Test Proposal to split test cricket into two divisions

[Freo Big Fella]

Really? You want to just keep seeing that, game after game? Last summer wasn’t even good cricket. Bumrah was the only Indian that bowled well. Jaiswal and occasionally Rahul was the only Indian that batted well. The Aussie bowlers bowled well. Smith and Head batted well with a few cameos from some other players.

I don't think I disagree with any of the broader points you're making here, but general support for cricket in Australia is a mile wide and inch deep.

I'm a die hard, a 30 year WACA member who has been to every day of every test and will turn up regardless alongside 5000-10000 others. But the other 40,000 people the association needs to turn up on Day 1 to make our hold on the First Test stick simply aren't going to show up in droves for the West Indies, Pakistan or Sri Lanka.

That being said, two tiers doesn't do anything to resolve that problem.

 

[PhatBoy]

I don't think I disagree with any of the broader points you're making here, but general support for cricket in Australia is a mile wide and inch deep.

I'm a die hard, a 30 year WACA member who has been to every day of every test and will turn up regardless alongside 5000-10000 others. But the other 40,000 people the association needs to turn up on Day 1 to make our hold on the First Test stick simply aren't going to show up in droves for the West Indies, Pakistan or Sri Lanka.

That being said, two tiers doesn't do anything to resolve that problem.

Look I get that not everyone loves cricket like you or I do and don’t intrinsically give a shit about how Niroshan Dickwella was one of the better batsmen never to make a test century. So fair play there, it’s a reasonable point.

But cricket authorities, as much as they need to take care of finances which they do, have a responsibility to the game and they DO have a responsibility to the people who genuinely have a proper affection for it

 

[cricketnut14]

brace yourselves peeps, we may have the next WTC fixture in the upcoming days and an announcement if we have 2 divisions.

 

[PhatBoy]

brace yourselves peeps, we may have the next WTC fixture in the upcoming days and an announcement if we have 2 divisions.

Great.

See I wouldn’t have AS much of a problem with it if they made it a bit more like a one day World Cup scenario where teams have to qualify for it, but sides still schedule bilateral series regularly. Ie. the Windies conspired to miss the last one but still play regular one day series against all sides irrespective.
I’m not that unrealistic to think that at the moment our test team can contend to win a WTC. I’m not that one eyed.

So a scenario where they say ‘ok these 6 teams will be our tier 1 and they will play the next WTC cycle and the next group will play for promotion’ I can accept, on the proviso that the teams outside those 6, can still and will still, play series against the other teams. But the proliferation of league cricket that both the ICC and countries themselves insist on impinging on the international calendar, and these extra long and repetitive series between particular nations I guarantee will ensure that won’t happen.

 

[Jack Mundy]

Great.

See I wouldn’t have AS much of a problem with it if they made it a bit more like a one day World Cup scenario where teams have to qualify for it, but sides still schedule bilateral series regularly. Ie. the Windies conspired to miss the last one but still play regular one day series against all sides irrespective.
I’m not that unrealistic to think that at the moment our test team can contend to win a WTC. I’m not that one eyed.

So a scenario where they say ‘ok these 6 teams will be our tier 1 and they will play the next WTC cycle and the next group will play for promotion’ I can accept, on the proviso that the teams outside those 6, can still and will still, play series against the other teams. But the proliferation of league cricket that both the ICC and countries themselves insist on impinging on the international calendar, and these extra long and repetitive series between particular nations I guarantee will ensure that won’t happen.

Funding must come from top nation series. Unless that happens, well..

 

[PhatBoy]

Funding must come from top nation series. Unless that happens, well..

Considering how much money those boards make from franchise cricket heavily involving players from the nations excluded from playing them, and who’s test teams have been directly impacted by those franchise competitions, so they should

 

[Sammo360]

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/icc-news-two-tier-wtc-model-scuppered-odi-super-league-revival-on-the-cards-1510711

Looks like the next WTC will expand to 12 teams in one division.

 

[magpiemaniac44]

ODI super league return is good news as well

 

[cricketnut14]

so 12 teams in the WTC championship - should've always been the way - rather than exclude Zimbabwe, Afghanistan and Ireland.

Lets hope they are treated equally.

Not sure how everyone can play everyone in a 2 year cycle though.

No doubt Aus/Eng, Aus/Ind and Ind/Eng series will still be slotted in, in each 2 year cycle.


No real sure on the relevance of ODI cricket anymore as much as I hate to say it.
With 14 teams now competing in the World Cup is there a need for the super league ?
The bi-lateral series are seriously treading water with all countries never playing their best XI.
I do however, look forward to ODI world cups.
Could the 2031 be the last?

 

[Jack Mundy]

so 12 teams in the WTC championship - should've always been the way - rather than exclude Zimbabwe, Afghanistan and Ireland.

Lets hope they are treated equally.

Not sure how everyone can play everyone in a 2 year cycle though.

No doubt Aus/Eng, Aus/Ind and Ind/Eng series will still be slotted in, in each 2 year cycle.


No real sure on the relevance of ODI cricket anymore as much as I hate to say it.
With 14 teams now competing in the World Cup is there a need for the super league ?
The bi-lateral series are seriously treading water with all countries never playing their best XI.
I do however, look forward to ODI world cups.
Could the 2031 be the last?

Odi world cup is going nowhere. It's cash cow along with t20 World cup.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

It's pretty much split into 2 divisions now as it is. India, England and Australia rule the roost.

 

[cricketnut14]

not sure how they can work in an even fixture including the 12 test nations over a 2 year period.

the big winners from this:

• zimbabwe, afghanistan, ireland as they are now included in the WTC
• bangladesh, west indies, sri lanka, pakistan (were either a tier 2 candidate or on the cusp if 2 tiers had of come in)

all things being equal, the aussies must play against one of zimbabwe, afghanistan, ireland in the next cycle then - otherwise its just a farce.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Odi world cup is going nowhere. It's cash cow along with t20 World cup.

The white ball tours might get reduced to qualifying tournament style events, much like WCL2 for example, rather than bilateral series. Then more franchise games can be cashed.

 

[Gibbke]

All ODI's and all T20 internationals should be qualifiers for WC finals tournaments, and all of those qualifiers should be multi-team tournaments and not bilateral.

Every game should matter. The current structure creates a huge gap where the public doesn't need to give a f### about the limited over matches, and there are no return or revenge bouts - rivalry is an incredibly important part of sport, and I'd wager that the huge interest in Aus v WI, Eng and NZ ODI's in the 1980-90's was due to the fact you knew they'd be returning in a couple of years to do exactly the same structured comp while harping on about the previous atrocities each had previously inflicted on the other. We used to ask the question: "Which two teams are coming this year?"...now you know it's India or England. Knowing the regular local test date and the repetition of the BBL each year either side of NY, the limited over matches are then crammed wherever, ensuring no continuity, and being bilateral there is no "story to each series"...

The coverage of ODI's is also bullshit, sold out to Rupert. Many of us here might be the types who Kayo the f### out of everything, eschewing FTA because it doesn't broadcast in 4K and has ads, but the kids who need to be sucked into cricket don't follow it these days due to it not being there and not being the ones who pay the subscription, and that's where the product lies. Academies build the talent via scouting, freelancers who start there are the product on tv, and there's enough of them to spread around while the game below rots...

And where does that put tests? A real catch-22...if everyone plays everyone, an Ashes series makes bucks while Bangladesh play primary school ovals in NZ, to the point where NZ says "no tests this year" and replaces them with shorter games...this did happen a while back. But divisions with P&R can entrench inequality...we might as well just stick with India and England. The continuity of knowing how the last series against anyone went last time, because we still remember it, will be gone outside the couple of regular visitors...imagine the lack of interest in a WI series if they haven't visited for two decades, a far cry from the 4 year cycle a few decades back where we all waited for the next chapter. And because in Australia we do actually have test continuity, it paints a far rosier picture of the health of that format as we see ourselves every summer knowing what we'll be doing twice in November, plus Boxing Day, plus NY's, each summer...not many other non-Big 3 nations enjoy that structure...

 

[Bletch]

All ODI's and all T20 internationals should be qualifiers for WC finals tournaments, and all of those qualifiers should be multi-team tournaments and not bilateral.

Every game should matter. The current structure creates a huge gap where the public doesn't need to give a f### about the limited over matches, and there are no return or revenge bouts - rivalry is an incredibly important part of sport, and I'd wager that the huge interest in Aus v WI, Eng and NZ ODI's in the 1980-90's was due to the fact you knew they'd be returning in a couple of years to do exactly the same structured comp while harping on about the previous atrocities each had previously inflicted on the other. We used to ask the question: "Which two teams are coming this year?"...now you know it's India or England. Knowing the regular local test date and the repetition of the BBL each year either side of NY, the limited over matches are then crammed wherever, ensuring no continuity, and being bilateral there is no "story to each series"...

The coverage of ODI's is also bullshit, sold out to Rupert. Many of us here might be the types who Kayo the f### out of everything, eschewing FTA because it doesn't broadcast in 4K and has ads, but the kids who need to be sucked into cricket don't follow it these days due to it not being there and not being the ones who pay the subscription, and that's where the product lies. Academies build the talent via scouting, freelancers who start there are the product on tv, and there's enough of them to spread around while the game below rots...

And where does that put tests? A real catch-22...if everyone plays everyone, an Ashes series makes bucks while Bangladesh play primary school ovals in NZ, to the point where NZ says "no tests this year" and replaces them with shorter games...this did happen a while back. But divisions with P&R can entrench inequality...we might as well just stick with India and England. The continuity of knowing how the last series against anyone went last time, because we still remember it, will be gone outside the couple of regular visitors...imagine the lack of interest in a WI series if they haven't visited for two decades, a far cry from the 4 year cycle a few decades back where we all waited for the next chapter. And because in Australia we do actually have test continuity, it paints a far rosier picture of the health of that format as we see ourselves every summer knowing what we'll be doing twice in November, plus Boxing Day, plus NY's, each summer...not many other non-Big 3 nations enjoy that structure...

• Get rid of ODIs. Sorry, but too many formats, stick to one short form format, and although I prefer 1-day over T20, the numbers have spoken.
• No T20 internationals.
• All T20 to be "club" cricket - with an international club competition based on the existing suite of country-based competitions (IPL, BBL etc).
• If you want to represent your country, you need to play test cricket.
• Exception - once per 4 years there is an international short form World Cup (T20 probably).

 

[Retzlaff]

Can’t see the Barmy Army showing up for Div 2 tests

 

[cricketnut14]

• Get rid of ODIs. Sorry, but too many formats, stick to one short form format, and although I prefer 1-day over T20, the numbers have spoken.
• No T20 internationals.
• All T20 to be "club" cricket - with an international club competition based on the existing suite of country-based competitions (IPL, BBL etc).
• If you want to represent your country, you need to play test cricket.
• Exception - once per 4 years there is an international short form World Cup (T20 probably).

yeah i tend to agree.

i enjoy and prefer odi's to T20 cricket but the masses have spoken.

teams simply do not pick their best XI's anymore in short form bi-laterals and seek the opportunity to rest players.

i'd be happy if there were no more odi's and T20I's and to just play the franchise stuff.
i'd still like a ODI and T20 world cup - although who qualifies etc would then become an issue and also how to continue to grow the game around the world.

this would also create room in the calendar to also play a minimum of 3 test series.

 

[Jack Mundy]

• Get rid of ODIs. Sorry, but too many formats, stick to one short form format, and although I prefer 1-day over T20, the numbers have spoken.
• No T20 internationals.
• All T20 to be "club" cricket - with an international club competition based on the existing suite of country-based competitions (IPL, BBL etc).
• If you want to represent your country, you need to play test cricket.
• Exception - once per 4 years there is an international short form World Cup (T20 probably).

That'll kill the game outside of test nations and probably most of the test nations too

 

[Bletch]

That'll kill the game outside of test nations and probably most of the test nations too

Why?

 

[Jack Mundy]

Why?

Look at crowds for t20i's and odi's. Look at test crowds currently for India vs SA and Bangladesh vs Ireland

 

[Bletch]

Look at crowds for t20i's and odi's. Look at test crowds currently for India vs SA and Bangladesh vs Ireland

And if not for Indian supporters, the recent ODI series here would have been played in front of empty stands.

Crowds will turn out for the T20 franchise games, even moreso if it became a worldwide comp. Let them. Then if they want to see their national team, then go to test matches. I think we've been diluting our product. Better focus will produce better results.

 

[Jack Mundy]

And if not for Indian supporters, the recent ODI series here would have been played in front of empty stands.

Crowds will turn out for the T20 franchise games, even moreso if it became a worldwide comp. Let them. Then if they want to see their national team, then go to test matches. I think we've been diluting our product. Better focus will produce better results.

If any format should go test cricket would make sense for most nations

 

[Bletch]

If any format should go test cricket would make sense for most nations

I think we should fight tooth and nail to prevent that. But unless the "rich" countries are prepared to give up some level of power and look to a new funding model for the game worldwide, then I can see that happening for sure.

 

[big_e]

Why?

T20 cricket is played internationally by almost 100 countries and you want to stop that? Strange opinion.

 

[Jack Mundy]

T20 cricket is played internationally by almost 100 countries and you want to stop that? Strange opinion.

Test cricket doesn't have appeal in countries where cricket is emerging. I think the Netherlands for example have no aspiration to play tests cricket. Like I said eliminating the international shorter format will stop nations from playing the sport.