Analysis Blaming Bucks not Clear-cut

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POKsPies252

Club Legend
Apr 25, 2013
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Collingwood
Blaming Bucks not Clear-cut

There’s no doubt that the fortunes of a playing group are the ultimate responsibility of the senior coach and those in charge. Following Collingwood’s disappointing loss on ANZAC Day against the bombers, the pressure has grown immensely to a stage where Pies fans are rightly asking for change. The most popular judgment is that the club should acknowledge that this succession plan has been a failure and that Buckley’s role as senior coach is terminated. It is the most popular because it is also the easiest stance for supporters to take.

Collingwood are 1-4 from their opening five games, an horrendous start in any language. Let’s be realistic here though, all four losses have come between 14-20 points rather than any major blowouts. In these games the opportunity has been there to win the game, we’re momentum was in their favour yet they failed to capitalize. If games were played in first halves, Collingwood are +7 this season, showing although not dominant, they have been well and truly in every game come the main break. One thing that is hard to fathom are the calls that the players show no heart or passion and that this is a direct result of Buckley being unable to motivate his players. Defence is the main principal in analysing the so-called passion and heart of the players. Collingwood rank 3rd in tackles in the league whilst conceding 12.8 goals a game, a goal below the league average of 13.8 goals per game.

Collingwood’s offensive issues are glaringly obvious. They sit just ahead of Carlton at 17th in goals kicked, averaging just 10.4 per game. Despite this stat, let’s not pretend that the opportunities haven’t been there. Despite the forward line issues, the Pies midfield is up there with the best in the competition. As a team the Pies are 2nd in contested possessions, 4th in total possessions, 5th in clearances and 5th in inside 50s. These statistics simply shouldn’t equate to a team ranked 17th in scoring. The issue comes from the ball use both around the ground and in front of goal. They rank 14th in disposal efficiency and 4th in behinds at 14.2 per game compared to their goal average of 10.8. Who is to blame for this? Collingwood’s game plan offensively is scratchy at best and at times is actually hard to identify with. Their entries inside 50 are often haphazard and give little help to a young and inexperienced forward line. So yes, the game plan or lack thereof is fault of the coaching staff and needs to addressed. However there’s only so much you can do with the limited personnel. The Pies are desperately requiring one if not two key forwards to supplement Darcy Moore who is unsurprisingly struggling with the pressure of being the main man.

Unfortunately a concrete solution will not arise until at least next year and even then it is hard to see them acquiring a top 10 key forward they require. In the meantime the coaching staff have to be creative in finding a way to become more potent. For the first time all season it seemed yesterday as if they were aware of this and at least tried something different. Captain Scott Pendlebury started as the deepest forward at the first bounce and he and Daniel Wells often found themselves starting deep at centre bounces in an attempt to add star power and much needed class up forward. This proved ineffective despite the fact Wells kicked two goals in his debut game at his new club. In a show of desperation Ben Reid was swung forward late but with little impact.

It is easy to put blame upon Nathan Buckley and the coaching staff and of course they must take some of the responsibility especially for a dodgy, unidentifiable game plan. But the list management team should also take responsibility for the fact they have not recruited adequately to take the pressure off Moore. A 2-3 goal a game key forward alongside him would help Moore and Collingwood immensely. Buckley can also not be blamed for the inaccurate goalkicking and the lack of ‘clutch factor’ when kicking for goal especially in pressure situations. The flow on effect from continuous missed shots cannot be underestimated as with every miss comes a continued wane in confidence among the playing group. A capable key forward and improved goalkicking and you are looking at a team that is at minimum 3-2 and the media and supporter hysteria surrounding Buckley simply wouldn’t exist.
 

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Blaming Bucks not Clear-cut

There’s no doubt that the fortunes of a playing group are the ultimate responsibility of the senior coach and those in charge. Following Collingwood’s disappointing loss on ANZAC Day against the bombers, the pressure has grown immensely to a stage where Pies fans are rightly asking for change. The most popular judgment is that the club should acknowledge that this succession plan has been a failure and that Buckley’s role as senior coach is terminated. It is the most popular because it is also the easiest stance for supporters to take.

Collingwood are 1-4 from their opening five games, an horrendous start in any language. Let’s be realistic here though, all four losses have come between 14-20 points rather than any major blowouts. In these games the opportunity has been there to win the game, we’re momentum was in their favour yet they failed to capitalize. If games were played in first halves, Collingwood are +7 this season, showing although not dominant, they have been well and truly in every game come the main break. One thing that is hard to fathom are the calls that the players show no heart or passion and that this is a direct result of Buckley being unable to motivate his players. Defence is the main principal in analysing the so-called passion and heart of the players. Collingwood rank 3rd in tackles in the league whilst conceding 12.8 goals a game, a goal below the league average of 13.8 goals per game.

Collingwood’s offensive issues are glaringly obvious. They sit just ahead of Carlton at 17th in goals kicked, averaging just 10.4 per game. Despite this stat, let’s not pretend that the opportunities haven’t been there. Despite the forward line issues, the Pies midfield is up there with the best in the competition. As a team the Pies are 2nd in contested possessions, 4th in total possessions, 5th in clearances and 5th in inside 50s. These statistics simply shouldn’t equate to a team ranked 17th in scoring. The issue comes from the ball use both around the ground and in front of goal. They rank 14th in disposal efficiency and 4th in behinds at 14.2 per game compared to their goal average of 10.8. Who is to blame for this? Collingwood’s game plan offensively is scratchy at best and at times is actually hard to identify with. Their entries inside 50 are often haphazard and give little help to a young and inexperienced forward line. So yes, the game plan or lack thereof is fault of the coaching staff and needs to addressed. However there’s only so much you can do with the limited personnel. The Pies are desperately requiring one if not two key forwards to supplement Darcy Moore who is unsurprisingly struggling with the pressure of being the main man.

Unfortunately a concrete solution will not arise until at least next year and even then it is hard to see them acquiring a top 10 key forward they require. In the meantime the coaching staff have to be creative in finding a way to become more potent. For the first time all season it seemed yesterday as if they were aware of this and at least tried something different. Captain Scott Pendlebury started as the deepest forward at the first bounce and he and Daniel Wells often found themselves starting deep at centre bounces in an attempt to add star power and much needed class up forward. This proved ineffective despite the fact Wells kicked two goals in his debut game at his new club. In a show of desperation Ben Reid was swung forward late but with little impact.

It is easy to put blame upon Nathan Buckley and the coaching staff and of course they must take some of the responsibility especially for a dodgy, unidentifiable game plan. But the list management team should also take responsibility for the fact they have not recruited adequately to take the pressure off Moore. A 2-3 goal a game key forward alongside him would help Moore and Collingwood immensely. Buckley can also not be blamed for the inaccurate goalkicking and the lack of ‘clutch factor’ when kicking for goal especially in pressure situations. The flow on effect from continuous missed shots cannot be underestimated as with every miss comes a continued wane in confidence among the playing group. A capable key forward and improved goalkicking and you are looking at a team that is at minimum 3-2 and the media and supporter hysteria surrounding Buckley simply wouldn’t exist.
The dodgy and extremely flawed game plan has been the criticism of Buckley for a long while now, regardless of whether we have scrapped a victory or had our pants pulled down. It is not merely about the immediate win/loss ratio, it is about not having a foundation and structure to ever truly contend regardless of the list make up. It hasn't and doesn't change.
 
He's had enough time to build his list and his game plan and so far there's not a lot to show for it. Each week there gets less and less to look forward to on game day and it's only been 5 rounds.
The optimist in me would like to think it will all click very shortly and we'll be amazed but the realist says otherwise. It's a sad state of affairs.
 
I admire the logic in your post friend, but 6 years is time up for excuses I'm afraid.

This doesn't have the signs of a Geelong 07 type turnaround.
 
Let's re sign Buckley up for another 10 years.

I've always belittled the 2010 Flag as one that should have come anyway. Any coach worth their salt would win a flag in 11 years. But honestly, I doubt Bucks could win one in 20.

I defended him for quite a while like many are doing.

"Let him get the team he wants" - he did it
"Let us get over our injuries" - we have

I'm not sure how much more time he wants when he's already demonstrated he's not up to the task. I just think this is a case of everyone loving Bucks SOOOOOOOOOOO much as a player that many are just incapable of admitting to themselves that he's not a good coach.
 
Blaming Bucks not Clear-cut

There’s no doubt that the fortunes of a playing group are the ultimate responsibility of the senior coach and those in charge. Following Collingwood’s disappointing loss on ANZAC Day against the bombers, the pressure has grown immensely to a stage where Pies fans are rightly asking for change. The most popular judgment is that the club should acknowledge that this succession plan has been a failure and that Buckley’s role as senior coach is terminated. It is the most popular because it is also the easiest stance for supporters to take.

Collingwood are 1-4 from their opening five games, an horrendous start in any language. Let’s be realistic here though, all four losses have come between 14-20 points rather than any major blowouts. In these games the opportunity has been there to win the game, we’re momentum was in their favour yet they failed to capitalize. If games were played in first halves, Collingwood are +7 this season, showing although not dominant, they have been well and truly in every game come the main break. One thing that is hard to fathom are the calls that the players show no heart or passion and that this is a direct result of Buckley being unable to motivate his players. Defence is the main principal in analysing the so-called passion and heart of the players. Collingwood rank 3rd in tackles in the league whilst conceding 12.8 goals a game, a goal below the league average of 13.8 goals per game.

Collingwood’s offensive issues are glaringly obvious. They sit just ahead of Carlton at 17th in goals kicked, averaging just 10.4 per game. Despite this stat, let’s not pretend that the opportunities haven’t been there. Despite the forward line issues, the Pies midfield is up there with the best in the competition. As a team the Pies are 2nd in contested possessions, 4th in total possessions, 5th in clearances and 5th in inside 50s. These statistics simply shouldn’t equate to a team ranked 17th in scoring. The issue comes from the ball use both around the ground and in front of goal. They rank 14th in disposal efficiency and 4th in behinds at 14.2 per game compared to their goal average of 10.8. Who is to blame for this? Collingwood’s game plan offensively is scratchy at best and at times is actually hard to identify with. Their entries inside 50 are often haphazard and give little help to a young and inexperienced forward line. So yes, the game plan or lack thereof is fault of the coaching staff and needs to addressed. However there’s only so much you can do with the limited personnel. The Pies are desperately requiring one if not two key forwards to supplement Darcy Moore who is unsurprisingly struggling with the pressure of being the main man.

Unfortunately a concrete solution will not arise until at least next year and even then it is hard to see them acquiring a top 10 key forward they require. In the meantime the coaching staff have to be creative in finding a way to become more potent. For the first time all season it seemed yesterday as if they were aware of this and at least tried something different. Captain Scott Pendlebury started as the deepest forward at the first bounce and he and Daniel Wells often found themselves starting deep at centre bounces in an attempt to add star power and much needed class up forward. This proved ineffective despite the fact Wells kicked two goals in his debut game at his new club. In a show of desperation Ben Reid was swung forward late but with little impact.

It is easy to put blame upon Nathan Buckley and the coaching staff and of course they must take some of the responsibility especially for a dodgy, unidentifiable game plan. But the list management team should also take responsibility for the fact they have not recruited adequately to take the pressure off Moore. A 2-3 goal a game key forward alongside him would help Moore and Collingwood immensely. Buckley can also not be blamed for the inaccurate goalkicking and the lack of ‘clutch factor’ when kicking for goal especially in pressure situations. The flow on effect from continuous missed shots cannot be underestimated as with every miss comes a continued wane in confidence among the playing group. A capable key forward and improved goalkicking and you are looking at a team that is at minimum 3-2 and the media and supporter hysteria surrounding Buckley simply wouldn’t exist.

You seem to want to concentrate on stats that lend weight to your argument.

Any chance of including the turnover/disposal efficiency stats? Apparently some of the worst stats in vfl/afl history under Bucks from what I heard last night on 'On the couch'.
 
I've always belittled the 2010 Flag as one that should have come anyway. Any coach worth their salt would win a flag in 11 years. But honestly, I doubt Bucks could win one in 20.

I defended him for quite a while like many are doing.

"Let him get the team he wants" - he did it
"Let us get over our injuries" - we have

I'm not sure how much more time he wants when he's already demonstrated he's not up to the task. I just think this is a case of everyone loving Bucks SOOOOOOOOOOO much as a player that many are just incapable of admitting to themselves that he's not a good coach.

Just to think.. this list is probably not going to remain as healthy as it looks right now.. it's unrealistic to think that there will not be injuries in the coming weeks.

And we still lost to an average side in Essendon.
 
I've always belittled the 2010 Flag as one that should have come anyway. Any coach worth their salt would win a flag in 11 years. But honestly, I doubt Bucks could win one in 20.

I defended him for quite a while like many are doing.

"Let him get the team he wants" - he did it
"Let us get over our injuries" - we have

I'm not sure how much more time he wants when he's already demonstrated he's not up to the task. I just think this is a case of everyone loving Bucks SOOOOOOOOOOO much as a player that many are just incapable of admitting to themselves that he's not a good coach.
Yep this is Buckleys team he's not coaching Micks boys anymore so he can't use that excuse and he can't use the injury excuse because there's no one on it. He needs to go.
 

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To
You seem to want to concentrate on stats that lend weight to your argument.

Any chance of including the turnover/disposal efficiency stats? Apparently some of the worst stats in vfl/afl history under Bucks from what I heard last night on 'On the couch'.

To be fair 14th in disposal efficiency is mentioned but the fact we are somehow only 13th in clangers means that adding that stat would have been pointless
 
I would like to point out that I'm certainly not of the opinion that Bucks should definitely stay. Like everyone else my support of him has decreased over time and I'm now at a point where I consider both arguments pretty equally. Although the opening post favours and supports him, this is simply to provide an argument and some rational thought as to why he may stay, something that has been scarce on here.
 
it just makes me angry that he was appointed without anyone else interviewed, was given a premiership list, decimated that list, got worse results every year, and still has excuses made for him, How much evidence is needed.
Honestly we have thrown away 10 to 15 years by appointing him cos we are no where near winning a premiership
 
To


To be fair 14th in disposal efficiency is mentioned but the fact we are somehow only 13th in clangers means that adding that stat would have been pointless

I'm not keen on stats to be honest.. but if you're going to write an article about it.. my suggestion would be to include as much stats as you can in it for/agst.

I'm more of you're visual type.. yes I read up on stats as well.. it's one thing getting the ball inside the 50.. it's another thing having players run in odd spots to receive them.. bombing it in there with no apparent purpose.. having far too many mids flooding the 50.. etc etc.. and the ball being slingshot the other way for a goal.

Where are the stats about clangers and turnovers in 3 parts of the ground.

We have played one decent quarter this yr agst Sydney.. the rest have been subject to debate. This aint a forward 50 problem.. the build up leading moving the ball forward has been disgraceful.

The players look utterly confused as to what is needed to be done.

I'm more concerned about how we look out there.. I'm not concerned about some bloke shooting for goal. How we are playing is seriously ugly.
 
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I'm not keen on stats to be honest.. but if you're going to write an article about it.. my suggestion would be to include as much stats as you can in it for/agst.

I'm more of you're visual type.. yes I read up on stats as well.. it's one thing getting the ball inside the 50.. it's another thing having players run in odd spots to receive them.. bombing it in there with no apparent purpose.. having far too many mids flooding the 50.. etc etc.. and the ball being slingshot the other way for a goal.

Where are the stats about clangers and turnovers in 3 parts of the ground.

We have played one decent quarter this yr agst Sydney.. the rest have been subject to debate. This aint a forward 50 problem.. the build up leading moving the ball forward has been disgraceful.

The players look utterly confused as to what is needed to be done.

I'm more concerned about how we look out there.. I'm not concerned about some bloke shooting for goal. How we are playing is seriously ugly.
I couldn't care how ugly we play if we were winning. But we are not winning and it's compounding things further.
 
I'm not keen on stats to be honest.. but if you're going to write an article about it.. my suggestion would be to include as much stats as you can in it for/agst.

I'm more of you're visual type.. yes I read up on stats as well.. it's one thing getting the ball inside the 50.. it's another thing having players run in odd spots to receive them.. bombing it in there with no apparent purpose.. having far too many mids flooding the 50.. etc etc.. and the ball being slingshot the other way for a goal.

Where are the stats about clangers and turnovers in 3 parts of the ground.

We have played one decent quarter this yr agst Sydney.. the rest have been subject to debate. This aint a forward 50 problem.. the build up leading moving the ball forward has been disgraceful.

The players look utterly confused as to what is needed to be done.

I'm more concerned about how we look out there.. I'm not concerned about some bloke shooting for goal. How we are playing is seriously ugly.

I do agree with you in most aspects however you have to be concerned with the shooting for goal. I know its a league wide issue but we are seriosuly bad as the statistics suggest. We currently average 24.6 scoring shots which is still pretty low but regardless of rushed behinds and whatever else we still should be scoring more goals than behinds. The goal average in the league is 13.8 whilst behinds is 11.9. Even if we averaged say approx 12.5 goals and 12 behinds that gives us atleast an extra win I reckon. Although the sling shot footy you mentioned that we concede often comes from turnovers in the forward half it can also come from the opposition kick-outs as a result of our misses. I just think that the effect that repeated missed shots has on players is underrated.
 
I'm not keen on stats to be honest.. but if you're going to write an article about it.. my suggestion would be to include as much stats as you can in it for/agst.

I'm more of you're visual type.. yes I read up on stats as well.. it's one thing getting the ball inside the 50.. it's another thing having players run in odd spots to receive them.. bombing it in there with no apparent purpose.. having far too many mids flooding the 50.. etc etc.. and the ball being slingshot the other way for a goal.

Where are the stats about clangers and turnovers in 3 parts of the ground.

We have played one decent quarter this yr agst Sydney.. the rest have been subject to debate. This aint a forward 50 problem.. the build up leading moving the ball forward has been disgraceful.

The players look utterly confused as to what is needed to be done.

I'm more concerned about how we look out there.. I'm not concerned about some bloke shooting for goal. How we are playing is seriously ugly.
Even in that decent quarter against Sydney we still struggled to kick the ball inside 50 effectively.
 
Blaming Bucks not Clear-cut

There’s no doubt that the fortunes of a playing group are the ultimate responsibility of the senior coach and those in charge. Following Collingwood’s disappointing loss on ANZAC Day against the bombers, the pressure has grown immensely to a stage where Pies fans are rightly asking for change. The most popular judgment is that the club should acknowledge that this succession plan has been a failure and that Buckley’s role as senior coach is terminated. It is the most popular because it is also the easiest stance for supporters to take.

Collingwood are 1-4 from their opening five games, an horrendous start in any language. Let’s be realistic here though, all four losses have come between 14-20 points rather than any major blowouts. In these games the opportunity has been there to win the game, we’re momentum was in their favour yet they failed to capitalize. If games were played in first halves, Collingwood are +7 this season, showing although not dominant, they have been well and truly in every game come the main break. One thing that is hard to fathom are the calls that the players show no heart or passion and that this is a direct result of Buckley being unable to motivate his players. Defence is the main principal in analysing the so-called passion and heart of the players. Collingwood rank 3rd in tackles in the league whilst conceding 12.8 goals a game, a goal below the league average of 13.8 goals per game.

Collingwood’s offensive issues are glaringly obvious. They sit just ahead of Carlton at 17th in goals kicked, averaging just 10.4 per game. Despite this stat, let’s not pretend that the opportunities haven’t been there. Despite the forward line issues, the Pies midfield is up there with the best in the competition. As a team the Pies are 2nd in contested possessions, 4th in total possessions, 5th in clearances and 5th in inside 50s. These statistics simply shouldn’t equate to a team ranked 17th in scoring. The issue comes from the ball use both around the ground and in front of goal. They rank 14th in disposal efficiency and 4th in behinds at 14.2 per game compared to their goal average of 10.8. Who is to blame for this? Collingwood’s game plan offensively is scratchy at best and at times is actually hard to identify with. Their entries inside 50 are often haphazard and give little help to a young and inexperienced forward line. So yes, the game plan or lack thereof is fault of the coaching staff and needs to addressed. However there’s only so much you can do with the limited personnel. The Pies are desperately requiring one if not two key forwards to supplement Darcy Moore who is unsurprisingly struggling with the pressure of being the main man.

Unfortunately a concrete solution will not arise until at least next year and even then it is hard to see them acquiring a top 10 key forward they require. In the meantime the coaching staff have to be creative in finding a way to become more potent. For the first time all season it seemed yesterday as if they were aware of this and at least tried something different. Captain Scott Pendlebury started as the deepest forward at the first bounce and he and Daniel Wells often found themselves starting deep at centre bounces in an attempt to add star power and much needed class up forward. This proved ineffective despite the fact Wells kicked two goals in his debut game at his new club. In a show of desperation Ben Reid was swung forward late but with little impact.

It is easy to put blame upon Nathan Buckley and the coaching staff and of course they must take some of the responsibility especially for a dodgy, unidentifiable game plan. But the list management team should also take responsibility for the fact they have not recruited adequately to take the pressure off Moore. A 2-3 goal a game key forward alongside him would help Moore and Collingwood immensely. Buckley can also not be blamed for the inaccurate goalkicking and the lack of ‘clutch factor’ when kicking for goal especially in pressure situations. The flow on effect from continuous missed shots cannot be underestimated as with every miss comes a continued wane in confidence among the playing group. A capable key forward and improved goalkicking and you are looking at a team that is at minimum 3-2 and the media and supporter hysteria surrounding Buckley simply wouldn’t exist.

It's too late to save Bucks, blood is in the water and the sharks are circling. You wont find much support on this board for keeping Bucks no matter how eloquent or factual your argument might be.
 

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