Training 2019 Preseason Discussion

[Grand Uncle Horace]

the problem with our list is we only have one genuine ruck.

sinclair and cameron are both second rucks who rest forward.

I am worried both will be selected and clog the forward line. Cameron is a decent height and no doubt has copped some decent ruckwork tutorials from Cox. He looked ok as leading ruck in the ressies last year. But he just seems to lack physicality.

Sinkers is simply not tall enough to beat the top line rucks.

 

[mtooler]

Depending on how we set up our forward 50, we might have to.

Without Naismith being available, and from what I saw of Cameron, I don’t see a lot of point in carrying two rucks with one, at least at this stage, not looking competent enough to be a general ruckman as yet.

And even when Naismith comes back, if he were to get selected for seniors, would we have all of Buddy, Reid, Sinclair, Menzel and even Blakey (and McCartin would have been included) forward? I doubt it.

The ruck rules this year seem to indicate to me that we won’t be able to play a grossly undersized player in there unlike the last couple of years. Reid however is tall and athletic enough to make a contest without the risk of exposing the news rules and thus if the club is confident in his body, I can see him giving Sinclair a chop out in the ruck.

Aliir is my guess over Reid.

 

[caesar88]

Aliir is my guess over Reid.

Nope nope nope. If one is to be a sacrifical lamb to the ruck it is Reid. Aliir is too good and is off limits to that kind of a move.

 

[WillHayward]

I'm biased but a shame the swans can't organise a pre season game in Newcastle.
I can only speculate that it is difficult to get a suitable venue during cricket season up here.

 

[mtooler]

Exciting news,got my NT membership today, looking forward to my $83 cap haha.

 

[LegendLewis]

Hey guys, just wanted to comment that it was good reading your thread as no-one jumps at shadows and blames each other and you peoples actually agree with and support each others opinions. Thanks!!
Not saying the hawks board is bad but some others I have been reading as a super coach nerd have given me flashbacks taking me back to a misspent youth in some pretty amazing and terrifying mosh pits back in the 80's and 90's.

 

[caesar88]

Hey guys, just wanted to comment that it was good reading your thread as no-one jumps at shadows and blames each other and you peoples actually agree with and support each others opinions. Thanks!!
Not saying the hawks board is bad but some others I have been reading as a super coach nerd have given me flashbacks taking me back to a misspent youth in some pretty amazing and terrifying mosh pits back in the 80's and 90's.

You obviously didn't venture into the John Longmire thread!

 

[sataris]

Been out of touch for a while.

How many square metres of property have been trained down and what's the cumulative council rates we have to pay?

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

The diabolical insurance companies are denying all claims and upping premiums to ruinous levels.

 

[mikey_san]

While Cameron was quiet - he did go off with a knee injury, so lets see how he goes next time. He was making great strides last year and pushing hard for a spot. Sure it's NEAFL but he can only play who they put in front of him.
Not (can't afford to be) giving up on him just yet.

 

[6yearsold]

since leaving the swans, mumford has really gone down hill. In becoming smitten with a caricature of himself he is losing his dignity.

 

[Jewelsbon]

since leaving the swans, mumford has really gone down hill. In becoming smitten with a caricature of himself he is losing his dignity.

Yep, a perfect description of how he appears these days.

 

[Wolftone]

Thanks for that Wolftone. The brain is one of our last frontiers. A century or so from now, medical science historians will probably consider our era and progress in understanding to be little more than the simple first steps.

ECT is an example of a treatment (nowadays mainly for depression attendant to bi-polar disorder), the efficacy of which can be observed, but the hows and whys of efficacy are still not fully understood.

I find this therapy short sighted. Many of the people who have had this suffer severe side effects even in later life. The efficacy of this treatment is under the microscope as we speak.

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[Wolftone]

I am just more cautious I guess. Let’s remember last year we looked as excited by Stoddart as we currently are by McInerney. When the heat was turned right up in the first half, McInerney wasn’t sighted. Then once we had a decent lead and the pressure kind of wilted away in the second half, McInerney had so much time and space and capitalised. Yes it looked good and was exciting to see a Swan want to run, but there were those that were able to do it right off the bat for four quarters (Florent, O’Riordan, Cunningham were breaking lines all day). Unfortunately that’s what will be required of McInerney if he played at AFL level. We have to be realistic and remember that he won’t be able to do half of the things he did yesterday in a home and away match.

Why I was more impressed with Blakey and Rowbottom is because their games looked more likely to translate well to the highest level. Blakey’s kicking style for example looked bloody smooth - that wouldn’t change at senior level. The fact he’s a 196cm bean-pole who attacks hard and works hard makes him an imposing player with or without the footy. Rowbottom was also great in tight and set up many plays by making something out of nothing and causing turnovers by being in the right places and reading the ball well. These are qualities they showed that will still be there even when surrounded by the big dogs in the AFL. McInerney’s to me was the quintessential NEAFL highlights reel match. But keen to see more of him so he better see some JLT action as I think he may be able to build a fitness load up pretty quickly and put some pressure on McVeigh later in the season!

I don't think McI played much in the first half.

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[Wolftone]

Again uninformed dumbie who failed science in high school here, but are the effects permanent? I could see why staff may advise retirement if the injuries were serious enough that they didn’t want him on the football field in the imminent future, but is there no chance of recovery or healing to the point of return in a few years time?

It all depends on the diagnosis. If he is prone to anurisms or brain bruising or other more damaging effects of concussion then specialists will recommend he retire. But if it is one of those unlucky incidents where a player gets hit at a certain angle he will be required to wear protective head gear

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[Wolftone]

I just figured he wasn't on the field early. Could be wrong.
Agree on Blakey. Can lead, can kick - fast for his size. Looks like a round one starter and in my supercoach team. How will opponents 3rd defender deal with him if Reid and Buddy are in the team? He could kick a lot of goals this year and if he starts demanding the 2nd defender Reid will kill them too.

Rowbottom looks well handy and a type we need. Hope he keeps it up - might need a year to get bigger as with his game style he's going to take a battering. Looking forward to his debut though and it might come early - he and Clarke battling for a spot?

I doubt Rowbotton is battling Clarke for a spot. Clarke is an outside mid, a winger if you will, and Rowbottom is an inside mid. He will be battling Heeney, Mills, Hewett, Joey, Jack, Papley, Jones, Parker etc.

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[Wolftone]

I watched the second half and the above is a good summation. I was not as impressed with Melican, but maybe he was better in the first half.

I though Lewis was very solid for his first hit out in almost a season. He most certainly beat his man. Ran off him a lot and had a very good first up for a player coming back from long term injury. I just think your expectations were a tad too high due to his firm in top match fitness. He is not match fit yet. Please remember that.

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[Wolftone]

He was really good. That’s what you want to see from kids that want to break into the 22. Continued improvement and the drive to put in strong performances early in the year. I’d be pretty comfortable with him playing senior footy now. He has definitely worked hard on the offensive aspects of his game too, as much like Melican was, they were pretty weak when drafted. He is tracking really well.

That’s probably why someone like Stoddart is disappointing as he doesn’t seem to have gone forward much at all from when he was draft in any aspect of his game or physique.

Rose also was almost absent and his performance didn’t back up the coaching staff giving him another year after an eye opening NEAFL grand final performance. Players like him should be stand outs after 4 years on the list and he wasn’t anywhere near it and when he was he did little that was productive.

The difference between Melican and Maibaum is that Melican has always been an attacking defender. Even in his first intra he attacked the ball and ran off his man. Constantly setting up the loose man. Whereas Maibaum was drafted as a lock down defender. He is not a naturally attacking player. His role is more the Reg role. He has had to learn to create a bit of space and also to use his generally good disposal to set up run and carry for the smaller players. This is probably not his natural game but he has developed very well as far as I can see.

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[Wolftone]

Really good points about competitiveness. At one stage in Q3, Bell made four repeat efforts in the one play. I was really impressed by his determination.

Yes I thought Bell a bit unlucky. He put in great effort but didn't get the rewards. Sometimes the ball just does not bounce your way and I think Belly had one of those days. He managed to do a couple of impressive things though. He also had a lot of holding out of the contest and could have been awarded three or four frees. It seems his opponent wanted to impress the GWS selectors too. He was a bit unlucky on the day but has plenty to work with.

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[Wolftone]

Ed Barlow had a huge amount of talent, but was not particularly competitive.

That's why he is playing for Southern Districts in Darwin

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[Wolftone]

Agree re Lloyd. Couple of absolute stinkers... and with plenty of time to execute.
Papley was very good. Solid contribution between the arcs. Always looks sore to me.
Watching live really let’s you see how much ground Stoddart covers. Fear he is the Jordan Foote of the flanks, in that he does all the hard yards but doesn’t have the skills/composure to capitalise.
With you on Dawson... think a few here forget that when our neafl side is kicking 25-30 goals he will get plenty of touches... around the forward fifty arc... where he does his best work.
Has COR reached his ceiling? Gets to good places, tackles strongly but his ball use isn’t consistent enough.
Fox has always had the ability to make some great plays and yesterday was no different. Seems quite popular and respected around the dugout. I suspect his greatest contribution to our great game may happen off the playing field.
Yeah... Cameron got smashed. Couldn’t keep his feet on a very hard cricket field (plenty of bloodied elbows and knees) especially under the weight of Simpson... he is a big big boy. Funny, Giant fan next to me applauded his grab in the goal square... I turned and said “He’s no chance to kick it”... sure enough!
He left the very soon after ht with a knee, which worryingly suggests Sinclair is the entire ruck dept for the foreseeable future.

Amarty is still there. Raw and yet to take the field yes. Be interesting to see what he can do if he plays preseason games

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[Wolftone]

We might see Reid back in the ruck?

Please no thank you. He is the world's worst ruckman

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[Wolftone]

Cox could be putting in some long hours with the likes of Pink and Amartey lol

Yes I think so as Reid is the crappie St Ruck man EVER

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[Wolftone]

thurlow offered absolutely nothing despite being pumped up by menzel in the commentary box. has his work cut out for him to make the rd 1 team imo. as does clarke who has brought his scrappy disposal with him from north though he makes himself available well with his running ability. COR seems to have plateaued. i though maybe cor or thurlow could take mills spot in defence before watching this match. right now i would rather robbie fox back there.

Robbie was really good in the back pocket when he played there. Very confident back there

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[TheMase]

The difference between Melican and Maibaum is that Melican has always been an attacking defender. Even in his first intra he attacked the ball and ran off his man. Constantly setting up the loose man. Whereas Maibaum was drafted as a lock down defender. He is not a naturally attacking player. His role is more the Reg role. He has had to learn to create a bit of space and also to use his generally good disposal to set up run and carry for the smaller players. This is probably not his natural game but he has developed very well as far as I can see.

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I think that is something Melican has developed into his game though. Early on I remember reading him saying that was a part of his game he needed to work on.

His first two years of NEAFL netted an average disposal of 7 and 9 respectively (whereas Maibaum has actually averaged 11 and 12 over his first two NEAFL seasons).

Both developing nicely.