List Mgmt. 2021 Draft and Trade Hypotheticals

[Ticky009]

Hi everyone, for those interested some great links plus the Big Footy Draft, Trade & Free Agency twitter as per below:

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Was hoping for future 2nd and 39 which seems fair.

31 and future second seems overs - equivalent to pick 12!

With a third coming back to us, values it around the late first round- early second.

 

[WillHayward]

With a third coming back to us, values it around the late first round- early second.

Still around a pick 17.

 

[BloodySwan]

Thanks for posting. I found this really interesting: "Former Eagles star Cox is considered the best ruckman of the modern era but Ladhams only trained with the forward group this year at the Power, which did not have an official ruck coach."

I was initially critical of recruiting Ladhams with the other young fwd/rucks we've just resigned, but the above might indicate that there's some improvement in his tapwork that hasn't been extracted yet. I have to put my hand up and admit that I thought he was 25-26 rather than 23, so again maybe there's more improvement left.

It's pretty apparent that Dees are now the benchmark - I kept waiting for them to roll over like old times when we challenged them in our away game and it never happened, further demonstrated by their response to the dogs on GF day.

If our plan is to take their crown you've got Hickey 1st ruck up against Gawn, Ladhams relief ruck up against Jackson. This leaves McLean as cover for Buddy or McDonald when they're unavailable, and Amartey as cover for Ladhams or McDonald when they're unavailable. If Hickey is injured Ladhams become # 1 and the forwards shuffle accordingly. Sinclair as break in case of emergency.

It's actually starting to make a lot more sense to me, because, well, I'm a lot slower than Kinnear and co.

Also worth pointing out - we get smashed in the middle. In almost every time Hickey took a rest we were just trying to just break even. With 2 genuine rucks our midfield will get better service, or Ladhams will get more of his own ball, or worst case scenario we will break even rather than trying to break even.

Heeney also seems like the best Dawson replacement for me with McDonald the best Heeney replacement in the forward line. Heeney doesn't have the same boot as Dawson but I rate his hard ball gets and marking ability stronger than Dawson. I don't think Heeney will be in the middle so much as more along with wing when he gets more midfield minutes

 

[ShireSwan]

McAndrew already on our list

This story's a 'Stretch': 209cm beanpole union player makes AFL list in 12 months

New Sydney player Lachlan McAndrew's rise to an AFL list is quite incredible

www.afl.com.au

Dude's got a set of arms on him, don't think beanpole is a good descriptor. Looks like more to work with than I was expecting physically.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Still around a pick 17.

Unfortunately he is contracted. I personally would rather target him next year BUT if we want him it's going to have to be a fraction of overs. Lets look at it rationally what is he work, lets say pick 20-30 give and take. Our second is probably not enough, our first is way too high. I wouldn't be against trading down from 12 to 16 if that makes them happy and just basically trading our second for Ladhams. That might be an option.

 

[RampeRobe]

Geez dal Santo is a Nuffie, just a couple of days ago he was saying that port trading ladhams doesn’t make any sense, and now he is saying that port must get a trade done because they have the depth to cover it. AFL media could be the worst in the world

 

[Bloods86]

Pick 31 should get Ladhams done. Offering multiple 2nd rounders even with a 3rd coming back seems unnecessary.

We've been over this. Port want him gone, or at least are feigning shock that telling a player to explore options might actually lead to them doing so. Ladhams wants us and no-one else is interested in coughing anything substantial up, or paying his expected salary for next year. We weren't looking for this, Port have essentially brought it on and it's pretty rich to make 1st round or equivalent demands.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Pick 31 should get Ladhams done. Offering multiple 2nd rounders even with a 3rd coming back seems unnecessary.

We've been over this. Port want him gone, or at least are feigning shock that telling a player to explore options might actually lead to them doing so. Ladhams wants us and no-one else is interested in coughing anything substantial up, or paying his expected salary for next year. We weren't looking for this, Port have essentially brought it on and it's pretty rich to make demands.

I agree with you mate but he's not out of contract and it adds a bit. Maybe we flip our firsts this year to sweeten it. There's nothing between 10-20 this year you'll probably get who you want at 12 at 16.

 

[caesar88]

Heeney also seems like the best Dawson replacement for me with McDonald the best Heeney replacement in the forward line. Heeney doesn't have the same boot as Dawson but I rate his hard ball gets and marking ability stronger than Dawson. I don't think Heeney will be in the middle so much as more along with wing when he gets more midfield minutes

I hope you are right about this as I want Heeney out in the space where he can use his marking and delivery, and don't want him taking midfield opportunities away from guys who are better suited to the contest.

But I reckon Heeney's kicking is every bit as good as Dawson's. Maybe playing a bit higher up we'll get to see it more.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I hope you are right about this as I want Heeney out in the space where he can use his marking and delivery, and don't want him taking midfield opportunities away from guys who are better suited to the contest.

But I reckon Heeney's kicking is every bit as good as Dawson's. Maybe playing a bit higher up we'll get to see it more.

Yeah 100% I can see Heeney as one I just hope and this isn't a shot at you, I hope we settle him in one position, I don't want him moving every second week all over the place.

 

[RUNVS]

I hope you are right about this as I want Heeney out in the space where he can use his marking and delivery, and don't want him taking midfield opportunities away from guys who are better suited to the contest.

But I reckon Heeney's kicking is every bit as good as Dawson's. Maybe playing a bit higher up we'll get to see it more.

Heeney is a pretty good kick but he has no where near the penetration Dawson has.

 

[Bloods86]

I agree with you mate but he's not out of contract and it adds a bit. Maybe we flip our firsts this year to sweeten it. There's nothing between 10-20 this year you'll probably get who you want at 12 at 16.

I'm ok with switching firsts and 39. The fact he's contracted is meaningless since Port initiated this! You can't tell him to look elsewhere before a backended $$ year, which has thoroughly pissed him off, and then backtrack and say oh we're happy to keep him, so pay up, even though we've brought in his replacement already.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I'm ok with switching firsts and 39. The fact he's contracted is meaningless since Port initiated this! You can't tell him to look elsewhere, which has thoroughly pissed him off, and then backtrack and say oh we're happy to keep him even though we've brought in his replacement already.

That honestly seems the fairest deal, values him around the 25 range which is more than fair.

 

[FreeAgent1]

Still around a pick 17.

Our second next year is largely a "points pick" with some reasonable academy talent, so no huge loss if we get a 3rd back.... we can always make up points

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Heeney is a pretty good kick but he has no where near the penetration Dawson has.

Brayden Campbell is the one whether he's ready next year who knows. The thing we lose isn't the kicking it's the overhead marking both on the wing and drifting forward.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Our second next year is largely a "points pick" with some reasonable academy talent, so no huge loss if we get a 3rd back.... we can always make up points

Yep that was my reasoning anything outside the first round will be largely irrelevant next season.

 

[Bloods86]

That honestly seems the fairest deal, values him around the 25 range which is more than fair.

I'd still prefer to say pick 31 take it or leave it. I would be extremely shocked if Port didn't take it, thus avoiding the problems they'll have with him staying.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Hopefully now the deal is done, those painful Crows fans (not all, some where fair and reasonable) will crawl back into the cracks they came from.

I spend a fair bit of time on Twitter and was amazed at the number of accounts with no followers there were supporting AFC and trolling Swans supporters. I reported 17 of them. I've never encountered anything like that, though I've heard some forums can be like that. Very unpleasant.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I'd still prefer to say pick 31 take it or leave it. I would be extremely shocked if Port didn't take it, thus avoiding the problems they'll have with him staying.

Either one is fine, I'm comfortable flipping 12 to 16, and using Melbournes F1 to live trade on draft night into the late first round,

 

[caesar88]

Heeney is a pretty good kick but he has no where near the penetration Dawson has.

See I have never thought of Dawson as a penetrating kick.

I generally consider good kicks of the footy to be of two different types, either good with penetration or good with placement.

Penetrating kicks can deliver the low, hard, fast bullets to get through an opposition structure; a well placed kick can find a difficult target from 50m away at least with no real speed or penetration but a lot of precision. Both are handy but they are needed for different things. Penetration is great for kicking out of the back half, as you can slice open a defence with a bullet. Placement is great for kicking inside 50, as you can put a perfectly weighted kick to a forward's advantage.

I would say in terms of our list:

Penetrating kicks - Heeney, Cunningham, Florent (on his good days), Campbell, Errol, Blakey, Buddy, Rampe

Placement kicks - Heeney, Rowbottom, Errol, McInerney, Hewett, Dawson

Heeney & Errol generally the only two who I think can do both fairly evenly.

The above is just how I see it anyway.

 

[Kiama Chris]

If Ladhams chucked in $100k of his own money just WOW! Not sure the deal but it'll get done.

 

[Millky95]

Penetrating kicks - Heeney, Cunningham, Florent (on his good days), Campbell, Errol, Blakey, Buddy,

Dude that kick Campbell did in I think the Richmond game where he split 2 Richmond players to hit the Swans player low at like 65m from goal was something else

 

[Wolfgang West]

See I have never thought of Dawson as a penetrating kick.

I generally consider good kicks of the footy to be of two different types, either good with penetration or good with placement.

Penetrating kicks can deliver the low, hard, fast bullets to get through an opposition structure; a well placed kick can find a difficult target from 50m away at least with no real speed or penetration but a lot of precision. Both are handy but they are needed for different things. Penetration is great for kicking out of the back half, as you can slice open a defence with a bullet. Placement is great for kicking inside 50, as you can put a perfectly weighted kick to a forward's advantage.

I would say in terms of our list:

Penetrating kicks - Heeney, Cunningham, Florent (on his good days), Campbell, Errol, Blakey, Buddy, Rampe

Placement kicks - Heeney, Rowbottom, Errol, McInerney, Hewett, Dawson

Heeney & Errol generally the only two who I think can do both fairly evenly.

The above is just how I see it anyway.

Fair summation but there is no Stuey Maxfields amongst them. That was penetrating.

 

[caesar88]

Dude that kick Campbell did in I think the Richmond game where he split 2 Richmond players to hit the Swans player low at like 65m from goal was something else

Yeah I heard from mates lucky enough to catch him live earlier this year that the sound as the ball leaves his boot is on another level. "Like he kicked it into a subwoofer" was the analogy one of them used. He'll be different from Dawson, but hopefully every bit as effective.

 

[Swansujelly]

If Ladhams chucked in $100k of his own money just WOW! Not sure the deal but it'll get done.

yeah, I found that interesting. WIll forgoe the last year of his contract. He really wants to be a Swan