2012 Draft Discussion

[CallumBartlett]

Yeah it might be a good idea to play a wait and see with getting highly, highly speculative picks when we're entrenched in the top 8 but we're not and we're a long way off playing finals and hemorrhaging money like there's no tomorrow and drafting another tall utility and ruck/foward when we've got a dozen of them in the team won't help us get there. I guess kerr gets to keep his job as he placates his sycophantic supporters here with a couple of his 'analysis' blogs every year and supporters are leaving the club in droves in the real world.

Who'll replace brown when he retires? Are we hoping one of our ruck/forward spuds will miracously come good or our tall utilities to suddenly grow 4cm and become contested marking machines because I'm not seeing it. We've got no one currently good enough to tie browny's bootlaces.

First of all your assuming that we have to have a gorilla up forward not necessarily. We may choose to have a three pronged 3rd tall style forwards which we have in abundance. Mayes is a no-brainer, he was the best pick at our position, Kerr has always had a best available policy at our first pick and it showed tonight.

Paparone, was a needs pick, he was touted to go around 30 odd for the majority of the phantom's. Kerr probably knew if we didn't take him at 23, we wouldn't have another chance. He's one of the very few in the draft who can play tall at both ends and he's not one of these 190cm Plowman types, he's a genuine big boy. His endurance is the best in the draft for his size, 15+ beep, he will work his ass for the team and present all day, he often drives his opponent into the ground averaging 16.5 disposals for W.A. His consistency is brilliant (the reason we didn't take Jaksch imo) he kicked 45 goals in 17 games for East Freo and kicked at least one goal in all but one of those games. His kicking, marking and strength are all questionable but he will have a couple of years (and pre-seasons) to work on all three, remember we do have time on our side. His agility and work rate will eventually allow him to play in the midfield (if we want) or just turn into the next Nick Riewoldt. Hadley is permanently in WA and would have seen and interviewed this guy 100 times, this should be the pick we are most confident with.

Close, I'll agree is questionable but his size gets me excited, he's ready made at 196 cm and 85 odd kilos, he's not necessarily a footballer but he's an athlete having also a 15+ beep we could turn him into anything. He also has a great determination and will to make it, he travelled 2000 km after his nan's funeral to get to the state combine. His kicking for a big man is elite, both at goal and ground kicking. His hands need work but again he'll have a couple of years in reserves to work on the little issues.

In conclusion, Mayes will play next year at some point and Paparone and Close are brilliant athletes with a great size, although they both have issues, they'll have a couple of years to work on them, a KPP is not a pressing issue but what it will do is put pressure on Karnezis, Cornelius and the like to perform better, which gives us good depth. Remember we got Martin and Moloney and Staker and Luey are coming back from injury, Bartlett, Docherty etc. haven't debuted yet and there are many youngsters who will keep developing, we're in fine shape.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Mayes' reserved nature seems to really fit the 'no dickheads' policy. Seems like a selection based on a mixture of best forward/mid talent available and temperament.

And maybe Port did us a big big favour.

 

[Old Den]

Just to alleviate some of the apprehension, Close is seen by many as a versatile kpp that could easily develop into a chb, as Quigs has already stated. Switched ends quite regularly for the Rebels this season and it was only injury that kept him from the big games during the Nationals.

In Inside Football the North Ballarat Rebels region manager made these points on Close:

Had a great start to the season.
Played well for Vic Country.
Then missed games with a high ankle sprain.
Can play forward or back.
Fantastic endurance base.
15 beep test.
Is fiercely competitive.
Has a good kick on him.

He deserves his chance...plenty of talls at the club now...let the cream rise to the top...plenty of smalls/mids too,it's going to be competitive.

 

[mpal6]

May need to start looking at free agents from other boards. I hear whispers that Wonaeamirri33 is considering a move.

Been carrying you lot on my shoulders for years. Have been double and triple-teamed by opposition trolls with little or no support.

TBD + first rounder for UTG.
On a winner here !!!

 

[POBT]

Don't really have an opinion on Paparone or Close as players, and I would like to think our recruiters are making better informed opinions that the media "experts" and BF phantom drafters, but I just fell that if we had picks in the 40's or 50's rather than 23 and 32 we could have ended with the same players. Maybe a better strategy would have been to trade picks 23 or 32 and still use later picks for Paparone or Close. Sorry if my previous post come off as bagging the recruiters, that wasn't my intention.

It depends on how much our ratings of players changes in the period between trade month and the draft.

It is worth remembering that we chose Paparone over just about every KPP mooted for the 15-35 range. We had the choice of White, O'Brien, Clurey, Shaw, Mcintosh, McBean, Smith and Wood and we still chose Marco. That says volumes to me about how the recruiters rated the bloke and, moreover, that we weren't prepared to take the risk that someone would nab him between 23 and 32.

And then, as Quigley said, just about every other rated KPP was taken straight after we took Paparone. Perhaps we were slightly blindsided by that but it is worth remembering that crispy creme linked us to Close a few days ago. The theme I'm getting from this draft is that the clubs saw the talls as a lot more even that the phantom drafters and media did. Guys like White, McIntosh, Stewart, Paparone and Close went a fair bit higher than predicted. Others like Clurey, Wood, Smith went a bit lower.

Of the live picks between 23 and 33, only one was not a KPP - that is remarkable and tells me that there was neither a universal view on players nor a great deal of difference between the various options.

 

[ManOfClay]

Another link with Mayes is Merrett's wife is from the same town in SA.

Could be comforting? I don't know.

 

[Haso]

Another link with Mayes is Merrett's wife is from the same town in SA.

Could be comforting? I don't know.

Could be. Sometimes we hear about which players take on the draftees when they first get up here. Billy Longer lodged with Leuenberger before he moved in with Docherty and his girlfriend.

We've also got Redden, Polec and Clarke as local SA boys to help him feel at home. Not sure how much that will help, though.

 

[CallumBartlett]

Also I'm not sure about the zone rookie selection but neither Brisbane nor Gold Coast used one in the 2011 rookie draft (two drafts ago), in the 2012 draft Gold Coast used there QLD priority selections on Sexton and Jackson Allen in the National Draft while we used our zone selection on Michael in the rookie draft so I'm not sure what that means in the rookie draft?

 

[The Flying Belgian]

It's worth noting that Mayes' actions as the top 10 went off the stage didn't look like those of someone who was disappointed. Gave one of the AFL talent manager's a high five.

 

[ManOfClay]

We've also got Redden, Polec and Clarke as local SA boys to help him feel at home. Not sure how much that will help, though.

The closeness to family would be a big thing. When Mayes went to school in Adelaide, he didn't board. The whole family moved. His two older brothers went to school in the country and had graduated so at that stage it was Sam and his twin sister.

 

[possum8]

I like what we have done. We desperately needed KPP's going forward as they do generally take a while longer to get to speed. We can use the next couple of years to bolster our midfield stock before pushing for a tilt at the flag hopefully.

 

[Hollow Knight]

The closeness to family would be a big thing. When Mayes went to school in Adelaide, he didn't board. The whole family moved.

Cool... so they'll all move to Brisbane then.

 

[CallumBartlett]

Could be. Sometimes we here about which players take on the draftees when they first get up here. Billy Longer lodged with Leuenberger before he moved in with Docherty and his girlfriend.

We've also got Redden, Polec and Clarke as local SA boys to help him feel at home. Not sure how much that will help, though.

And our reigning club champion.

 

[BuntonRules]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/vlad-i-want-to-cap-the-interchange-at-20-per-quarter.98153

He said:

Last night two coaches came up to me and said you didn't tell us you were I going to cap the interchanges next year. I told them yes I did, we announced it....

Mayhap this has something to do with us taking the 2 big men with elite endurance - Kerr is preparing for the game as it will be in 3 - 5 years. From all I have seen/read I have faith in our recruiting team.

Have wanted Sam Mayes all season, but would not let myself get my hopes up. Pepperoni & Close replace Retzy, and both seem that they really want it. Methionx McKeever may only be short term - for needs.

We will see. And thanx for the laughs, some of the emo's posting here.

 

[Bobby Beecroft]

BRISBANE LIONS

What the recruiter said"The area we lack a bit of polish in is our forward area. It was a slightly tricky pick (eight). We debated long and hard about whether we go tall early or wait later. In the end we felt the class of Sam (Mayes) was too attractive to pass up on. Sam helps us in that regard and we think he also becomes a midfielder as he develops. And the other two boys we'll see as playing forward of centre as well." - Brisbane Lions national talent manager Rob Kerr.

Pick 8: Sam Mayes, North Adelaide
Kerr says: He's a very good kick, that helps us in terms of delivery, but we feel he has the ability to move into the midfield after he develops his footy. Clearly he'll start in a forward role and has played on a flank in the SANFL. He'll have a big frame, he's quite quick and he shows signs of being able to get in and out of the game as well and will be a bit of a weapon for us with his versatility.

Pick 23: Marco Paparone, East Fremantle
Kerr says: He's a non-stop runner, he's got super endurance. Another area Michael (Voss) wanted to address was he thought we lacked that player to connect that defence with our forward half and we think Marco's got the ability to do that. (National recruiting manager) Graham Hadley has seen him since he was 15 and really brought him to our attention around about April-May in terms of the players we really hone in on.

Pick 32: Michael Close, North Ballarat
Kerr says: He had a couple of super games early in the season in the TAC Cup. He got injured and fell away a bit so we're probably picking him on his early season form. The thing we like is he's very competitive young man, got a bit of aggression. He's got very good endurance and he's not a bad kick. When he's on-song he looks like a powerful mark. Got a good leap too.

 

[uzabuz]

Welcome to the club boys!.

I know very little of the draft beyond the top prospects. More than happy to back in our recruiting department after their recent track record. Looking forward to next few years to see how they develop.

 

[Ironmonger]

I'm a little disappointed that Wines didn't slip to us at 8, and that Hrovat didn't get to us at 23, but it seems like the recruiting team were left with picking their favourites remaining out of a great swarm of speculative KPPs with the second and third picks, and that's the way it goes.

I think the odds are probably against all of the KPPs selected in that glut of them between 23 and 36. The way they were ordered didn't really bear much resemblance to the phantom draft order.

 

[carnthemlions]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/vlad-i-want-to-cap-the-interchange-at-20-per-quarter.98153



Mayhap this has something to do with us taking the 2 big men with elite endurance - Kerr is preparing for the game as it will be in 3 - 5 years. From all I have seen/read I have faith in our recruiting team.

Have wanted Sam Mayes all season, but would not let myself get my hopes up. Pepperoni & Close replace Retzy, and both seem that they really want it. Methionx McKeever may only be short term - for needs.

We will see. And thanx for the laughs, some of the emo's posting here.

I was just about to post something similar. If this goes ahead, having big guys who have good endurance and can play in multiple positions could could become a lot more important in the future

 

[lionsrthebest]

quigs - picked Tim O’Brien a good pick in the mock draft ( was not one i was aware obvious hawthorn liked him too of, but i agree with quigs had alot of upside reading about him and watching in replays ) in detail- i feel better option than macro p

Tim O’Brien is a quality key forward with some real pace.
O’Brien isn’t as big as you’d like from a key forward but his marking, particularly in contested situations, is a real feature of his game.
If O’Brien continues to develop his strength and endurance he’ll be a real handful for opposition defenders in a few years.
It is hard to place O’Brien in this draft but I’m a big fan, smart key forwards don’t grow on trees and smart, quick key forwards are even rarer.
I’d expect O’Brien to get selected in the first two rounds of the draft.
Tim O’Brien’s Highlights

 

[Blackswan]

Some thoughts on Marco from someone who watches WAFL colts.

Marco Paparone 193/85 East Fremantle

STYLE LIKE: Keplar Bradley

*TRADEMARK: Lead and Lead again

*SUMMARY ASSESSMENT, RECOMMENDATION:

*DISPOSAL, DECISION-MAKING, SMARTS:

- Very accurate field kick, perhaps the by product of such a poor set shot routine. Has developed an excellent sense of where his teammates are in the forward 50 and has no trouble weighting the ball to advantage

- Kicks with penetration and solid technique on his right side when spot up his targets, has a tendency to swing and kick around corners rather than pushing back hard off the mark to get himself set. Left foot is acceptable if a little slow.

- Set shot is poor. Ball drop and momentum are the keys for Paparone, once the ball drop goes so too does the momentum. Seems to freeze up occasionally in front of goal, when he gets the yips he is gone for the day and prefers to look for targets in the forward 50. Will need to be pulled aside and given an approach technique to follow come what may.

- Is very solid by hand, has no doubt been the lead up target at training for many years and has a firm grasp of what is necessary for a teammate running past at full tilt, does not fire bullet handballs, nurses the ball onto a runners chest. Has good vision in congestion and likes to handball.



*HANDS: Clean, particularly below his knees. Does not break stride picking up the half volley and powering through with momentum.

*OVERHEAD MARKING: Paparone is excellent on the lead, his hands are always extended to which allows him to take alot of marks in front or receive and arm chop. Where he falls down is when the ball comes in from distance and he is forced to fight for the drop zone. Often lead under the ball and snatches at the ball directly above his head. Needs to read the ball better in flight and arrive at the contest with momentum.

*ATHLETICISM, INTENSITY, ETHIC, CONSISTENCY:

- Acceleration is very good, allows separation on the lead.

-Very good closing speed , capable of running down much smaller sized opponents, rarely does this though.

- Without doubt the fittest of all the boys over 192cm mark coming into this draft. Absolute destroys his opponents at Colts level. Runs one opponent into the ground, smiles as the next comes at him. Massive engine and perhaps capable of pushing into the middle somewhere down the line.

- Big leap, would like him to show it off more by reading the ball better in flight. Excellent cruising speed Paparone’s jog is most other players 80% sprint.

- Good work ethic, especially as a lead up target. May not get into the game early in the piece but is very hard to keep down simply due to the strength of his running game. Perhaps can do more from a defensive perspective, very capable of hunting down opposition runners, doesn’t do it enough.

Very consistent footballer effort wise, will run himself into the ground as a lead up option, will never have to ask him to give more as a leading forward. May need to refine his running patterns to cut down on unnecessary leads.

Improvement Scope

Large – Still believe MP is very raw as a footballer, set shot technique is simply not up to scratch. Also believe he has lost the ability to time his leads as he simply looks to burn his opponents into the ground. It’s a positive at underage football, will need to be more efficient once he progresses up the grades.

*AFL VERSATILITY: - High – I see Paparone being capable of playing multiple positions, his natural position presently is forward, he could be a very strong defender. Has excellent agility, long limbs and a tank to stick with the elite running forwards. A move back would mitigate his set shot kicking and potentially improve his reading of the ball in flight.


*QUERY: - Set shot kicking – ball in flight.

 

[Hollow Knight]

Sounds like plenty to work with. Won't need to come off all the time either. Recruiters definitely thinking ahead to the 2/2 era.

 

[brenjay]

. It'll be interesting to see the careers of longer and Mayes v greene and Grundy unfold.

 

[lionsrthebest]

Leon Harris ex-Fitzroy man (the only genuine expert on SEN coverage) & current High Performance Vic Country Manager was excited when Michael Close 'good pick' was read out as a Lion, not sure what you were listening too.

i will clarify they were referring to macro p at pick 23 .Yes leon did also say he had spoken to brisbane and told the caller brisbane were very happy with their picks what else would they say . i personally believe in terms of skill macro p was not worth pick 23 . i could be proven wrong only time will tell ,wether quigs pick of tim obrien ends up a better choice. i think Quigs deserves credit for his choice in the phantom draft

 

[Haso]

*Marco

 

[13Beast]

3 Bloody forwards?

Sorry but I'm not happy with this draft.

I dare say Cornelius and Karnezis aren't happy with this draft either