1/3 mark

[Adam H]

The league are not going to do it, it would bring into strong doubt their support of the Independence of the Tribunal, if it is going to happen it would have had to come from the club. I know it is a Catch 22. I am also not sure of the time-frame for the appeal to be lodged, probably well past time

Then they will have to deal with the critisism that come's there way. The only way to have this matter cleaned up is to have it heard by truely independent tribunal member's.

 

[sportguru]

Then they will have to deal with the critisism that come's there way. The only way to have this matter cleaned up is to have it heard by truely independent tribunal member's.

The League appoint Tribunal members at the start of a season, the officers of the League have nothing to do with what happens in a hearing. The actual process is mandated by AFL Vic Country, and is managed by the Chairman of the Tribunal. You seem to have some sort of idea that the League tells the tribunal what to do, and the penalties it expects, that is simply not true. I was not in the hearing so I have no idea what was said, but to insinuate that the league influenced the outcome is just rubbish. I can understand the questioning of the competence of members, but that does not mean they are not independent.

If you look at the process, I am not sure how you justify abuse of the CEO, it was clearly not his call

 

[Oxy_tourche]

We can sit here and ramble on about it as much as we like but the simple fact is that the league does not control the tribunal system, I personally think it's a kangeroo court as well.. Maybe it's some thing they will have to reacess at years end to ensure there is a better system in place.. The only way out of this for mick and warby is too go to the VCFL and fork out the $$. You can bag the league as much as you like but at the end of the day olinda/ Blake Walter put in the investigation, not the league or steve. As I said earlier I really feel for mick on this one but there's not alot you can do unless appealed, to put up that sort of money isn't ideal but if he truly sees his innocence. I think he has been a massive surver of the warby fc and they should put $2500 bond up (witch you get back) and pay the $2500 to get him off.. If your not willing to do it unfortunately he will have to do the time and everyone has to move on.

Just my thoughts!!

 

[Adam H]

The League appoint Tribunal members at the start of a season, the officers of the League have nothing to do with what happens in a hearing. The actual process is mandated by AFL Vic Country, and is managed by the Chairman of the Tribunal. You seem to have some sort of idea that the League tells the tribunal what to do, and the penalties it expects, that is simply not true. I was not in the hearing so I have no idea what was said, but to insinuate that the league influenced the outcome is just rubbish. I can understand the questioning of the competence of members, but that does not mean they are not independent.

If you look at the process, I am not sure how you justify abuse of the CEO, it was clearly not his call

If the VCFL heard the process and what went on they would clear Mick immediatley. I understand the League claim's these tribunal member's are independent until you have been to the tribunal you will see this is clearly not the case.

 

[sportguru]

If the VCFL heard the process and what went on they would clear Mick immediatley. I understand the League claim's these tribunal member's are independent until you have been to the tribunal you will see this is clearly not the case.

Sounding more like Finger the more the discussion proceeds.

A bad result for you from early in the year does not mean that Tribunal is not independent, competence is another issue.

You can say as often as you like that an Appeal would turn it over, either appeal it or move on.

End of topic

 

[Brassferal]

If the VCFL heard the process and what went on they would clear Mick immediatley. I understand the League claim's these tribunal member's are independent until you have been to the tribunal you will see this is clearly not the case.

What about also what has been written.. That "Walker" hip and shouldered the player whilst in the arms of the trainer? Duty of care?

 

[Monniehawk]

I think the Appeal can also be on the grounds that the Tribunal just got it wrong, or that the penalty was manifestly to heavy based on the facts. I understand that all the evidence is reheard, and the appeal board then make a decision. I think the clubs have a pretty good record at getting penalties reduced, and that the vast majority get their bond back.

MIW and sportguru are on track.
The tribunal is an independent body of (generally) luminaries in the local area. They may have got it wrong, but it is unlikely. To slur them, the League and its officers because of innuendo and parochialism is scandalous. More likely, it is a desperate and despicable ploy by some posters. The Tribunal can only adjudicate on the evidence as it is presented, (he said, they said... etc.) decide guilt or innocence, then impose a penalty they see is appropriate to the acts. I guess they were more concerned about interference to an injured player and the penalty reflects that. The first incident may have been accidental, albeit serious, but obviously deemed unnecessary as it was off the play. The second is just plain unforgivable.
There is a good case to reform the fee payable for an appeal. Some strong leagues spend well in advance of $500k on players and the $2-3k is small change. Most leagues are from small communities and the cost is prohibitive. Possibly a sliding scale from major to minor leagues could be looked at.
A legal case may also be brought on the grounds of natural justice. The tribunal has to conform with the laws of the land and clubs are free to consult legal advice
The YVMDFL and VCFL can NOT interfere with the independent tribunal. They have no mandate or legal standing to do so. They MAY lodge an investigation if they feel there is compelling new evidence denied to the hearing or if they are certain there was an abuse of process. It's up to Warby to provide that compelling evidence as the league was not in attendance at either the incidents or the hearing.
Who lodged the report? Was it an umpire, or the club? How was it lodged? It would appear to be an umpire, given the short time frame.

 

[Adam H]

What about also what has been written.. That "Walker" hip and shouldered the player whilst in the arms of the trainer? Duty of care?

False and anyone who suggest's that it did happen was either not there or lying.

 

[RIP Tony S]

I don't think that anyone questions the process and options that are available to them just the cost. This cost is set by AFL Victoria.

Any club can appeal any sentence handed down by the tribunal however for it not to be proved a waste of time new evidence or an issue in the judicial process needs to be present you cant just re hear to the case along the same lines and expect a different result.

Again don't know the details surrounding the Walker report however if Warburton wanted to appeal they would be best to look at the following avenues of appeal.

1. What law / rule he was charged under and the sanctions that are linked to those charges

2. new evidence or evidence not considered in the original verdict.

3. Accept the guilt and appeal that the sentence was excessive based and his previous record was not considered.

 

[Adam H]

Sounding more like Finger the more the discussion proceeds.

A bad result for you from early in the year does not mean that Tribunal is not independent, competence is another issue.

You can say as often as you like that an Appeal would turn it over, either appeal it or move on.

End of topic

Sportguru,

I apolagise if it seem's I'm rambling on but as witness to the event's I can assure you this is a great injustice to a great clubman and supporter of Yarra Valley Football. Such is the character of Mick that he would never allow the club to spend that sort of money on an appeal.

 

[Brassferal]

False and anyone who suggest's that it did happen was either not there or lying.

So did anything happen whilst the player was in the trainers arms? As you are the only witness on here.

 

[Adam H]

So did anything happen whilst the player was in the trainers arms? As you are the only witness on here.

Yes they brushed each other as they walked off nothing more. Do you honestly believe a goal umpire10 meters away would not see a bump to a player walking off?

 

[pterodactyl]

Yes they brushed each other as they walked off nothing more. Do you honestly believe a goal umpire10 meters away would not see a bump to a player walking off?

Adam. On behalf of the majority here, STFU. A league is NEVER going to appeal on your behalf. Get a sponsor to contribute, have a fundraiser for the cash, even better, why don't you get your players to contribute a match payment for the money if you all feel so certain?

 

[Adam H]

Adam H seems to be the only one posting on here that "witnessed" the incident, but unfortunately he holds a lot of bias. You also seem to have a lot of intimate knowledge from inside the hearing, claiming to know exact testimony from each of the witnesses, were you in attendance for the entire thing, actually in the rooms when witnesses were giving evidence? If so, why don't you tell us exactly why the 9 weeks? You must know if it was for 2 separate incidents or not? If they "bumped shoulders when walking off", it takes 2 people to tango. Where is the similar 6 weeks for the other player. I find it hard to believe that extra 6 weeks would be for something trivial, but you seem to be in the know, so tell us.

As for the league appealing on Walker's behalf, that is a ludicrous statement. Where does the league get the money to foot the appeal bill? Other clubs would be furious that some of their affiliation fees are being used to appeal a players charge. It would also show the league is not confident in the tribunal process, it must stand firm in that regard, or fear all clubs saying "why didn't you appeal my player's charge, we felt he was hard done by too and has played X games" etc.

Lastly, the amounts for the appeal must cover the costs required for the proceedings. AFL Vic Country need to pay the people involved, pay for the venue required. If you were to say "ok this appeal holds some merit, they get their bond back", then some amount still needs to go to them to pay for the night. They're not doing it out of the good gracious of their hearts. If the fee is reduced to say $300 as people are suggesting, is that going to benefit them? The only argument I can see here is if the league foots the rest of the bill for appeals that hold merit, since that would somewhat prove the tribunal was a bit of a joke and encourage the league to fix it, so they don't have to foot more appeal bills. But if the appeal is crap, then the club pays it. Not sure I agree with that, but AFL Vic Country need their money from somewhere.

The reason there is not 6 weeks's for the other player as there was nothing in it either way. At quarter time when it was explained to Mick that the collision was a accident only then did he himself think he wasn't the target. Why would you Investigate a accident?

 

[sportguru]

Adam H seems to be the only one posting on here that "witnessed" the incident, but unfortunately he holds a lot of bias. You also seem to have a lot of intimate knowledge from inside the hearing, claiming to know exact testimony from each of the witnesses, were you in attendance for the entire thing, actually in the rooms when witnesses were giving evidence? If so, why don't you tell us exactly why the 9 weeks? You must know if it was for 2 separate incidents or not? If they "bumped shoulders when walking off", it takes 2 people to tango. Where is the similar 6 weeks for the other player. I find it hard to believe that extra 6 weeks would be for something trivial, but you seem to be in the know, so tell us.

As for the league appealing on Walker's behalf, that is a ludicrous statement. Where does the league get the money to foot the appeal bill? Other clubs would be furious that some of their affiliation fees are being used to appeal a players charge. It would also show the league is not confident in the tribunal process, it must stand firm in that regard, or fear all clubs saying "why didn't you appeal my player's charge, we felt he was hard done by too and has played X games" etc.

Lastly, the amounts for the appeal must cover the costs required for the proceedings. AFL Vic Country need to pay the people involved, pay for the venue required. If you were to say "ok this appeal holds some merit, they get their bond back", then some amount still needs to go to them to pay for the night. They're not doing it out of the good gracious of their hearts. If the fee is reduced to say $300 as people are suggesting, is that going to benefit them? The only argument I can see here is if the league foots the rest of the bill for appeals that hold merit, since that would somewhat prove the tribunal was a bit of a joke and encourage the league to fix it, so they don't have to foot more appeal bills. But if the appeal is crap, then the club pays it. Not sure I agree with that, but AFL Vic Country need their money from somewhere.

Each club in our league pay something like $6,000 affiliation fee to AFL Vic Country each year. I think they have a duty to provide a reasonably priced appeals process as part of the checks and balances required to provide the players with some certainly that there is a fair system in place, and that obvious inconsistencies can be resolved. Keep the bond high for the bulls%#t appeals to help pay for the valid ones. Appeal process is to important to cost it out of the reach of the average club.

I should add this is not a comment on the Walker incident, more the big picture of what should be in place.

 

[Rufee Ralph]

Adam seriously your like the proverbial dog with the proverbial bone, under no circumstance are the league going to appeal and nor should they. If you and the club are so enraged by this pony up with the cash. Your bleating on here is bordering on hysterical. Either appeal it or move on.

 

[Adam H]

Adam seriously your like the proverbial dog with the proverbial bone, under no circumstance are the league going to appeal and nor should they. If you and the club are so enraged by this pony up with the cash. Your bleating on here is bordering on hysterical. Either appeal it or move on.

That's their choice of course but at the moment they are open to all the critisism that come's their way.

 

[footysnumberone]

Criticism is one thing, but slandering (Which is what most of the warburton supporters are doing) is completely different.
You need to let it go. You're making a full of yourself adam h.
To late to appeal now and i can't believe you would actually think that the league would appeal its own tribunal?! Foolishness at its finest!

 

[Adam H]

Criticism is one thing, but slandering (Which is what most of the warburton supporters are doing) is completely different.
You need to let it go. You're making a full of yourself adam h.
To late to appeal now and i can't believe you would actually think that the league would appeal its own tribunal?! Foolishness at its finest!

Slandering??? Please, stop it. What has happened to Mick Walker is far worse than anything that's been posted on social media toward's the League. His reputation has been tarnished for something he simply wasn't guilty of yet of course that's fine.

 

[Rufee Ralph]

Slandering??? Please, stop it. What has happened to Mick Walker is far worse than anything that's been posted on social media toward's the League. His reputation has been tarnished for something he simply wasn't guilty of yet of course that's fine.

Well mick is a big boy and I'm sure can stand up for himself. If he is as aggrieved as you are blabbering about I can't see why the club wouldn't do everything within its powers to see 'justice' done. Clearly they don't see sufficient grounds for appeal so case closed. The continual argument is becoming boring.

 

[Cheap Whine]

Boring!

 

[Broken Bone]

Well this is as boring as bat sh!t. I am almost as sick of hearing about Walker as i am Essendon. Am i wrong in thinking that finals started on the weekend? Yarra Junction out, Powelly move on to play Seville and Yarra Glen now take on Healesville. From the quality of the games i saw on the weekend it is Healesville's to lose. If Jones is out as suggested would make it very tough for Seville. However they do have a young bloke by the name of O'Keefe who surley could just rip apart a game at some stage. Seriously the quality of this player he should be un stoppable every week. My opinion is the only danger to Healesville sits on the shoulders of O'Keefe.

 

[Zipo]

What about also what has been written.. That "Walker" hip and shouldered the player whilst in the arms of the trainer? Duty of care?

Please expand your duty of care argument

 

[jmac12]

Just imagine we talked footy on this footy forum

Reading this crap is about as exciting as reading the herald
Sun the last 8 months...
Boring as batshit. How bout we discuss finals footy?
Bombers would be thrilled to make the 5
Worri slipped late and cost themselves the dbl chance losing to monbulk
Belgrave would fancy themselves against wandin after beating them three times this yr
Wandins fowlkes bags a tonne in a stellar performance
Upwey is the week rest what they need...

Please someone talk actual footy because this investigation shit is a beaten story

 

[sportguru]

Just imagine we talked footy on this footy forum

Reading this crap is about as exciting as reading the herald
Sun the last 8 months...
Boring as batshit. How bout we discuss finals footy?
Bombers would be thrilled to make the 5
Worri slipped late and cost themselves the dbl chance losing to monbulk
Belgrave would fancy themselves against wandin after beating them three times this yr
Wandins fowlkes bags a tonne in a stellar performance
Upwey is the week rest what they need...

Please someone talk actual footy because this investigation shit is a beaten story

I am sure Upwey would be rapt to get weeks break, allows some of their best players to get over some niggles they have carried in the last few weeks.

Interesting to see if Belgrave can beat Wandin on a bigger ground, both the games this season played on their small grounds - do Belgrave have the run to keep up on a bigger ground. If Mitch Collins is out would certainly tip it in favour of Wandin.

Woori form has been average in last two weeks, is it because they played quality opposition or are they of the boil, great opportunity for Emerald to progress (although I will not write of Woori just yet)