Rance "players who use their strength in marking contests are being penalised too harshly."
- Thread starter lollol
- Start date
- Tagged users None
Defenders have been getting away with s**t for years. Since we got BBB, it was noticeable how often he was either scragged, tunnelled or had his arms chopped when he was going for the ball.
Rance is just crying because the umpires have finally decided enough is enough.
Rance is just crying because the umpires have finally decided enough is enough.
owen87
Premium Gold
- Apr 23, 2016
- 30,854
- 43,236
- AFL Club
- Essendon
It does seem that when both players are holding on, the forward is more likely to wear the benefit of the holding call. Whether that's just coincidence or a directive to the umpires is unknown.
I do recall seeing a defender (I think it was Cale Hooker) manhandle a much smaller opponent and get a free paid against them that wasn't there - no hand in the back or holding, just brute strength - that makes you think there's a focus on letting forwards have a little bit more protection, which gels with the AFL wanting higher scoring games.
I do recall seeing a defender (I think it was Cale Hooker) manhandle a much smaller opponent and get a free paid against them that wasn't there - no hand in the back or holding, just brute strength - that makes you think there's a focus on letting forwards have a little bit more protection, which gels with the AFL wanting higher scoring games.
even though i dont like rance as a player (he is a great defender)
i do agree with his argument
im sick and tired of forwards getting rewarding a lot of times for minor contact.
in most sports you dont reward the attacking team, yet in AFL we want to reward the forwards as much as possible and allow easy scoring. IMO i want it as hard as possible to score.
i do agree with his argument
im sick and tired of forwards getting rewarding a lot of times for minor contact.
in most sports you dont reward the attacking team, yet in AFL we want to reward the forwards as much as possible and allow easy scoring. IMO i want it as hard as possible to score.
Summer Nights
Norm Smith Medallist
- Banned
- #5
Dirty scragging Alex Rance has a sook because he is being exposed for stretching the rules too far.
A contested mark is a mark that's taken in a marking contest, yeah?
telsor
Hall of Famer
Looking at the comments here....talk about playing the man, not the ball...
Has anyone got anything to say about what he said, or is it all going to be about who said it?
Has anyone got anything to say about what he said, or is it all going to be about who said it?
Defenders get away with WAY too much. Make everyone play the ball first and you will see a marked improvement towards the footy we "want to see".
No scragging, blocking or chopping arms - much less spoiling, more packs of players all going for the mark.
The issue isn't the use/abuse of strength - it's how it's applied. Grabbing hold of your opponent and throwing them to ground SHOULD be penalised. Using your body to do the same (whilst taking the mark) - should not.
My viewpoint is pretty simple - and reflected in the 'unrealistic attempt' interpretations - if the ball is your objective, unless you infringe (holding, hands in back, high tackle) it's play on.
No scragging, blocking or chopping arms - much less spoiling, more packs of players all going for the mark.
The issue isn't the use/abuse of strength - it's how it's applied. Grabbing hold of your opponent and throwing them to ground SHOULD be penalised. Using your body to do the same (whilst taking the mark) - should not.
My viewpoint is pretty simple - and reflected in the 'unrealistic attempt' interpretations - if the ball is your objective, unless you infringe (holding, hands in back, high tackle) it's play on.
I thought I did.
Topkent
Confirmed ITK Drafting King
I agree with him however the free kicks paid against him this year especially against Jenkins were all there. He wasn't penalized for strength he was penalized for holding on
- Apr 25, 2011
- 2,218
- 4,717
- AFL Club
- Fremantle
It's perfectly acceptable for defenders to defend, Rance has a valid point - I've seen heaps of examples of both players holding each other but the forward gets a free.
I lived through the glory days of high scoring, the game is better now than then. Back then, if you were tall you were a ruck or forward - defenders were an afterthought. The greats of old usually did it against poor opposition - hence the high scores, Buddy for example, hasn't scored as highly, but did it the hard way against quality defence and his moments of glory are well earned.
It's a contest now, it's as interesting to watch a defender get the better as it is to watch a forward tear his opponent apart. We just used to watch the forwards.
I lived through the glory days of high scoring, the game is better now than then. Back then, if you were tall you were a ruck or forward - defenders were an afterthought. The greats of old usually did it against poor opposition - hence the high scores, Buddy for example, hasn't scored as highly, but did it the hard way against quality defence and his moments of glory are well earned.
It's a contest now, it's as interesting to watch a defender get the better as it is to watch a forward tear his opponent apart. We just used to watch the forwards.
- Jul 13, 2015
- 36,489
- 40,667
- AFL Club
- Hawthorn
It is obvious the umpires have been told to pay more frees.
More frees = bigger scores.
Bigger scores = better games.
But coming from Rance it is just sooking. He has gotten away with so much over the years. Even now with the crackdown he still gets away with more.
More frees = bigger scores.
Bigger scores = better games.
But coming from Rance it is just sooking. He has gotten away with so much over the years. Even now with the crackdown he still gets away with more.
Funny how the rucks use their strength in contests and its a coin flip to see who gets the FK.
The problem for defenders is that forwards are (should be) always having the ball kicked to their advantage so what hope do defenders have if they remove the 'strength' element? Keep a marking contest as a test of strength as well as ability
Nah, as posted above, when push comes to shove it's usually the forward that gets the free.
Forwards have literally all the benefits - no chopping the arms, no holding, no blocking out of contests and most of the time get to shove/push off their opponent to go on a lead.
Most forwards instigate the arm wrestle knowing that at worse once or twice a game they might give away a free kick but most of the time they are going to be rewarded with a free and a shot at goal.
IMO if a forward and a defender are wrestling 1v1 and both have an arm free then it should be play on. I'd go even further and make a rule, if two players are isolated 1v1 in the attacking 50m arc then you can't have a 3rd player starting from more than 5-10 meters away get involved in the contest until the ball has touched the players in the 1v1.
This would allow team mates to get back and help but not at the expense of the contest.
Most forwards instigate the arm wrestle knowing that at worse once or twice a game they might give away a free kick but most of the time they are going to be rewarded with a free and a shot at goal.
IMO if a forward and a defender are wrestling 1v1 and both have an arm free then it should be play on. I'd go even further and make a rule, if two players are isolated 1v1 in the attacking 50m arc then you can't have a 3rd player starting from more than 5-10 meters away get involved in the contest until the ball has touched the players in the 1v1.
This would allow team mates to get back and help but not at the expense of the contest.
Boxhead_31
The Greatest Team Of All
- Oct 12, 2007
- 36,820
- 51,287
- AFL Club
- Geelong
- Other Teams
- South BHFL
Exception to this rule is Tom Hawkins, never gets free kicks that every other forward in the comp gets regularly
Snake_Baker
The one true King of the North
- Apr 24, 2013
- 81,024
- 153,169
- AFL Club
- North Melbourne
- Other Teams
- Essendon Lawn Bowls Club
- Banned
- #20
There is some merit in what you say, but surely you would agree that defenders are overwhelmingly more likely to hold forward players?
8 rounds in to last year and this was posted that clearly highlights that most free are paid in the midfield or defence:
Percentage of total frees paid being inside forward 50 first 8 rounds.
Hawthorn 20.3%
Geelong 20.2%
Adelaide 19.1%
Gold Coast 18.7%
North Melbourne 18.3%
St Kilda, port Adelaide 18.2%
Western bulldogs 17.1%
Brisbane 15.7%
West coast 15%
Melbourne 14.4%
Fremantle 14.3%
Collingwood 13.7%
Sydney 13.5%
Essendon 13.1%
Richmond 12.8%
GWS 12.7%
Carlton 10.1%
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/free-kick-ladder.1167200/page-7#post-50559874
My guess is that the defenders fare a lot better.
Anyone got some better stats?
Rance is 100% correct. His statements match up with what I have seen so far this year. Some people are just disagreeing with Rance because for whatever reasons they do not like him - so therefore he must be wrong. Big footy logic at its finest.
The reason they don't like him is because he's good, very good. I don't like good players from other teams either. As a matter of fact I don't like any of their players. It's all part of footy banter.
I don't think it's a fair statement by Rance. Strength is used by plenty of forwards and defenders (and in other positions) to beat their opponents , it just has to be done legally. In most cases I'd ask to look at an individual contest rather than make a blanket statement like that. I've seen plenty of marks paid this year when the player marking has thrown their opponent to the ground, so the stronger player can win with brute strength.
If there is a feeling that defenders are getting the rough end of it versus forwards, then you have to consider the nature of the two players and what they're trying to achieve in a contest.
In a one-on-one marking contest, the forward is looking to mark the ball pretty much 100% of the time whilst the defender is looking to do anything to stop that happening, so it's probably not surprising if the defender is doing more illegal things. Anything the defender can do to stop the forward is a win, legal or otherwise.
Umpires tend to award fees against players who make the man the focus in a marking contest and if the defender is grappling or holding or not facing the ball, then they'll pay a free to the player who is focused on marking the ball, and as mentioned above, this is probably the forward.
If there is a feeling that defenders are getting the rough end of it versus forwards, then you have to consider the nature of the two players and what they're trying to achieve in a contest.
In a one-on-one marking contest, the forward is looking to mark the ball pretty much 100% of the time whilst the defender is looking to do anything to stop that happening, so it's probably not surprising if the defender is doing more illegal things. Anything the defender can do to stop the forward is a win, legal or otherwise.
Umpires tend to award fees against players who make the man the focus in a marking contest and if the defender is grappling or holding or not facing the ball, then they'll pay a free to the player who is focused on marking the ball, and as mentioned above, this is probably the forward.
So a defender will "do anything" to stop the mark being taken but a forward won't "do anything" to take the mark? Nah. Also, the man is allowed to be the focus, afterall footballers shepherd, bump, hold, etc. I'm not saying Rance doesn't get away with a lot of scragging, which isn't entirely against the rules, but forwards aren't all non-contact types either.
- Jun 17, 2007
- 3,713
- 4,749
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
- Other Teams
- Inverleigh Hawks
Travis Cloke would get penalised all the time for using his strength in a marking contest. Rance is just having a sook.
Similar threads
- Locked
