List Mgmt. 2021 Trade & List Management Thread II - IN: CCJ

[giantroo]

Spoiler: Lore's 2021 Draft Order

Spoiler: Lore's 2022 Future Picks Draft Order

 

[HBFlanker]

It's 'feeling' more and more we're deliberately leaving him in the shop window.

Dumont?

I think Dawsons request has stitched him right up to be honest. Cant see him getting back to SA now.

 

[Horace]

I don't think it is as clear cut as you make it out to be. Ie... https://afl.draftcentral.com.au/202...e-number-one-what-separates-daicos-and-horne/

While I think Daicos is potentially much better than Hawks Mitchell, he shares the same stat padding traits of taking 3 disposals to go 5m, he is just a significantly better user of the football once he gets out into space. Horne has more the feel of Martin/Fyfe/Petracca type of footballers. Don't get me wrong, I'd love a ball magnet mid like Daicos if he was available, he has the potential to be like Judd depending on the players around him.

I just don't think it is as clear cut, if both were available in the draft who would we take. People just seem overly obsessed with making Collingwood pay more, because they will match it for sure.



Best is subjective. We knew nobody else would have taken Phillips last year until GC, it was why we tried to trade down our pick last year. He could have gone 3rd, could have gone 5th, could have gone later. We wanted Phillips but could have taken him with a range of different picks had we moved our pick around.



Psychology plays an important role in sports. I don't think it will impact how he performs on-field but some players have a different type of ego, he mentioned he really wanted to go number one, I don't think that would be something would bring up in a video interview if it was something that didn't mean anything to him.



Maybe, maybe not.

I cannot be bothered getting into a longwinded debate with you on this.

In my opinion we should bid on the player we think is the best player available in the draft, at that particular stage, whether that is Pick 1 or Pick 20 or Pick 120. I don't know who is the best player, but I do know that most people nominate Daicos. Its nothing to do with making the Pies pay for me; its simply we should try to obtain the best player as we judge it. We want and need the best possible list playing for us next year.

In my opinion everything in terms of the draft is subjective. Nothing different with Pick 1.

In my opinion every club should draft according to who they think is the best player available at the time of their Pick.

In my opinion Psychology plays an important part in everything in life. If being Pick 2 or Pick 3 is going to affect him adversely, as opposed to being Pick 1, then he should, like everyone who is struggling for whatever reason, get help from an experienced medical professional.

I can't be bothered responding to your "Maybe, maybe not" comment.

These are my opinions, they are neither right not wrong, I am entitled to them, as are we all in matters like this.

That is all from me on this topic so don't bother responding, because I certainly won't be adding any more.

 

[Harpergun]

I think a bid on Daicos makes sense if we rate him number 1, plus Pies are guaranteed to grab him.

A bid of Darcy in my opinion carries a lot more risk. Wasn't really rated a top 20 prospect at the start of year, played a few good games and is all of a sudden a top 3 prospect.
I feel he doesnt have the resume of JHF and Daicos. Plus there is no guarantee the Dogs take him and I would hate to be stuck with him just so we could make the dogs pay a few extra draft points.

 

[Themanbun]

* it's a long offseason already

 

[Passmore]

It's 'feeling' more and more we're deliberately leaving him in the shop window.

How much is that froggy in the window………?

 

[The Nostradamus]

I would happily pay 50% of Polecs wage to get a draft pick in for him.

Would not have thought i would be saying that after we signed him.

That or take a late pick and someone picks up the rest of polecs wage

 

[Shinboner1]

I would happily pay 50% of Polecs wage to get a draft pick in for him.

Would not have thought i would be saying that after we signed him.

TBH I'd be happy to trade him under the same situation to Geelong for Jordan Clark.

 

[Ligma]

That or take a late pick and someone picks up the rest of polecs wage

Hi tZ

 

[Firebat]

I hope Polec gets a good uninterrupted preseason... He's a good player with limitations. Regardless of salary, he'll probably have a better career than someone picked at 50 plus in the draft.

Also, don't discount the impact of COVID isolation on these guys. They're all just young men, some cope better than others.
I can't see him being trades so let's see how he goes next year.

 

[Tas]

I cannot be bothered getting into a longwinded debate with you on this.

I wasn't debating you, i gave my opinion and you chimned in.

I was just exploring the holes in your logic, but fine if you don't want to explain your thoughts.

In my opinion we should bid on the player we think is the best player available in the draft, at that particular stage, whether that is Pick 1 or Pick 20 or Pick 120. I don't know who is the best player, but I do know that most people nominate Daicos. Its nothing to do with making the Pies pay for me; its simply we should try to obtain the best player as we judge it. We want and need the best possible list playing for us next year.

I agree, in principle, but Daicos isn't in the picture. It doesn't matter if we bid 1 on Daicos, we aren't getting Daicos. We are going to get JHF or someone else. Collingwood is going to end up with Daicos regardless and I don't think it matters at all if they move in a fringe pick from next year into this year to make up the difference.

In my opinion everything in terms of the draft is subjective. Nothing different with Pick 1.

I agree.

In my opinion every club should draft according to who they think is the best player available at the time of their Pick.

I agree, to a certain extent. However, if the best player available is always a midfielder then you wouldn't always draft midfielders. There is more nuance to it than that and that partly feeds into the subjective differences.

In my opinion Psychology plays an important part in everything in life. If being Pick 2 or Pick 3 is going to affect him adversely, as opposed to being Pick 1, then he should, like everyone who is struggling for whatever reason, get help from an experienced medical professional.

We do have sports psychologists involved with football clubs. There is a difference between a Carey or Buckley type ego and having a psychological problem though. People with egos are a lot harder to handle, but they are sometimes exceptional footballers.

I can't be bothered responding to your "Maybe, maybe not" comment.

But you did anyway.

These are my opinions, they are neither right not wrong, I am entitled to them, as are we all in matters like this.

Opinions can be dead wrong. Football related ones don't really matter a whole lot, we are just shooting the breeze, no need to get emo about it.

That is all from me on this topic so don't bother responding, because I certainly won't be adding any more.

Thanks for the posting advice, I will take that up. :stern look

 

[LB2Snake]

If it was JHF ...Daylight....and then Daicos you take JHF...but it isn't. Why would we not take Daicos....it alters all our later picks as well.

If JHF is "upset" we didn't pick him at 1, then that's a massive worry anyway.....Club is bigger than any individual.

 

[justroyal]

Because JHF is the best player in the draft and deserves to be pick 1.



Pretty sure draftees contracts are locked for 2 years so you can’t pay them extra till their 3rd year.

yeah I don’t think Brady will be taking the same approach as you

 

[Mav]

That or take a late pick and someone picks up the rest of polecs wage

HBFlanker has already said he’d pay half his wage!

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

I wouldn't have thought that Thilthorpe gave two shits that he was the actual second picked player in last year's draft. He got drafted. For most that is the goal, getting drafted to a team in your home state, a bonus.

 

[Tas]

I’d be happy to keep Dumont if we could offload Polec and his remaining wage

I would have assumed his deal was front-loaded, I wouldn't expect his remaining salary to be a lot. That being said, we are going to pay 100% of our TPP and a third of our list are on fixed draft deals and a lot of our older players are on 1 year contracts. I think we need deals like CCJ, Corr, etc to take up both our TPP requirement and utilise what has been brought forward in previous years.

 

[Tas]

I wouldn't have thought that Thilthorpe gave two shits that he was the actual second picked player in last year's draft. He got drafted. For most that is the goal, getting drafted to a team in your home state, a bonus.

I don't think he cared either, did anyone in that draft pool have the desire to be #1 and think they were better than JUH?

That is comparing apples to oranges.

 

[ferball]

But what if it's true ...

Or we asked him to talk down CCJ' value as some sort of way to start paying back the damage he has done.

 

[Val Keating]

yeah I don’t think Brady will be taking the same approach as you

Considering I’m just a footy nuffy and he’s a paid professional you’re probably right

 

[Tas]

Considering I’m just a footy nuffy and he’s a paid professional you’re probably right

He's also the guy who botched the Brown saga, don't sell yourself short. :stern look

 

[blackshadow]

If there is a marginal difference between Daicos and Porne, then I would give pick 1 to Porne.

If the difference was between JUH and the next person then fine, but the margin is a lot closer. I think it would show a lack of faith in JHF if we say we don't think he is better than Daicos.

Much as I'd like to * over the pies and dogs, there's a shitload of publicity capital associated with the number 1 pick, something that we should be able to leverage to increase membership, people at games, eyes on TV telecasts etc.

It's extremely important for us to showcase our future as much as possible.

 

[Tas]

Dumont?

I think Dawsons request has stitched him right up to be honest. Cant see him getting back to SA now.

Wasn't he going to the Crows? People were talking all year like it was a done deal.

 

[Sphynx]

Much as I'd like to fu** over the pies and dogs, there's a shitload of publicity capital associated with the number 1 pick, something that we should be able to leverage to increase membership, people at games, eyes on TV telecasts etc.

It's extremely important for us to showcase our future as much as possible.

"If" he ever requested a move home, you would be trading the former #1 pick in lieu of the #3 pick etc.....

 

[Val Keating]

He's also the guy who botched the Brown saga, don't sell yourself short. :stern look

Did he though? I think there’s more to that saga then we’ll ever know

 

[Mr north man]

Wonder if Scotts new gig will cost us any chance of a priority pick because:
a) He doesn't want to be perceived as having a conflict of interest (not that it seemed to have stopped Hockings)
b) His astute football brain when it comes to helping Joyces and McMahons with list management and recruiting in the past could never have led to a situation where the club would justify a priority pick
c) Sour grapes
d) All of the above
e) None of the above (enter your response here)

Your forgetting option F
He takes pitty on us as his Golf Partner at Huntingdale over 18 JB might say to him just help us 1 more time.

 

[Long Live the King]

Love to see the Doggies whiteboard......assuming they take the same pragmatic approach ie take the best available player what if they rate JHF higher than Darcy. Will they still bid to get him if we call his name out. Or do we safely assume they will take Darcy regardless?? FWIW if the North whiteboard has Daicos 1 and JHF 2 then call them in that order