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And given your selective use of a single statistic D, you have no place calling someone else mathematically incompetent.

And given that you didn't know the statistical test for outliers until a few hours ago, I'd reckon you need to know what you are talking about before making accusations.
 
Mattrox said:
The definiton of an outlier is a) a point that lies outside Median + 1.5xIQR or Median - 1.5xIQR
b) Q1 + 1.5xIQR or Q3 - 1.5xIQR

Due to a small sample size I chose definition a).

the 1.5 is in the definiton
IQR = Upper Quartile - Lower Quartile

The Value 46893 is the upper boundary using definition a) and therefore the Collingwood game is not an outlier under this definiton.

In any case the GWS factor is dragging the average down. This was not a factor in previous years.
Click to expand...

Shall we try median +/- 1.5*IQR

Here are the 8 games and there crowds in order.

28261
33780
34021
35535
36394
40714
41649
44238

Median: (35535 + 36394)/2 = 35964.5

Let's use method 2 first.

Method 2.
Lower quartile (xL): 33780 +( 34021 - 33780)/4 = 33840.25
Upper quartile (xU): 41649 - (41649 - 40714)/4 = 41415.25

IQR = 41415.25 - 33840.25 = 7575
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7575 = 11362.5

Lower Outlier: Median – 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 - 11362.5 = 24602
Upper Outlier: Median + 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 + 11362.5 = 47327

It looks like there are no outliers there.

Method 1.
Lower quartile (xL): (33780 + 34021)/2 = 33900.5
Upper quartile (xU): (40714 + 41649)/2 = 41181.5

IQR = 41181.5 - 33900.5 = 7281
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7281 = 10921.5

Lower Outlier: Median – 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 - 10921.5 = 25043
Upper Outlier: Median + 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 + 10921.5 = 46886

I am starting to understand why you wouldn't show me the derivation of your values. It's because using both methods the GWS game is not an an outlier and it would expose you as the lying sack of shit you are. :rolleyes:
 

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Mattrox said:
Um no, both methods are valid. Just because your degree in Mathematics took 2hrs to complete by using wikipedia..... and you lack the understanding to utilise the best measure.

You are wrong.

Your response indicates you are being told something you don't want to hear.
Click to expand...

Squirm you lying sack of shit.

Laughing_hard.gif
 
Elite Crow said:
Can you go read the OP, this thread is about Ports shit crowds. So who do you blame?
Click to expand...

I blame the same people responsible for the fact that the Kamry Krows Korp are averaging their third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4.

So who do you blame for the fact that you are averaging your third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4?

C'mon coward answer the question.
 
D_One said:
There are two methods available

Here are the 8 games and their crowds in order.

28261
33780
34021
35535
36394
40714
41649
44238

Median: (35535 + 36394)/2 = 35964.5

Method 1.
Lower quartile (xL): (33780 + 34021)/2 = 33900.5
Upper quartile (xU): (40714 + 41649)/2 = 41181.5

IQR = 41181.5 - 33900.5 = 7281
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7281 = 10921.5

Lower Outlier: Q1 – 1.5*IQR = 33900.5 - 10921.5 = 22979
Upper Outlier: Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 41181.5 + 10921.5 = 52103

I don't know why you're excluding the GWS crowd based on that.

Method 2.
Lower quartile (xL): 33780 +( 34021 - 33780)/4 = 33840.25
Upper quartile (xU): 41649 - (41649 - 40714)/4 = 41415.25

IQR = 41415.25 - 33840.25 = 7575
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7575 = 11362.5

Lower Outlier: Q1 – 1.5*IQR = 33840.25 - 11362.5 = 22477.75
Upper Outlier: Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 41415.25 + 11362.5 = 52777.75

Once again I don't know why you're excluding the GWS crowd based on that.

So are you mathematically incompetent or are you just a lying sack of shit?

It's one or the other.
Click to expand...

D_One said:
Shall we try median +/- 1.5*IQR

Here are the 8 games and there crowds in order.

28261
33780
34021
35535
36394
40714
41649
44238

Median: (35535 + 36394)/2 = 35964.5

Let's use method 2 first.

Method 2.
Lower quartile (xL): 33780 +( 34021 - 33780)/4 = 33840.25
Upper quartile (xU): 41649 - (41649 - 40714)/4 = 41415.25

IQR = 41415.25 - 33840.25 = 7575
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7575 = 11362.5

Lower Outlier: Median – 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 - 11362.5 = 24602
Upper Outlier: Median + 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 + 11362.5 = 47327

It looks like there are no outliers there.

Method 1.
Lower quartile (xL): (33780 + 34021)/2 = 33900.5
Upper quartile (xU): (40714 + 41649)/2 = 41181.5

IQR = 41181.5 - 33900.5 = 7281
1.5 * IQR = 1.5 * 7281 = 10921.5

Lower Outlier: Median – 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 - 10921.5 = 25043
Upper Outlier: Median + 1.5*IQR = 35964.5 + 10921.5 = 46886

I am starting to understand why you wouldn't show me the derivation of your values. It's because using both methods the GWS game is not an an outlier and it would expose you as the lying sack of shit you are. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Now where did Mattrox go??
 
That's not answering the question. Is it the SANFL or Port's shit side? Here's a hint, our crowds are up from the last two years, yours are down. Here is another clue, when the crowd boos and abuses your players, it's not the administrators sitting in the stands they are unhappy with.

So is it the SANFL or the Powers shit side? C'mon you can say it.
 
Elite Crow said:
That's not answering the question. Is it the SANFL or Port's shit side? Here's a hint, our crowds are up from the last two years, yours are down. Here is another clue, when the crowd boos and abuses your players, it's not the administrators sitting in the stands they are unhappy with.

So is it the SANFL or the Powers shit side? C'mon you can say it.
Click to expand...

Now you're squirming.

I answered. I blame the same people responsible for the fact that the Kamry Krows Korp are averaging their third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4. Your crowds are about 5000 lower than the other 4 times you finished top 4.

So who do you blame for the fact that you are averaging your third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4?

C'mon coward answer the question.
 

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D_One said:
Squirm you lying sack of shit.
Click to expand...
I'm not squirming....... The GWS figure is an anomoly as an expansion club. Your home figues do not include an expansion team so I am comparing like against like. The GWS figure distorts the mean and is also not comparable to years where there were no expansion clubs.

If you be patient and not start with your wild accusations and let me finish I'll explain. Since the actual value for GWS does not lie outside method a) there is no need to calculate method b). But to set the value aside to check all other games at AAMI for the Crows is entirely valid. Without the expansion club, which didn't exist in 2008 and 2009, it is valid to compare this years home games minus GWS with the average of those years. Having done that we find that the match attendences on the whole are quite good and on par with 2008. We have Essendon at home this week, which is likely to boost our average futher anyway, so at the end of the season we will have a true picture. I'm not suggesting removing the figure for good, but for analysis purposes which is valid. Especially when comparing to "non-expansion club years".

For your 9 home games

median = 19032
Q1 = 15963
Q3 = 22962
IQR = 6999

Med + 1.5*IQR = 29530
Med - 1.5*IQR= 8533

However your max attendence is 34829 at the Showdown.
So to double check with the wider measure for outlier Q3+1.5*IQR = 33461, still an outlier. But rather than exclude it from your average because it would be embarrassing if we recalculated the average, we'll keep it and put down the anomoly to the "Showdown phenomenon" of Port fans hoping to see Crows lose. The frighteneing part for you guys is that an attendence of 8.5K would not be a suprising figure statistically given your current figures.


But to answer your question about "Why is the average the 3rd lowest?" It is because the GWS game which rightly attracted less interest. You insist on comparing figues from GWS's 1st year to figures where there is no expansion club, therefore to more accurately compete the analysis a mean was calculated without the figure.

I think that satisfactorily answers your question.

I have a whole bunch of questions, but I'll hold them for after the AFL compulsorily acquires your AFL licence and moves you to Tas or ACT or renames you the Southern Sharks.
 
Crows crowds are irrelevant to this debate.

They are still at a sustainable level and it appears our club is going into the move to Adelaide Oval on an upward swing.

Port are going down, like Coles. With little sign of the club having any optimism for its move to Adelaide Oval.

Afterall, win 6-9 games next year playing the crap we saw on the weekend, a change in scenery wont drag all those latent Power "supporters" to a new stadium.
 
D_One said:
Now you're squirming.

I answered. I blame the same people responsible for the fact that the Kamry Krows Korp are averaging their third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4. Your crowds are about 5000 lower than the other 4 times you finished top 4.

So who do you blame for the fact that you are averaging your third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4?

C'mon coward answer the question.
Click to expand...

You are truely acting like a ****-****. Our crowds are not 5000 lower that other top 4 years. GWS did not exist in those years, nor did any other 1st year expansion club. Looking at each home game the actual figures in a like for like match are much of a much-ness.

2009
2009.jpg


2012
2012.jpg
 
D_One said:
Now you're squirming.

I answered. I blame the same people responsible for the fact that the Kamry Krows Korp are averaging their third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4. Your crowds are about 5000 lower than the other 4 times you finished top 4.

So who do you blame for the fact that you are averaging your third lowest crowd in 21 seasons despite being in the top 4?

C'mon coward answer the question.
Click to expand...
I have nothing to squirm about. Our crowds are up on the last two years, which is consistent with an improving side. They may not be to the same level as they were when were last in the top 4 but the world as changed a lot. There is live or near live, there is Foxtel and there is a major economic downturn at the moment. I don't blame the SANFL. Besides our crowds are still healthy, we are currently averaging the 6th best crowd in the comp. Our last game had over 40k supporters.

Now there is no defending 14k, when you were in your 3 game winning streak your crowds were in the 20k's, but as your season has gone down the toilet again so have your crowds. This was your second lowest crowd. Your fans boo your style of play and abuse your players and some fall asleep. Stop being a pathetic sod and man up, your crowds are pathetic because your team is pathetic.
 
Mattrox said:
You are truely acting like a ****-****. Our crowds are not 5000 lower that other top 4 years. GWS did not exist in those years, nor did any other 1st year expansion club. Looking at each home game the actual figures in a like for like match are much of a much-ness.

2009
2009.jpg


2012
2012.jpg
Click to expand...

Years you finished top 4 and your average crowds
1997 - 40173.18
2002 - 43068.36
2005 - 42341.00
2006 - 42454.73
2012 - 36824.00 *

yep about 5000.

* yet to finish top 4
 
Mattrox said:
I'm not squirming....... The GWS figure is an anomoly as an expansion club. Your home figues do not include an expansion team so I am comparing like against like. The GWS figure distorts the mean and is also not comparable to years where there were no expansion clubs.

Wank Wank Wank

Deflection Deflection Deflection
Click to expand...

You said your GWS crowd is an outlier using the 1.5 * IQR technique.

You have ben exposed as a lying sack of shit and you are squirming like buggery now.
 

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Elite Crow said:
I have nothing to squirm about. Our crowds are up on the last two years, which is consistent with an improving side. They may not be to the same level as they were when were last in the top 4 but the world as changed a lot. There is live or near live, there is Foxtel and there is a major economic downturn at the moment. I don't blame the SANFL. Besides our crowds are still healthy, we are currently averaging the 6th best crowd in the comp. Our last game had over 40k supporters.

Now there is no defending 14k, when you were in your 3 game winning streak your crowds were in the 20k's, but as your season has gone down the toilet again so have your crowds. This was your second lowest crowd. Your fans boo your style of play and abuse your players and some fall asleep. Stop being a pathetic sod and man up, your crowds are pathetic because your team is pathetic.
Click to expand...

Remember that the GWS figure distorts the average compared to 2008 & 2009, and thus far we are on par with 2009 and just short of 2008.

Last year we had 2 in total and the Sydney game was only 23K. This game alone pulled our figures down. Likewise in 2010 we only had 2 40+K home games with WBD, Rich, and Bris 29K, 31K and 31K respectively.

This year we have already had 3 40K+ games. Our lowest game this year was GWS with 28K, and this is better than last years lowest game by 5000. It will be interesting to see how many GC draws in round 23. The down side of a soft draw is poor home game attendence. Double edge sword.

In reality if we are to have a serious discussion about Crows attendances it is better done away from the Bay because D_luded's question has been answered, yet he keeps asking it.


Back on track. Instead of asking us why our overall average hasn't risen, he'd be better off getting behind his club and getting people to their own home games. Clubs attracting less than 20K to home games on a consistent basis need to fix this asap as they are a drain on the rest of the comp. due to subsidies.
 

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