. This is where the backline depth is a problem. Hopefully JSOS is fit to play.

Young should have played deeper on Thilthorpe and Weitering should have taken Walker. Big error playing Young on Walker who ran him around. Weitering should have taken ownership, - that’s leadership - instead as per normal wanted to play his game and ignore what is best for the team. Just disppointing.

 

[BJuddy]

Young should have played deeper on Thilthorpe and Weitering should have taken Walker. Big error playing Young on Walker who ran him around. Weitering should have taken ownership, - that’s leadership - instead as per normal wanted to play his game and ignore what is best for the team. Just disppointing.

Wow. Some big calls there SB. I can't say i have noticed JW putting himself above the team.

 

[Soapy V]

If we are smart and honest we will start playing the younger blokes over the next month or so

Lucas, Ben, Binns, Wilson, HOK, Lemmey should all get a taste to see if they what it takes. We aren't going to win the flag and playing VFL isn't helping them at all

Docherty & Fantasia should retire before MSD and I would try some things like Evans as a small defender or Cowan on a wing

We need to properly assess every option