Preview Round 15: Changes v Carlton

[The Sloane Ranger]

Dumb Talia
“Thommo adds a lot to our group,” teammate Daniel Talia told reporters yesterday.

“He has come off a pretty tough pre-season so it has taken him a while to get going but I definitely think he’s at the level now.”


And apart from teh number of other experts

He obviously isnt the ideal choice, that would be to have sloane up and firing, but without that we need to look for a replacement or contiune on with how we are going

I find it extremely hard listening to Talia, he is the true "Party-Line Person"

He also said yesterday in response to Tex's form that "Tex was playing great football", I know he is trying to back Tex however we are not stupid, why not just say "Tex is not in his bluest career form however he is still contributing to the team and I'm confident that his best form is not that far away"

 

[MRB37]

Yes I know, but there is some logic behind it. In the first few games Sloane was getting a heap of it and disposing of it in a manner that was very effective. Was going at 80%+ DE. Since then he hasn't been getting as much of it and what he has, has been far less effective ie around 60% DE.

Bringing in Thommo adds another contested beast to win that ball. The opposition all of a sudden has to make a choice as to who they want to try and shut down. Thommo or Sloane. Both are very capable of getting that ball out to the right players and the right hands.

Problem is Thommo will kill us the other way. Just depends on whether the club feels it can cover that.

There could be some merit in playing Thommo this week. Keeping Sloane on the outside a bit more. Letting him get a bit more of it and freshen up. Build confidence again.

I don't feel Thommo is needed at this stage, however Im not going to rant and rave if he is selected. Happy to see how it unfolds. Sloane has to do things better personally as well. He is not free of blame.

Thompson only went at 65% DE last year, so he's not a massive improvement. With how we're setting up at the centre bounce with 4 forwards on 6-8 defenders, Thommo's hack kicks forward from the stoppage are going to be easy pickings for opposition defenders.

 

[Heafy83]

Thompson only went at 65% DE last year, so he's not a massive improvement. With how we're setting up at the centre bounce with 4 forwards on 6-8 defenders, Thommo's hack kicks forward from the stoppage are going to be easy pickings for opposition defenders.

Most players of his ilk have a lower DE because their job is just to win it and shovel it forward. He does have very good hands though and can give it off to the right players in the right spaces.

 

[MRB37]

I find it extremely hard listening to Talia, he is the true "Party-Line Person"

He also said yesterday in response to Tex's form that "Tex was playing great football", I know he is trying to back Tex however we are not stupid, why not just say "Tex is not in his bluest career form however he is still contributing to the team and I'm confident that his best form is not that far away"

Gotta sing kumbaya at the press conferences. It's always sunny in Crowland.

 

[MRB37]

Most players of his ilk have a lower DE because their job is just to win it and shovel it forward. He does have very good hands though and can give it off to the right players in the right spaces.

Just winning it and shoveling it forward is constant mistake we keep on making though. If we continue to play outnumbered up forward with absolutely no movement by our forwards like we're playing marks up, it doesn't matter what we're doing, whether he's kicking it himself or passing it off to Atkins/Milera whoever, it's not gonna be a massive help at all.

He's also going to be a problem if/when we try to slingshot it because he's one of those guys who will hold onto the ball for an eternity if he marks it in the middle while he sizes up every option, only to do the long down the line because he took so long to make a decision.

 

[marty36]

Thompson only went at 65% DE last year, so he's not a massive improvement. With how we're setting up at the centre bounce with 4 forwards on 6-8 defenders, Thommo's hack kicks forward from the stoppage are going to be easy pickings for opposition defenders.

Thommo is no improvement if we didnt have players out of form, you do realise all being equal Thommo would never be in line for a recall, but be F anyone wants to sit through anymore performances like Geelong, Hawthorn, Melbourne and North. We have persisted for 6 weeks to see if it will come good it hasnt, changes to the mid need to be made

 

[MRB37]

Thommo is no improvement if we didnt have players out of form, you do realise all being equal Thommo would never be in line for a recall, but be F anyone wants to sit through anymore performances like Geelong, Hawthorn, Melbourne and North. We have persisted for 6 weeks to see if it will come good it hasnt, changes to the mid need to be made

But changing the midfield won't make a lick of difference if we refuse to change how we structure elsewhere. You can bang on about the midfield all you like, but we have completely gone away from the structures that made us successful early in the year and in some cases, we're actively making it easier for the opposition to beat us by playing tall, slow players up forward, while dragging all our forward pressure out of the 50 and leaving whats left outnumbered.

You can guarantee that Carlton will play numbers back, whether we have Thommo or not, we are going to make it difficult for any midfield by expecting them to be able to pinpoint targets when all the forwards do is stand still calling for a bomb on their heads while they have have 2 defenders each on them.

 

[earlsta]

If McGovern gets picked will this be the first time this year that McGovern, Jenkins, Walker have played together all year?

I think they may have played together once in round 2 against Hawthorn but JJ went off in the first quarter.

 

[marty36]

But changing the midfield won't make a lick of difference if we refuse to change how we structure elsewhere. You can bang on about the midfield all you like, but we have completely gone away from the structures that made us successful early in the year and in some cases, we're actively making it easier for the opposition to beat us by playing tall, slow players up forward, while dragging all our forward pressure out of the 50 and leaving whats left outnumbered.

You can guarantee that Carlton will play numbers back, whether we have Thommo or not, we are going to make it difficult for any midfield by expecting them to be able to pinpoint targets when all the forwards do is stand still calling for a bomb on their heads while they have have 2 defenders each on them.

Blind Freddy can see the midfield is teh issue so can these no hopers



"Parkin and Bell have joined the chorus of pundits claiming the Crows are over-reliant on Sloane and when he is tagged out of games they lack the midfield punch to beat the competition heavyweights, such as bogey side Geelong."






“Normally what happens the second ranked midfielder gets some freedom but they (Adelaide) don’t have a star alongside Rory Sloane.

“This is going to be his life for the next 15 weeks and that is just bad luck.

“You’re a good player, that is what comes your way.”

King also added the top teams have worked out the fast starting Crows.






"The Crows midfield was always going to be a worry at some stage. Rory Sloane is their No. 1 but he is also the opposition’s No. 1 target. When he gets the ball more than 24 times Adelaide’s record is 8-0."

He has had less than that number three times and yes, they have lost every time.Chris Mcdermott






"Mark Bickley says Adelaide Crows must find a hard edge if they are going to have impact in AFL finals"






Adelaide has fallen to second on the AFL ladder with an 8-3 win-loss count. But the lasting note from being brushed aside by Geelong is the failure of the Adelaide midfield.

As Brownlow Medallist Mark Ricciuto admitted to his frustration in watching the Crows midfield failing to work against Geelong midfielder Patrick Dangerfield off the ball, Walker agreed with Ricciuto that the Adelaide players needed to “toughen up”.

 

[Paladin]

Generally agree with this line of thought, although if Brown & Milera are possibly injured they could well make way for Seedsman & Cheeney to come in. Beech to either play some midfield minutes, or to be dropped for another midfielder (preferably Knight).

The club has to make a decision between Otten & Jenkins to try and restore a bit more speed and structure in the team, we just can't continue to persist with both of them in our forward line.

How is a choice even needed? Jenkins has been playing well and Otten hasnt got a touch for a month, isnt a natural forward and cant run!

 

[MRB37]

Blind Freddy can see the midfield is teh issue so can these no hopers



"Parkin and Bell have joined the chorus of pundits claiming the Crows are over-reliant on Sloane and when he is tagged out of games they lack the midfield punch to beat the competition heavyweights, such as bogey side Geelong."






“Normally what happens the second ranked midfielder gets some freedom but they (Adelaide) don’t have a star alongside Rory Sloane.

“This is going to be his life for the next 15 weeks and that is just bad luck.

“You’re a good player, that is what comes your way.”

King also added the top teams have worked out the fast starting Crows.






"The Crows midfield was always going to be a worry at some stage. Rory Sloane is their No. 1 but he is also the opposition’s No. 1 target. When he gets the ball more than 24 times Adelaide’s record is 8-0."

He has had less than that number three times and yes, they have lost every time.Chris Mcdermott






"Mark Bickley says Adelaide Crows must find a hard edge if they are going to have impact in AFL finals"






Adelaide has fallen to second on the AFL ladder with an 8-3 win-loss count. But the lasting note from being brushed aside by Geelong is the failure of the Adelaide midfield.

As Brownlow Medallist Mark Ricciuto admitted to his frustration in watching the Crows midfield failing to work against Geelong midfielder Patrick Dangerfield off the ball, Walker agreed with Ricciuto that the Adelaide players needed to “toughen up”.

It's A issue, not THE issue. Fixing one without working on the others does nothing. We could chuck Dangerfield back into this current midfield but we'd get nothing with our current forward setups and refusal to even acknowledge that we're being hurt by the extra defenders.

 

[Anzacpaul]

Blind Freddy can see the midfield is teh issue so can these no hopers



"Parkin and Bell have joined the chorus of pundits claiming the Crows are over-reliant on Sloane and when he is tagged out of games they lack the midfield punch to beat the competition heavyweights, such as bogey side Geelong."






“Normally what happens the second ranked midfielder gets some freedom but they (Adelaide) don’t have a star alongside Rory Sloane.

“This is going to be his life for the next 15 weeks and that is just bad luck.

“You’re a good player, that is what comes your way.”

King also added the top teams have worked out the fast starting Crows.






"The Crows midfield was always going to be a worry at some stage. Rory Sloane is their No. 1 but he is also the opposition’s No. 1 target. When he gets the ball more than 24 times Adelaide’s record is 8-0."

He has had less than that number three times and yes, they have lost every time.Chris Mcdermott






"Mark Bickley says Adelaide Crows must find a hard edge if they are going to have impact in AFL finals"






Adelaide has fallen to second on the AFL ladder with an 8-3 win-loss count. But the lasting note from being brushed aside by Geelong is the failure of the Adelaide midfield.

As Brownlow Medallist Mark Ricciuto admitted to his frustration in watching the Crows midfield failing to work against Geelong midfielder Patrick Dangerfield off the ball, Walker agreed with Ricciuto that the Adelaide players needed to “toughen up”.

So how does bringing in Scott Thompson fix this?

hint: it doesn't.

 

[marty36]

It's A issue, not THE issue. Fixing one without working on the others does nothing. We could chuck Dangerfield back into this current midfield but we'd get nothing with our current forward setups and refusal to even acknowledge that we're being hurt by the extra defenders.

Come on face facts whilst our midfielding was working and sloane was Brownlow favorite look at the scorelines we were avaeraging in excess of 140 points per game, since our midfield has collapsed what do you think has happened

Its the main issue everyone commentator football expert in australia is or has called it, there is no secret formula

 

[marty36]

So how does bringing in Scott Thompson fix this?

hint: it doesn't.

Mate Ive said Thommo, lever, lynch I dont care butwe need someone to put their physicall statement on the mid

Thommo is the best of a bad bunch, give me dusty anyday

Tex and Roo have clearly stated toughen up, that certainly counts out Knight, Menzel, Galluci to try for a fix

 

[MRB37]

Come on face facts whilst our midfielding was working and sloane was Brownlow favorite look at the scorelines we were avaeraging in excess of 140 points per game, since our midfield has collapsed what do you think has happened

Its the main issue everyone commentator football expert in australia is or has called it, there is no secret formula

Our forward line was working then too and we weren't having 1-2 extra defenders sitting in our forward line while we went and pulled numbers out too.

We had 56 forward entries last week and only 21 scoring shots. Hawthorn got 27 from 44. Against Geelong we had 51 inside 50's for 25 scoring shots. Geelong had 33 from 52. Melbourne game? 49 inside 50's for 20 scoring shots while the Dees had 26 from 53. The only game where he completely lacked supply from the midfield was against North where they had 79 entries to our 56.

When we beat the Hawks earlier in the year we only had 55 entries, but had 32 shots from those entries. We had 28 from 53 against the Power, Richmond we had 35 from 60. Our efficiency moving the ball forwards has gone WAY downhill because our forward line is clogged and we can't move the ball as quickly from halfback anymore. We're averaging slightly less inside 50's, but we're still getting it in more than our opponents, but our biggest issue is we're not generating nearly as many shots on goal as we did previously and we're getting massively hurt on the rebound from those entries because we can't keep it in there.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Hasn't got the tank for it unfortunately

Thommo can't run either.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Most players of his ilk have a lower DE because their job is just to win it and shovel it forward. He does have very good hands though and can give it off to the right players in the right spaces.

Greenwood has a DE of 72% despite a huge percentage of contested possessions.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Our forward line was working then too and we weren't having 1-2 extra defenders sitting in our forward line while we went and pulled numbers out too.

We had 56 forward entries last week and only 21 scoring shots. Hawthorn got 27 from 44. Against Geelong we had 51 inside 50's for 25 scoring shots. Geelong had 33 from 52. Melbourne game? 49 inside 50's for 20 scoring shots while the Dees had 26 from 53. The only game where he completely lacked supply from the midfield was against North where they had 79 entries to our 56.

When we beat the Hawks earlier in the year we only had 55 entries, but had 32 shots from those entries. We had 28 from 53 against the Power, Richmond we had 35 from 60. Our efficiency moving the ball forwards has gone WAY downhill because our forward line is clogged and we can't move the ball as quickly from halfback anymore. We're averaging slightly less inside 50's, but we're still getting it in more than our opponents, but our biggest issue is we're not generating nearly as many shots on goal as we did previously and we're getting massively hurt on the rebound from those entries because we can't keep it in there.

BANG...proper analysis beyond the superficial (which is all the 'experts' provide of which 90% don't really analyse the Crows, just rehash popular groupthink)

 

[MRB37]

Again, i'm not saying the midfield isn't an issue, they were clearly beaten with the Geelong loss, but last week was the first time this year where we've won all our "key indicators" but still lost the match, which should be a cause for concern and show us that it's not just a matter of "winning the ball more". If you take out the North Melbourne game which the club probably consider an "aberration" or whatever, we've averaged +2 on inside 50's, but -6 on scoring shot in our losses, while our clearance count is only -1.

There is more than one issue at play here, there's holes all over the ground at the moment, not just the midfield which is all that is being focused on.

 

[marty36]

Again, i'm not saying the midfield isn't an issue, they were clearly beaten with the Geelong loss, but last week was the first time this year where we've won all our "key indicators" but still lost the match, which should be a cause for concern and show us that it's not just a matter of "winning the ball more". If you take out the North Melbourne game which the club probably consider an "aberration" or whatever, we've averaged +2 on inside 50's, but -6 on scoring shot in our losses, while our clearance count is only -1.

There is more than one issue at play here, there's holes all over the ground at the moment, not just the midfield which is all that is being focused on.

Pretty common for that to occur when your mid isn't as good as your opposition

Better get it right before the Melbourne game they have a gun mid


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[1970crow]

Roo said this morning there will be a change to the height in the forward line. Wonder if both Beech and Otten go out.

Finally, going taller again is the only way forward. But it's never been about height, it's about pace.

 

[1970crow]

Thompson only went at 65% DE last year, so he's not a massive improvement. With how we're setting up at the centre bounce with 4 forwards on 6-8 defenders, Thommo's hack kicks forward from the stoppage are going to be easy pickings for opposition defenders.

I doubt he'd find the time to kick, it'll be hands to a player under more pressure who will hack it forward.

 

[Godallblighty]

I would like to sell you my car.
It's worth twice as much as I bought it for...

But its worth is not set in stone. What's it worth to you is the point. If you're halfway from Alice Springs to Adelaide and you've got a once-in-a-lifetime job interview but you've just seized the engine on your car...then the car that will get you to that interview is worth what that job is to you. Someone else without the same incentive may say it's worth only $500 but you'll pay double that and consider it money well spent. If you get the job, who cares what you spent on the car?

 

[Geoffa32]

But its worth is not set in stone. What's it worth to you is the point. If you're halfway from Alice Springs to Adelaide and you've got a once-in-a-lifetime job interview but you've just seized the engine on your car...then the car that will get you to that interview is worth what that job is to you. Someone else without the same incentive may say it's worth only $500 but you'll pay double that and consider it money well spent. If you get the job, who cares what you spent on the car?

Make sure you have oil in your car before driving that far.



Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[1970crow]

Most players of his ilk have a lower DE because their job is just to win it and shovel it forward. He does have very good hands though and can give it off to the right players in the right spaces.

That's just wrong. For the most part of last year he was panic giving to players under just as much pressure. He's no longer holding up the ball awaiting the perfect moment as he had in the past. His leg power has completely left him. Eyewitness report in the sanfl thread was that many of his very many handballs on Saturday put teammates under pressure. He's nowhere near the player he was.