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Draft Review 2008 - Re-do the 2008 draft

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The Bomb said:
It would be very interesting to put Cotchin alongside Pendles and Swan and put Beams alongside Delidio and Martin.
Beams tagged week in week out like Cotchin.
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Cotchin has limited hurt factor to his game. And his kicking is only average. Cotchin is one of those media hyped players - Can't believe he got 19 votes in the Brownlow - Had an average season and struggled with taggers.
 

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the distributer said:
Rockliff needs to kick more Goals, Beams has him well and truly covered.
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It's not like I said Rockliff was a better player than Beams or anything. Just said that Rockliff would have won it this year if he played all of his games in the middle. I rate Beams very highly.
 
the distributer said:
Rockliff needs to kick more Goals, Beams has him well and truly covered.
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It's not like I said Rockliff was a better player than Beams or anything. Just said that Rockliff would have won it this year if he played all of his games in the middle. I rate Beams very highly.
 
cotter101 said:
It's not like I said Rockliff was a better player than Beams or anything. Just said that Rockliff would have won it this year if he played all of his games in the middle. I rate Beams very highly.
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Yeah sorry about that.

I still think Rocky needs to hit the scoreboard more though, Swan was similar in his early days, got a heap of the pll but wasn't as damaging as he is now, I think 20 goals PA is what he should be aiming for.
 
the distributer said:
Yeah sorry about that.

I still think Rocky needs to hit the scoreboard more though, Swan was similar in his early days, got a heap of the pll but wasn't as damaging as he is now, I think 20 goals PA is what he should be aiming for.
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Yeah he does need to hit the scoreboard a bit more. He kicked 18 goals in 2012 but kicked something like 20 behinds too. So he needs to work on his goal kicking in general. But he is similar to Swan as he protects the drop zone very well.
 
SizeMatters said:
Rockliff to be the first off the 2008 group to win a Brownlow. Bookmark this.

He should be IMO top 3 of the draft so far.
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Why? Every team has a player like him. We have Scott Selwood. Fremantle have Barlow/Mundy. Sydney have a bunch of them. Every team has a "Rockliff".

He might be a good Brisbane player but he's not rated in the league's top 10.
 
cotter101 said:
It's not like I said Rockliff was a better player than Beams or anything. Just said that Rockliff would have won it this year if he played all of his games in the middle. I rate Beams very highly.
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I also would have won the Brownlow - if I was as good as GAJ.
 
Rocky was equal 6th in the Brownlow and all his votes pretty much came from round 15 on wards... remember he had about 10 weeks of playing forward with an injured leg throughout the early rounds. Give him a full time role back into the midfield and he would have gotten 30+ Brownlow votes last year and took home the award. Rockliff is once again under rated by the majority of bigfooty because1. he's not from an AFL state and 2. The Lions are struggling. Once we add a decent clearance mid and the team develops and start to play good footy you will see that not every team has a bunch of Rockliffs
 

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SizeMatters said:
Rocky was equal 6th in the Brownlow and all his votes pretty much came from round 15 on wards... remember he had about 10 weeks of playing forward with an injured leg throughout the early rounds. Give him a full time role back into the midfield and he would have gotten 30+ Brownlow votes last year and took home the award. Rockliff is once again under rated by the majority of bigfooty because1. he's not from an AFL state and 2. The Lions are struggling. Once we add a decent clearance mid and the team develops and start to play good footy you will see that not every team has a bunch of Rockliffs
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I think you're under-estimating every other club's mids. There's no doubt Rockliff is a good player but every team has them. He doesn't receive the praise as he's just not in the upper echelon yet. He'll have to raise his game to receive the individual honours and public praise.
 
SizeMatters said:
Rocky was equal 6th in the Brownlow and all his votes pretty much came from round 15 on wards... remember he had about 10 weeks of playing forward with an injured leg throughout the early rounds. Give him a full time role back into the midfield and he would have gotten 30+ Brownlow votes last year and took home the award. Rockliff is once again under rated by the majority of bigfooty because1. he's not from an AFL state and 2. The Lions are struggling. Once we add a decent clearance mid and the team develops and start to play good footy you will see that not every team has a bunch of Rockliffs
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You can't say he would have won it - you don't know if his form would have held up. It is just your opinion that he may have won it. It's like me saying the Roos would have won the Grand Final - if we made the finals.
 
SizeMatters said:
Rocky was equal 6th in the Brownlow and all his votes pretty much came from round 15 on wards... remember he had about 10 weeks of playing forward with an injured leg throughout the early rounds. Give him a full time role back into the midfield and he would have gotten 30+ Brownlow votes last year and took home the award. Rockliff is once again under rated by the majority of bigfooty because1. he's not from an AFL state and 2. The Lions are struggling. Once we add a decent clearance mid and the team develops and start to play good footy you will see that not every team has a bunch of Rockliffs
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He came fourth in Brisbane's B&F. Apparently, we're not the only ones underrating him.
 
Wild Bill said:
You can't say he would have won it - you don't know if his form would have held up. It is just your opinion that he may have won it. It's like me saying the Roos would have won the Grand Final - if we made the finals.
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Regression to the mean. It is unlikely he would have maintained that high of an average for the full season, if he had played on ball for the duration.

Take Selwood, Swan or Ablett, each had a dip and peak in form which corresponded to more or less votes. The same would likely have been true for Rockliff.
 
SizeMatters said:
Rocky was equal 6th in the Brownlow and all his votes pretty much came from round 15 on wards... remember he had about 10 weeks of playing forward with an injured leg throughout the early rounds. Give him a full time role back into the midfield and he would have gotten 30+ Brownlow votes last year and took home the award. Rockliff is once again under rated by the majority of bigfooty because1. he's not from an AFL state and 2. The Lions are struggling. Once we add a decent clearance mid and the team develops and start to play good footy you will see that not every team has a bunch of Rockliffs
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And who was taking votes away from Rockliff again? If Rockliff managed to win a Brownlow on his current output it would be in the top 3 most non deserved Brownlows of all time.

He struggles to kick half the goals Beams does, he isn't anywhere near Beams as a clearance player, he isn't anywhere near Beams as a ball magnet, Beams is a better disposer on both sides of his body and is clearly the better contested player, and, Beams isn't even in the top 2 mids at Collingwood, so please, rave on about Brownlows if you like but if Rockliff does manage to snag enough votes to win one it'll be through the umpires lack of options.

Rockliff is a dime a dozen mid, nothing more at this stage.
 

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the distributer said:
And who was taking votes away from Rockliff again? If Rockliff managed to win a Brownlow on his current output it would be in the top 3 most non deserved Brownlows of all time.

He struggles to kick half the goals Beams does, he isn't anywhere near Beams as a clearance player, he isn't anywhere near Beams as a ball magnet, Beams is a better disposer on both sides of his body and is clearly the better contested player, and, Beams isn't even in the top 2 mids at Collingwood, so please, rave on about Brownlows if you like but if Rockliff does manage to snag enough votes to win one it'll be through the umpires lack of options.

Rockliff is a dime a dozen mid, nothing more at this stage.
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I don't think you can compare Rockliff and Beams on this season. Beams only played the 8 games and Rockliff played 10 or 11 games up forward. Will be interesting to see how they compare next year assuming they play midfield and they're both injury free.
 
cotter101 said:
I don't think you can compare Rockliff and Beams on this season. Beams only played the 8 games and Rockliff played 10 or 11 games up forward. Will be interesting to see how they compare next year assuming they play midfield and they're both injury free.
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Compare them on 2012 then.
 
cotter101 said:
Rockliff still had a groin injury and payed most of his games up forward. Hopefully under Leppa he will be a full time midfielder and only rest of forward for 5 or so minutes a quarter. :thumbsu:
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Not saying he didn't have a groin injury, but why on earth would a team rebuilding play an injured player? Especially a young one rated as highly as Rockliff.
 
the distributer said:
Not saying he didn't have a groin injury, but why on earth would a team rebuilding play an injured player? Especially a young one rated as highly as Rockliff.
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There is not a player in the AFL that would not run out with a niggle of some sort. Supporters pump there players up to be a lot better than what they are and when they fall short of these lofty standards the excuses roll in - injured, played out of position, no pre-season fitness base, poor delivery, playing in a poor side etc etc

I could name so many players that get a free pass from supporters because of those examples above. Some get more than 1 rolled out for them - look at Michael Hurley and the reasons you get for his under achieving:

Rarely plays 4 quarters - "he was in a moon boot this pre-season - watch out if he has a full pre-season - will tear the comp apart"

Marking is poor - "He has had wrist operations that have not allowed him to clunk the ball - wait until his wrists are better - he will tear the comp apart"

Runs under the ball - "Our midfield delivery is terrible and does not give him a chance - wait until we get some decent mids - he will tear the comp apart"

Not a very good CHF - "He is a gun defender played out of position - wait until he is moved back - he will tear the comp apart"
 
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