Who will finish higher - Adelaide, Geelong or West Coast?

[ScarlettFever]

Sorry but I disagree

Damn, I thought my logic was flawless.

 

[mattsea]

I'm running a comp to tip which teams will make the finals, some of you might be interested: https://thearcfooty.com/2017/01/21/projecting-finalists-challenge/

 

[Duskfire]

I actually think Geelong will be stronger - menegola after a full season is going to be that consistent third midfielder that the cats need and Thurlow is an extremely underrated player who is just injury prone. West coast will struggle without Nat.

Adelaide a bit of a wild card - I could certainly see them having a massive season.

 

[Ricmel]

Got flogged by Collingwood in the Prelim, Ablett gone where is the improvement going to come from...

Well you buy in the best player in the AFL. And bonus.....he has one of the most stellar years ever.

That will usually do it. Not sure they have grabbed another danger in 2017 though and cannot see him being a big improver on 2016. If he does then he is heading toward GOAT.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

I think Adelaide's midfield is better than what is generally acknowledged on BF.

It's interesting evidence that you've pulled up, even without this I felt that Adelaide had a better midfield (ability to win contested ball specifically) than what some on BF have acknowledged.

I look at your players who will have the most impact in the midfield in 2017 and more specifically at the stoppages and I would say they would be Sloane, the Crouch Brothers and Thompson less so as I think it's been flagged that he'll spend more time at half back to give the Crows more flexibility and allow the younger mids to have more opportunity.

If you go by stats, Thompson actually averaged the most clearances for the Crows last year with an average of 5.77 clearances per game and some may say there could be a reliance on him but considering he's going to spend less time in there it should benefit the other midfielders to have more of an opportunity to step up.

I reckon Brad Crouch will step up this year and I haven't heard anything to suggest that he's had an injury interrupted pre-season this time around so I think he can eliminate the form and injury issues he had for the first part of last year and improve on the 16 games he played. I think he'll start delivering on his potential now despite question marks externally regarding injuries and his commitment.

Matt Crouch I feel is underrated. I rate his work on the inside and to his credit he finds plenty of the ball on the outside as well. I feel he still has room for improvement on the outside more so than inside, and he averaged 268 metres gained and 2.55 I50s per game this year which considering his age and him improving each year I think that can get better as well.

Sloane is Sloane I think we know what we're going to get from him and he's probably at his peak right now considering his age so there won't be much room for improvement but that doesn't matter as he's a top class mid anyway who can play inside and outside equally as well.

Ideally, you would hope another younger mid emerges this year to increase the Crows midfield depth specifically in the best 22 to help support Sloane, the Crouch's and Thompson and I'm a little unsure who that could be maybe Ellis-Yolmen but I feel that the time may have passed him despite the greater opportunity he should have.

I think the Crows will be similar to last year, I reckon they will fight for that last spot in the top 4 with Geelong which I think will be tight and it could be decided by the two games they play this year but I'm leaning towards the Crows as I feel that their midfield has enough support from their terrific backline and forwardline to make top 4.

Although I don't agree with all of it, great post none the less Bazza.

 

[Seeds]

How is your list weaker? Well you lost one of your best 3 and one of the very best in his position in the comp, in Enright and you replaced him with someone inferior, in Touhy; you lost another who was best 22, in Bartel and replaced him with someone who is almost certainly inferior, who hasn't played a game, from the draft; you lost another who was best 22 and rated "elite" for their position by Champion Data (because he achieved the relatively rare double of averaging 20 disposals and a goal a game), in Caddy and likewise replaced him with someone who hasn't played a game and you lost another of the top 6 in your goalkicking, in Kersten, and replaced him with someone who has been wallowing in the VFL for all but 3 games in the last two years, in Black.

From where I'm sitting, it looks like 4 clear downgrades from a list perspective. The 4 you lost played a combined total of 80 AFL games for the year and the best 4 you brought into your list to replace them with played a combined total of 22. Then you also have the others you lost who have AFL experience, who have been replaced by others who have none, are untried and very speculative- given where they were drafted. So your depth may not be as good in the short term if you get injuries.

This is why to many your list looks weaker, because the "ins" don't look anywhere near as good as the "outs". At least in the immediate term.

So you're potentially relying largely on an improved game plan, internal individual improvement, getting pretty much no injuries for the year and no-ones form dropping off- due to age or whatever- to counteract the form of others improving. As every other club will be hoping and praying for for their own team.

Good luck to you if all that happens, you'll deserve whatever you get if it does and you'll probably be right in it up to your necks again.

you are counting bartel and kersten? Seriously? Kersten was a walking poo. Literally. His presence actually made the team worse. Bartel was only in the 22 at the end cos menzel was injured and cockatoo was coming back from injury. He was gone. Caddy i rate but he has been injured the past 18 months and a shadow of what he was prior.

Enright aint being replaced by tuohy. He is being replaced by thurlow who missed all of last year and is effectively a list addition. Not as good but he will mitigate the loss. Tuohy is just an added bonus to give us some pace of the half back flank which we sorely lacked last year.

Your analysis accounts for no improvement in the under 25s. Nor the fact that we had a number of mids who had interupted seasons last year and so far this preaseason all are going well.

Then there is menzel and cockatoo who are the two big question marks. Both non existant in the finals due to injuries in the back half of the season.

 

[ok.crows]

Yes but through uncontested possession. Not through winning contested posessions which is where the quality of the midfield matters.

Hardly. It takes either quality on your team or lack of quality on the part of the opposition (which is still quality for your team relatively speaking) in order to create uncontested possession.

Just because no opposition player is near you when you get a possession doesn't mean that you did not have to do any quality work to get that uncontested possession in the first place.

Have you ever heard the terms "gut running" and "run both ways"?

 

[ok.crows]

Although I don't agree with all of it,

Why? Did you perhaps have some of those "alternative facts" that I am hearing about lately?

 

[Leeda]

holy cow these are the least expected clubs to require help media wise and so I can't help but laugh...

just helping out the helpless..

have you known that the more you say a word... i.e. help... helpless.. it seems to mean less or is not very
helpful in the end.. Help me but don't blame me!!!

just don't shoot the messenger..

 

[Stan The Caddy]

Why? Did you perhaps have some of those "alternative facts" that I am hearing about lately?

I didn't agree with all of it. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings. #notreally

 

[Leeda]

just so I answer the question correctly,I can only say that two out of three wing bad and therefore geelong are the danger house of the
three... just got sidetracked... lol

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Losing Enright and Bartel makes Geelong weaker. Enright is a massive loss! AA defender. He killed the crows both games last year.

I'm not sure how many times I need to repeat myself before the message gets through but Bartel has been a liability for a year and a half.

Any astute football
Observer knows we're stronger as a collective due to covering our weaknesses... I'll let you work out what those were.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

West Coast

Its easily forgotten they finished strongly to earn a home final last year and made a GF the year before, that said I still think they will surprise and make top 4.

Adelaide are expected of big things, they should be fine, but I have higher hopes for the Eagles.

I'll probably get slammed for the team I support but I objectively think the Cats will miss the 8. Not sure they should be included with these two.

 

[ok.crows]

I didn't agree with all of it. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings. #notreally

How did you get from my observation that "you don't seem to have any facts" to #myfeelingsarehurt ?

I can assure you that facts are facts, and a lack of facts is a lack of facts, and that no #notreally I am not the least bit hurt by your illogic. #strawman #ArgumentumAdPopulum

 

[Leeda]

West Coast

Its easily forgotten they finished strongly to win a home final last year and made a GF the year before, that said I still think they will surprise and make top 4.

Adelaide are expected of big things, they should be fine, but I have higher hopes for the Eagles.

I'll probably get slammed for the team I support but I objectively think the Cats will miss the 8. Not sure they should be included with these two.

hmm no I have gone off the eagles... the wee grrls.. sam come back to me but it won't do no good... absolutely shot to bits and so I treat the eagles to a
very big dose of nasty if only so that he regrets the move and well lets hear it right when he retires.. short pants and nice hair will always get you somewhere..

 

[Alwaysacrow]

It's interesting evidence that you've pulled up, even without this I felt that Adelaide had a better midfield (ability to win contested ball specifically) than what some on BF have acknowledged.

I look at your players who will have the most impact in the midfield in 2017 and more specifically at the stoppages and I would say they would be Sloane, the Crouch Brothers and Thompson less so as I think it's been flagged that he'll spend more time at half back to give the Crows more flexibility and allow the younger mids to have more opportunity.

If you go by stats, Thompson actually averaged the most clearances for the Crows last year with an average of 5.77 clearances per game and some may say there could be a reliance on him but considering he's going to spend less time in there it should benefit the other midfielders to have more of an opportunity to step up.

I reckon Brad Crouch will step up this year and I haven't heard anything to suggest that he's had an injury interrupted pre-season this time around so I think he can eliminate the form and injury issues he had for the first part of last year and improve on the 16 games he played. I think he'll start delivering on his potential now despite question marks externally regarding injuries and his commitment.

Matt Crouch I feel is underrated. I rate his work on the inside and to his credit he finds plenty of the ball on the outside as well. I feel he still has room for improvement on the outside more so than inside, and he averaged 268 metres gained and 2.55 I50s per game this year which considering his age and him improving each year I think that can get better as well.

Sloane is Sloane I think we know what we're going to get from him and he's probably at his peak right now considering his age so there won't be much room for improvement but that doesn't matter as he's a top class mid anyway who can play inside and outside equally as well.

Ideally, you would hope another younger mid emerges this year to increase the Crows midfield depth specifically in the best 22 to help support Sloane, the Crouch's and Thompson and I'm a little unsure who that could be maybe Ellis-Yolmen but I feel that the time may have passed him despite the greater opportunity he should have.

I think the Crows will be similar to last year, I reckon they will fight for that last spot in the top 4 with Geelong which I think will be tight and it could be decided by the two games they play this year but I'm leaning towards the Crows as I feel that their midfield has enough support from their terrific backline and forwardline to make top 4.

Excellent post especially from an opposition supporter.Crows MF could be underated this year but only if the likes of Crouch's, Cameron, CEY??? , Milera, Knight, Hampton have break out years. The last 2 didn't play senior footy last year through injury so with some luck they might add to our MF this year. Of course not all of the players I mentioned will have break out years but if 2 or 3 do our MF may surprise some. I'm hoping it will anyway.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

How did you get from my observation that "you don't seem to have any facts" to #myfeelingsarehurt ?

I can assure you that facts are facts, and a lack of facts is a lack of facts, and that no #notreally I am not the least bit hurt by your illogic. #strawman #ArgumentumAdPopulum

Haha!

 

[thebarry111]

West Coast

Its easily forgotten they finished strongly to earn a home final last year and made a GF the year before, that said I still think they will surprise and make top 4.

Adelaide are expected of big things, they should be fine, but I have higher hopes for the Eagles.

I'll probably get slammed for the team I support but I objectively think the Cats will miss the 8. Not sure they should be included with these two.

Thanks for the input champ. "Objectively" your post adds nothing. Let's look at the in depth analysis, Adelaide are expected of big things, so should be fine. Ground breaking stuff right there! Can't wait to break that out into conversation at the pub. I objectively think the cats will miss the eight. More ground breaking analysis. I hope it didn't hurt your head putting this all together.

 

[Leeda]

Thanks for the input champ. "Objectively" your post adds nothing. Let's look at the in depth analysis, Adelaide are expected of big things, so should be fine. Ground breaking stuff right there! Can't wait to break that out into conversation at the pub. I objectively think the cats will miss the eight. More ground breaking analysis. I hope it didn't hurt your head putting this all together.

Hey something I would like to achieve this year is that hopefully none of us will just chuck hissy fits at everyone else and so we all understand everything
and don't crash anyone's party.

Just don't be absolutely rude, or snarky or otherwise cheating the system.

It is my endeavour to be nice and encourage everyone else to be the same.. I don't know if it will work but I will try...

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Yes but through uncontested possession. Not through winning contested posessions which is where the quality of the midfield matters.

Crows were 2nd in contested possession last year including the Cats... so your theory is complete rubbish!

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Crows were 2nd in contested possession last year including the Cats... so your theory is complete rubbish!

A free kick is also a contested possession as is a loose ball get. I take no notice in rubbish stats.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

A free kick is also a contested possession as is a loose ball get. I take no notice in rubbish stats.

When they completely debunk your theory

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

When they completely debunk your theory

What theory was that?

 

[Seeds]

When they completely debunk your theory

Out of interest, how did you go in those stats in your games against the prelim finalists?

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

What theory was that?

Seeds theory which that the Crows are rubbish with contested possession that I was quoting...