Discussion 1981 and the "forgotten drafts"

The_Wookie

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The countdown continues with 81 days to go on the clock, and I figured that since Im making this an educational experience we'd look at the very first drafts in 1981 and 1982. (although right up until mere minutes ago I was going to do this about Fitzpatrick getting pinged for timewasting)

Taken entirely from Footystats -

The forgotten drafts, 1981, 1982
They are noted in our Chronology and in the Victorian Football League Annual Reports of the time but elsewhere the drafts which were held by the VFL in 1981 and 1982 are almost never referred to, and for all purposes never took place, but they did and several players from other competitions took the opportunities presented to them as described below.

Each season when the League publishes its "Season Guide" more than 150 pages are devoted to all details of the drafts held beginning in 1986.

However ...

Page 29 of the VFL Annual Report of season 1981 records that in November, 1980, the VFL Board of Directors resolved to adopt a totally new approach to the recruitment of interstate players. The Permit Regulations of the League were amended to provide that, in future, players could only be registered with VFL Clubs through being drafted at an Interstate Selection meeting.

Previously, players were registered on Form 4's and clubs vied with each other for the signatures of the outstanding players from interstate clubs.

In accordance with the regulations of the "draft", the club which finishes at the 12th position has first choice at the Selection Meeting. The Premiership team has 12th choice. This procedure is then repeated with the 12th club on the ladder having 13th choice, and the Premiers, 24th.

The history-making first Interstate draft took place at VFL House (82 Jolimont Road, Jolimont) on Tuesday, 8th October, 1981 with the following players being selected by the clubs –

1. Melbourne, Alan Johnson (Perth, W.A.)
2. Footscray, Neil Craig (Sturt, S.A.)
3. St Kilda, Grant Campbell (East Perth, W.A.)
4. South Melbourne, Mark Naley (South Adelaide, S.A.)
5. North Melbourne, Craig Holden (Swan Districts, W.A.)
6. Richmond, Peter Hofner (Port Adelaide, S.A.)
7. Hawthorn, Ken Judge (East Fremantle, W.A.)
8. Essendon, Wayne Otway (East Perth, W.A.)
9. Fitzroy, Dean Turner (East Perth, W.A.)
10. Geelong, Tony McGuinness (Glenelg, S.A.)
11. Collingwood, Chris Carpenter (Launceston, Tas.)
12. Carlton, Ross Ditchburn (Claremont, W.A.)
13. Melbourne, Danny Hughes (Port Adelaide, S.A.)
14. Footscray, Trevor Klisby (North Adelaide, S.A.)
15. St Kilda, Geoff Linke (South Adelaide, S.A.)
16. South Melbourne, Phil Brooksby (South Adelaide, S.A.)
17. North Melbourne, Tom Warhurst (Norwood, S.A.)
18. Richmond, David Tiller (North Adelaide, S.A.)
19. Hawthorn, John Platten (Central District, S.A.)
20. Essendon, Stephen Copping (Glenelg, S.A.)
21. Fitzroy, Chris McDermott (Glenelg, S.A.)
22. Geelong, Greg McAdam (North Adelaide, S.A.)
23. Collingwood, Scott Knight (Launceston, Tas.)
24. Carlton, Chris Velde (Glenelg, S.A.)


Interstate Draft 1982

The second Interstate Selection (draft) meeting was held at VFL House (120 Jolimont Road, Jolimont) on the 19th October, 1982.

The League, attempting to make the competition more even, replaced the Form 4 method of Interstate recruitment, in which clubs vied for outstanding players, with the draft system in November 1980. The first meeting was held in October, 1981.

The club finishing in 12th position has first and thirteenth choice at the selection meeting. The Premiership team has 12th and 24th choice.

Players chosen in the initial draft who played VFL football in 1982 include Alan Johnson (Melbourne), Wayne Otway and Stephen Copping (Essendon) and Geoff Linke (St Kilda).

Copping, from Glenelg, S.A., was only 20th choice but had a particularly successful season.

Ross Ditchburn (Claremont, W.A.) played in Carlton's 1982 Premiership team.

The following players were selected by clubs for the 1983 season:-

1. Footscray, Andrew Purser (East Fremantle, W.A.)
2. St Kilda, Alan Sidebottom (Swan Districts, W.A.)
3. Collingwood, Gary Shaw (Claremont, W.A.)
4. Geelong, Baden Harper (Claremont, W.A.)
5. Melbourne, Keith Thomas (Norwood, S.A.)
6. Swans, Peter Motley (Sturt, S.A.)
7. Fitzroy, Bill Lokam (North Adelaide, S.A.)
8. Essendon, Brenton Phillips (North Adelaide, S.A.)
9. North Melbourne, Richard Cousins (Central District, S.A.)
10. Hawthorn, Rod Lester-Smith (East Fremantle, W.A.)
11. Richmond, David Palm (West Perth, W.A.)
12. Carlton, John Simpson, Woodville, S.A.)
13. Footscray, Peter Walker (East Launceston, Tas.)
14. St Kilda, David Grant (City South Under 16's, Tas.)
15. Collingwood, Carl Herbert (Mayne, Qld.)
16. Geelong, Brad Hardie (South Fremantle, W.A.)
17. Melbourne, Ray Holden (West Perth, W.A.)
18. Swans, Greg Anderson (Port Adelaide, S.A.)
19. Fitzroy, Grant Fielke (West Adelaide, S.A.)
20. Essendon, Anthony Antrobus (North Adelaide, S.A.)
21. North Melbourne, Gary Macintosh (Norwood, S.A.)
22. Hawthorn, Greg Hodson (West Torrens, S.A.)
23. Richmond, Mark Howsley (Kedron, Qld.)
24. Carlton, Chris Gray (Swansea, Tas.)
 
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pazza

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Both lists show how many clubs got it right with their selections...but the question remains about certain players not going to where they had been drafted in the first place.

Imagine had Hardie and McGuiness both being in the Geelong team instead of ending up at Footscray for example.
 

Herne Hill Hammer

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Both lists show how many clubs got it right with their selections...but the question remains about certain players not going to where they had been drafted in the first place.

Imagine had Hardie and McGuiness both being in the Geelong team instead of ending up at Footscray for example.
Jeez, Hawthorn did alright, Platten, Lester-Smith and Judge.

I spoke with McGuiness a few years back, he was going to go to Geelong but Goggin didn't want him.
 

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little graham

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More evidence of how superior the SANFL was to every other football league, before corporate media bankrolled inept VFl crooks.
 

cammo78

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Both lists show how many clubs got it right with their selections...but the question remains about certain players not going to where they had been drafted in the first place.

Imagine had Hardie and McGuiness both being in the Geelong team instead of ending up at Footscray for example.
Any idea how this came to be? Did they become free agents again if they didn't come immediately?

Interesting that Neil Craig could have been a Bulldog.
 

Howard Littlejohn

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Seriously, someone was drafted directly from Swansea????
There were three main leagues in Tassie at the time, far too many for such a small place, and Swansea was not playing in any of those.
 

The_Wookie

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Seriously, someone was drafted directly from Swansea????
There were three main leagues in Tassie at the time, far too many for such a small place, and Swansea was not playing in any of those.
Those early drafts were loaded with people taken from obscure teams in country areas, in part because metro players in SA in particular but also elsewhere would nominate for the draft and then just not show up.
 

35Daicos

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Seriously, someone was drafted directly from Swansea????
There were three main leagues in Tassie at the time, far too many for such a small place, and Swansea was not playing in any of those.
http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=34396&start=0

There's a video about this chap here^ that you might find interesting. He was registered with Sandy Bay, though playing with Swansea, maybe that's what allowed him to be drafted.

The_Wookie you obviously post a bit on that forum. There's discussion there about a Chris Velde (it's shown that way here as well), the correct last name is Veide.
 
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walhawk

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Most of those players never came over when they were 'drafted'.
Platten took four year to get to Hawthorn. Agreed to terms with Carlton in between.
 

35Daicos

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Those early drafts were loaded with people taken from obscure teams in country areas, in part because metro players in SA in particular but also elsewhere would nominate for the draft and then just not show up.
That certainly applies to the draft from 1986 onwards, especially in it's early years, but in the 1981-82 drafts pretty much everyone looks to have come from "main leagues" outside of the VFL. I'd like to find more information somewhere about what the exact rules were, such as how long players were tied to the club that drafted them.

Great to see the "forgotten drafts" get a mention anywhere these days, so thanks a lot for bringing the topic up. I'd say a very large proportion of fans are unaware any of this took place. For a long time I had the idea that hardly anyone actually went to the club that drafted them (I was probably influenced by the Garry McIntosh story!), and that it was a total flop, yet there were obviously quite a few success stories.

I find it annoying when even respected journalists like Emma Quayle talk about the draft commencing in 1986, with no mention of the two earlier drafts, and as Kevin Taylor (Footystats) points out, the AFL also act like none of this ever happened. (I'm pretty sure) there was nothing said about State of Origin games in the AFL Record Season Guide for many years, yet it's made a comeback in recent editions. I'm hoping the details from the "forgotten drafts" will show up there too one of these days.
 

The_Wookie

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That certainly applies to the draft from 1986 onwards, especially in it's early years, but in the 1981-82 drafts pretty much everyone looks to have come from "main leagues" outside of the VFL. I'd like to find more information somewhere about what the exact rules were, such as how long players were tied to the club that drafted them.

Great to see the "forgotten drafts" get a mention anywhere these days, so thanks a lot for bringing the topic up. I'd say a very large proportion of fans are unaware any of this took place. For a long time I had the idea that hardly anyone actually went to the club that drafted them (I was probably influenced by the Garry McIntosh story!), and that it was a total flop, yet there were obviously quite a few success stories.

I find it annoying when even respected journalists like Emma Quayle talk about the draft commencing in 1986, with no mention of the two earlier drafts, and as Kevin Taylor (Footystats) points out, the AFL also act like none of this ever happened. (I'm pretty sure) there was nothing said about State of Origin games in the AFL Record Season Guide for many years, yet it's made a comeback in recent editions. I'm hoping the details from the "forgotten drafts" will show up there too one of these days.
These articles were on trove for 1981 and 1982



Whats interesting about the 1982 one is the apparent deal between the VFL and WAFL to limit recruits and no mention of a similar deal for SA.

 

35Daicos

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Really interesting to see from the article directly above this post that trading was available to clubs back in those days. Very surprising to see that.

http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/116476678

There's a reasonable write-up in this article about the 1982 draft. The last bit is particularly interesting as it says Melbourne and Geelong wanted a moratorium on interstate transfers as they felt SA and WA clubs had been hit hard by interstate moves. I had always wondered why the draft stopped after just two years, could this be the reason why?

It's an interesting article, but they certainly get a few things wrong:- two attempts at getting the name Antrobus right fail miserably, Lester-Smith has his name cut in half, and I'm pretty sure it was Marc Housley (not Mark Rowsley) etc.
 
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PrideOf

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It's an interesting article, but they certainly get a few things wrong:- two attempts at getting the name Antrobus right fail miserably, Lester-Smith has his name cut in half, and I'm pretty sure it was Marc Housley (not Mark Rowsley) etc.
Those Antrobus references are hilarious. And also shows us that the Vic footy media have been unable to get 'interstate' details right for more than 30 years.
 

pazza

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Any idea how this came to be? Did they become free agents again if they didn't come immediately?

Interesting that Neil Craig could have been a Bulldog.
Prior to this was the old Form Four system, which had a time limit on players coming across (e.g Craig Bradley signed by Essendon in 1980, finally crossed to Carlton before 1986). Seems the time limit was changed for the new system.
 

expires

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Sheedy's first year as coach. Fitzroy just missing a prelim final. Neale Daniher kicking 20 goals in twenty seconds against Carlton......
 

The_Wookie

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Sheedy's first year as coach. Fitzroy just missing a prelim final. Neale Daniher kicking 20 goals in twenty seconds against Carlton......
Theres a lot of things we could have chosen, up until the last minute I was going with Fitzpatrick being pinged for Timewasting against Essendon :p
 

expires

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Theres a lot of things we could have chosen, up until the last minute I was going with Fitzpatrick being pinged for Timewasting against Essendon :p

Wasn't having a go. Enjoyed reading through the forgotten drafts. Then went to my own recollections of the year 1981. (That time wasting was a dag. Incidentally, was at the Fitzroy - Collingwood second semi in 1981. It was one of those ones when you thought it was going to happen at last as the final quarter neared its end and then at death it was all a dream.)
 

35Daicos

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Does anyone have any idea about the story of Marc Housley (Queensland Football Hall of Fame member), drafted by Richmond in 1982 but apparently not allowed to play for them? It seems incredible to me that 30 odd years ago a player from a "non-football state" could be prevented from playing for a top level team. It sounds a bit like the story of the next player taken in that draft, Tasmanian Chris Gray who was unable to play for Carlton.

Trialed impressively at Richmond before falling victim to transfer ‘red tape’ which denied him a possible shot at the AFL, he also played in Tasmania and Darwin, coached on the Sunshine Coast and finished his career in Canberra.

http://www.aflq.com.au/index.php?id=299

Ron The Bear
rbartlett

Any of you old Tigers know anything about this?
 
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The_Wookie

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Does anyone have any idea about the story of Marc Housley (Queensland Football Hall of Fame member), drafted by Richmond in 1982 but apparently not allowed to play for them? It seems incredible to me that 30 odd years ago a player from a "non-football state" could be prevented from playing for a top level team. It sounds a bit like the story of the next player taken in that draft, Tasmanian Chris Gray who was unable to play for Carlton.

Trialed impressively at Richmond before falling victim to transfer ‘red tape’ which denied him a possible shot at the AFL, he also played in Tasmania and Darwin, coached on the Sunshine Coast and finished his career in Canberra.

http://www.aflq.com.au/index.php?id=299
Played more than 400 games in the end according to this article on trove. At the time the article was written he'd never played a reserves game.
  • Queensland - 30 games
  • Northern Territory - 2 games
  • Kedron, Queensland - 188 games
  • Cooee, Tasmania - 26 games
  • Sth fremantle, WA - 11 games
  • Maroochydoore, QLD - 79 games
  • St Marys, NT - 20 games
  • Belconnen, ACT - 46+ games
Cant find anything on his reasons for not coming to Richmond in 1982
 

35Daicos

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Played more than 400 games in the end according to this article on trove. At the time the article was written he'd never played a reserves game.
  • Queensland - 30 games
  • Northern Territory - 2 games
  • Kedron, Queensland - 188 games
  • Cooee, Tasmania - 26 games
  • Sth fremantle, WA - 11 games
  • Maroochydoore, QLD - 79 games
  • St Marys, NT - 20 games
  • Belconnen, ACT - 46+ games
Cant find anything on his reasons for not coming to Richmond in 1982
Thanks for that. I've had a pretty decent look around and not found anything to explain it. He certainly moved around the country a fair bit, what it was that apparently stopped him playing for Richmond is a mystery.
 

andrew coombs

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1981 Queens Birthday Monday, 92,935 at VFL Park for Collingwood v Hawthorn. Roughly 15,000 over capacity. I was there and it was scary. I saw an ESPN doco on the Hillsborough tragedy in 89 and it reminded me of that day with thousands of angry fans attempting to storm the turnstiles in the half hour before the opening bounce. The curtain raiser was the Teal Cup final between Victoria and South Australia, won by Victoria. Salmon,Brereton, Steve Wallis, Mötley, Bradley all starring. Hawks won.
 

Supermercado

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At least we started out drafting history with two good picks before the tradition of stuffing it up began in 1982.
 

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