Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 8 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[_Mike_]

Opposition supporters coming to troll , you have been warned

 

[redmania]

My mail is hes gonna be a part of the trade

What other mail do you have

 

[CDBulldog]

Giants and Pies will be the sliders for me.

Yeah. I think the cliff is coming for Collingwood and the fall starts next year.

 

[CDBulldog]

If Carlton do that Trade they are idiots

They are already idiots so doing that trade makes no difference to them.

 

[perro_loco]

I reckon JJ is finished watching him trying to defend in that last game v Freo. Bailey Dale is an incredibly good footballer and Bramble has also gone past him too.
JJ is 32 and he would’ve been watching Dane Zorko who is 36 and playing nearly career best football at the moment. Zorko seems so determined not just to keep playing, but his attack on the footy is as good as ever. JJ may be determined to keep playing, but he has to match that with determination on the field, to both defend and attack.

Correct with JJ, who is totally cooked unfotunately. We cannot persist with players like him, Poulter, VDM, McNeil, Coffield. Footy or any sport at this level is a cruel game. Unfortunately, these players do not win you a premiership. c.f. the quality of the bottom 6-10 players at Brisbane or Geelong, with ours. I think that is the difference. we have some really good young players, but the ones i mentioned and others are not the future.

 

[trophies]

The Dogs were competitive in just about every game, but were incredibly uncompetitive in individual quarters.

In virtually every loss we were destroyed in 1 qtr.
Freo - 7 goals against
Brisbane - 2 qtrs of 7 goals against
Suns - 6 goals
Cats - 6 and 5 goals
Hawks - 5 goals
Crows - 6 goals
Lions - 5 goals
Demons - 7 goals (win)
Freo - 7 goals again.

The only loss where we didn't get blown away in a qtr was Collingwood. You can't win games like that, and given our games played and age demographic, it shouldn't be happening. Some of these games, it wasn't the forwards beating us either, we had a huge amount of goals kicked against us by resting mids, or mids who ran forward.

If you're happy to settle for mediocrity, yeah, we're doing great!
What I saw in these games was a side that just couldn't handle the heat when the pressure was turned up. Look at it any way you want, a loss is a loss. I think Plough Wallace said it best - "if I see one bloke walk out of here, getting a pat on the back from people out there for a good effort, I'll spew up!"
Get real. This is the AFL.
Compare the WBFC team to the premiers. I see a chasm of difference in athleticism, talent and skill between the two teams and nearly the same for the next 3 or 4. We really are nowhere near it, and hopeful thinking and optimism are not going to do the job.
How is it possible that we are so inept when we have been blessed with excellent F/S picks and have the same salary cap as the top teams? Oh yeah, that's right. We settle for mediocrity.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

“So North Melbourne is set to get the Wyndham area as their NGA zone, after losing Tasmania. The Kangaroos are understood to be keeping their Wyndham access as part of their updated region, with that a big part of the club's submission to the AFL, and are also expected to get a northern corridor part of Victoria.”

 

[VitalDread]

“So North Melbourne is set to get the Wyndham area as their NGA zone, after losing Tasmania. The Kangaroos are understood to be keeping their Wyndham access as part of their updated region, with that a big part of the club's submission to the AFL, and are also expected to get a northern corridor part of Victoria.”

They pretty much had that zone from the start

 

[perro_loco]

If you're happy to settle for mediocrity, yeah, we're doing great!
What I saw in these games was a side that just couldn't handle the heat when the pressure was turned up. Look at it any way you want, a loss is a loss. I think Plough Wallace said it best - "if I see one bloke walk out of here, getting a pat on the back from people out there for a good effort, I'll spew up!"
Get real. This is the AFL.
Compare the WBFC team to the premiers. I see a chasm of difference in athleticism, talent and skill between the two teams and nearly the same for the next 3 or 4. We really are nowhere near it, and hopeful thinking and optimism are not going to do the job.
How is it possible that we are so inept when we have been blessed with excellent F/S picks and have the same salary cap as the top teams? Oh yeah, that's right. We settle for mediocrity.

You are spot on. We need to improve big if we want to make the top 4 next year.

 

[Freshwater]

“So North Melbourne is set to get the Wyndham area as their NGA zone, after losing Tasmania. The Kangaroos are understood to be keeping their Wyndham access as part of their updated region, with that a big part of the club's submission to the AFL, and are also expected to get a northern corridor part of Victoria.”

How can a club called North Melbourne get a zone in the southwest of Melbourne? The western suburbs were traditionally a very small part of Melbourne, only since the West Gate Bridge in 1978 and now the recent rapid immigration of migrants is it now growing. It is not football really football heartland. It doesn’t produce anything like the numbers of players other parts of Melbourne produce.

 

[lachy]

How can a club called North Melbourne get a zone in the southwest of Melbourne? The western suburbs were traditionally a very small part of Melbourne, only since the West Gate Bridge in 1978 and now the recent rapid immigration of migrants is it now growing. It is not football really football heartland. It doesn’t produce anything like the numbers of players other parts of Melbourne produce.

Pretty simple really, we went to Ballarat for the money and moved our resources there.

They initially merged with Werribee and then continued to put their development resources into Wyndham.

I have mentioned this numerous times in the Ballarat thread as I was involved in local football in and then around the area for 20 years.

There are ramifications for neglecting one area for another

 

[grassman75]

They have had a big off season. Good on them

Have a look how the last team that’s won trade week has gone for the last 20 years

 

[Dogs Rule]

Pretty simple really, we went to Ballarat for the money and moved our resources there.

They initially merged with Werribee and then continued to put their development resources into Wyndham.

I have mentioned this numerous times in the Ballarat thread as I was involved in local football in and then around the area for 20 years.

There are ramifications for neglecting one area for another

I still don't get our presence in Ballarat. Werribee and Hoppers Crossing is the western suburbs, it's our region. North should have no part of it.

It would be like saying to Geelong, we're going to take the Torquay/Ocean Grove area and give it to Carlton.

 

[Freshwater]

Pretty simple really, we went to Ballarat for the money and moved our resources there.

They initially merged with Werribee and then continued to put their development resources into Wyndham.

I have mentioned this numerous times in the Ballarat thread as I was involved in local football in and then around the area for 20 years.

There are ramifications for neglecting one area for another

Going to Ballarat shouldn’t mean we neglect Werribee. North Melbourne should be focused on the northern corridor and Bendigo in the north if they want a regional town as well, nearly exactly the same size as Ballarat.
I also was involved in local footy in the Werribee area for nearly 20 years. We definitely had North and Geelong fans but it was mostly a Footscray area. The competition was even called the Footscray District Football league.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Going to Ballarat shouldn’t mean we neglect Werribee. North Melbourne should be focused on the northern corridor and Bendigo in the north if they want a regional town as well, nearly exactly the same size as Ballarat.
I also was involved in local footy in the Werribee area for nearly 20 years. We definitely had North and Geelong fans but it was mostly a Footscray area. The competition was even called the Footscray District Football league.

Yep, as someone who's been in and around Werribee all my life, I could count the North fans around here on one hand. Dogs fans in the many thousands...

Anyway. Club knows best.

 

[Bonti 5416]

I'd argue Dovaston is and will be capable as a HFF.

In his highlights he often pushes up the ground like an extra midfielder and crashes into and through packs, you don't do that sitting in a forward pocket all day.

Cant wait to see his Yo-yo, agility and 20m sprint results. He seems average in all of these in the eye test. Got footy IQ but I worry about how damaging he can be at AFL level without elite athletic traits.

Charlie Clarke being a good example of someone who had a similar under 18 year

 

[VitalDread]

Feel like we will trade down from 10 to 16 and 22 then trade back up to 6

 

[Salad dog]

Feel like we will trade down from 10 to 16 and 22 then trade back up to 6

There must be a player that we’ve identified and are very keen on to move from our 1st to pick 7. Largely, they seem like similar players but in our current spot, we get left with whoever’s left. At the Suns pick, you likely get to pick the one you want most.

 

[Ash1337]

View attachment 2446274
I like what they are doing. We don’t need to try it as we’ve been very fortunate with father sons and we have had much better list management in place for longer. I do like the similar to money ball approach for the Saints through (even through they are paying top dollar for all these guys) in that they are actively hunting role players who will fill their needs as opposed to chasing elite players who are refusing to join them. They have genuinely given thinking differently a crack. They may still die and get stuffed right down the bottom of the ladder in a few years but they won’t die for lack of giving something different a crack.

This is the same approach Ross took with the saints in the 2000s by bringing in role players instead of going after elite players and it burnt them on the big stage.

 

[BigFloppa]

This is the same approach Ross took with the saints in the 2000s by bringing in role players instead of going after elite players and it burnt them on the big stage.

The late 2000s Saints team were dominant and tied in a Grand Final. To use the fact that they didn't win the flag as evidence of it being a poor strategy seems crazy to me. If you make a GF and dominate like that Saints team did then its evidence that your list strategy was pretty bloody effective.

 

[Foxman98]

Feel like we will trade down from 10 to 16 and 22 then trade back up to 6

Is this to grab someone early and Dovaston?

 

[lachy]

Going to Ballarat shouldn’t mean we neglect Werribee. North Melbourne should be focused on the northern corridor and Bendigo in the north if they want a regional town as well, nearly exactly the same size as Ballarat.
I also was involved in local footy in the Werribee area for nearly 20 years. We definitely had North and Geelong fans but it was mostly a Footscray area. The competition was even called the Footscray District Football league.

I also lived there from the early 90's. What should happen and did are 2 very different things. Clubs only have limited resources and we decided to go hard at Ballarat in conjunction with the state and local government.

North to their credit understood if you want to grow your footprint you just have to be there on the ground, not play games there. Also they have competition from Carlton and Essendon in areas you mention so took advantage of our decisions

 

[TiAn_]

The late 2000s Saints team were dominant and tied in a Grand Final. To use the fact that they didn't win the flag as evidence of it being a poor strategy seems crazy to me. If you make a GF and dominate like that Saints team did then its evidence that your list strategy was pretty bloody effective.

Yeah they were up for quite a while with that list. It was a different strategy back then anyway. They had a number of years down the bottom first and built around an incredible core of high draft picks in Riewoldt (1), Hayes (11), Goddard (1), Ball (1), Dal Santo (13), Montagna (28), Koschitzke (2) and others so the players they added only needed to be around the margins.

 

[VitalDread]

Pretty simple really, we went to Ballarat for the money and moved our resources there.

They initially merged with Werribee and then continued to put their development resources into Wyndham.

I have mentioned this numerous times in the Ballarat thread as I was involved in local football in and then around the area for 20 years.

There are ramifications for neglecting one area for another

Half the under 15s league names in the western region is named after the dogs

 

[Bulldogs85]

 

[iambrilliant]

What’s that saying about smoke and fire ?