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2025 Finals MVP

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doppleganger said:
What were your scores this week?

Thilthorpe highest again? He took two marks inside 50 and kicked 3, both increases on his wk1finals output.
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Stop trashing me mate. But if you really must know.

53. J.N got 84
 
doppleganger said:
Legit question

Riley had DBL the score involvements, DBL the marks inside 50 and kicked more goals against the Hawks. Actually was the Crows best forward threat in the semi final.
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Well I'm cautious. Fadge and a number of others have been trolling and trashing me all week, of which I have zero interest in entertaining.

Obviously he broke the system last week and CD also ranked him high. It was one of those games where he did minimal of ALL the right things.

RT was actually 47. Jai Newcombe was 87.

I superseded Gunston over Meek for the 5 goals with a relatively close score. Rory Laird was the highest ranked Crows player.
 

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JHF1870 said:
Well I'm cautious. Fadge and a number of others have been trolling and trashing me all week, of which I have zero interest in entertaining.

Obviously he broke the system last week and CD also ranked him high. It was one of those games where he did minimal of ALL the right things.

RT was actually 47. Jai Newcombe was 87.

I superseded Gunston over Meek for the 5 goals with a relatively close score. Rory Laird was the highest ranked Crows player.
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Fadge and a couple of others have devolved into schoolyard trolls. Don't worry about 'em mate.
 
JHF1870 said:
Well I'm cautious. Fadge and a number of others have been trolling and trashing me all week, of which I have zero interest in entertaining.

Obviously he broke the system last week and CD also ranked him high. It was one of those games where he did minimal of ALL the right things.

RT was actually 47. Jai Newcombe was 87.

I superseded Gunston over Meek for the 5 goals with a relatively close score. Rory Laird was the highest ranked Crows player.
Click to expand...
Just trying to help to out in pointing out shortcomings in your algorithm.
 
Mr Meow said:
Fadge and a couple of others have devolved into schoolyard trolls. Don't worry about 'em mate.
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The Hawks guy who started off being argumentative and fought everyone has come good. Actually read a few of their posts on other boards and have some really wholesome posts. Probably a bit too passionate early. Here's the thing, It's ok to have varying points of view but what's the point of having a slinging match with someone who just wants to start a fight all the time.
 
JHF1870 said:
The Hawks guy who started off being argumentative and fought everyone has come good. Actually read a few of their posts on other boards and have some really wholesome posts. Probably a bit too passionate early. Here's the thing, It's ok to have varying points of view but what's the point of having a slinging match with someone who just wants to start a fight all the time.
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If you're going to develop a player rating algorithm and share it for public consumption, you really should expect some critical feedback so as to help you with improving the algorithm...

Particularly if you say you didn't actually watch the game yourself.
 
JHF1870 said:
Obviously he broke the system last week and CD also ranked him high. It was one of those games where he did minimal of ALL the right things.

RT was actually 47. Jai Newcombe was 87.
Click to expand...
That is always the danger of just basing it off stats.

Thilthorpe actually had more scoreboard impact and looked threatening against the Hawks, he didn't against the Pies.

But surely the right things for a key forward are goals, marks inside 50 and score involvements?
 
JHF1870 said:
The Hawks guy who started off being argumentative and fought everyone has come good. Actually read a few of their posts on other boards and have some really wholesome posts. Probably a bit too passionate early. Here's the thing, It's ok to have varying points of view but what's the point of having a slinging match with someone who just wants to start a fight all the time.
Click to expand...
We used to get this with some Richmond supporters and their club + Dusty. Really nasty, toxic stuff for any opinion or piece of data that didn't directly or indirectly label their club/player the GOAT. With Fadge he spent too long in a banter/troll thread and seemed to sour. Anyway take his complaints and mockery with a grain of salt.
 
doppleganger said:
That is always the danger of just basing it off stats.

Thilthorpe actually had more scoreboard impact and looked threatening against the Hawks, he didn't against the Pies.

But surely the right things for a key forward are goals, marks inside 50 and score involvements?
Click to expand...
Careful.

You'll be accused of 'trolling' and 'trashing'...
 
doppleganger said:
That is always the danger of just basing it off stats.

Thilthorpe actually had more scoreboard impact and looked threatening against the Hawks, he didn't against the Pies.

But surely the right things for a key forward are goals, marks inside 50 and score involvements?
Click to expand...
It's always a challenge, then comparing it to visual inspection there's bias. As I've mentioned before I didn't even notice Max Holmes before I started investing time into what he does. The same could go for Jeremy Howe.

As for the system, I've been open about using this as a segue for next season. Rucks were overpowered for this season and I'm tuning them down. Defenders are getting tuned up. I've considered bonuses for milestones (3, 5, 7 and 10) goals for example. As you stated, that's an important metric.

Same could go for intercepts. If I gave the best player to a guy who got 18 intercepts, you probably wouldn't disagree too much given how important that would be as a defender. 18 intercepts might only score 50 points in total and someone with a lot of metrics might get 60 but have limited impact.

The danger with a player like RT, and TDK is they're versatile dynamic players that score across many metrics.

In the end nobody is capable of building the perfect system and unless there's a standout dominant performance it's always going to be debatable.
 

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JHF1870 said:
The danger with a player like RT, and TDK is they're versatile dynamic players that score across many metrics.
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Might be busier, but if the best key forward in the game only has 1 mark inside 50 and 3 score involvements for a game, he hasn't played well.
JHF1870 said:
In the end nobody is capable of building the perfect system and unless there's a standout dominant performance it's always going to be debatable.
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It depends what the system is being built for.

Player rating systems are all flawed, the coaches know what role they ask their players to perform. Ratings systems have no idea.
 
doppleganger said:
Player rating systems are all flawed, the coaches know what role they ask their players to perform. Ratings systems have no idea.
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I reckon most people who understand football well could watch a game closely, pick the best player on the ground and give him a ranking of 100, and give every other player a relative ranking based on their influence on the game, refer to the stats sheet to validate their opinion, and be more accurate than any Player Ratings algorithm.

For example, the Collingwood v. Adelaide game:

100 - D. Moore
94 - N. Daicos, J. De Goey
91 - J. Elliott
86 - I. Quaynor
82 - S. Sidebottom
.
.
.
55 - R. Thilthorpe
 
doppleganger said:
Might be busier, but if the best key forward in the game only has 1 mark inside 50 and 3 score involvements for a game, he hasn't played well.

It depends what the system is being built for.

Player rating systems are all flawed, the coaches know what role they ask their players to perform. Ratings systems have no idea.
Click to expand...
2 Games come to mind. Aliir and Ratugulea both dominated down back. Didnt get best score but both standout games. Im adjusting for that

But it really is just another way of doing it
 
Brisbane Vs Gold Coast

HAve to give the votes to Brisbane here. Rowell was good but not good enough in a losing side.

3. Will Ashcroft
2. Harris Andrews with 7 intercept marks, 10 IP, 14 marks. Solid defensive effort
1. Hugh Mcluggage with 10 clearances
 
JHF1870 said:
Brisbane Vs Gold Coast

HAve to give the votes to Brisbane here. Rowell was good but not good enough in a losing side.

3. Will Ashcroft
2. Harris Andrews with 7 intercept marks, 10 IP, 14 marks. Solid defensive effort
1. Hugh Mcluggage with 10 clearances
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Dunkley unlucky, but you can't fit them all in.

Rowell nowhere near the votes last night.
 
If Newcombe has a belter this Friday and we win its hard to see how he loses this. But that will be a big hurdle given Geelong really dont have any weaknesses.

LEADERBOARD​

18 Jai Newcombe (HAW)
10 Darcy Moore (COLL)
10 Caleb Serong (FRE)
9 Oliver Dempsey (GEEL)
8 Will Ashcroft (BL)
8 Finn Callaghan (GWS)
8 Josh Dunkley (BL)
8 Jack Gunston (HAW)
7 Jordan De Goey (COLL)
7 Blake Hardwick (HAW)
7 Tom Stewart (GEEL)
6 Harris Andrews (BL)
6 Matt Rowell (GCFC)
5 Mark Blicavs (GEEL)
5 Nick Daicos (COLL)
5 Tom Green (GWS)
4 Tom Atkins (GEEL)
4 Jarrod Berry (BL)
4 Sam Collins (GCFC)
4 Max Holmes (GEEL)
4 Hugh McCluggage (BL)
4 Wil Powell (GCFC)
4 Isaac Quaynor (COLL)
4 Josh Ward (HAW)
 

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Geelong Vs Hawthorn

3 Votes - Patrick Dangerfield (113 points) Far surpasses any other scores this finals series by a crap load. Super comprehensive game.
23/31 effective disposals, 20 contested 3 goals, 2 assists, 13 score involvements 9 inside 50
8 clearances, 6 Center

2 Votes - Gryan Miers 25 effective disposals, 1 goal, 4 goal assists, 14 score involvements, 6 intercepts. Outstanding game probably goes unnoticed by the general public.

1 Vote - Bailey Smith - Didn't really dominate any key stats but balanced all over in a robust game.

Brisbane Vs Collingwood

3 Votes - Darcy Gardiner

Solid in defence. 6 one on one contested battles, 5 won
9 one percenters, 8 spoils, 5 rebounds, 7 intercept posessions, 3 intercept marks, 1 contested.

2 Votes - Hugh McLuggage

24/37 effective disposals 14 contested
1 goal, 6 Score involvements 6 Inside 50
(6 Clangers)

10 Clearances (2CC, 9 SC)

1 Vote Dayne Zorko

718 M gained, played a solid role all over ground for 1 goal, 21 Eff Disposals. No real dominant stats as such but played a very versatile role.

Gave Zorko 1 over Ashcroft and Andrews
Daicos tried hard all day but didn't impact the game enough in a losing side.

Would have given H.Mc 3 votes if he didn't burn the ball as much as he did and Gardiners game was robust.
 
Fadge said:
3 votes for the yellow ***** who yet again influenced the result of the game.

*****.
Click to expand...
Get Over It GIF
 
JHF1870 said:
Geelong Vs Hawthorn

3 Votes - Patrick Dangerfield (113 points) Far surpasses any other scores this finals series by a crap load. Super comprehensive game.
23/31 effective disposals, 20 contested 3 goals, 2 assists, 13 score involvements 9 inside 50
8 clearances, 6 Center

2 Votes - Gryan Miers 25 effective disposals, 1 goal, 4 goal assists, 14 score involvements, 6 intercepts. Outstanding game probably goes unnoticed by the general public.

1 Vote - Bailey Smith - Didn't really dominate any key stats but balanced all over in a robust game.

Brisbane Vs Collingwood

3 Votes - Darcy Gardiner

Solid in defence. 6 one on one contested battles, 5 won
9 one percenters, 8 spoils, 5 rebounds, 7 intercept posessions, 3 intercept marks, 1 contested.

2 Votes - Hugh McLuggage

24/37 effective disposals 14 contested
1 goal, 6 Score involvements 6 Inside 50
(6 Clangers)

10 Clearances (2CC, 9 SC)

1 Vote Dayne Zorko

718 M gained, played a solid role all over ground for 1 goal, 21 Eff Disposals. No real dominant stats as such but played a very versatile role.

Gave Zorko 1 over Ashcroft and Andrews
Daicos tried hard all day but didn't impact the game enough in a losing side.

Would have given H.Mc 3 votes if he didn't burn the ball as much as he did and Gardiners game was robust.
Click to expand...
Zorko was horrid in 1st half. Even though 2nd half was decent doesn't deserve to be in any voted. Andrews should be top 3 along with suitcase and Gardiner
 

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