2012 Draft Discussion

[Morgs_]

Pretty much. I think the only way we'd get it over the line is 8 and a player, and not sure who GWS would want that we'd be willing to throw in as part of that deal.

Stiller? Would be a great pickup for them and a serviceable clubman to boot

 

[PattyKwasagun]

Stiller? Would be a great pickup for them and a serviceable clubman to boot

But 8 and Stiller isn't exactly better than pick 5 or 6.

 

[jjami15]

I guess one that could kick goals regularly would come in handy going into the future.

For me an older KPF to take the best KPD would help. They're 22 I believe and expected to lead their forward line. Before we start pointing the finger this could be a situation that we could be in ourselves.

 

[cotter101]

But 8 and Stiller isn't exactly better than pick 5 or 6.

Pick 8 and Banfield?

Unsure on whether I want us to get rid of him or not. He has the talent, but can he get back to his best? I'm unsure if he can on can't, could it be the injury that has been affecting him?

 

[jjami15]

Some would argue that those three equate to bugger all in terms of young key forwards.

Some would equate that to our stocks of Ace, Lisle and Retzlaff. What are we left with when Brownie retires?

 

[jjami15]

Pick 8 and Banfield?

Unsure on whether I want us to get rid of him or not. He has the talent, but can he get back to his best? I'm unsure if he can on can't, could it be the injury that has been affecting him?

I've stated this one before as I don't see GWS with any small, speedy forwards

 

[Grimreepah]

Some would equate that to our stocks of Ace, Lisle and Retzlaff. What are we left with when Brownie retires?

It's a problem area for us too.

 

[PattyKwasagun]

Pick 8 and Banfield?

Unsure on whether I want us to get rid of him or not. He has the talent, but can he get back to his best? I'm unsure if he can on can't, could it be the injury that has been affecting him?

I'm not sure even that would do it. It'll probably come down to whether or not we're trying to get pick 1 or 2 in the minidraft. Obviously pick 2 will be cheaper, but may still get Hogan as Martin is very highly rated. It's a massive risk to assume Hogan will still be there at the second pick, though.

 

[LION UP]

I could be mistaken, but I thought both of his knees were LARS fixed?

EDIT--Sorry, getting him confused with Bartlett.

Bartlett had traditional reconstruction in both knees, so not sure what "confusion" you are talking about?

 

[LION UP]

Agree. Bartlett may still prove to be a bargain buy but 3 years without a senior game for a midfielder isn't a great endorsement just yet for repeating the experiment.

Surely a query over his fitness/medical management at the club. The kid works his ...... Off. He doesn't decide his regime just does what he's told.

 

[cotter101]

I'm not sure even that would do it. It'll probably come down to whether or not we're trying to get pick 1 or 2 in the minidraft. Obviously pick 2 will be cheaper, but may still get Hogan as Martin is very highly rated. It's a massive risk to assume Hogan will still be there at the second pick, though.

If we had pick 1 in the mini draft I would probably pick Hogan myself. He is a potential match winner and already ways in at something like 97kgs. And it would not surprise me if a few bottom clubs thought the same. Martin is a very good talent but where our list is at I'd rather try and get a couple of good midfielders through trading and free agency. I also would like to see how Polec and Yeo develop as they have shown some good signs.

I feel a very promising KPF is the biggest hole in our list at the moment, If we don't get one and guys like Rich, Redden, Rockliff and co develop and we have no genuine key forward target than we will end up like Carlton. With that said you could easily come up with a counter argument.

 

[PattyKwasagun]

If we had pick 1 in the mini draft I would probably pick Hogan myself. He is a potential match winner and already ways in at something like 97kgs. And it would not surprise me if a few bottom clubs thought the same. Martin is a very good talent but where our list is at I'd rather try and get a couple of good midfielders through trading and free agency. I also would like to see how Polec and Yeo develop as they have shown some good signs.

I feel a very promising KPF is the biggest hole in our list at the moment, If we don't get one and guys like Rich, Redden, Rockliff and co develop and we have no genuine key forward target than we will end up like Carlton. With that said you could easily come up with a counter argument.

I completely agree, but I think there are a few clubs who would undoubtedly take Martin with pick 1. Gold Coast is one who springs to mind. There is a possibility that we could trade for pick 2 and end up with Hogan anyway, while not having to pay as much as we would've for pick 1.

The issue is, of course, that we really won't know what the club with pick 1 would do and would be taking a massive gamble. I'm sure we rate Martin (it would be hard not to), and he's a handy consolation prize, but if Hogan was our preference for filling the KPF vacancy, trading for pick 2 would just be too risky.

 

[Lions1024]

Surely a query over his fitness/medical management at the club. The kid works his ...... Off. He doesn't decide his regime just does what he's told.

I dare say that they didn't want to get him onto a hectic heavy fitness regime straight after a knee reconstruction, especially considering he's done the other knee aswell. They'll have to up seriously up the ante this pre-season if he's going to make it though, that is if he's still on our list.

 

[cotter101]

I

I completely agree, but I think there are a few clubs who would undoubtedly take Martin with pick 1. Gold Coast is one who springs to mind. There is a possibility that we could trade for pick 2 and end up with Hogan anyway, while not having to pay as much as we would've for pick 1.

The issue is, of course, that we really won't know what the club with pick 1 would do and would be taking a massive gamble. I'm sure we rate Martin (it would be hard not to), and he's a handy consolation prize, but if Hogan was our preference for filling the KPF vacancy, trading for pick 2 would just be too risky.

I also agree with you.

We'd be crazy not to rate Martin, But I'm with the camp(if there's any) that rates Hogan ahead of Martin. But at the end of the day I think the club with the first pick will simply pick one of them based on needs. Both are very good talents.

Kerr seems like a real professional in the way he handles our list and his details after Trade week and Draft day. I'd love for him to come and work for my company but I think he is just doing to good of a job at the club!

 

[blueiris]

I think we only need the one forward can see Lisle improving over the summer as he'll only be 22 next year and he has a lot of talent. Hoping we don't get Tippett but will live it if we do just hope is not another problem like we had with Fevola and injury. Looking at elevating Clarke I think would really work for us and maybe drafting a Tanner Smith if he's avilabel and with Tickner coming though can see our defence really standing up just hope that mid is avilabel at 23 or 30

 

[jjami15]

I feel a very promising KPF is the biggest hole in our list at the moment, If we don't get one and guys like Rich, Redden, Rockliff and co develop and we have no genuine key forward target than we will end up like Carlton. With that said you could easily come up with a counter argument.

I emphatically agree with your sentiments. This need has to be rectified either in trade or draft. I'm not in the Tippet bandwagon and I'm obviously on the Hogan one. However I have been pleasantly surprised with our recruitment team and feel confident that they'll again do a good job. I believe that they will try to get players in to rectify our needs. Currently though for me KPF and KPD needs to be rectified this year due to the longer development that they seem to require. Looking at the last four teams in the finals and possibly last six, elite or at least top of the comp KPF are in all of these teams and finals are what we want our team to play and to not just make up the numbers but to also go deep.

 

[cotter101]

I'm unsure on Tippett now. He has big games that makes you think ''Gee he will be a star'' and games that just plain suck.

 

[POBT]

Pretty much. I think the only way we'd get it over the line is 8 and a player, and not sure who GWS would want that we'd be willing to throw in as part of that deal.

I don't think GC will play in the MD again. Firstly, I think it is over-paying to use pick 2. Maybe Martin is a better prospect but, in reality, is the gap between pick 2 this year and pick 1 next year going to be all that great? Secondly, if I were them, I'd want to start getting games into the 28-30 blokes who are potentially going to win them their first flag. A 17yo playing NEAFL is missing that development. Someone like Toumpas comes straight into the mix. Perhaps short sighted but next season is the year when GC have to start to lower the vision and focus on winning games and building an elite mix.

I think the Dogs will be all over the MD. Either Martin and Hogan will suit them.

I wonder if the Viney situation will play a part in Melbourne's decision. If Melbourne have to take Viney with pick 3 (perhaps paying a little "over"), will they be prepared to put pick 4 on the table for a young bloke who can't play for 12 months? Or will they take the more known, less risk option of a guy who is more ready to go? If they go down the MD path, they run the real risk of having 2 x 5 picks and not getting any of the top 5 players from this year's draft in return. If I were Neeld, I don't think I'd want a bloke who couldn't play for me for 12 months.

So, assuming the Dogs are definitely in the game, GC is out and Melbourne is a maybe, I think we're on the next rung. We're not in the box seat but, if we want to play, I don't think we're absolute outsiders either.

 

[mish33]

Unfortunately, i think we're out of the running. I don't think pick 8 and A player will cut it for either pick in the mini-draft. If I was gws, I wouldn't be giving up a top five talent for next year for pick 8 unless it came with a Polec or Karnezis. They don't have to Give these picks away, and if they rate these two highly, I'd be keeping them in the draft for next year. O'Meara went for 4, I'd be surprised if gws took anything less than pick 5 for either mini-draft pick.

 

[whatboutbob]

nm

 

[POBT]

Unfortunately, i think we're out of the running. I don't think pick 8 and A player will cut it for either pick in the mini-draft. If I was gws, I wouldn't be giving up a top five talent for next year for pick 8 unless it came with a Polec or Karnezis. They don't have to Give these picks away, and if they rate these two highly, I'd be keeping them in the draft for next year. O'Meara went for 4, I'd be surprised if gws took anything less than pick 5 for either mini-draft pick.

They don't have the choice of retaining the mini-draft picks. It is a "use it or lose it" situation. If they don't trade them, then those players are simply available in next year's draft. GWS don't get to keep the extra draft selections.

So it is totally a buyer driven market. The buyers will dictate what the "price" is.

The only reason GWS wouldn't trade the MD picks is if they desperately want one of Martin/Hogan. Assuming GWS will finish last next year, they'll be able to take one of those guys if they forfeit the MD selections. That's a pretty high risk strategy - you're effectively losing out on top 10 picks this year for the sake of maybe getting (arguably) the best/second best player (Martin/Hogan) instead of the third best in next year's draft.

 

[POBT]

nm

lk

I love the backwards alphabet game.

 

[Offsider]

Unfortunately, i think we're out of the running. I don't think pick 8 and A player will cut it for either pick in the mini-draft. If I was gws, I wouldn't be giving up a top five talent for next year for pick 8 unless it came with a Polec or Karnezis. They don't have to Give these picks away, and if they rate these two highly, I'd be keeping them in the draft for next year. O'Meara went for 4, I'd be surprised if gws took anything less than pick 5 for either mini-draft pick.

I wouldn't be swapping a mini-draft pick for Polec on his own, let alone Pick 8 and Polec.

Last year Adelaide traded pick 10 and a first round compo pick (probably considered about that time to be about a pick around 10-12 for Mini-draft pick 2 and Luke Brown, who was potentially thought of as a late first round pick. I think pick 8 with Banfield would get the job done, provided 2 teams below us don't make bids.

 

[Quigley]

Unfortunately, i think we're out of the running. I don't think pick 8 and A player will cut it for either pick in the mini-draft. If I was gws, I wouldn't be giving up a top five talent for next year for pick 8 unless it came with a Polec or Karnezis. They don't have to Give these picks away, and if they rate these two highly, I'd be keeping them in the draft for next year. O'Meara went for 4, I'd be surprised if gws took anything less than pick 5 for either mini-draft pick.

They don't have to trade those minidraft picks but they lose the minidraft picks after this year. Personally I would rather pick 8 and 23 this year and someone like Crouch say next year rather than Hogan only especially when I am absolutely stacked with KPF.

Adel got Crouch for pick 10 plus last year.

It is also worth considering that our academy currently has 3 AIS members. One is a CHF and another is a FF. They will take a bit of time to develop perhaps and I think Tickner will be a better CHB but I am sure Kerr has factored these two into the equation when thinking about how much he wants to sell the farm for Hogan. Hogan is the same age as Tickner and is only a year older than Hammelmann. I have not seen Hammelmann play but he does sound like a nice prospect.

 

[jjami15]

Don't forget that this is the last year for mini draft and the buyers will dictate their worth with what they offer. It's interesting to hear everyone's thoughts and I always believe in never giving overs for anything. I just would want to think that we would put a bid in. Who knows just pick 8 might be enough.