Unsolved The Family Murders * BREAKING! Von Einem is dead

[Kurve]

* Slurs against any group and hateful content will be removed in accordance with the rules and warnings issued.

The Who's Who List

• #2,647

VICTIMS
AB - Alan Barnes 16yo
NM - Neil Muir 25yo
PS - Peter Stogneff 14yo
ML - Mark Langley 18yo
RK- Richard Kelvin 15yo

• DS - Derrance Stevenson high risk lifestyle pornographer and criminal lawyer shot to death
• DS - David Szach convicted for the murder of criminal lawyer Derrence Stevenson

DECEASED
DSD - Denis St Denis hairdresser
RBD - Richard Dutton Brown the magistrate
PF - Pru Firman
SN - Sarah Novak
BG - Brian Gant
NB - Noel Brook also known as Di Di
TP - Trevor Peters of the diaries
PM - Dr. Peter Leslie Millhouse acquitted for the murder of Neil Muir
GG - Gino Gambardella chiropractor fled to Italy
JL - Jacquie the nurse mentioned in the ebook as a good friend of and who rented a unit close to BVEs unit we assume name suppressed? Reportedly deceased.

LIVING until further notice
BVE - Bevan von Einem also known as 'Bevbang' to inner circle and 'Vonnie' in the prison system
Mr R - The businessman name suppressed
SGW - Dr Stephen George Woodards
Mr. B - Teenage prostitute and informant name suppressed

LT - Lewis Turtur also known as 'Louie'
A - The older teenage boy Peter Stogneff's parents feel may have had something to do with their son's abduction
RR - Raymond Rozankowski who was a friend of BVE and lived in the same street as A

DK - Darko Kastellan assistant to Gambardella

Out of Sight - The Untold Story of Adelaide's Gay Hate Murders

The Cases of Forensic Pathologist Colin Manock

Use this thread below to lodge media, maps and photos for quick reference.

Unsolved - The Family Murders - MEDIA

This thread may be used to post the Family Murders media related content. To include press and gathered photographs from various sources. Please feel free to post but as this is a no discussion thread, comments will be deleted or moved at discretion. WHO'S WHO VICTIMS AB - Alan Barnes 16yo...

www.bigfooty.com

The Untold Story of Adelaide's Gay Hate Murders

 

[theredrooster]

Blue shirt and beard — possibly the businessman “Mr. R”?
Tinted glasses and dyed jet-black hair — most probably Von Einem.
Young guy in black (not the victim) — Mr. B?
Trans woman — possibly Pru Firman or Sarah Novak? (I’m finding it hard to feel much sympathy for her, whoever she is, given that she’s portrayed here as more of a central figure than simply someone caught up in things due to drug dependence.)

From most publicly available details, it certainly seems reminiscent of the Alberton trans house, though the setting appears far more polished and upscale than descriptions of the actual location.

 

[dc3]

Yep I reckon you’ve nailed it

I’ve always wondered how the thought process went with locations or was it just availability

Cruise grand junction, port road, old port road and tapleys if alberton was the location or city east end if the east suburbs houses were the available location or was any of it planned at all

 

[theredrooster]

Yep I reckon you’ve nailed it

I’ve always wondered how the thought process went with locations or was it just availability

Cruise grand junction, port road, old port road and tapleys if alberton was the location or city east end if the east suburbs houses were the available location or was any of it planned at all

According to what Lewis Turtur told Debi Marshall in her investigative series and book, most weekends BVE would reportedly show up — presumably at the Alberton house — in the middle of the night with an intoxicated boy, often around 2 or 3 a.m. The trans women were said to be expected to “have a room ready” for him in exchange for drugs. BVE would then allegedly contact the businessman to come over and take part, and the trans women were also described as sometimes participating. From these accounts, it appears to have been a fairly organized operation, though it also seems that the routines and arrangements evolved over the years.

At times, BVE might have been able to lure a boy on his own by presenting himself as a good Samaritan, while on other nights he reportedly also relied on the trans women as foxy lures. At some stage, it seems possible that the trans woman involved grew tired of hosting, leading BVE and others (reportedly the businessman, the businessman's assistant and hairdresser Denis St Denis) to rent an apartment to use as a separate “play space.”

I hadn’t realized that Mr. B (the former male prostitute) was involved for such an extended period, but he testified that he witnessed Alan Barnes’ abduction in 1979, and the newly-released 1988 60 Minutes segment noted that “these were the same people who took Richard Kelvin” in 1983. Taken together, it suggests he was present throughout the entire four-year span in which the five known deaths occurred.

I’m not sure where “the Sydney doctor,” presumably Dr. Stephen George Woodards (named unredacted above), fits into the broader system. That aspect has never been clearly explained publicly. One is left only to speculate that he may have been involved intermittently or that he might have been contacted for medical assistance when needed, but there’s no definitive public account confirming what his role actually was.

 

[theredrooster]

According to what Lewis Turtur told Debi Marshall in her investigative series and book, most weekends BVE would reportedly show up — presumably at the Atherton house — in the middle of the night with an intoxicated boy, often around 2 or 3 a.m. The trans women were said to be expected to “have a room ready” for him in exchange for drugs. BVE would then allegedly contact the businessman to come over and take part, and the trans women were also described as sometimes participating. From these accounts, it appears to have been a fairly organized operation, though it also seems that the routines and arrangements evolved over the years.

At times, BVE might have been able to lure a boy on his own by presenting himself as a good Samaritan, while on other nights he reportedly also relied on the trans women as foxy lures. At some stage, it seems possible that the trans woman involved grew tired of hosting, leading BVE and others (reportedly the businessman and hairdresser Denis St Denis) to rent an apartment to use as a separate “play space.”

I hadn’t realized that Mr. B (former male prostitute) was involved for such an extended period, but he testified that he witnessed Alan Barnes’ abduction in 1979, and the 60 Minutes segment noted that “these were the same people who took Richard Kelvin” in 1983. Taken together, it suggests he was present throughout the entire four-year span in which the five known deaths occurred.

I’m not sure where “the Sydney doctor,” presumably Dr. Stephen George Woodards (named unredacted above), fits into the broader system. That aspect has never been clearly explained publicly. One is left only to speculate that he may have been involved intermittently or that he might have been contacted for medical assistance when needed, but there’s no definitive public account confirming what his role actually was.

The one figure who seems to appear repeatedly in these accounts is “Mr. R — the businessman.” It’s baffling that, after more than 46 years, SAPOL hasn’t been able to establish anything remotely concrete on him. How could someone maintain that level of insulation for so long? And what is it about him that leaves people so hesitant or afraid to speak openly? From the outside, he appears to be just a somewhat enigmatic retail keeper-of-time salesman, which only makes the lack of clarity around him even more puzzling.

Can someone explain what has kept Mr. R seemingly insulated for so long? Perhaps, in earlier years, he had connections with a now-deceased former Premier and certain judicial figures, but that’s only speculation. Still, it raises the question: what factors are protecting him now? Why would Von Einem have avoided naming him for all these years? And why haven’t any of his former associates come forward, especially given the $1,000,000 reward?

What am I missing about this man? What is it about him? What needs to happen to finally nail him?

 

[Soldier Of Misfortune]

Thirty-seven years after this 1988 report, the case hasn’t officially advanced even an inch. Not one inch.

not publicly. Who knows how much info the police are sitting on tortured by the fact that they can't quite get it to a concrete court case. That'd be hellish for them I imagine.

 

[Soldier Of Misfortune]

I hadn’t realized that Mr. B (former male prostitute) was involved for such an extended period, but he testified that he witnessed Alan Barnes’ abduction in 1979, and the 60 Minutes segment noted that “these were the same people who took Richard Kelvin” in 1983. Taken together, it suggests he was present throughout the entire four-year span in which the five known deaths occurred.

According to Dissected, Nurse Jacqui (and PJ) was in the car at Kelvin's abduction and she was Mr B's housemate (at some point in time, not sure about then) so possibly he knew about things that way? Still would like to know how McInerney seemed to have so many more details than any other book regarding who was involved in things. Would love him to be able to get on here for some Q & A!

 

[Soldier Of Misfortune]

What am I missing about this man? What is it about him?

other than the alleged gun threats against Mr B, I'm guessing it's absolute concrete evidence. Surely Mr B can't just turn up to the police and say "I saw this and that" and then people go to jail.

 

[dc3]

not publicly. Who knows how much info the police are sitting on tortured by the fact that they can't quite get it to a concrete court case. That'd be hellish for them I imagine.

That and the evidence was left in a tin shed

 

[dc3]

According to what Lewis Turtur told Debi Marshall in her investigative series and book, most weekends BVE would reportedly show up — presumably at the Alberton house — in the middle of the night with an intoxicated boy, often around 2 or 3 a.m. The trans women were said to be expected to “have a room ready” for him in exchange for drugs. BVE would then allegedly contact the businessman to come over and take part, and the trans women were also described as sometimes participating. From these accounts, it appears to have been a fairly organized operation, though it also seems that the routines and arrangements evolved over the years.

At times, BVE might have been able to lure a boy on his own by presenting himself as a good Samaritan, while on other nights he reportedly also relied on the trans women as foxy lures. At some stage, it seems possible that the trans woman involved grew tired of hosting, leading BVE and others (reportedly the businessman, the businessman's assistant and hairdresser Denis St Denis) to rent an apartment to use as a separate “play space.”

I hadn’t realized that Mr. B (the former male prostitute) was involved for such an extended period, but he testified that he witnessed Alan Barnes’ abduction in 1979, and the 60 Minutes segment noted that “these were the same people who took Richard Kelvin” in 1983. Taken together, it suggests he was present throughout the entire four-year span in which the five known deaths occurred.

I’m not sure where “the Sydney doctor,” presumably Dr. Stephen George Woodards (named unredacted above), fits into the broader system. That aspect has never been clearly explained publicly. One is left only to speculate that he may have been involved intermittently or that he might have been contacted for medical assistance when needed, but there’s no definitive public account confirming what his role actually was.

Dr w is probably the one who retrieved the stuck toy/bottle that had finger prints and probably put Neill Muir’s legs in his chest cavity

I know they think he probably didn’t have surgical experience but if you don’t plan to keep them alive it’s not a big stretch for a GP

 

[dc3]

Police were pretty good at keeping people away from clocker….

 

[Macka_321]

Caught the end of a police press conference unrelated to this case but a reporter asked the question about MC meeting with bevan she confirmed they did but didn’t say what or if anything was said.

 

[Rake]

The one figure who seems to appear repeatedly in these accounts is “Mr. R — the businessman.” It’s baffling that, after more than 46 years, SAPOL hasn’t been able to establish anything remotely concrete on him. How could someone maintain that level of insulation for so long? And what is it about him that leaves people so hesitant or afraid to speak openly? From the outside, he appears to be just a somewhat enigmatic retail keeper-of-time salesman, which only makes the lack of clarity around him even more puzzling.

Can someone explain what has kept Mr. R seemingly insulated for so long? Perhaps, in earlier years, he had connections with a now-deceased former Premier and certain judicial figures, but that’s only speculation. Still, it raises the question: what factors are protecting him now? Why would Von Einem have avoided naming him for all these years? And why haven’t any of his former associates come forward, especially given the $1,000,000 reward?

What am I missing about this man? What is it about him? What needs to happen to finally nail him?

He has money to pay for lawyers to fight attempts to lift the suppression order. That’s it. You don’t need to have friends in high places to keep a suppression order in place.

As for what it would take for a conviction, it would take a credible eyewitness of events almost 50 years ago. And that eye witness would have to convince a jury of why he/she stayed silent all these years. There will never be convictions for these murders after all these years.

 

[Peter Doherty]

This thread, over 200 pages, doesn't name all the people that are speculated as being members of The Family.

There are other names out there, roughly how many more? The names the books and shows didn't touch.

 

[Shadows]

Please correct me if I am wrong but I reckon you may have provided further details regarding the discovery of RK? If so do we have any details on whether or not they are still around? From my basic understanding he was out bush walking with family. Spotted van that was poorly hidden, then wandered off a little to find body. Call cops who laugh it off until he mentions the boy is wearing adidas romes? Waits nearby for a couple hours and then a cop that wasn't even aware takes him there. Van is now possibly gone? If this is all legit then WTF were the cops doing?

The father has passed away but his wife and children are still around.

 

[Shadows]

The medical examiners conducting the autopsy and examinations also discovered that Alan's body had been washed extensively after his death; likely an effort to scrub away any evidence linking him to the killer. He was also found to be wearing clothing that did not belong to him, and his original clothing was missing entirely. Maybe QC stands for a Queens Counsel

It turns out that the clothing did belong to him according to his brother.

 

[Peter Doherty]

nominal_port_supporter I'm unsure what part of my post you disagree with.

I'm not looking for names, just trying to get an idea of how many un-named names we're talking about here.

 

[theredrooster]

He has money to pay for lawyers to fight attempts to lift the suppression order. That’s it. You don’t need to have friends in high places to keep a suppression order in place.

As for what it would take for a conviction, it would take a credible eyewitness of events almost 50 years ago. And that eye witness would have to convince a jury of why he/she stayed silent all these years. There will never be convictions for these murders after all these years.

I can accept that. But surely it wouldn’t be difficult to find at least one credible witness who could attest to the businessman's involvement in one or more of the assaults. There must still be victims or associates who could identify him. And at his age, that alone would be enough to see him imprisoned for the rest of his life. Even Lewis Turtur confirmed Mr. R’s presence to Debi Marshall. This bastard has slid through life scot-free.

 

[Tanned]

He has money to pay for lawyers to fight attempts to lift the suppression order. That’s it. You don’t need to have friends in high places to keep a suppression order in place.

As for what it would take for a conviction, it would take a credible eyewitness of events almost 50 years ago. And that eye witness would have to convince a jury of why he/she stayed silent all these years. There will never be convictions for these murders after all these years.

The cover up was complete many years ago.

 

[nominal_port_supporter]

nominal_port_supporter I'm unsure what part of my post you disagree with.

I'm not looking for names, just trying to get an idea of how many un-named names we're talking about here.

Because I think across the full 203 pages of this thread those most likely involved in the murders is pretty well discussed. Of course without conviction it's all basically speculation, but it seems like the police and some of the posters on this forum have a strong idea of who was involved, both directly and more on the periphery. Unfortunately, it's unlikely there will ever be at this point sufficient evidence for conviction, so we will never be 100 per cent certain.

 

[Peter Doherty]

Because I think across the full 203 pages of this thread those most likely involved in the murders is pretty well discussed. Of course without conviction it's all basically speculation, but it seems like the police and some of the posters on this forum have a strong idea of who was involved, both directly and more on the periphery. Unfortunately, it's unlikely there will ever be at this point sufficient evidence for conviction, so we will never be 100 per cent certain.

I respect your opinion, that there is likely no one else outside who has been mentioned in this thread. There are no other names you've heard that have not been mentioned here.

Question is still open to everyone else.

 

[theredrooster]

Police were pretty good at keeping people away from clocker….

Well yes, Clocker was Mr. R’s assistant and would likely have known many details from that time. One of the rental “play pen” apartments was reportedly listed in his name. If that’s true, it raises the question of why he wouldn’t come forward now—especially with a $1,000,000 incentive—regarding someone he worked for more than four decades ago.

 

[Soldier Of Misfortune]

Well yes, Clocker was Mr. R’s assistant and would likely have known many details from that time. One of the rental “play pen” apartments was reportedly listed in his name. If that’s true, it raises the question of why he wouldn’t come forward now—especially with a $1,000,000 incentive—regarding someone he worked for more than four decades ago.

possible involvement may lead to being overly careful. He may have been involved and doesn't want to risk his own neck. I'd imagine even if you were clean it'd also be quite scary to give that information and possibly not be safe from repercussions.

 

[Macka_321]

In terms of getting convictions I think that’s not going to happen now. The suppression orders on the names definitely has to be lifted which the government have the power to do if they really wanted.

 

[theredrooster]

Let’s hope 60 Minutes revisits the case soon and pulls it out of this internet forum and back into the national dialogue. With BVE’s impending death dominating the news and their revelatory 1988 report resurfacing this week, my guess is that the program is already working on something big. And, hopefully it helps.

 

[dc3]

I respect your opinion, that there is likely no one else outside who has been mentioned in this thread. There are no other names you've heard that have not been mentioned here.

Question is still open to everyone else.

I think it’s been a fairytale for years that The Who’s who of adelaide were involved everyone from radio personalities, to weather woman and even co-workers of rob kelvin! But none substantiated