2011 Draft Discussion

[jackess]

Quigley and a few others have suggested that Bartlett could play down back and use his line-breaking and kicking skills in a Yarran type role.

I'd prefer using guys like Drummond and Adcock's kicking skills and using the Hawthorn model of short kicking through the zone.

I also think that Ash should play own back in this role and that Golby can play a rebounding role despite not having Yarran's speed or Davis' kicking ability.

 

[POBT]

Quigley and a few others have suggested that Bartlett could play down back and use his line-breaking and kicking skills in a Yarran type role.

My issue with Bartlett is that we've seen nothing of him at senior level yet. He might be someone who could play that role but we've got no real evidence of that (yet). He's also been spoken about as a small forward and part of the midfield rotations which suggests to me that he's a bit of an unknown quantity.

Polec is certainly one to consider as a HBF. Has a long, damaging kick and works well in traffic which is important in the forward press era.

 

[Quigley]

I agree that O'Brien and Polec could both be groomed into a running half back type player. Personally I like the idea of Bartlett starting out there because I like his strength and agressiveness and he has the speed that would free up others and break the lines the other way. Golby has speed and with a bit more of a tank he could use it more. His kicking does need to improve though. The other one to consider who I think will be in the minds of our coaches is Lester. Nice height and good skills and has played a lot of defense as a junior.

In this year's draft Buntine is a 50/50 to be available and would fit the bill if we wanted to go that way. I also wouldn't mind Grigg starting off in that role. He is a hard at it type and played mostly through the midfield but I rate him as close to the best kick in this draft. He can take the more physical smalls defensively and going the other way his leg would be really valuable. I am thinking atm though he might not get past Port at 6.

 

[POBT]

In this year's draft Buntine is a 50/50 to be available and would fit the bill if we wanted to go that way. I also wouldn't mind Grigg starting off in that role. He is a hard at it type and played mostly through the midfield but I rate him as close to the best kick in this draft. He can take the more physical smalls defensively and going the other way his leg would be really valuable. I am thinking atm though he might not get past Port at 6.

There's a bit of Shannon Hurn in the way Grigg goes about it. Hurn was more of a man child at junior level and I think Grigg is a more proficient mid as he doesn't have the size advantage that Hurn had as a youngster. But I think they could play similar roles in the backline. Both are long kicking, bigger bodied types. Grigg would be round 1 ready as a back flanker.

 

[jackess]

There's a bit of Shannon Hurn in the way Grigg goes about it. Hurn was more of a man child at junior level and I think Grigg is a more proficient mid as he doesn't have the size advantage that Hurn had as a youngster. But I think they could play similar roles in the backline. Both are long kicking, bigger bodied types. Grigg would be round 1 ready as a back flanker.

I think Grigg is more of a midfielder than a flanker. For Norwood this season they have selected Forster to play HBF ahead of Grigg and Brown to play HFF ahead of him.

 

[POBT]

I think Grigg is more of a midfielder than a flanker. For Norwood this season they have selected Forster to play HBF ahead of Grigg and Brown to play HFF ahead of him.

I think so too but I think he is more than competent as a flanker. I think the reason why Grigg has been playing midfield is because he is proficient on ball. But that doesn't rule him out from playing as a play making flanker at senior level. Guys like Enright, Hurn, etc started life as midfielders and would probably be quite passable if thrown onball these days. My only query on Grigg as a flanker is that he doesn't appear to have the dash of a Yarran, Shaw, Davis type which means that the penetration he provides is purely through his kicking.

 

[tysonp]

With the discussion about the half back line I believe Lester will be the one to play the role as the 3rd tall defender next year and create some run and carry out of the backline.

With our first pick in this draft I'm going to be biased and say we should pick up Toby Greene. Having seen Toby play and trained with him in previous years I can say that he is the hardest worker I have seen on the track. He will imporve the sides ability to win the clearance and contested footy, which is badly needed, especially with Blacky retiring must likely at the end of 2012.

 

[cotter101]

Personally If we got Hoskin Elliot I think he would be able to play down back. He can break lines, has good speed and good skills, Kavanagh could do the same. If not I would take a inside midfielder like Tyson or Greene if available

 

[Lace Out]

Is Hoskin- Elliot a likely starter round 1 for the club that selects him ?

 

[cotter101]

Is Hoskin- Elliot a likely starter round 1 for the club that selects him ?

Depends who he get selected by. But I think he would plays reserves for a bit and see how he goes. But if he has a good pre-season well then it is possible.

 

[blackpowerlappin]

I like Polec and Lester in the back 6. In particular Polec. Looks like the modern half back prototype. Hanley and Polec on the flanks with 50 games behind them will be interesting. Potential is great, hopefully they make it. As mentioned, Bartlett would be great in that type of a role too, may need some time to settle into the big time whne he gets his chance. POBT mentioned O'brien, like him on a wing/HFF especially if Polec can settle in to a half back role.

Will be interesting to see if Lester and Polec grow any further over the off season. A little height with their agility can only make them better.

Whilst its not a trade thread, D Beams on a wing/flank would be more than handy. No potential trade options or exchange of draft pick suggestions required thanks, just a comment.

 

[cotter101]

Would be looking at Docherty one of my favourites in the draft along with Hoskin Elliot.

 

[charles202]

If we end up with Freos first round pick I would love us to pick up McKenzie at pick 16.

Would seem to be a good value pick and also fill a need for a couple of years time.

Pick 8 = Sumner
Pick 16* = McKenzie
Balance = KPP/Ruckmen

 

[cotter101]

Billy Longer has pinged a hamstring according to Emma Quayle. And she thinks he could last to pick 10 or a bit later even. Surely we would take him If available

 

[Gibbo_88]

Why? From what I've read he is a ruckman and he is over 2 metres tall so it is very unlikely he is going to play CHB or CHF for us.

 

[cotter101]

Why? From what I've read he is a ruckman and he is over 2 metres tall so it is very unlikely he is going to play CHB or CHF for us.

First of he is a Ruckman which is a position we need players in and he can play forward with stints in the ruck.

 

[Gibbo_88]

He's over 2 metres tall isn't he? If so then I can't see him playing as a key forward and playing only a bit in the ruck. I would be shocked if we drafted him, we need a back up ruck, not another no. 1 ruck. Think the club is better off getting 1 or 2 from the rookie draft and another through trade week either through a pre-listed player from GWS or another club than using pick 8 on him.

Ben Brown would cost far less and sounds pretty impressive from what a few guys have said in the phantom drafts.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

He's over 2 metres tall isn't he? If so then I can't see him playing as a key forward and playing only a bit in the ruck. I would be shocked if we drafted him, we need a back up ruck, not another no. 1 ruck. Think the club is better off getting 1 or 2 from the rookie draft and another through trade week either through a pre-listed player from GWS or another club than using pick 8 on him.

Ben Brown would cost far less and sounds pretty impressive from what a few guys have said in the phantom drafts.

Exactly. While I'm thrilled to have Leuie, I can't justify taking a ruckman with an early pick when you can get one a bit more cheaply down the order.

Here's a list of the first rucks at every AFL club:

Adelaide: Jacobs - #72 2009 / Maric - #40 2004
Brisbane: Leuenberger - #4 2006
Carlton: Warnock - #42 2005 / Hampson #17 2006 / Kruezer #1 2007
Collingwood: Jolly - #31 2000R
Essendon: Hille #40 1999 / Bellchambers #8 2007PSD
Fremantle: Sandilands #33 2001R
Geelong: Ottens #2 1997
Gold Coast: Smith (pre-selection)
Hawthorn: Renouf #24 2006 / Bailey #18 2005
Melbourne: Jamar #7 2001R
North Melbourne: Goldstein #37 2006 / McIntosh #9 2002
Port Adelaide: Brogan - #26 1999R / Lobbe #17 2007
Richmond: Vickery #8 2008 / Graham #5 2005R
St. Kilda: McEvoy #9 2007
Sydney: Mumford #57 2007R
West Coast: Cox #28 1999R
Western Bulldogs: Hudson #58 2003

I'd challenge anyone to assert that the first-rounders in that group are, as a whole, any better than those taken second round or after.

From a cost/risk viewpoint, I can't see that it's worthwhile "wasting" a first round pick on a ruckman, no matter the need. I'd be happy using one or two of our later picks on a ruck, and one/two in the rookie draft.

As a side point, I've never understood why we don't use the rookie list more for ruckmen.

 

[Bobby Beecroft]

Exactly. While I'm thrilled to have Leuie, I can't justify taking a ruckman with an early pick when you can get one a bit more cheaply down the order.

From a cost/risk viewpoint, I can't see that it's worthwhile "wasting" a first round pick on a ruckman, no matter the need. I'd be happy using one or two of our later picks on a ruck, and one/two in the rookie draft.

As a side point, I've never understood why we don't use the rookie list more for ruckmen.

From another perspective how many ruckman that have been taken top 10 have failed? Not quite sure myself just thought I would throw it out there.

Leuenberger, Kreuzer, & Natanui all appear to be as good as it gets going forward.
Of the rookie/later pick ruckman for each one that has made it there has been dozens fail.

Without researching it, from our own recent past ruckman taken later or on the rookie list don't tend to be around that long. Why do we only have Leuy at this current stage? Perhaps as you state it says more about our own ability to rookie list potential ruckman, but in recent times the sure fire way to get a good ruckman has been to select the 1st one available.

Wouldn't concern me if we took Longer if available, especially if we get Freos pick 16. For once Cotter I am with you.

 

[tancas]

I know recruiter's emphasize alot on being able to kick when drafting these day's, but I think another key element we should be looking at in these kids is being able to win the footy in 1 on 1 contest's.
Looking at Collingwood you don't see many of them getting beaten 1 on 1, and I know this can come with time but for some players it comes naturally.
So even if you have a great kick but you can't win the footy in 1 on 1 contest's (eg: Cale Morton) then it should be a big NO.

 

[POBT]

Why? From what I've read he is a ruckman and he is over 2 metres tall so it is very unlikely he is going to play CHB or CHF for us.

Quigley reckons he's got a fair bit of forward talent.

I dunno. He seems a ruck who can go forward occasionally. I wouldn't set a forward line up around him.

Interesting that, according to one or two, Longer was apparently a lock for top 5 and anyone who suggested otherwise needed their head read. Might be a lesson to some that the draft rankings change almost daily at this time of year.

My gut feel is that he won't be there at our pick but it is no sure thing.

 

[POBT]

I know recruiter's emphasize alot on being able to kick when drafting these day's, but I think another key element we should be looking at in these kids is being able to win the footy in 1 on 1 contest's.
Looking at Collingwood you don't see many of them getting beaten 1 on 1, and I know this can come with time but for some players it comes naturally.
So even if you have a great kick but you can't win the footy in 1 on 1 contest's (eg: Cale Morton) then it should be a big NO.

Good call. I reckon it is something that Hadley rates highly.

 

[Crusha]

He's over 2 metres tall isn't he? If so then I can't see him playing as a key forward and playing only a bit in the ruck. I would be shocked if we drafted him, we need a back up ruck, not another no. 1 ruck. Think the club is better off getting 1 or 2 from the rookie draft and another through trade week either through a pre-listed player from GWS or another club than using pick 8 on him.

Ben Brown would cost far less and sounds pretty impressive from what a few guys have said in the phantom drafts.

For what it's worth.......


[youtube]0v8rhT6bGjA[/youtube]

[youtube]WQs5dF7IoNQ[/youtube]

 

[Harry Haller]

Jackson Coleman or Fletcher Roberts anyone?

 

[cotter101]

Well if HFF07 is correct we are very interested in Mitch Brewer and Ben Brown. I would assume we would have to trade for Brown but I'm not sure if we would have to trade for Brewer. I'm getting a DVD of Mitch Brewer in the mail from his dad so I will tell you about him when I get it(Stay Tuned). Or is there anyway I can upload it without having to upload it to youtube first?