Past #1: Jack Mahony - drafted w #34 in '17 ND - delisted end '23 - 40 NM games/17 NM goals - thx Mahns

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the Ziebull said:
I could tell anyone to just pressure as a priority and they would do just as good if not a better job

thing is other players main focus is not just that it’s actually getting the ball and if you can’t get the ball then pressure not the other way around
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I genuinely think you're wrong in thinking that nearly any and every player is capable of playing a pressure based game style. Whether it be their mentality, their physicality, their endurance, their ability to give repeat efforts, their ability to cleanly take a hit, or keep/regain their feet etc etc. There are a lot of barriers to doing it successfully.

I also think you're a bit hung up on the 'main focus' bit too, tbh. 12 disposal average in the positions he plays is perfectly fine for a 19 year old, and doesn't indicate that his pressure game particularly takes away from his ability to find the ball. And once he has the ball he's not too shabby with it either, being 7th among rising star players for goal assists per game.

Yeah his kicking lacks depth but personally that's about the only truly valid knock on him I see.
 
Psicosis said:
Wow… you really don’t understand the sport, do you?

If I view your posting as someone that has never played at any level, your posting actually begins to make sense.
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he's too busy looking at every single player who's in a contract year and speculating about them coming to us through free agency, he doesn't have time to watch footy
 

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At this point you have to ask, is he trolling? Surely someone can’t be this ignorant surely
 
Devington said:
I genuinely think you're wrong in thinking that nearly any and every player is capable of playing a pressure based game style. Whether it be their mentality, their physicality, their endurance, their ability to give repeat efforts, their ability to cleanly take a hit, or keep/regain their feet etc etc. There are a lot of barriers to doing it successfully.

I also think you're a bit hung up on the 'main focus' bit too, tbh. 12 disposal average in the positions he plays is perfectly fine for a 19 year old, and doesn't indicate that his pressure game particularly takes away from his ability to find the ball. And once he has the ball he's not too shabby with it either, being 7th among rising star players for goal assists per game.

Yeah his kicking lacks depth but personally that's about the only truly valid knock on him I see.
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Oh, and before you try to counter with turnovers/disposal effective I'll point out that I'm not at all concerned with it considering how absurdly weighted his ranking is due to a bad start to the year. He's had the same total number of turnovers in his last seven games as he did in the first TWO for the year.
 
So I value all those on here defending Jack, his role and his contribution, but sometimes we distract ourselves over differences of opinion that aren't easily shifted, and forget to observe little signposts or milestones that indicate a player's development. One of the biggest knocks on Mahony has been the lack of penetration in his kicking ("can't kick 30 metres, etc etc"). So in that regard, I thought his conversion from a set shot at 46-48 metres on the weekend was very noteworthy, and it was also distinctly noticeable that no-one circled around him to take a hand off, as if the team was collectively saying, okay, young fella, time to step up - and he did.

Kudos - hope he's back soon
 
Psicosis said:
The kicker is that Jack has both grunt and class. His field kicking is exceptional for a second year player that regularly gets 20+ pressure acts.
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Came here to post exactly this. Simply calling him a pressure player undersells his football talents. He's such a neat kick of the footy and nearly always makes good decisions. And at 19 too. He's a really promising little player.

However, emphasis on little. I think his size, associated lack of kicking depth, and, regardless of what the GPS stats say, lack of real pace leaves me with what I think are valid questions about where exactly his ceiling is at the AFL level. Like I think he's definitely a good player in our current side and he should have a good career. I'm just not sure what that looks like when he's 25/26, if that makes sense.
 
Merlin007 said:
So I value all those on here defending Jack, his role and his contribution, but sometimes we distract ourselves over differences of opinion that aren't easily shifted, and forget to observe little signposts or milestones that indicate a player's development. One of the biggest knocks on Mahony has been the lack of penetration in his kicking ("can't kick 30 metres, etc etc"). So in that regard, I thought his conversion from a set shot at 46-48 metres on the weekend was very noteworthy, and it was also distinctly noticeable that no-one circled around him to take a hand off, as if the team was collectively saying, okay, young fella, time to step up - and he did.

Kudos - hope he's back soon
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Agreed, almost like young players can improve with coaching and experience.
 
Ligma said:
At this point you have to ask, is he trolling? Surely someone can’t be this ignorant surely
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Well he’s either doing a ten year apprentice or ignorant

AnEmptyChair said:
Came here to post exactly this. Simply calling him a pressure player undersells his football talents. He's such a neat kick of the footy and nearly always makes good decisions. And at 19 too. He's a really promising little player.

However, emphasis on little. I think his size, associated lack of kicking depth, and, regardless of what the GPS stats say, lack of real pace leaves me with what I think are valid questions about where exactly his ceiling is at the AFL level. Like I think he's definitely a good player in our current side and he should have a good career. I'm just not sure what that looks like when he's 25/26, if that makes sense.
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Stevo and Simmo started off as taggers/run with players - if bf was around in the early 90s there’d be a fair few bad takes.
Pickett after one game in his first year - premiership player capuano would of copped it.
 
shinboner magic said:
Well he’s either doing a ten year apprentice or ignorant



Stevo and Simmo started off as taggers/run with players - if bf was around in the early 90s there’d be a fair few bad takes.
Pickett after one game in his first year - premiership player capuano would of copped it.
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Mate, I'm not having a crack. As I said, I really like him and think of him as more than a simple pressure player. It's just that I'm unsure of his ceiling atm.
 
Frank Thring said:
To be fair, your main skill is harassing the rest of this board
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Look, I don’t want to pile on but this is pretty accurate


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Devington said:
I disagree with tZ's stubborn attitude towards things, but he's very civil considering how often he gets directly called out.
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its amusing when people react personally to an opinion

i could go low blow for low blow but whats the point.

in the end we all want whats best for north and I strongly believe mahony is not good enough the same way I thought about macmillan, gibson etc. I am strong on fringe players that I don't rate. They are the types of plodders that mediocre teams have

Mahony would not get a game at most teams, if others disagree thats on them
 
the Ziebull said:
its amusing when people react personally to an opinion

i could go low blow for low blow but whats the point.

in the end we all want whats best for north and I strongly believe mahony is not good enough the same way I thought about macmillan, gibson etc. I am strong on fringe players that I don't rate. They are the types of plodders that mediocre teams have

Mahony would not get a game at most teams, if others disagree thats on them
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How do you feel about Liam Anthony?
 
the Ziebull said:
its amusing when people react personally to an opinion

i could go low blow for low blow but whats the point.

in the end we all want whats best for north and I strongly believe mahony is not good enough the same way I thought about macmillan, gibson etc. I am strong on fringe players that I don't rate. They are the types of plodders that mediocre teams have

Mahony would not get a game at most teams, if others disagree thats on them
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Mate, guys like Aarts and Castagna and Baker (as a forward), and Dalhaus and Miers, and McNeil and Garcia, Spargo and Neal-Bullen all get games on good teams. Mahony isn't a million miles away from most of them. In fact, at least statistically he outstrips most of the players his age. For rising stars, Jack's ranked 6th in total tackles, 2nd in total tackles inside 50, 2nd for goal assists, 7th for contested possessions, 6th for marks inside 50.
 
AnEmptyChair said:
Mate, guys like Aarts and Castagna and Baker (as a forward), and Dalhaus and Miers, and McNeil and Garcia, Spargo and Neal-Bullen all get games on good teams. Mahony isn't a million miles away from most of them. In fact, at least statistically he outstrips most of the players his age. For rising stars, Jack's ranked 6th in total tackles, 2nd in total tackles inside 50, 2nd for goal assists, 7th for contested possessions, 6th for marks inside 50.
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And tbh he's got those totals and averages while playing in the worst team in the comp all year and flirting with being dropped in the first half dozen games when his form wasn't near where it is now. He's done well to turn his form around, specifically his effectiveness with the ball in hand, to build into what I would consider a fairly impressive year for a second year player playing under these conditions.
 
AnEmptyChair said:
Mate, guys like Aarts and Castagna and Baker (as a forward), and Dalhaus and Miers, and McNeil and Garcia, Spargo and Neal-Bullen all get games on good teams. Mahony isn't a million miles away from most of them. In fact, at least statistically he outstrips most of the players his age. For rising stars, Jack's ranked 6th in total tackles, 2nd in total tackles inside 50, 2nd for goal assists, 7th for contested possessions, 6th for marks inside 50.
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CF556013-33F2-46AB-A2BB-761A1E3CE614.jpeg
Mahony is no slouch
 
the Ziebull said:
its amusing when people react personally to an opinion

i could go low blow for low blow but whats the point.

in the end we all want whats best for north and I strongly believe mahony is not good enough the same way I thought about macmillan, gibson etc. I am strong on fringe players that I don't rate. They are the types of plodders that mediocre teams have

Mahony would not get a game at most teams, if others disagree thats on them
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Fair enough. And we all know that. Take it as accepted and noted. Thanks.
The frustrating thing is you are very singular in that view, post it incessantly in multiple threads and hold dogmatically to your opinion even when new facts or evidence come to light that are contrary to the initial viewpoint you’ve taken.
Eventually, it becomes repetitive, boring and brings down the vibe of the Board when you constantly repeat that opinion when not relevant.
It’s not personal. Just really f’ing annoying and boring.
 
king of the road said:
Fair enough. And we all know that. Take it as accepted and noted. Thanks.
The frustrating thing is you are very singular in that view, post it incessantly in multiple threads and hold dogmatically to your opinion even when new facts or evidence come to light that are contrary to the initial viewpoint you’ve taken.
Eventually, it becomes repetitive, boring and brings down the vibe of the Board when you constantly repeat that opinion when not relevant.
It’s not personal. Just really f’ing annoying and boring.
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Hear hear.

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