List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion - part 2

[thekizzler]

It’s got legs. Heard it from someone yesterday. We are apparently after Buku Khamis too.

An exclusive from St Kilda Insider FB page.

Possibly the only source less reliable than Rucci

 

[gringo2011]

Welcome back, Daniel Wulf.

I was hoping for Cam the Panther Shenton.

 

[HeavenlySources]

Just to do a Flamingo on you it was mentioned that an ex player would like to come back to us if the option arose

Future 2nd pick for Josh Battle sounds fair

 

[gringo2011]

An exclusive from St Kilda Insider FB page.

Possibly the only source less reliable than Rucci

Didn’t see that but probably where they heard it.

 

[CursingFijian]

His stats were alright it was his testing that made people question him.

You mean those other pesky numbers?

 

[mighty_sainters]

Lancey Boy doesn't look like he is going anywhere

View attachment 2401304

Not my proudest wank.

 

[Veer Right]

This is a LONG rant and may not belong in this thread, but as a former journo, my god the quality of AFL journalism is just absolutely cooked.

There are clear professional and ethical standards in journalism which are totally ignored by those covering AFL, because I guess, footy isn’t considered serious news. But especially when it comes to contract negotiations, which are significant financial transactions, the coverage is incredibly problematic. If business mergers and acquisitions were covered the way AFL list management is, then half the journos and managers would be in strife for stockmarket manipulation.
Instead almost all the media coverage is gossip reported as fact, and - WORSE - sources with direct financial interests in the outcome of negotiations given the opportunity to anonymously shape the narrative in the media. It’s corrupt.
Major issues:

1. Anonymous sources. In standard journalism practice you don’t grant your source anonymity unless there is a really good reason. And the reason can’t be just because they want you to. Usually there has to be repercussions for the source if they are named. If a player manager tells you that a player they represent is getting lots of offers from different clubs, then it is obviously in their financial interest for you to report that. In that circumstance the manager should never be granted anonymity in the media coverage. Either the manager comments on the record, or you don’t print the story. The only reason you would give a player manager the option of anonymity is if they were telling you something that could harm their own interests - say commenting on a story about performance enhancing drugs, for example.
2. Sole sourcing. Standard practice is you need multiple sources for a story. ESPECIALLY if the sources will only comment off the record. So if a player manager says they are fielding interest form club X and club Y, you need to confirm the story with those clubs before reporting it as fact. Otherwise you shouldn't print it - certainly you shouldn't report it as fact.

Most of the media coverage of AFL contracts fails to meet both of the standards above.

Take for example the coverage of Windhager’s contract negotiations.

Back in May Will Faulkner at Fox Footy wrote a piece saying that Fox ‘understands he is hopeful of greater opportunities on-ball’ and intimating that this could be factor in contract negotiations. Where did this understanding come from?? Assuming Falukner didn’t make it up, it is pretty clear that the story came from Windhager’s management, Phoenix Management Group. Its also pretty clear that putting the story in the press is in the company’s financial interests. It creates a narrative about Windhager moving clubs, which generates interest, which ultimately drives up the contract price. So why did Fox Footy run the story? And why give Windhager’s management anonymity?

Then there is another story by Will Faulkner in August saying that Fox ‘understands the Giants are closing in on a pitch to lure the 22-year-old to western Sydney’. Where did that story come from?? The only reliable source for that information would be someone who works at GWS. But Faulkner doesn’t give us the source. Is someone at GWS really leaking their list management strategy to Will Faulkner at Fox Footy? For what purpose? Or is this coming from Phoenix Management again?

Then the next day you get stories in the Age and Zero Hanger, both saying that three clubs are actively pursuing Windhanger - North Melbourne, Essendon and Melbourne. Neither media outlet provides any sources for this statement, but both report it as fact. Did the journalists who wrote these stories both call every club and ask them on the record if they were considering making an offer to Windhager, and both get the same result, and then both decide not to quote their sources for some reason? Or did Phoenix Management give them this story and they both just reported it as fact without confirming with the clubs? I know where my money is. Notably the Zero Hanger story also repeats the previous claims made by Faulkner at Fox as if they are confirmed, which is also shoddy practice.

Then yesterday Cal Twomey says ‘My understanding is north Melbourne have tabled a 5 year deal’, but again doesn’t tell us what this 'understanding' is based on. Logically the inforamtion can only come from either the club or the management. If his information is coming from the North Melbourne Football Club then Twomey should be able to state it as fact and name the source. If his information is coming from Phoenix Management and hasn’t been confirmed, then he should either not report it, or tell us that his source is the player management.

This is representative of all the media coverage around contracts. It doesn’t meet professional standards. And it lets down the fans, while serving the financial interests of those involved with the story. The managers increase the profile and price of their clients, and the media outlets get advertising clicks without having to do any proper journalism (which takes time and costs money). It sucks. This is what Ross Lyon means when he talks about feeding the chooks.

You and Aussierules will get along like a house on fire!

Do you have a tl,dr version? Serious.

 

[beside the seaside]

Blake Acres

13

Blake Acres

Age

30

Ht

193cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.5

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

8.6

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

3.2

5star

CL

1.9

4star

D

12.7

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

7.7

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.7

4star

CL

1.0

3star

D

8.2

2star

K

3.8

2star

HB

4.4

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.4

4star

CL

1.8

4star

is a bit of an enigma. Seems to start out as a gun wherever he goes and ends up getting turfed.

 

[Veer Right]

There was talk that Acres wanted to come back. Heard it from 2 different people now.

Would love him back.

 

[SainterinSydney]

Lancey Boy doesn't look like he is going anywhere

View attachment 2401304

I will say, though, without overanalysing--a certain someone you'd expect in the picture isn't

 

[Circus]

Welcome back, Daniel Wulf.

Or my all-time favorite, Jason Daniels!!

 

[billings2paddy]

Joyce

Jarrad Lienert

 

[magd2992]

Not my proudest wank.

Well, it was mine.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Lancey Boy doesn't look like he is going anywhere

View attachment 2401304

Of course he isn't going anywhere , he is contracted for another Two years, how the hell do you have time for a GF when you're always on here or stalking young men

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Well I would first start at Ross and Ben Williams painting a nice picture about us needing to build something successful to retain Nas long term.

Then I would go look at Geelong recruiting over the years.

• Jack Martin 29 years old
• Jon Ceglar 30 year old
• Shaun Higgins 32 years old
• Isaac smith 31 years old
• Josh Jenkins 30 years old
• Jack Steven 29 years old

Re Mannagh, I point you in the direction of Max Hall.

Lists can be built many different ways

Geelong have been playing finals for the past 20 years and a lot of that was top 4 finishes. They already have the core in place, we dont hence topping up with cast offs now is way too early in our development curb in my view.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Never one around when you need one

 

[Veer Right]

I agree with much of this.

People who oppose TDK's signing aren't suggesting we throw everything out, trade Sinclair and Wilkie and go scorched earth.

We're suggesting TDK doesn't replace much that Marshall isn't already doing (in the next couple of years), or not enough to justify giving him the biggest contract in AFL history, which may hurt the club 3, 4, 5 years from now, as we've seen with others like Grundy and Treloar at Collingwood, McGovern at Carlton, potentially McKay at Essendon, etc.

I am chiefly concerned how Dodson gets seniors time with TDK incoming. TDK isn't worth the coin but he costs nothing in trade so i am just ok with it. Can also see the TDK contract blowing up in the clubs face if he doesn't perform strongly.

 

[billings2paddy]

Or my all-time favorite, Jason Daniels!!

It's tom lee

 

[Veer Right]

I bet Aaron Hamill wants to come back too, hearing most assistant coaches there are in trouble.

We stunk when he was with us. Pass.

 

[SainterinSydney]

Of course he isn't going anywhere , he is contracted for another Two years, how the hell do you have time for a GF when you're always on here or stalking young men

Hey, hey, those kinds of slurs could get you 6 weeks and miss the finals

 

[billings2paddy]

Geelong have been playing finals for the past 20 years and a lot of that was top 4 finishes. They already have the core in place, we dont hence topping up with cast offs now is way too early in our development curb in my view.

Clever accounting regarding the salary cap

 

[Spider Eater]

Loved the goat but he’s well and truly doneski now surely we don’t consider

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

I am chiefly concerned how Dodson gets seniors time with TDK incoming. TDK isn't worth the coin but he costs nothing in trade so i am just ok with it. Can also see the TDK contract blowing up in the clubs face if he doesn't perform strongly.

He will perform strongly, if his first 7 games? this year are to go by.
He checked out after that

 

[thekizzler]

Welcome back, Daniel Wulf.

Sadly my strongest memory of Daniel Wulf is when he hit the post from five metres out and then we drew with Sydney haha.

 

[SaintsFooty1107]

Any ITK’s or ears to the ground are Windy , where is that at , no feelings but anything concrete. IMO all clubs chasing are considerably worse than us in the short term and his best chance at on ball minutes is also us. But can understand leaving for guaranteed money