1st test XI of the summer

Remove this Banner Ad

Scratchy05

Team Captain
Sep 16, 2020
434
296
AFL Club
Collingwood
Street is nowhere near the side and Whiteman needs to do it for longer to be a legitimate contender.

Street gets bogged down against First Class level, against Bumrah, Shami and B Kumar he'll get bogged down like nobody else. He is not ready, that's just a stone cold fact. I think he'll be next in line a few years from now, but for now? Nah
That is fair enough. May as well play Burns and save Street for an easier series.
 

Scratchy05

Team Captain
Sep 16, 2020
434
296
AFL Club
Collingwood
I don’t think Street is ready just yet. Completely agree with the rest though, I really hope one day Pattinson forces his way ahead of Starc because I think he’s more consistent and he brings a fierce edge he also has a knack of picking up big wickets.
I think Pattinson currently is better than Starc as he is very fierce, and seems to just get big wickets. I don't think it is that close either. But CA don't see it that way and not like Starc is a bad player at all.
 

LukeParkerno1

Premium Platinum
Sep 23, 2005
118,679
46,863
Sydney
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
Sydney Swans
I think Pattinson currently is better than Starc as he is very fierce, and seems to just get big wickets. I don't think it is that close either. But CA don't see it that way and not like Starc is a bad player at all.
Few years ago before his injuries Pattinson might have been not now. Jhye Richardson is probably better than both.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Scratchy05

Team Captain
Sep 16, 2020
434
296
AFL Club
Collingwood
Few years ago before his injuries Pattinson might have been not now. Jhye Richardson is probably better than both.
Pattinson bowled very well when called upon last summer and has been tearing it up in the IPL. I feel bad for the bloke. He was going to be an all time great but just couldn't stay healthy.
 

LukeParkerno1

Premium Platinum
Sep 23, 2005
118,679
46,863
Sydney
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
Sydney Swans
Pattinson bowled very well when called upon last summer and has been tearing it up in the IPL. I feel bad for the bloke. He was going to be an all time great but just couldn't stay healthy.
Please tell me you haven’t just used IPL form! What’s next pick Stoinis lol

Richardson is a better talent going forward
 

t_94

Premiership Player
May 6, 2014
3,069
5,239
AFL Club
St Kilda
Wade should be in the gun instead of Head. People seem very eager to drop Head on this board. I understand the reservations they have regarding lack of discipline outside off stump, but I reckon he's very strong mentally. I think he can carve out a long career averaging low 40's.

He's the anti Shaun Marsh in a lot of ways. Looks like a crab but finds ways to score runs.
 

Scratchy05

Team Captain
Sep 16, 2020
434
296
AFL Club
Collingwood
Please tell me you haven’t just used IPL form! What’s next pick Stoinis lol

Richardson is a better talent going forward
I haven't. My main basis is how he has performed over the last 2 years. Averaged 19 in the sheffield Shield in 2018/19 and when called upon for Australia last summer, he took crucial wickets at valuable points. He isn't quite as quick as Richardson (anymore) but he moves it more and seems to hit the bat very hard. Plus is a gun fielder. The IPL form is just a bonus.
 

LukeParkerno1

Premium Platinum
Sep 23, 2005
118,679
46,863
Sydney
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
Sydney Swans
I haven't. My main basis is how he has performed over the last 2 years. Averaged 19 in the sheffield Shield in 2018/19 and when called upon for Australia last summer, he took crucial wickets at valuable points. He isn't quite as quick as Richardson (anymore) but he moves it more and seems to hit the bat very hard. Plus is a gun fielder. The IPL form is just a bonus.
Starc has been much better. Then we have the younger options. Plus he’s made of glass if you can guarantee he won’t break down mid test I’m all ears.
 

Scratchy05

Team Captain
Sep 16, 2020
434
296
AFL Club
Collingwood
T
Starc has been much better. Then we have the younger options. Plus he’s made of glass if you can guarantee he won’t break down mid test I’m all ears.
Your comment about much better is a straight lie. Pattinson has better first class and test bowling & batting averages. Pattinson has better economy rates. Starc has test strike rate but Pattinson has a better first class strike rate. Pattinson outperforms Starc on everything bar longevity.

Lets look at 2019 as a year now. Starc averaged 20.71 while Pattinson averaged 21.45. Meanwhile, this is with Starc getting to pad his stats against Pakistan & Sri Lanka as he absolutely cleaned them up, a luxury Pattinson didn't have only playing against England and New Zealand. Pattinson had an economy rate of 2.56 and a strike rate of 50.1 meanwhile Starc had an economy of 3.38 and a strike rate of 36.7, mind you while once again, getting to take on Sri Lanka and Pakistan. So it is clear to see not much separates the two.

Looking at this after my research, Starc provides a PoD whereas Pattinson is just more of what we currently have so even after looking at it, even though I think he is better than Starc, we probably should stick with Starc as Pattinson is similar to a Cummins and Hazlewood, both who I'd rate over Pattinson.

And surrounding the injury, since his last back surgery which I believe was almost 2 years ago now, he hasn't broken down. I imagine covid could've only helped with this as well.
 

JackOutback

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 15, 2011
22,433
29,628
AFL Club
West Coast
T

Your comment about much better is a straight lie. Pattinson has better first class and test bowling & batting averages. Pattinson has better economy rates. Starc has test strike rate but Pattinson has a better first class strike rate. Pattinson outperforms Starc on everything bar longevity.

Lets look at 2019 as a year now. Starc averaged 20.71 while Pattinson averaged 21.45. Meanwhile, this is with Starc getting to pad his stats against Pakistan & Sri Lanka as he absolutely cleaned them up, a luxury Pattinson didn't have only playing against England and New Zealand. Pattinson had an economy rate of 2.56 and a strike rate of 50.1 meanwhile Starc had an economy of 3.38 and a strike rate of 36.7, mind you while once again, getting to take on Sri Lanka and Pakistan. So it is clear to see not much separates the two.

Looking at this after my research, Starc provides a PoD whereas Pattinson is just more of what we currently have so even after looking at it, even though I think he is better than Starc, we probably should stick with Starc as Pattinson is similar to a Cummins and Hazlewood, both who I'd rate over Pattinson.

And surrounding the injury, since his last back surgery which I believe was almost 2 years ago now, he hasn't broken down. I imagine covid could've only helped with this as well.
It wouldn’t be an LP cricket post without a wholly simplistic, yet strident, opinion. Probably drawn more lines through cricketers than all our selectors put together.
 

corbies

Moderator
Jul 31, 2010
4,525
6,258
Newcastle
AFL Club
Sydney
Other Teams
S'roos, New Jets, WHam, Cronulla
Wade will be back for Tassie's 3rd Shield game and you'd think he'd really want some runs to hold off any talk about his spot given the runs scored by Head and Green.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

DaRick

Norm Smith Medallist
Jan 12, 2008
5,483
4,324
Brisbane
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Other Teams
(See avatar)
My preliminary first Test XI:
- Warner
- Burns
- Labu
- Smith
- Head
- Green
- Paine+*
- Starc
- Cummins
- Lyon
- Hazlewood

The ones in italics I'm not fully convinced about. Burns is Burns - he will maul poor bowling in good conditions but struggles against movement. That said, Maddinson hasn't yet staked a case, so my mind could change. That said, if Bancroft/Harris turn out to be the alternatives then you may as well stick with Burns. Bancroft is perhaps more capable of toughing it out against good bowling for a while, but Burns has shown the temperament to score heavily once set. Khawaja has not been in good enough form for consideration and barring a Rogers-like renaissance his Test career is over.

Wade hasn't yet played so he could change my mind, or Green could score 4 ducks in a row or something, but at this point Green's form with the bat has been too impressive for me to pass up, especially since Wade was just clinging on anyway. I also think that besides being a WA batsman, Green is pretty good at making and going on with starts, so he suits Langer's vision of our batting lineup.

I'm not fully sold on Head either, but I'm surprised that some posters think his spot is under threat. Yes, his technique is far from classical. Yes, his tendency to squander a start is infuriating. However, at least he usually does make a start, and we've established that he's no downhill skier (his 140* for SA being a case in point). Basically, he suits Langer's vision and has performed well enough over the past year to be safe for the season if nothing else.

I would also select Starc over Pattinson. I think that Pattinson has on the whole bowled fairly well since his return to the side and he's not as inconsistent as he once was, but Starc was definitely more consistent last season than he has been previously - probably due to his remodelled action. Both are prone to their down periods and down matches, but Starc's footmarks are very useful for Lyon and he offers a point of difference. With Hazlewood/Cummins holding down the other hand, he can just go flat out searcing for wickets.

The other guys pick themselves.
 

Tyberious Funk

Club Legend
May 13, 2005
2,180
956
Melbourne
AFL Club
West Coast
Nic Maddinson. The fact you didn't know that already speaks volumes
Maddinson's purple patch came last season. That doesn't mean it counts for nothing, but I suspect the selectors will put more weight on runs scored this summer -- particularly for a guy that has a history of being inconsistent. If he backs it up again, fine, he'll deserve another shot... but I hardly think it's unreasonable for people to reserve their judgement on the guy. Personally, I just don't think he has the temperament to play at the highest level, but I'd be delighted to be proven wrong.
 

eth-dog

Premium Platinum
Jan 11, 2007
89,833
46,376
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Coburg Lions, All Boston sides
Maddinson's purple patch came last season. That doesn't mean it counts for nothing, but I suspect the selectors will put more weight on runs scored this summer -- particularly for a guy that has a history of being inconsistent. If he backs it up again, fine, he'll deserve another shot... but I hardly think it's unreasonable for people to reserve their judgement on the guy. Personally, I just don't think he has the temperament to play at the highest level, but I'd be delighted to be proven wrong.
Maddinson has scored 1300 runs in FC cricket over the past 2 seasons at an average of 83, including 5 centuries. That's pretty consistent.
 

Docker82

Premiership Player
Jun 21, 2013
3,910
4,838
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
Couldn’t care less what a player has done this season if they were rubbish last season tbh.

Picking players who’ve performed for a short-ish period has hardly ever worked and hardly ever will.

Mainly trying to stick up for players who were good last season and have been just okay this season tbh. Maddinson for example has runs on the board... literally.
 

cricketnut14

All Australian
Jan 13, 2015
713
325
AFL Club
Sydney
There is also Cam Green to consider who is getting close to getting picked as a pure bat let alone as a genuine AR.
Yeah, gotta agree , it's nearly time.

Might have a real special one this time.

*4 tons
*2 5fa's
*17 first class games and into his 5th season and 21 years old.
*averaging 52/22 (ponting like with the bat/mcgrath like with the ball)

I've always said give him a bit of time but his numbers are getting hard to ignore now.

I'd have him in over Wade and bat him @6 as he offers so much more other than experience and leadership and a bit of grit, but we may have to wait until the end of the summer.
 

Docker82

Premiership Player
Jun 21, 2013
3,910
4,838
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
Yeah, gotta agree , it's nearly time.

Might have a real special one this time.

*4 tons
*2 5fa's
*17 first class games and into his 5th season and 21 years old.
*averaging 52/22 (ponting like with the bat/mcgrath like with the ball)

I've always said give him a bit of time but his numbers are getting hard to ignore now.

I'd have him in over Wade and bat him @6 as he offers so much more other than experience and leadership and a bit of grit, but we may have to wait until the end of the summer.
17 first class isn’t that few compared to what some of the greats were picked off.

For me bowling all rounders are a touch overrated unless they’re a genuine top six batsman. If Green is at test level then he’s a really special player.
 

big_e

Premium Platinum
Apr 28, 2008
6,676
19,240
The Championship
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Other Teams
Wycombe Wanderers
Look at the totality. Not one game. Yet to prove himself when it counts.
The totality? OK, I'll play that game:

Seventh highest run scorer in the world in tests in 2019. More runs and at a higher average than David Warner (742 at 49.5, for those playing at home). Same number of centuries in the year as Virat Kohli.

After 17 tests, he has more career runs, at a higher average and with the same number of centuries and more 50s than both Michael Clarke and Ricky Ponting.
 

The Falcon Strike

Hall of Famer
Nov 18, 2008
34,865
26,471
Perth
AFL Club
West Coast
17 first class isn’t that few compared to what some of the greats were picked off.

For me bowling all rounders are a touch overrated unless they’re a genuine top six batsman. If Green is at test level then he’s a really special player.
It would be to assess his bowling given he probably hasn't bowled in half of those.

And probably only the last half dozen or so he has played as a specialist bat.

I can see why CA would be cautious - but geez - one of the most exciting packages in a long time.

Also - it may come ot pass that he is never a top 6 bat - however he doesn't really need to be - he just needs to be reasonably close.

Let's top 6 averages 40 and he averages 37 - close enough when you consider his skillset.

I'd be less inclined to be that generous with the top 4 bowlers - Test cricket is about 20 wickets - you need your best 4 all the time.
 

Remove this Banner Ad