Current Claremont Murders Discussion & Edwards trial updates

[Beatnicked]

I've stayed logged in & have the right boxes ticked. today I seem to be getting notifications, possibly a glitch with the upgrades

There may be an auto preset on days from last visit to site to kick off notifications.

 

[Beatnicked]

Remember they lost the alleged weapon used in the Pam Lawrence case. They either had a catalogue problem, or it was deliberately left out as evidence.

I think there was a shake up in how everything was stored. I'm sure it is, but I doubt they put the 3 tonne meth busts with the kimonos

That shake up is detailed in the Wark trial transcript. Sure from memory it details year too. Can't put my hand on the link at the moment. Anyone help with that?

 

[Beatnicked]

Yep, Power Plex 20 replaced Profiler Plus in 2014.

Edit* Same year the National Database was upgraded which gave them a huge increase of hits matching between 2 crime scenes, up from 9700 odd for each of the 2 years prior to over 72,000 in 2013-2014. Crime scene to people matches increasing from 18k to 68k.
Only 88k new profiles being added too. Thats a huge increase in matches & major benefit if the new system can be attributed.

WA DNA database legislation proclaimed in part 28Jun02.

Apparently in Sept 2018 the national DNA database made familial testing available to all states and they can check everything as far as I can tell.

I am gobsmacked. Thank you for the detailed reply. Found this
https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wa...old-cases-ng-8f519ed9600a892e252080c1ffbd9926

The arrest in December 2016 is certainly looking as a consequence of this high powered technology doesn't it. The timing of changeover appears critical to me. His time in the light approached rapidly and he couldn't control that!

 

[Beatnicked]

PowerPlex 21 from the manufacturer Promega
https://worldwide.promega.com/produ...lification/powerplex-21-system/?catNum=DC8902

 

[FTY1]

Where in this article does it refer to Lawless having a familial connection to Ciara and or her family?

The only articles I could see in relation to Lawless were all international articles. I don't have access to the Sunday Times at that time. Stating he offered £375,000 ($750,000) and Richard Court offered £125,000. Australian Newspapers didn't seem to report on it. The Sun reported that it was for Ciara's safe return.

Also reasoning may be "how her disappearance brought back memories of his tragic friend Elizabeth Plunkett, 23. She vanished after leaving a pub in Brittas, Co Wicklow, in 1976."

I assume this money might have been withdrawn.

 

[FeelingThroaty]

If you look at the electric pole in police aerial the loop track is too far east. Aerials don't lie they are proof. What are you relying on to prove the loop track?

I have been there & seen Ciaras cross at least twice.

 

[Beatnicked]

I have been there & seen Ciaras cross at least twice.

The 1st cross was wooden and was vandalized then someone set it alight. The 2nd one metal and it got moved several times by person unknown. Various police aerial shots prove the actual location.

 

[Beatnicked]

The only articles I could see in relation to Lawless were all international articles. I don't have access to the Sunday Times at that time. Stating he offered £375,000 ($750,000) and Richard Court offered £125,000. Australian Newspapers didn't seem to report on it. The Sun reported that it was for Ciara's safe return.

Also reasoning may be "how her disappearance brought back memories of his tragic friend Elizabeth Plunkett, 23. She vanished after leaving a pub in Brittas, Co Wicklow, in 1976."

I assume this money might have been withdrawn.

The donors' monies were used to form the Safe Community Foundation. Ultimately the funds were used to cover the costs of initial dna testing.

 

[Melsy]

The 1st cross was wooden and was vandalized thensomeone set it alight. The 2nd one metal and it got moved several times by person unknown. Various police aerial shots prove the actual location.

 

[Melsy]

The only articles I could see in relation to Lawless were all international articles. I don't have access to the Sunday Times at that time. Stating he offered £375,000 ($750,000) and Richard Court offered £125,000. Australian Newspapers didn't seem to report on it. The Sun reported that it was for Ciara's safe return.

Also reasoning may be "how her disappearance brought back memories of his tragic friend Elizabeth Plunkett, 23. She vanished after leaving a pub in Brittas, Co Wicklow, in 1976."

I assume this money might have been withdrawn.

Nope not uncle. You are correct. Lawless was just a property developer from Ireland. AFAIK. I was incorrect but its a lot fo water under the bridge.

 

[Beatnicked]

There are various other photos that show wider area. The one you posted is a zoomed in one.

 

[Melsy]

The cops are standing in two places. One lot in the half circle of Balga Grass Trees. The others just to the side, over clothing. About 10 feet away.

 

[Melsy]

There are various other photos that show wider area. The one you posted is a zoomed in one.

This photo I posted a couple of pages back?

 

[FTY1]

The donors' monies were used to form the Safe Community Foundation. Ultimately the funds were used to cover the costs of initial dna testing.

I think if he did donate it certainly wasn't anywhere near the £350,000 or even $350,000 to the Secure Community Foundation. The Irish Times article below shows $850,000 raised by 1999.

11 May 2001 the West Australian reported "Mr Glennon's company, Environmental Solutions International, put in $50,000. Blake Dawson Waldron threw in $100,000. The list of donors was a who's who of the Perth business community."

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/...49685?mode=print&ot=example.AjaxPageLayout.ot

I would find it hard to believe that an Irishman donated huge amounts and it not be reported in an Irish Times article. I have my doubts.

 

[one eyed spy]

The donors' monies were used to form the Safe Community Foundation. Ultimately the funds were used to cover the costs of initial dna testing.

Ive only seen 1 article detailing the first expenditure and the money received initially was said to be $550k in 3 weeks die to Neil Ferris calling asking for help from Accountants, QCs & business leaders to raise money in the hope they could track him down in time to find Chiara still alive. The specify it paid $18k for the initial Ciara reenactment, $8K for the 2nd, the cost to bring David Caldwell out from US, the entire "Act on your own suspicions" campaign and the cost to link WA police with British advanced computer data linking technology so they could sort through the excessive amounts of worthless leads such a mass campaign generated. I read also that they bought forensic equipment for the lab here too.

Beat, in regard to the loop road do you think everyone has relied on the wrong location for years and not realised?

Does this image help?
This is possibly one of Melsys images from ages ago but I dont agree the marker is exactly where her body was. Its been placed in the bare patch in front of the large group, my finger points to the location of the woman stands, but the loop track is correct.

 

[one eyed spy]

Damn, I cant edit.. DUE to Neil.
I cant edit it clearer either, my image is nowhere near that dark but I can hardly see it here. Sorry.

 

[Beatnicked]

Nope not uncle. You are correct. Lawless was just a property developer from Ireland. AFAIK. I was incorrect but its a lot fo water under the bridge.

I am very curious as to why you republished the Lawless article and in doing so bought to our attention what you falsely had opined was a connection between Lawless and the Glennon family in a familial sense. Astonishing.

 

[Melsy]

I am very curious as to why you republished the Lawless article and in doing so bought to our attention what you falsely had opined was a connection between Lawless and the Glennon family in a familial sense. Astonishing.

I'm surprised with why you are nitpicking. For someone who claims to be a professional, you aren't very professional. Your self inflated ego has got the better of you.

I didn't republish it. Someone else did. I pointed out that there was a significant donation from a property developer who had obvious ties with the Glennon family. It was the largest financial offer. Let me recap it for you.

I explain the matter, but you persist, although even if the claim was made online in the media, time has proven much of it goes missing for different reasons. As you can see, the link is a cached archive as it is.

All in the same paragraph.

"Miss Glennon's parents, Dennis, from Westport, Co Mayo, and Una, from Co Monaghan, emigrated from the Irish Republic some years ago. But the family made regular visits home. Kevin Lawless, a property developer from Dublin who emigrated to Perth, put up a ý375,000 reward for information leading to her safe return. Her parents appeared on Australian television to appeal for help and even released their home telephone number. "

Hugely off topic here, but i was digging through some old forums and found an article that the now managing editor of the Washington Examiner wrote in 1997, has a few spurious details. He was either incredibly well informed or he started his illustrious journalism career in a very lazy and imaginitive fashion.

http://web.archive.org/web/20040917...t.jhtml?html=/archive/1997/04/04/wkill04.html

 

[BlueE]

Ive only seen 1 article detailing the first expenditure and the money received initially was said to be $550k in 3 weeks die to Neil Ferris calling asking for help from Accountants, QCs & business leaders to raise money in the hope they could track him down in time to find Chiara still alive. The specify it paid $18k for the initial Ciara reenactment, $8K for the 2nd, the cost to bring David Caldwell out from US, the entire "Act on your own suspicions" campaign and the cost to link WA police with British advanced computer data linking technology so they could sort through the excessive amounts of worthless leads such a mass campaign generated. I read also that they bought forensic equipment for the lab here too.

Beat, in regard to the loop road do you think everyone has relied on the wrong location for years and not realised?

Does this image help?
This is possibly one of Melsys images from ages ago but I dont agree the marker is exactly where her body was. Its been placed in the bare patch in front of the large group, my finger points to the location of the woman stands, but the loop track is correct.

Can I confirm you are pointing to a more accurate discovery location of Ciara from the 2002 map that Melsy posted?

 

[Melsy]

View attachment 606653
Can I confirm you are pointing to a more accurate discovery location of Ciara from the 2002 map that Melsy posted?

The big bunch of cops are looking at the pin.

The yellow line is 38 metres long to give scale

 

[Melsy]

 

[Sorbet Bliss]

These aerial photographs may help to figure out the distance and exact location of where Ciara was found.
First image looks like the crime scene investigation unit, forensics, pathologist etc have set up their stations and started to work on the areas of interests inclusive of the crime scene/ciaras location. Circled in red could be detectives viewing from a short distance.
Second and third images appear to be before these units arrived while an officer guards the area close to the primary crime scene.
It doesn't appear that the location was very far from the sandy track or the road but this could also be due to skewed photographic interpretation.

 

[Kerouacian]

I'm surprised with why you are nitpicking. For someone who claims to be a professional, you aren't very professional. Your self inflated ego has got the better of you.

I didn't republish it. Someone else did. I pointed out that there was a significant donation from a property developer who had obvious ties with the Glennon family. It was the largest financial offer. Let me recap it for you.

I explain the matter, but you persist, although even if the claim was made online in the media, time has proven much of it goes missing for different reasons. As you can see, the link is a cached archive as it is.

All in the same paragraph.

"Miss Glennon's parents, Dennis, from Westport, Co Mayo, and Una, from Co Monaghan, emigrated from the Irish Republic some years ago. But the family made regular visits home. Kevin Lawless, a property developer from Dublin who emigrated to Perth, put up a ý375,000 reward for information leading to her safe return. Her parents appeared on Australian television to appeal for help and even released their home telephone number. "

I posted the article, with no intention of hi-lighting the content as such, but purely in astonishment that such a decorated and journalist and now editor at a huge newspaper started of his career by writing such a badly researched or fabricated article. This is the only one I’ve seen that has mentioned supposed method of killing etc. Where did he get that info and why was he allowed to get away with publishing it.

 

[Melsy]

I posted the article, with no intention of hi-lighting the content as such, but purely in astonishment that such a decorated and journalist and now editor at a huge newspaper started of his career by writing such a badly researched or fabricated article. This is the only one I’ve seen that has mentioned supposed method of killing etc. Where did he get that info and why was he allowed to get away with publishing it.

It doesn't matter. You are addressing your statement to a person answering someone else who was questioning your motive.

 

[FTY1]

I posted the article, with no intention of hi-lighting the content as such, but purely in astonishment that such a decorated and journalist and now editor at a huge newspaper started of his career by writing such a badly researched or fabricated article. This is the only one I’ve seen that has mentioned supposed method of killing etc. Where did he get that info and why was he allowed to get away with publishing it.

The only thing that the police have every said publicly about the crime scenes and bodies are that they were not mutilated. They have never revealed cause of death so I suspect it was a guess. The Age article on 30 May 1998 Hunt for a Serial Killer Part 1 has the quote Police have revealed little about the bodies or the investigation, but the rumors became so frightening they told The Age emphatically: "They were not mutilated."