AFL Silver Membership Waitlist Number Part 2

[eddiesmith]

If you're so much of a supporter going to your "own clubs" games, buy a membership where more of your money actually directly goes to the club and you get more benefits from the club. The waiting lists to go get a grand final ticket access should your club make it are certainly shorter and therefore less costly than even the advertised 7-10 year wait time as advertised in 2011-12 for AFL Gold membership.

I honestly don't see an argument for neutral game AFL membership benefits if you're using the AFL membership as a workaround for your own club's MCG game benefits and not proving yourself as an AFL member? When the MCG hosts a non-Collingwood Prelim Final why should a new AFL Gold member who signed up in 2012 and only used the 13 years in the interim as a workaround Collingwood memberships get access to that neutral game, morally, than someone who signed up in (say) 2016 and has spent 9 years going to an average of 20+ neutral games a year? They have proven themselves more than the Collingwood fan as someone who enjoys the Prelim for neutral football's sake as a fan of neutral football rather than the Collingwood fan going to the Prelim game becuase they want a sense of social capital and theatre.

This is not to say that the Collingwood fan doesn't deserve to go if they're willing to pay for their membership every year. Just that if you're paying an increasingly big amount - to the point that you don't ever see the "value for money" because you aren't exceeding going to 20 games per year - either don't pay the silver membership amount anymore (and buy a Collingwood membership), or otherwise don't complain and understand the problem is not that it isn't value for money anymore, just that you're not accepting the value of being able to use your barcode, for free, for an empty seat, at non-Collingwood Melbourne games, so it's your fault, not the AFL's that you don't see the value for moeny.

Well I’m a full member and it’s cheaper and more readily available than a Collingwood membership which provides guaranteed grand final access.

Good on you for going to 20+ games a year, doesn’t really make you more entitled than someone else to tickets.

 

[Shipping Report]

Well I’m a full member and it’s cheaper and more readily available than a Collingwood membership which provides guaranteed grand final access.

Good on you for going to 20+ games a year, doesn’t really make you more entitled than someone else to tickets.

Kind of should though.

Most English football clubs now have programs where you accrue points to get away tickets or access to cup semis or finals. And they’re pretty cut throat.

I was speaking to a Londoner a few weeks ago who said that since moving to the new Tottenham Hotspur stadium, you just about lose your season ticket if your seat goes empty for one game. People who had allowed a seat to go empty even four or five times were outright unable to even ballot for Tottenham’s Europa Cup final tickets.

I think it’s a fair system. I was recently talking to some campaigner who was a full MCG and AFL Member but lived on the Sunshine Coast and went to one game a year: the Grand Final. He’d give the other ticket to someone he was doing business with.

Not really in the spirit of it.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Well I’m a full member and it’s cheaper and more readily available than a Collingwood membership which provides guaranteed grand final access.

Good on you for going to 20+ games a year, doesn’t really make you more entitled than someone else to tickets.

Go for broke when Collingwood are the team that makes the PF or GF.

I don't think your use of AFL membership as a backdoor Collingwood membership (avaliable to you because Collingwood have a separate deal that guarantees them 15 MCG games a year, another ridiculous unfair disadvantage to the fans of 17 other clubs) makes you more deserving of attending neutral PFs and GFs, on the occasion that they don't involve Collingwood.

I get that it's a matter of interpretation which group of people is "deserving".

But I think I have a pretty solid argument that the neutral fan with a few years less of membership, but with more actual use of the AFL membership itself in terms of raw scanning into games for free as a neutral than the Collingwood fan who only uses it for 15 Collingwood games + maybe a handful more, which adds up to fewer total games attended via use of the AFL membership (despite the extra years) is more deserving to attend the neutral PF/GF.

Or if not measuring actual use of the membership itself, I have no real concerns with the AFL making the membership more expensive but in a way that's still value for money that want to use it as a form of attending actual games. Perhaps they could do something like make the membership $150 more expensive, but take $5 off the cost of the following year's membership for every game you attend. You attend 30 games, it pays for itself, you attend more, the AFL is actually paying you to attend games.

For the sake of argument if we're being stricter for these things and because of increased demand of GF tickets, I'm fine with the AFL not offering up as many memberships for 'neutral' AFL membership GF tickets and corporates, and offering more GF tickets to club members to make them more 'readily available' - maybe club membership GF access could increase from its current 17,000 to 20-25,000.

 

[TigerR]

I was speaking to a Londoner a few weeks ago who said that since moving to the new Tottenham Hotspur stadium, you just about lose your season ticket if your seat goes empty for one game.

What does "just about" mean? Sounds like it doesn't to me.

I was recently talking to some campaigner who was a full MCG and AFL Member but lived on the Sunshine Coast and went to one game a year: the Grand Final. He’d give the other ticket to someone he was doing business with.

This person is in breech of the conditions of whichever membership he is sharing. So will hopefully be caught (and I imagine would be sharing the AFL membership as they seem to not care as much). That said, if someone is living on the Sushine Coast and values the memberships that much they retain it (perhaps planning on returning to Melbourne one day) then so be it. If they make it for the GF that is their right. (Not sharing though.)

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

idk man people are allowed to use their membership in the way they see fit, if they only want to attend their teams games then that's their prerogative. doesn't mean it makes sense to me, someone who likes to go to 25-30 games a year, but it doesn't have to.

 

[TigerR]

I don't think your use of AFL membership as a backdoor Collingwood membership (avaliable to you because Collingwood have a separate deal that guarantees them 15 MCG games a year,

What does this mean and what does it matter where Collingwood are playing? AFL membership entitles you to MCG and Marvel (and KP for Geelong fans I think) whichever club you support.

But I think I have a pretty solid argument that the neutral fan with a few years less of membership, but with more actual use of the AFL membership itself in terms of raw scanning into games for free as a neutral than the Collingwood fan who only uses it for 15 Collingwood games + maybe a handful more

But you don't because AFL membership was never marketed this way. It has always been that Gold gets you GF access and recently with priority to members with club of support for those in it.

For the sake of argument if we're being stricter for these things and because of increased demand of GF tickets, I'm fine with the AFL not offering up as many memberships for 'neutral' AFL membership GF tickets and corporates, and offering more GF tickets to club members to make them more 'readily available'

I'm not. Golds pay a premium to go to any GF. And you know the AFL would never reduce corporates in your plan, only AFL members.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

What does this mean and what does it matter where Collingwood are playing? AFL membership entitles you to MCG and Marvel (and KP for Geelong fans I think) whichever club you support.

But you don't because AFL membership was never marketed this way. It has always been that Gold gets you GF access and recently with priority to members with club of support for those in it.

I'm not. Golds pay a premium to go to any GF. And you know the AFL would never reduce corporates in your plan, only AFL members.

Ok fine, then surely a solution to your arguments is precisely mine - make a membership $150 more expensive than what it currently is, but get a $5 discount per game attended, hell make it $300/$10.

That would weed out some (though not you) Silver/Golds who don't see it as a value-for-money neutral membership but just as a ticket to premium fixtures.

If you want to go to 15 MCG Collingwood games, fine. You only have to find 15 other games in Melbourne among 23 weeks in footy to get your money back. Give the ticket to a mate, whatever, that's still gets a bum in seat more than literally leaving a ticket barcode unscanned and an MCG neutral Melbourne vs. Freo seat empty, which the insane neutral fan who does bother to go to that game should be the one who gets the reward for getting to go to the GF.

 

[TigerR]

Ok fine, then surely a solution to your arguments is precisely mine - make a membership $150 more expensive than what it currently is, but get a $5 discount per game attended, hell make it $300/$10.

That would weed out some (though not you) Silver/Golds who don't see it as a value-for-money neutral membership but just as a ticket to premium fixtures.

If you want to go to 15 MCG Collingwood games, fine. You only have to find 15 other games in Melbourne among 23 weeks in footy to get your money back. Give the ticket to a mate, whatever, that's still gets a bum in seat more than literally leaving a ticket barcode unscanned and an MCG neutral Melbourne vs. Freo seat empty, which the insane neutral fan who does bother to go to that game should be the one who gets the reward for getting to go to the GF.

My only arguments are that the the waitlist moves too slowly and Gold members should be able to go to a neutral GF still. Increasing the price and then discounting based on attendence is too convoluted if you ask me and would penalise someone who genuinely can't go for a bunch of games (away for a few months, sick, etc). Sharing the membership is not a good idea and only makes the problem for current members worse (wanting to attend a blockbuster).
The simplest solution is in fact to stop people sharing memberships (plus stop Medallion club stealing our seats which won't happen). If people get caught and booted out they lose their membership or don't renew in the first place. MCC has 63000 full members but don't have a capacity issue on GF day.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Increasing the price and then discounting based on attendence is too convoluted if you ask me and would penalise someone who genuinely can't go for a bunch of games (away for a few months, sick, etc)

I'm not saying that these don't exist, but no system is perfect.

As pointed out above these are considerations for big club European soccer ticketing systems and they manage a way.

The payment system for attending games is another that's similar to US sports - you're forced to buy a seat for every game but to ensure the seat is used they allow you to sell it on resale sites. What I'm proposing is similar, just that the AFL itself is the 'resale site'.

The simplest solution is in fact to stop people sharing memberships (plus stop Medallion club stealing our seats which won't happen). If people get caught and booted out they lose their membership or don't renew in the first place. MCC has 63000 full members but don't have a capacity issue on GF day.

Not saying I don't disagree with this but clearly there are still several thousand PF/GF attendees who are simply not that passionate neutral footy fans and IMO shouldn't have a natural priority to the biggest neutral games.

 

[kurt_kb]

Ok fine, then surely a solution to your arguments is precisely mine - make a membership $150 more expensive than what it currently is, but get a $5 discount per game attended, hell make it $300/$10.

That would weed out some (though not you) Silver/Golds who don't see it as a value-for-money neutral membership but just as a ticket to premium fixtures.

If you want to go to 15 MCG Collingwood games, fine. You only have to find 15 other games in Melbourne among 23 weeks in footy to get your money back. Give the ticket to a mate, whatever, that's still gets a bum in seat more than literally leaving a ticket barcode unscanned and an MCG neutral Melbourne vs. Freo seat empty, which the insane neutral fan who does bother to go to that game should be the one who gets the reward for getting to go to the GF.

That sorta ignores the reality that the fewer members that attend overall, the higher they can make the caps on membership numbers given average attendance would be lower. If every member attended as much as you're suggesting they should, there wouldn't be able to be as many members as there currently is given the capacity of the AFL Reserve. And members who don't attend regularly in effect subsidise the cost of members who attended as much as possible. The cost of membership would be significantly higher if there was fewer members attending more games.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

That sorta ignores the reality that the fewer members that attend overall, the higher they can make the caps on membership numbers given average attendance would be lower. If every member attended as much as you're suggesting they should, there wouldn't be able to be as many members as there currently is given the capacity of the AFL Reserve. And members who don't attend regularly in effect subsidise the cost of members who attended as much as possible. The cost of membership would be significantly higher if there was fewer members attending more games.

I take it as a given that the AFL having a fair system for its fans would require them to be slightly less money-hungry. That's the entire basis of people complaing about Medallion club.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Meanwhile back on the waitlist numbers.

How did everyone go this year?

Was 6103 last year and only moved to 5899 this year

 

[eddiesmith]

Kind of should though.

Most English football clubs now have programs where you accrue points to get away tickets or access to cup semis or finals. And they’re pretty cut throat.

I was speaking to a Londoner a few weeks ago who said that since moving to the new Tottenham Hotspur stadium, you just about lose your season ticket if your seat goes empty for one game. People who had allowed a seat to go empty even four or five times were outright unable to even ballot for Tottenham’s Europa Cup final tickets.

I think it’s a fair system. I was recently talking to some campaigner who was a full MCG and AFL Member but lived on the Sunshine Coast and went to one game a year: the Grand Final. He’d give the other ticket to someone he was doing business with.

Not really in the spirit of it.

The problem with your example and comparison to here, is there is obviously a demand for seats and season ticket holders are taking up seats and if they don’t use them, then people miss out.

As AFL membership doesn’t come with a seat, it shouldn’t matter to anyone else whether people go to 1 game or 40.

The more people who don’t waste their time with Melbourne v Freo means better seats for those who do.

 

[eddiesmith]

Go for broke when Collingwood are the team that makes the PF or GF.

I don't think your use of AFL membership as a backdoor Collingwood membership (avaliable to you because Collingwood have a separate deal that guarantees them 15 MCG games a year, another ridiculous unfair disadvantage to the fans of 17 other clubs) makes you more deserving of attending neutral PFs and GFs, on the occasion that they don't involve Collingwood.

I get that it's a matter of interpretation which group of people is "deserving".

But I think I have a pretty solid argument that the neutral fan with a few years less of membership, but with more actual use of the AFL membership itself in terms of raw scanning into games for free as a neutral than the Collingwood fan who only uses it for 15 Collingwood games + maybe a handful more, which adds up to fewer total games attended via use of the AFL membership (despite the extra years) is more deserving to attend the neutral PF/GF.

Or if not measuring actual use of the membership itself, I have no real concerns with the AFL making the membership more expensive but in a way that's still value for money that want to use it as a form of attending actual games. Perhaps they could do something like make the membership $150 more expensive, but take $5 off the cost of the following year's membership for every game you attend. You attend 30 games, it pays for itself, you attend more, the AFL is actually paying you to attend games.

For the sake of argument if we're being stricter for these things and because of increased demand of GF tickets, I'm fine with the AFL not offering up as many memberships for 'neutral' AFL membership GF tickets and corporates, and offering more GF tickets to club members to make them more 'readily available' - maybe club membership GF access could increase from its current 17,000 to 20-25,000.

So if I was in Melbourne I could walk past, scan in and leave for 30 game a year and then you’d probably end up with the ridiculous scenario of a lockout for a game with empty seats everywhere.

 

[NetworkNerd]

Meanwhile back on the waitlist numbers.

How did everyone go this year?

Was 6103 last year and only moved to 5899 this year

Yeah not a big year of movement. My kids are still in the 20K+ range and only moved up 1200 spots

 

[threenewpadlocks]

So if I was in Melbourne I could walk past, scan in and leave for 30 game a year and then you’d probably end up with the ridiculous scenario of a lockout for a game with empty seats everywhere.

If you decide to do spend the several minutes to do that and then not spend the additional 90 seconds it takes to take your seat, all power to you.

 

[Shipping Report]

The problem with your example and comparison to here, is there is obviously a demand for seats and season ticket holders are taking up seats and if they don’t use them, then people miss out.

As AFL membership doesn’t come with a seat, it shouldn’t matter to anyone else whether people go to 1 game or 40.

The more people who don’t waste their time with Melbourne v Freo means better seats for those who do.

There isn’t demand for seats because pillows like you warp what AFL Membership is about so the AFL can get away with selling blow ins into the Members reserve, making a 30,000 capacity stand into essentially a 100,000 one.

The AFL makes money on a lot of Members who don’t attend games knowing they can sell their unused tickets.

I’m genuinely unsure why you’d be an AFL Member if you don’t like attending neutral games.

Ultimately I think you’re trying to give off a vibe of ‘I’m rich and very important.’

 

[Shipping Report]

So if I was in Melbourne I could walk past, scan in and leave for 30 game a year and then you’d probably end up with the ridiculous scenario of a lockout for a game with empty seats everywhere.

An entirely unlikely scenario

 

[Shipping Report]

Meanwhile back on the waitlist numbers.

How did everyone go this year?

Was 6103 last year and only moved to 5899 this year

Yeah back to the fascinating topic of random people blabbering on about pointless numbers.

 

[ComfortablyNumb]

Yeah back to the fascinating topic of random people blabbering on about pointless numbers.

not entirely sure if you can read, but the title of this thread is "AFL Silver Member Waitlist Number Part 2"
so those pointless numbers is kinda why we're here

 

[The Golden Glenferrie]

Yeah back to the fascinating topic of random people blabbering on about pointless numbers.

 

[TigerR]

Ultimately I think you’re trying to give off a vibe of ‘I’m rich and very important.’

I'm so rich I have an MCC and an AFL membership. And I still won't go to a Melbourne vs. Freo game.

 

[Satan]

I'm so rich I have an MCC and an AFL membership. And I still won't go to a Melbourne vs. Freo game.

neither would I , too many corporates

 

[Boxhead_31]

Yeah back to the fascinating topic of random people blabbering on about pointless numbers.

What is the thread title again?

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Are the tickets to the Boxing Day Test cheaper than GA? Do we get access to BBL tix as well?