List Mgmt. 2025 List Management 📃

[Chamber JJJ]

We may not agree but, how TF would Silvagni be 50/50 , so just on his few games available he has owned controlled directed the backline, has nullified or beaten his direct opponents…

His poise, ball use and decision making has been outstanding…

Unlike a few other defenders who don’t defend their opponent properly or actually defend for their teammates…

Coming off his man to impact a contested situation, marking by contesting & defendiing contests is the most natural and influential key defender on our list..

50/50 depends on how much he puts over his head he will stay if Doc, Mcgovern and maybe if Walsh and Mckay move to other club paying their contract. Newman and Haynes would be on the cheap or don't get contact simple over 30 you don't pay much when their young ones that can develop on the cheap. Silvagni on his few games available he has owned controlled directed the backline like you said but he is near 30 starting to get injured not a great kick at times but try hard so your not giving him a long contract more likely 2 years. I think Wright will do hard decision see who in Carlton 5 year plan. I would trade Mckay try getting Bergmen and Walsh he has back issues that never goes away as much i like him may be best interest to get a early pick in 2026 draft not this year. I am not sure we have other players we could trade getting better or a position needed I don't think a Motlop and Kemp going to get something better or Pitto getting something descent. Ollie Holland and Cowan are better being kept both young but may get you something different like a small forward if you can replace them. The other Holland is talented but doesn't deserve a list spot over the other young players off contact yes has talent but doesn't have the right attitude to have team success. He may get a spot as a rookie if his mental health improve but if he isn't playing your basically have 1 spot less on list than other clubs that not good.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

In regards to fixing our situation there are a few points that are key to that.

1. Keep our core.

Trading McKay, DeKoning, Curnow, Weitering, Cripps Walsh etc is not the go. None of the successful sides of the last 30 years have taken this approach. Teams like us and melbourne and North have and it's totally f**ked them. Trade one and only if we have to. Our goal should still be to build a side around them and if we can do that then we will win a premiership that way. Offloading our core would be the start of another full rebuild and that is something we really do not want.

2. Stop worrying about age.

Yes we have a lot of core players who are 27 or 28. So what. Teams like Geelong and Collingwood have shown time and time again that having older players who have quality and expierence in your side is absolutly key to building a premiership winning side. Lets not look to write players off because they are 30-33. Lets expect that we can get quality and invaluable expierence from players who are 35-38 years old. It's not just Collingwood and Geelong who can have players this age who are playing good football, it can be us as well. I am expecting that those core players will still be playing good footy when they are 34 and potentially onwards.

3. Patience.

Fixing our team's issues is going to take around 3 years but it could take more. We have made mistakes recruiting. Lack of pace, kicking skills and genuine forwards. I've been calling it since 2022 and we have done nothing. With Graeme Wright there this will be the end of it and with some academy and father sons coming on we have some real talent being gifted to us. Keeping the band together is crucial.

4. Trading and delisting.

It should not come from the top and it can not come from the bottom. To make salary cap room and bring in draft picks it will have to come from the mid tier of our best 22. Who lacks pace, isn't really top level and isn't really a great kick? Who can we afford to lose? If we are trading/offloading I am thinking it will be the likes of McGovern, Williams, Both Hollands brothers, Acres, Moir, Pittonet and possibly Kemp and Docherty. I think anyone who is an average to poor kick is in trouble first and formost. I called it mid way through last season that we should be looking at having a big clean out of small forwards because none of them can really play. I still hold to that. We can easily replace these guys with our youth, trades and out of the draft.

5. My vision of a good carlton side is one with Weitering, Silvagni, Cripps, Cerra, Walsh, Curnow, McKay and DeKoning. BUT it has to have a lot more pace and good skills around it. It's a very dangerous side if we add some genuine talent to the half back line wings and some genuine proper smaller forwards to that group. Fixing the makeup of the list and developing a modern game plan around that is a dynamite side. We currently do not have the list to play a modern game plan and that core of talented players is going to waste.

Paitence is key.

 

[JJBagger]

Two things.

How would people feel if we offered TDK $1.3M to stay

And

How do we rate Bergman?

1. Not terrible, but seems like overs for us imo
2. Gun. Great drive, solid user, and can be effective both as a running defender and mid

 

[reubsblues]

Re TDK asking for a meeting to see what are the likely changes... I like it.
Why wouldn't you ask the question. I don't think that he's dictating what he wants etc. I think it's smart to at least ask what may be changing, certain changers may swing you one way or the other..... Wouldn't you want to know if you were about to commit 5-7 years.... I would.

I hope he asked for a new coach
One with a modern game plan and can adapt
During a game

 

[Chamber JJJ]

None of the successful sides of the last 30 years have taken this approach. Those players have had success Mckay hasn't got the mental toughness that why if you can get better or something back younger in a position you do it. Walsh is different but he is similar to Kreuzer both were very good but now needed management we seen how Kreuzer ended with Walsh Back issues that never goes away you manage it. He will never be the same player like he was designed to be you were better off these days with a knee injury missing a year. Back Issues linger for life once you develop . Carlton have a history of players after them never the same. Walsh would have likely been our next Captain if not for it.

 

[reubsblues]

In regards to fixing our situation there are a few points that are key to that.

1. Keep our core.

Trading McKay, DeKoning, Curnow, Weitering, Cripps Walsh etc is not the go. None of the successful sides of the last 30 years have taken this approach. Teams like us and melbourne and North have and it's totally f**ked them. Trade one and only if we have to. Our goal should still be to build a side around them and if we can do that then we will win a premiership that way. Offloading our core would be the start of another full rebuild and that is something we really do not want.

2. Stop worrying about age.

Yes we have a lot of core players who are 27 or 28. So what. Teams like Geelong and Collingwood have shown time and time again that having older players who have quality and expierence in your side is absolutly key to building a premiership winning side. Lets not look to write players off because they are 30-33. Lets expect that we can get quality and invaluable expierence from players who are 35-38 years old. It's not just Collingwood and Geelong who can have players this age who are playing good football, it can be us as well. I am expecting that those core players will still be playing good footy when they are 34 and potentially onwards.

3. Patience.

Fixing our team's issues is going to take around 3 years but it could take more. We have made mistakes recruiting. Lack of pace, kicking skills and genuine forwards. I've been calling it since 2022 and we have done nothing. With Graeme Wright there this will be the end of it and with some academy and father sons coming on we have some real talent being gifted to us. Keeping the band together is crucial.

4. Trading and delisting.

It should not come from the top and it can not come from the bottom. To make salary cap room and bring in draft picks it will have to come from the mid tier of our best 22. Who lacks pace, isn't really top level and isn't really a great kick? Who can we afford to lose? If we are trading/offloading I am thinking it will be the likes of McGovern, Williams, Both Hollands brothers, Acres, Moir, Pittonet and possibly Kemp and Docherty. I think anyone who is an average to poor kick is in trouble first and formost. I called it mid way through last season that we should be looking at having a big clean out of small forwards because none of them can really play. I still hold to that. We can easily replace these guys with our youth, trades and out of the draft.

5. My vision of a good carlton side is one with Weitering, Silvagni, Cripps, Cerra, Walsh, Curnow, McKay and DeKoning. BUT it has to have a lot more pace and good skills around it. It's a very dangerous side if we add some genuine talent to the half back line wings and some genuine proper smaller forwards to that group. Fixing the makeup of the list and developing a modern game plan around that is a dynamite side. We currently do not have the list to play a modern game plan and that core of talented players is going to waste.

Paitence is key.

This is 100% right so many people have no idea about football and the game
This man does

 

[katmanblue]

Really annoys me that people here were stating Cottrel was out for the season weeks ago, yet we still only took one player in the MSD.

Why wouldn’t we try and have a look at someone? What harm could it have done?

In the two weeks since the MSD we have Cottrel ruled out for the season and Hollands reported as out for the season.

Crap by Austin

I was calling out for mean to be on the inactive list so we could go for another player. There's ALWAYS another season ending injury.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

what’s the hold up with jacks next contract ?

He’s been injured but he’s only just returned from an acl so I see it as a bit of a teething problem and expect his durability to ramp up this year.

The year hasn't ended why does anyone get a contract you wait too see what happens with TDK. Hewitt comes cheap it easy to do Lemmey, Wilson, White contract all basic wage small contact . The rest can wait you don't see Motlop contact. I am sure everyone even Haynes, Mcgovern. Doc and even Newman will wait. My personal view Silvagni gets 2 years but depends on amount although if i was running club and him being near 30 what his Dad doing to the club with TDK and we lose TDK i would let his son go. Hey just imagine your company getting one of your best in your business then we getting something back in a weaker draft. The Company has that guy in the organization who been their been a handy worker then your Dad takes your best talent you be pretty pissed off making your organization weaker. I would be a bit pissed off if i was Jack what his Dad doing to Carlton club going for TDK he could have gone targeting other club. SOS has become a turncoat i bet if John Elliot was alive he would have a few nasty words been sent his way. SOS had a big part with or Loss of draft picks as well as our 30 years of disaster since mark my words he didn't need to talk Fraser Brown kept quiet. SOS and Ian Collins in my opinion have destroyed the club since 2001. John Elliot would have won in court if club didn't remove him 100% pity Go Fund Me wasn't around. The Millions would have been made for a better course not abused by People who don't have a cent to their name who get paid well that go on Holidays and do stupid things without Insurance

 

[katmanblue]

This is so, so true.

He plays very offensively minded so gets a lot of touches and looks flashy.

But so often, even his 'lesser' opponents also play influential games. TDK kicks his share of goals, but how often do his opponents bob up for 1 or 2 against him?

The net gain from playing him vs someone who is less flashy but more accountable (and cheaper) wouldn't be that much IMO.

He's very far from having the brains, consistency and dominance of Gawn.

Nankervis kicking 2 in round 1 was the difference. Nank kicked something like 4 goals for the whole of 2024.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

Yes our issue is we can only develop All Australians...

JSOS, Cowan, Lord, Ollie, Elijah, Cottrell, Cincotta, Durdin, Fogarty, TDK, Kemp and Boyd will all no doubt reach 100 games for us if they aren't traded for, ruined by injury or get themselves into trouble. All AFL quality players despite us not being able to develop players.

Wrong Cincotta, Fogarty and Boyd will not get 100. Elijah might not be at club the way he is going. Kemp could make it to 100 if still here. JSOS already has TDK, same as Ollie and Durdin should. Cottrell possibly if he stays fit in best 22 and Lord depends if he keeps getting better keep spot. Cowan should.

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

50/50 depends on how much he puts over his head he will stay if Doc, Mcgovern and maybe if Walsh and Mckay move to other club paying their contract. Newman and Haynes would be on the cheap or don't get contact simple over 30 you don't pay much when their young ones that can develop on the cheap. Silvagni on his few games available he has owned controlled directed the backline like you said but he is near 30 starting to get injured not a great kick at times but try hard so your not giving him a long contract more likely 2 years. I think Wright will do hard decision see who in Carlton 5 year plan. I would trade Mckay try getting Bergmen and Walsh he has back issues that never goes away as much i like him may be best interest to get a early pick in 2026 draft not this year. I am not sure we have other players we could trade getting better or a position needed I don't think a Motlop and Kemp going to get something better or Pitto getting something descent. Ollie Holland and Cowan are better being kept both young but may get you something different like a small forward if you can replace them. The other Holland is talented but doesn't deserve a list spot over the other young players off contact yes has talent but doesn't have the right attitude to have team success. He may get a spot as a rookie if his mental health improve but if he isn't playing your basically have 1 spot less on list than other clubs that not good.

Salary cap increased by $500K in 2024, $1.9K 2005 and another $500K in 2026… $2.9K in 3 years…

Jack is 27yrs old 28 in December, imo we wouldn’t need to move on Harry to fit him in our cap, We would be incompetent to trade out Harry unless there is a request by him, for personal reasons…

We will have a list of retirements trades and delistings to an array of players of all ages and levels that should balance out the playing list profiles and options to drafting and trading…

Just my take, JSOS and Harry are non negotiable not to be traded…

The list needs to keep improving by identifying the right type of players required moving forward, on the run…

 

[Chamber JJJ]

If TDK does stay, you have to let Williams, Gov and Doc all go. That's if you would like to see SOS (arguably more important than TDK) stay. Pay SOS.

That easy let Williams, Gov and Doc all go all would be gone this or next year all replaceable

 

[Chamber JJJ]

No other list manager would make that kind of offer for a RUCKMAN.
A RUCKMAN that has never even finished top 5 in the B&F !!
FACT !!
Silvagni made the offer knowing 2 things :

TDK as a RUCKMAN couldn’t refuse that kind of offer

Losing TDK would severely damage Carlton’s chances of contending.

The bloke is a seriously bad egg with issues.
He wouldn’t even attend his own son’s 100th game celebration …

Exactly guy has become scum

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Wrong Cincotta, Fogarty and Boyd will not get 100. Elijah might not be at club the way he is going. Kemp could make it to 100 if still here. JSOS already has TDK, same as Ollie and Durdin should. Cottrell possibly if he stays fit in best 22 and Lord depends if he keeps getting better keep spot. Cowan should.

Cincotta is best 22 for us when healthy and only 28. Needs to play essentially 3 more full seasons before he's done to reach 100. Would be the least likely of the 3 but would still back him in to reach it.

Fogarty is up to 56 games just for us half way through this year and still a regular. Every chance he gets there given he's only 26. Counting his Geelong games he only needs to play 20 more games.

Boyd should be best 22 but Voss is a clown. He's still got plenty of years left at 26 yrs old too.

 

[Benaly28]

This years draft more than most years is so compromised with academy picks and father son that’s it’s actually so diluted.

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

The year hasn't ended why does anyone get a contract you wait too see what happens with TDK. Hewitt comes cheap it easy to do Lemmey, Wilson, White contract all basic wage small contact . The rest can wait you don't see Motlop contact. I am sure everyone even Haynes, Mcgovern. Doc and even Newman will wait. My personal view Silvagni gets 2 years but depends on amount although if i was running club and him being near 30 what his Dad doing to the club with TDK and we lose TDK i would let his son go. Hey just imagine your company getting one of your best in your business then we getting something back in a weaker draft. The Company has that guy in the organization who been their been a handy worker then your Dad takes your best talent you be pretty pissed off making your organization weaker. I would be a bit pissed off if i was Jack what his Dad doing to Carlton club going for TDK he could have gone targeting other club. SOS has become a turncoat i bet if John Elliot was alive he would have a few nasty words been sent his way. SOS had a big part with or Loss of draft picks as well as our 30 years of disaster since mark my words he didn't need to talk Fraser Brown kept quiet. SOS and Ian Collins in my opinion have destroyed the club since 2001. John Elliot would have won in court if club didn't remove him 100% pity Go Fund Me wasn't around. The Millions would have been made for a better course not abused by People who don't have a cent to their name who get paid well that go on Holidays and do stupid things without Insurance

Could this be the return of starchamber?

 

[DangerousD]

This years draft more than most years is so compromised with academy picks and father son that’s it’s actually so diluted.

Depends where we finish

 

[DangerousD]

Big Harry Madden played till he was 36?

If Cameron was available for a second round pick, sure, but I’m not sure about that.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Cincotta is best 22 for us when healthy and only 28. Needs to play essentially 3 more full seasons before he's done to reach 100. Would be the least likely of the 3 but would still back him in to reach it.

Fogarty is up to 56 games just for us half way through this year and still a regular. Every chance he gets there given he's only 26. Counting his Geelong games he only needs to play 20 more games.

Boyd should be best 22 but Voss is a clown. He's still got plenty of years left at 26 yrs old too.

 

[The Bighouse]

Cincotta is best 22 for us when healthy and only 28. Needs to play essentially 3 more full seasons before he's done to reach 100. Would be the least likely of the 3 but would still back him in to reach it.

Fogarty is up to 56 games just for us half way through this year and still a regular. Every chance he gets there given he's only 26. Counting his Geelong games he only needs to play 20 more games.

Boyd should be best 22 but Voss is a clown. He's still got plenty of years left at 26 yrs old too.

How is Voss the clown when Boyd was mostly bog ordinary last season when returning from injury (kicking completely dropped off) and has not been prevalent this year at all with the mystery injury from the pre-season finding him where he is ATM.

Perhaps more on Jordan to knock the door down with training / performance so the MC selects. Attitudinal perhaps.

OH, Carroll & Haynes (+ Cowan) taking up defender roles in lieu of JB.

 

[swuzzlebubble]

This years draft more than most years is so compromised with academy picks and father son that’s it’s actually so diluted.

Saw ranking this week that only had two academy/FS in the top 10 but plenty in the teens, so there is some scope to get ahead of them

 

[Chamber JJJ]

Really annoys me that people here were stating Cottrel was out for the season weeks ago, yet we still only took one player in the MSD.

Why wouldn’t we try and have a look at someone? What harm could it have done?

In the two weeks since the MSD we have Cottrel ruled out for the season and Hollands reported as out for the season.

Crap by Austin

They probably in my opinion need the cash to pay The AWFL the Australian Woman Football League/ The same in my opinion like The Club Membership scrapping our Inside Carlton Hard Copy made Magazine that delivered and digital copy online.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

Darcy Cameron makes zero sense to me, good player but would turn 31 in the middle of his 1st season with us.

Don't need him have O'keefe and Pitto until 2027 get Bergmen defence midfield also wouldn't take a pick if around Pick 8 will get another dodgy brothers pick Sam Petrevski-Seton, Paddy Dow, Lochie O'Brien, Kane Lucas, Troy Menzel or at best a Jordan Russell in a weaker draft this year. It has to be a Pick around 3 where their a gun tall defender to team up with O'farrell, best Midfielder or that Ruck Forward Kreuzer 2.0 that was rated Pick 1. They were saying he is AFL ready so have Pitto until 2027 then O'keefe and that pick become the Key Rucks.

 

[Chamber JJJ]

These calls of saying TDK is no superstar... what have you been watching? He's a gun. Moves like a mid. No wonder other teams want him.

People forget the final he made the difference when he came on game was lost by the match committee run by the Dodgy Brothers

 

[TENACIOUS]

Just for thoughts
The young next gen carlton kinda might look like this

Cowan Hof Carroll
O Hollands Dean Wilson
Walsh Cerra Binns
E Hollands Lemmey Moir
Motlop ? Kemp

Hok Jagger B Camporeale

Lord L Camporeale Durdin Charleston

What people think of the next wave ?
Any positions need attention in there that gets replaced or drafted for, FF for example

Snuck Dean and Jagga in there, also Cerra and Walsh its meant to be under 25 24 or so
Just playing around
I think there's a pretty good good group there, add in draft and trades to it with maturity

That would be the worst 22 we’ve had since the dark old days. Our time is now before our stars retire.

Losing: (from your 22)
Cripps, Weitering, Saad, Haynes, McGovern, Docherty, Curnow, TDK, McKay, Silvagni, Williams, Newman & Hewett.

Cowan - talented (hasn’t shown he’s a best 22 lock yet)
HOF - one to be excited about
Carroll - talented (not an accumulator for the distributor role)
O.Hollands - getting better every week
Dean - projects well (never played a game)
Wilson - talented (struggles to accumulate for the distributor role - never played a game)
Walsh - AFL quality
Cerra - AFL quality
Binns - accumulator (poor kick)
E.Hollands - AFL quality (off-field issues)
Lemmey - growing into the role (never played a game - average aggression)
Moir - not up to AFL fitness
Motlop - lazy
Kemp - AFL quality
HOK - one to be excited about
Smith - one to be excited about
B.Camporeale - inside accumulator (turnover merchant) never played a game
L.Camporeale - outside (turnover merchant)
Lord - AFL quality (needs mid-field time)
Durdin - Average quality
Charleston - talented (not an accumulator for the distributor role)