List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
​

 

[OxSaint]

Did anyone else hear Roey’s cheeked remark and “there is more to come” on MMM this morning. I got the sense there isn’t something that we haven’t heard about yet.

 

[snails13]

Let’s start with Darcy and Bontempelli.

Let's just say you have 2 years left on your contract that you signed,and we will give you a pay rise in 2 years.
Or we just keep our current players and finish bottom 6 every year.
But i doubt we trade anyway

 

[akaifu]

Ahahaha good timing

 

[Remboy]

Wow Saints have rattled a few clubs, Whateley reporting Collingwood and Bulldogs felt 'played' by the Silvagni deal.

Now Bulldogs trying the same play on the club that played them. A slight problem though, the player they targetted is contracted, was paid a bonus earlier this year, has publicly stated he loves the club, will in all probability be the next captain.
This in concert with a strategy to bring in backmen to give Wilks a chop out and Lyon publicly stating good clubs don't trade contracted players.
The Saints strategy is not scattergun. It has been plotted for the past two seasons for this exact time. The only wrinkle was the overpay for NAZ, which for the club was a good thing, but not ideal for list management.
However the Saints knew they would ruffle feathers and these EXACT scenario's would have been wargamed by the List Management team. Extensions for the likes of Wilkie would already have been factored in and we have two years to convince him. If we improve, it wont be hard to resign him or NAZ.
Seems a bit amateur and dated reactionary recruiting from the Bulldogs.

100% correct Joffa. It’s like Bassett said, we’ve been popular sitting at the bottom end of the ladder. If we want to be successful we have to be prepared to be unpopular. We’re ruffling some feathers and the media, other clubs and their supporters aren’t happy. As one of my teachers used to say ‘if you don’t like it - tough luck’.
Welcome to the brave new world of the Saints.

 

[Yawkey way]

Shift Naughton back? Are you sure?

Bloke kicked 60 goals. One less scoring shot than Ben King.

Maybe in previous season's form but definitely not now.

Imagine having the luxury of taking a 60-goal forward out of attack?

He’s a gun at both ends but yes I would with Darcy, Croft and a fit Ugle-Hagen how big do you need to be up front.

Plus wasn’t Busslinger meant to be a defender with sticky hands?. Also what’s Croft’s twin up to, Cat B special.

I still want to know how the wound up with James O’Donnell.

 

[Joffaboy]

Absolutely nothing. From a nuffie point of view, it is clear to me Steele doesnt have what it takes to inspire his teammates to fight the good fight on-field and watching him communicate, it's little wonder. Wilkie seems better at this but I could easily be wrong I guess.

His teammates consistently say you are wrong.

 

[thekizzler]

The fact that we continued to vote Jack Steele in as club captain for many years while Cal Wilkie was on our list will surely be viewed in the future as one of the biggest blunders our club has made in the Ross 2.0 era

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the players vote in the captain?

 

[St Neil]

Or AA mid Richards

No, let’s start with Darcy and Bontempelli.

Hold firm. Watch them offer a million alternatives.

Then continue to hold firm. See if they crack.

Honestly, this whole play reeks of desperation from the Bulldogs. They look reactive and panicky.

Perhaps they should have offer Silvagni $1m x 5.

They may have got their man.

 

[sauce_head]

Not wrong though

But not totally right either. It ignores the momentum that a few key signings builds. Others want to join in or be retained.

In any regard, the Blues feel victimised and part of that is that they have to cheat in a much more refined way now, more like Geelong are alleged to have done, than simply passing brown paper bags under the table. They can’t and are losing players like rats off a sinking ship.

We will find out how much of a destination club we may have become in two years, when it’s up to NAS again and players, hopefully, want to be a part of something with us.

As is often the case, being in the moment is no time to measure success, but can be a time to laugh at external jealously. Thanks Carlton, you are making our day, again!

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Absolutely nothing. From a nuffie point of view, it is clear to me Steele doesnt have what it takes to inspire his teammates to fight the good fight on-field and watching him communicate, it's little wonder. Wilkie seems better at this but I could easily be wrong I guess.

His teammates think you are wrong I guess.
He's not the most media savvy guy, sure.
Saying that he doesnt fight the fight on field is complete BS.
One of the current best tacklers in the league
I'd say that is putting up a good fight.

 

[SainterinSydney]

Did anyone else hear Roey’s cheeked remark and “there is more to come” on MMM this morning. I got the sense there isn’t something that we haven’t heard about yet.

Buttery Butters. That would be nice.

 

[Joffaboy]

100% correct Joffa. It’s like Bassett said, we’ve been popular sitting at the bottom end of the ladder. If we want to be successful we have to be prepared to be unpopular. We’re ruffling some feathers and the media, other clubs and their supporters aren’t happy. As one of my teachers used to say ‘if you don’t like it - tough luck’.
Welcome to the brave new world of the Saints.

I see it this way.
2023, the strategy was put in place to save SC, and front load contracts.
This was because the AFL basically only gave us one way to improve, through FA while taking four years to hit the draft. We didn't have FS, free picks like beggars North or free top 10 NGA's like the fake Northern clubs.
We also have Tassie coming in which will compromise the draft and drive up player salaries.
Yawkey Way put it best, Saints have started an arms race in recruiting and are stepping on toes while tooling up before the AFL gets nuked by Tassie.
It's the new reality and the others haven't caught up.

 

[BrutThough]

Absolutely nothing. From a nuffie point of view, it is clear to me Steele doesnt have what it takes to inspire his teammates to fight the good fight on-field and watching him communicate, it's little wonder. Wilkie seems better at this but I could easily be wrong I guess.

But clearly the people he is directly communicating with think differently. And I'd say their opinion is much more informed then anyone on here.

 

[EddieMurphy]

Has Windy signed his offer yet?

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Did anyone else hear Roey’s cheeked remark and “there is more to come” on MMM this morning. I got the sense there isn’t something that we haven’t heard about yet.

Buttery Butters. That would be nice.

 

[Sully111]

Of course it is. And what do you know about the leadership and fabric of the club that the players don't?

They got it wrong.

They might just be showing loyalty. Happens all the time.

He’s not the man to lead us forward. A change is long overdue.

 

[saintbill]

Wilkie does a lot of captain-like media engagements for someone who isn't the captain. Can't remember the last time I saw Jack Steele do a presser.

I have met Jack Steele a couple of times, and thank god he is ridiculously handsome in real life because his personality is like a bit of cardboard.

 

[Hayes4PM]

Club strategically waits until a story about Wilkie is run by journos then release a 5 minute interview with Cal talking about how excited he is for next year hahahha

 

[FQFjt]

The fact that we continued to vote Jack Steele in as club captain for many years while Cal Wilkie was on our list will surely be viewed in the future as one of the biggest blunders our club has made in the Ross 2.0 era

That's not quite how it played out.

Steele was made Geary's co-captain at a time when Steele was clearly our best player, there were no obvious alternatives, and at a time when it was widely considered important that we give the captaincy to someone whose spot in the team was never going to be in doubt (following Geary's captaincy).

While not unheard of, once he became the incumbent (and not an old captain at that), it was always going to be difficult to replace him.

I would have liked to see it happen at the start of 2025 though.

 

[snails13]

I think above all else
Jack Steele pushes players standards by the way he plays & trains
And the captaincy is player voted.
So, go ahead & disagree, but don't shame the lad.

Who is starting to whinge? There is no evidence Wilkie is if that is what you are inferring. In fact, quite the opposite.

In any regard, negotiating is not the same as whinging.

AFL players in general.
Why negotiate if you have already signed a contract.
That generally means you accept what was offered.
It may be media,but talk of Curnow,Merrett etc for example wanting out with multiple years still on their contracts.That may not be money,but losing consistently. So stiff to them if in fact it is the player themselves and they have to stay at their current clubs

 

[Tom12]

So funny that the Bulldogs can just offer a new contract to a contracted player and the rules allow for this.

Should be like in the NBA where a deal can only be re-negotiated at certain points of the contract, and the contract is traded with the player. Ie they don't get a new one when they show up at a new club (unless via free agency)

 

[BrutThough]

Has Windy signed his offer yet?

Unfortunately no. The club wont wait to announce it, if he does.

 

[stavro#4]

The self interest is delicious here. 2-3 years so they can collect all their academy and father sons picks

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

No, let’s start with Darcy and Bontempelli.

Hold firm. Watch them offer a million alternatives.

Then continue to hold firm. See if they crack.

Honestly, this whole play reeks of desperation from the Bulldogs. They look reactive and panicky.

Perhaps they should have offer Silvagni $1m x 5.

They may have got their man.

They should be, they've got an unbelievable list that is missing September after getting smoked during week 1 last year.

Yes they got their (umpire assisted) flag almost 10 years ago but Bevo has p1ssed away the career of one of the absolute GOATs of our game & the best team the Dogs has ever assembled.

 

[Armoooo]

The self interest is delicious here. 2-3 years so they can collect all their academy and father sons picks

Too right. They have made list decisions with these players very much a part of their plans.

Fair enough to make teams pay a fair price, but pulling the rug from under clubs isn't right.