Marriage equality debate - Pt.3 - Australia votes yes

[Hoops]

The NO vote numbers look even smaller when calculated this way...

60% more voters voted 'yes' than 'no'. That's a landslide in anyone's language.

 

[BEaston]

Hahaha these campaigners are funny.

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

If we are talking about the SSM debate, then white conservative Christians bore the brunt of everything because they were the most visible and vocal in their opposition.
There was the Chinese doctor though, her opposition resulted in a petition to deregister her.

The Muslim community were smart to not have a public face in the debate as the results show they are clearly against SSM. Publicly declaring this during the debate would have opened them up to even more criticism.

Were the Muslim community smart or were the media just cowards? Everyone with a semblance of common sense would have known that there'd be a big no vote in that particular community, or they certainly should have, but I barely saw anything about this, nor any media trying to provoke them for comments / reactions for click bait.

Obviously Christians are more valuable to them than Muslims, not that Christian groups or politicians with a Christian bent helped themselves most of the time.

 

[GreyWind]

Were the Muslim community smart or were the media just cowards? Everyone with a semblance of common sense would have known that there'd be a big no vote in that particular community, or they certainly should have, but I barely saw anything about this, nor any media trying to provoke them for comments / reactions for click bait.

Obviously Christians are more valuable to them than Muslims, not that Christian groups or politicians with a Christian bent helped themselves most of the time.

Probably both. I'll lean towards smarter as I don't remember any prominent Muslim leader making a public statement, even if the media approached them for an answer.

Then I think with the way the No campaign played out the media was getting their dose of religious idiocy so they stayed away from minority groups.

 

[bourbons]

Well anyone could find anything traumatising. It's a weak characteristic to be traumatised by something so trivial.

I think you need to consider that some people may have been traumatised by events stemming from the campaign rather than just 'discussion'. Would you consider threats/abuse and the kicking of your rainbow flag wearing dog to be trivial? How about your house being vandalised?

If i was traumatised by my discussion right now with you. Would you not consider me weak? Do you just not like the word weak at all when using it in context with mental health? I would argue it would be just as appropriate when discussing mental health as it is when discussing physical health.

And you'd be wrong. I won't derail the thread with a detailed explanation of why mental health absolutely differs from physical health and certain terms should be avoided, but suffice to say its time to educate yourself. I say that in all honesty too, not having a crack at you - a few years ago I had, well not the same attitude as you, but lets say less of an appreciation about the nuances of mental health. A friend of mine attempted suicide a few years back (thankfully unsuccessful) and another mate took his own life earlier this year. So I've gotten a bit more knowledge on the issues and believe me the attitudes I held previously and that you hold now are very outdated and can be harmful.

 

[Chief]

Again, why aren't you whinging about other polls and surveys?


You got any peer reviewed stats to back this up, Chief?

Given that's the hurdle you require for other matters, cough up.

How many other national government surveys have you witnessed?

Are you talking about elections?

 

[Crankyhawk]

The United States has voluntary voting. Therefore not everyone who was eligible to vote did so just like the SSM survey. Trump did win the majority of the votes under the electoral college system however, which is the required method to get elected to the president post. Therefore Trump did win a majority of votes from a majority of voters under the required systems.

And the SSM, also a voluntary vote, also won a majority of voters.

Trump did not win a majority of voters, but did win the electoral college under the gerrymandered USA system.

 

[Kurve]

Were the Muslim community smart or were the media just cowards? Everyone with a semblance of common sense would have known that there'd be a big no vote in that particular community, or they certainly should have, but I barely saw anything about this, nor any media trying to provoke them for comments / reactions for click bait.

Obviously Christians are more valuable to them than Muslims, not that Christian groups or politicians with a Christian bent helped themselves most of the time.

I saw it Herne, the warnings were there but I already knew high immigrant and Muslim electorates would reflect more to NO in comparison. What I didn't expect was for it to be quite as negative as it was. Couple of articles went out, one by a young Muslim woman and I think basically she was ignored.

Cowards, I suspect all around.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Were the Muslim community smart or were the media just cowards? Everyone with a semblance of common sense would have known that there'd be a big no vote in that particular community, or they certainly should have, but I barely saw anything about this, nor any media trying to provoke them for comments / reactions for click bait.

Obviously Christians are more valuable to them than Muslims, not that Christian groups or politicians with a Christian bent helped themselves most of the time.

I think they were smart by not making a media noise. Plus the fringe "Christians" like Lyle were doing the job of being the public face of "NO", so no need for the Islamic religious groups to go public.

 

[Kurve]

I think they were smart by not making a media noise. Plus the fringe "Christians" like Lyle were doing the job of being the public face of "NO", so no need for the Islamic religious groups to go public.

Some progressive Muslims from Western Sydney have stated that preachers were advocating and pushing a NO vote as 'civic duty'. It's getting harder now for these people to speak out, whites who voted YES are on the defensive, the apologists and the bigots each as bad as each other in being totally unhelpful to furthering discussion. Rock, hard place.

 

[King Brown]

How many other national government surveys have you witnessed?

Are you talking about elections?

Where are the peer reviewed stats, Chief?

 

[QuietB]

IT IS OVER

Who cares about peer reviewed stats.

It is done.

 

[Flameboy]

IT IS OVER

Who cares about peer reviewed stats.

It is done.

Maybe we can send out a plebiscite regarding the closure of this thread then

 

[Satan]

Maybe we can send out a plebiscite regarding the closure of this thread then

Compulsory ?

 

[Toump Ass]

#qualitymelts

Funny this first appeared on a dinky-die true blue Aussie "SAY NO TO MOSQUES!!!!1!" facebook page.

Uneducated right wing conservatives and fundamentalist Islamic terrorists actually share so much in common.

They should be friends, not foes.

 

[NSWCROW]

Probably belongs in the Murdoch thread but posting here due to recent events

 

[Appa]

I think you need to consider that some people may have been traumatised by events stemming from the campaign rather than just 'discussion'. Would you consider threats/abuse and the kicking of your rainbow flag wearing dog to be trivial? How about your house being vandalised?

The government haven't put anyone through these events. It would be disingenuous to say they have. The government started a debate. No one implied that allowed assault or vandalism.

And you'd be wrong. I won't derail the thread with a detailed explanation of why mental health absolutely differs from physical health and certain terms should be avoided, but suffice to say its time to educate yourself. I say that in all honesty too, not having a crack at you - a few years ago I had, well not the same attitude as you, but lets say less of an appreciation about the nuances of mental health. A friend of mine attempted suicide a few years back (thankfully unsuccessful) and another mate took his own life earlier this year. So I've gotten a bit more knowledge on the issues and believe me the attitudes I held previously and that you hold now are very outdated and can be harmful.

You don't have more knowledge on a issue because your friend committed suicide. You just used a tragedy as a way to try and give yourself an authority on a subject. That is low. Also, that is not a point.

 

[bourbons]

The government haven't put anyone through these events. It would be disingenuous to say they have. The government started a debate. No one implied that allowed assault or vandalism.

Not sure why you're talking about blame - the original point was simply whether people saying they had experienced trauma had a valid claim, or were just being 'weak'.

You don't have more knowledge on a issue because your friend committed suicide. You just used a tragedy as a way to try and give yourself an authority on a subject. That is low. Also, that is not a point.

Wow

As I assumed would be blindingly obvious, the events I described caused me to seek out information - do some reading, talk to professionals, that sort of thing.

 

[Lethality]

Lol!

$120 mil to change something that we already knew the overwhelming majority wanted changed.

I don't think 'we already know' works well in the Senate.

 

[Lethality]

Were the Muslim community smart or were the media just cowards? Everyone with a semblance of common sense would have known that there'd be a big no vote in that particular community, or they certainly should have, but I barely saw anything about this, nor any media trying to provoke them for comments / reactions for click bait.

Obviously Christians are more valuable to them than Muslims, not that Christian groups or politicians with a Christian bent helped themselves most of the time.

Nobody wants to know about it. I mentioned that Muslims poll more conservative views on homosexuality to Maggie5 the other day, pointing to Google for proof, and the denial and lack of curiosity from her was quite staggering. This is what we're dealing with.

 

[Forward Press]

The government haven't put anyone through these events. It would be disingenuous to say they have. The government started a debate. No one implied that allowed assault or vandalism.

You really think the Coalition For Marriage would've run those TV ads and distributing their pamphlets if there wasn't a postal survey?

The three months between the announcement of the survey and collecting of results was some of the most disturbing aspects of Australian political debate and the LGBT community are far worse for it. Honest sincere question - do you have gay and lesbian friends? Because all of mine have found it demoralising and dehumanising but are at least relieved the worst is over.

 

[Lethality]

It was just so the right-wing fruitcakes, led by the fruitcake-in-chief, could stall the issue for as long as possible.

This is a matter that should have been settled by parliament. That's what they are there for. It's their job.

Just a disgraceful waste of public funds.

122 million is a small price to pay if it will convince more Libs to vote for gay marriage now. Labor were hoping to lose on one hand, and the public vote has made that less likely. Daniel Andrews is trying to maintain the rage, but so far this looks like a big win for Turnbull who has fought opponents left and right.

 

[skilts]

Bennelong is headed for a bye-election but the Liberals are expected to retain that seat.

I would have thought that a bye election would have seen a defeat for the encumbent.

 

[Showbags]

122 million is a small price to pay if it will convince more Libs to vote for gay marriage now. Labor were hoping to lose on one hand, and the public vote has made that less likely. Daniel Andrews is trying to maintain the rage, but so far this looks like a big win for Turnbull who has fought opponents left and right.

So in other words, all this was simply for Turnbull's political expediency.

The LGBT community were quite happy to wait for a Labor Government to be elected to simply pass a bill through Parliament. It was the RWNJ's that were salivating at the potential of being given a public licence to attack queers and relive their fond memories of NTTAWWTter bashing from their youth.

 

[Lethality]

So in other words, all this was simply for Turnbull's political expediency.

It's also the best way to actually have it done under present circumstances.

The LGBT community were quite happy to wait for a Labor Government to be elected to simply pass a bill through Parliament.

Not very progressive. It could be done so much sooner, hopefully by Christmas.

It was the RWNJ's that were salivating at the potential of being given a public licence to attack queers and relive their fond memories of NTTAWWTter bashing from their youth.

Weird take.