Analysis - 2010/11 build vs 2017/18 build | Page 3 | BigFooty

Analysis 2010/11 build vs 2017/18 build

Discussion in 'North Melbourne Kangaroos' started by Snake_Baker, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. Snake_Baker

    Snake_Baker Brownlow Medallist

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    Just cut and paste : "blah, blah, blah, blah............I blame Brad Scott" in to every single post you make and save yourself some time.:thumbsu:
     
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  2. Snake_Baker

    Snake_Baker Brownlow Medallist

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    This


    ...and this.

    As for JZ, he's been played out of position for 90% of his career.
     
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  3. Pykie

    Pykie Brownlow Medallist

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    Yeah, I agree to some extent, not blaming him so to speak, it's as much the game moving away from his type more than anything.

    In his first year he was being compared to Buckley and Voss, it seemed we had a genuine top midfielder on our hands.

    Hopefully he can still continue to improve, he has shades of A grader, especially when he's hitting the scoreboard, but for most of his career hes been a solid B grader at best.
     
  4. Hazey1977

    Hazey1977 Premium Platinum

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    Continued selection of injured players
    Continued selection of blokes out of form
     
  5. Hazey1977

    Hazey1977 Premium Platinum

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    Thumbs up to this!!!

    I specifically watched Clarke against Richmond and time and time again he was caught between effecting the contest in front of him or giving the opposition a bumtap as they toe poke the ball through from 2m out.

    Our systems stink; both development and gameplan!
     
  6. North Viking

    North Viking Premium Gold

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    Spot on

    I was going to post something similar but you articulated it better than what I would of.

    On a note 2010/11 wasn’t a full rebuild. More a top up if anything. We went in to fix holes on our list to complement our champions such as Boomer and Wells, and more than handy side acts, like the Dish for example.

    The 2010 side however did have higher top end picks than what we have today. Wells and Hansen, pick 2 and 3.

    Looking over our 2018 side there are gaping holes in depth and top end talent.
    The recent top end draft talent we have on our list are years off being match winners and require much more development. Whilst, as mentioned before our 24-28 group hasn’t gone up a gear. Bar Cunners.

    I believe we are only 1 year into our rebuild. As 2016 was weird year and our mid table finish didn’t allow us access to top end talent. Simpkin was a great pick up but pick 12, one can only expect so much....

    I believe we will need 2 more years to reinvigorate and overhaul our list, and I am expecting ladder posistioning towards the bottom of the table with this current list.

    If we do pick up some gun FA in 2018/19 then I would hope we would have a list full of young talent to maintain an era of success around the 2021-2026.

    I don’t see us pushing up the table till 2020. And I’m ok with that. As I am realist.

    I am also pleased with how we recruited last year given our picks. I believe we went left field on a few later picks that have high ceilings but are quite unknown. I.E. Will Walker and Kyron Hayden. Add Ahern as another left field pick from 2016. The key to future success will be creative list building over the next 2 drafts.

    I think we have done great recruiting over the last 2 years with the picks we have had. Aside from FA obviously.

    I think the challenge that Scott’s and co have is in developing our youth, kids only develop so much in the VFL. So I hope to see kids playing senior footy, if form warrants it to a degree.

    If by years end I’m not seeing improvement in our kids then I’ll be calling for his head. The heat is on Scotts, no doubt. Though I’m gonna allow him the year to do his work.

    I don’t believe the board will stand for zero development in the kids, and will act as they aren’t fools.

    I can see the nucleus of something special, though as stated it’s only 1/3 complete. This year is about development not wins for me.
     
  7. North Viking

    North Viking Premium Gold

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    I would counter and say Garner and Wood both have the potential to both be A graders. We have seen glimpses. Injury has hampered these two for sure.

    If Garner stays on the park this year, mark my words he will go up another level again from last year.

    Same can be said with Wood. We get 18+ games out of him and we will see improvement.

    Clarke, not so much. I don’t see where he fits in. Perhaps a depth player?? I just don’t see much more of a ceiling.
     
  8. Heaps of fun

    Heaps of fun Brownlow Medallist

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    Yeah we got ahead of ourselves with the Cousins comparisons on Clarke. Looking more like Matt Rosa atm.
     
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  9. Zondor

    Zondor Brownlow Medallist

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    You'll soon get it. :stern look
     
  10. andana

    andana Premiership Player

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    Quoting from above.

    Looking over our 2018 side there are gaping holes in depth and top end talent.
    The recent top end draft talent we have on our list are years off being match winners and require much more development. Whilst, as mentioned before our 24-28 group hasn’t gone up a gear. Bar Cunners.

    I believe we are only 1 year into our rebuild. As 2016 was weird year and our mid table finish didn’t allow us access to top end talent. Simpkin was a great pick up but pick 12, one can only expect so much....

    I believe we will need 2 more years to reinvigorate and overhaul our list, and I am expecting ladder posistioning towards the bottom of the table with this current list.

    ...........
    We traded in M.Williams at pick 105 who is ok, maybe a fill in til someone else pushes up or Sam Wright comes good. Ahern who was a pick 7 ,didn't play last year, could be an A grader if stays healthy, at pick 69 and Hrovat.
    Besides Simpkin , in the draft we got Declan Watson, out injured ,J.Williams, a project player and Larkey.

    There's plenty of questions about 2016 but it could work out really well and sooner than we expect.
     
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  11. Pykie

    Pykie Brownlow Medallist

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    Whilst I don't exactly think Carlton is a beacon of performance in a rebuild, I think they have gone about things the right way over the last 2-3 years with the recruitment of Marchbank, Kennedy, Plowman, Ah Chee etc

    They might not be stars, but they are good young players they have gotten for unders which will only really strengthen their depth down the track.

    I'd be going heavily after any top Victorian (Hopper for example isnt Victorian but boarded here) draft pick currently in NSW or QLD in the next 2-3 years:

    Taranto, McCluggage, Scrimshaw, Brodie, Setterfield, Witherden, Bonar, Hopper & Fiorini.

    Setterfield is an interesting one for the end of this year given he is coming off of an ACL.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
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  12. Heaps of fun

    Heaps of fun Brownlow Medallist

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    Ah Chee? Do you mean Garlett?
    We could offer Setterfield a lot more than GWS could. Would be a bit of a risky move culture wise but could have a big pay off.
     
  13. Pykie

    Pykie Brownlow Medallist

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    Sorry, Pickett and Garlett.
     
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  14. GreatBradScott

    GreatBradScott You are a f***ing biscuit tin

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    This. You get another go, but explain what's different this time around.
     
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  15. King Corey

    King Corey Moderator

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    More pay obviously.
     
  16. RobZombie

    RobZombie Premium Platinum

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    The important part of that list is

    Harvey > Everyone
    also, arguably Wells > Everyone (although possibly Wells ~ Higgins)

    Tarrant > anyone we've plonked at full back since Micky and not comparable to 2010 KPF Tarrant at all.
    Goldstein = Goldstein
    Brown > Petrie as a pure FF but less versatile
    2010 Greenwood wasn't much chop but by the time he left had some occasional games well beyond what Dumont has done. Fine with Greenwood ~ Dumont, but the good part is it can be equally Greenwood ~ Mountford or Greenwood ~ Hayden. Fight it out lads.
    Wright the inconsistent HFF < Wright the reliable HBF but Garner > Wright at HF.
    Turner >>> Speight
    Wood ??? Azza Edwards

    1st-2nd year or outside the 22,
    Simpkin > Matt Campbell
    Hartung > Liam Anthony
    McKay > Josh Smith
    Preuss > HMac (based on what Hamish turned out to have left in him, not how he was in 2010)
    Maj > Ben Mabon
    Anderson ~ Cruize Garlett
    EVW > Ayden Kennedy
    Hibberd > Urquhart (projecting my optimistic view of Hibberd against what actually became of Gav)
    Zurhaar >? Ben Warren

    I said this on the pod last year, but I reckon we're comfortably better off down the list this time around, and hopefully the survival of the fittest among surplus young mids we have right now will serve us well. The problem obviously is where does the game-breaking type come from.
     
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  17. Le Grille

    Le Grille The Bear of BeanCoin

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    You could be right, but not one of those (maybe simpkin) have not proven that yet in terms of impact on the AFL side.
     
  18. Harris 10

    Harris 10 Norm Smith Medallist

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    When i think about the current rebuild I keep coming back to this.

    Tarrant, Cunnington, Goldy, Waite, Thompson, Waite, Higgins won't play in a final again for us and how do we best manage their careers going forward so it can set us up for the future.

    Is it helping younsters develop or is it by moving them on?.
     
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  19. kangatime

    kangatime Norm Smith Medallist

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    You do know Ziebell is older than Cunnington?
     
  20. Harris 10

    Harris 10 Norm Smith Medallist

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    yep, he should be on the list as well.
     
  21. kangatime

    kangatime Norm Smith Medallist

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    Wright is older than both of them so add him to the list?

    Jacobs is only 6 months younger than Cunnington so may as well cut him. And Brown was born the same year as Jacobs so we should trade him, no point having him for 1 year of finals.
     
  22. RobZombie

    RobZombie Premium Platinum

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    Given the combined senior games total of Kennedy and Mabon, I'm pretty confident about EVW and Maj already ;).

    And I know it's not the best hill to die on, but I'll stand by my claim that Jed is no worse than Cruize.

    Should be uncontroversial to be optimistic about McKay being better than Josh Smith?

    Hamish was a good player before Goldy took his job but played 7 games for us after 2010.

    Can take or leave Hartung at the moment but he's just as outside as LA, faster and a better kick.

    I admit I'm not buying into the doom and gloom about Hibberd after 3 senior games, but SupaGav played 8 games in 2010 and only one more after that.

    Anyway, my point was that while it's easy to look at the top dozen players in that 2009-2011 era and say they were pretty good, there were some honest toilers at best as you go down the list.
     
  23. Moti

    Moti Norm Smith Medallist

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  24. Le Grille

    Le Grille The Bear of BeanCoin

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    Agreed but I think your judgements are based on potential of many of that group, particularly Hibberd/McKay/Pruess and Jed has actually contributed less than cruise. I agree they should be better in all of those cases, but in terms of actual contribution to the senior side that list has not yet outperformed their previous iterations. My point is can we harness this potential. Im 50/50
     
  25. Harris 10

    Harris 10 Norm Smith Medallist

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    Did i say we should cut any of them?
     
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