2012 Draft Discussion

[Bert Man]

There are big plans for Isaac Conway as well.

I forgot about him. The future looks good IMO. Can't wait for Tickner as well

 

[ZoBlitz]

Just because the current recruitment team has drafted better than the last recruitment team doesn't automatically mean that they have drafted great. We are still a long way from finals football and filling a quarter of list spots with tall utilities and ruck/forwards won't land us a premiership especially when an inside midfielder (a critical, critical need) wasn't drafted. I'm not a richmond supporter, I can't wait another 8 years without success and there's not a lot the club is doing that makes me confident success is achievable this decade. How long do supporters tolerate the Kerr's recruiting strategies without anything to show for it other than jumping a couple of steps up the ladder? Another 5 years?

What do you think is more likely, that the current recruitment team thought we really needed an inside midfielder but decided to select other player types or that they feel that an inside midfielder isn't a "critical, critical need". They may feel that improvement will come from within and that it's simply a matter of getting games into the midfielders we currently have. You may disagree with the strategies of the recruitment team but they are not idiots. They obviously have a plan in place and they are attempting to draft and trade according to that.

You obviously have a general disdain for the tall utilities and ruck/forwards that we've drafted recently. Is it cause you question the quality or you simply feel we should have less? I see it more as providing depth in an area that we've struggled in. For instant, we only technically have three pure ruckmen on the list: Longer, Leuy and Martin. And we arguably don't have many tall key forwards/ruck-forwards: Brown, Lisle, Michael (rookie) and now Close and Paparone (Staker and Cornelius are probably more third talls than anything else). I don't see how that's a massive amount of our list taken up with those types of players, especially considering their ages.

Considering that we had the issues with Fevola and we've lost Clark, Sherman, Riska, Bradshaw and Brennan in the years since 2008 it's unreasonable to suggest we should have been on an uphill trajectory for the entirety of that period. It's only this season we've managed to stem the flow of players leaving for cash. We've also obviously lost out on some prime picks due to the GC and GWS introduction which has cost us. We went from a middle of a road team to a rebuilding team due to various issues. We've managed to cobble together a midfield (Rocky, Redden and Rich) that could be very very good once they gain further experience and that's down to some very sensible recruiting.

I also find your ranting rather bizarre considering we won ten games last season and arguably improved from the year before, and this is with some of our players having inconsistent seasons. Was winning six more games than the previous season a poor result for us? Should Kerr not take some of the credit for the improvement considering some of our key players this season were drafted under his watch?

Teams don't suddenly become premiership winners. I think you have unreasonable expectations as to how quickly a premiership side can be developed.

Edit: Oh and has been mentioned, maybe the recruitment team is taking into consideration the academy players on the horizon.

 

[BigCat2]

Just because the current recruitment team has drafted better than the last recruitment team doesn't automatically mean that they have drafted great. We are still a long way from finals football and filling a quarter of list spots with tall utilities and ruck/forwards won't land us a premiership especially when an inside midfielder (a critical, critical need) wasn't drafted. I'm not a richmond supporter, I can't wait another 8 years without success and there's not a lot the club is doing that makes me confident success is achievable this decade. How long do supporters tolerate the Kerr's recruiting strategies without anything to show for it other than jumping a couple of steps up the ladder? Another 5 years?

Simple question for you: what do you think we should have done instead, given the state of our list in the last few years, and without the help of premium draft picks? "Try drafting an elite talent with every single pick, and make sure they're contributing consistently from year 1 to the senior team?"

 

[dlanod]

So that's your idea of a good success rate? Absolutely baseline AFL talent? We've got no elite talent to show for our years of being at the bottom of the table and all we've got are guys capable of getting us 4 wins less than required to make the top 8. The pies have won a flag since 2002, sydney and west coast are at the top again since '06 I'm not happy seeing my team being satisfied with the subpar results the team achieved this year and the rapidly declining membership numbers suggest I'm not the only one.

Well unless you plan to walk back in time and fire our recruiting and list management team from the early 2000s through to 2007, you're going to have to suck it up or switch teams. Because those years gutted our team. If you have a look at any of the teams you named, they'll all have a huge percentage of their team from those drafts. Those are the players at or hitting their peak right now.

Just because the current recruitment team has drafted better than the last recruitment team doesn't automatically mean that they have drafted great. We are still a long way from finals football and filling a quarter of list spots with tall utilities and ruck/forwards won't land us a premiership especially when an inside midfielder (a critical, critical need) wasn't drafted. I'm not a richmond supporter, I can't wait another 8 years without success and there's not a lot the club is doing that makes me confident success is achievable this decade. How long do supporters tolerate the Kerr's recruiting strategies without anything to show for it other than jumping a couple of steps up the ladder? Another 5 years?

Agreed, we lack elite talent - how many "elite talents" have been drafted pick 7 or later since 2008? Because we've only had one pick below that (pick 5) in those years.
Agreed, we're a few years away from finals football, at least - how many other clubs have less of a dependence on the drafts since 2008? Given the "average age" stat commonly quoted, everyone but Gold Coast, GWS and maybe Melbourne.
Agreed, an inside midfielder would be nice - should we have "reached" and got Lonergan at 8? Or "reached" and gotten Saunders and McDonough at 23 and 33, since they seem to be the next two inside midfielders drafted? Or would you have a nice set of posts up complaining about how we always pick guys that no one else rates?

Basically from all your posts, what I get the impression is that I can throw out all the facts and figures I want to support that our current recruiting team deserves the benefit of the doubt at this point, given their track record, and that our club's player issues are largely due to the previous drafting organization, but you'll reject it with no actual case made to support your POV and instead complain about how it should all be magically better. Correct?

 

[Bucking Beads]

I would have thought we have plenty to show for Kerr's recruiting strategy..

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Rich, Docherty, Mayes, Paparone et al may yet prove to be elite. Look how long it has taken a guy like Deledio tp make the grade. We would have had Mark Murphy if he had wanted to come. No credit to Carlton there. Buddy is elite but nobody other than Hawthorn wanted him. The draft is a glorified lottery and we have done OK these last few years considering.

 

[Apex61]

Ah, the way certain posters were using "spud" willy nilly, I just assumed it was one of those terms for "cool" that sound bad, like "sick" or "badass". I guess I was just trying to be cool.

Keep it real bro.

 

[chopperduck]

Just because the current recruitment team has drafted better than the last recruitment team doesn't automatically mean that they have drafted great. We are still a long way from finals football and filling a quarter of list spots with tall utilities and ruck/forwards won't land us a premiership especially when an inside midfielder (a critical, critical need) wasn't drafted.

It does mean you can't hold them responsible for the previous terms bad drafting. We have made more progress with our list in the last 3-4 years than we ever did in the 6 or so years prior to that, that alone speaks volumes about the current guys in charge. Yes, it is too early to tell just how good the current recruiting is, but early signs are certainly pretty good. When we are getting players like Yeo, Karni, Lester and Green, just to name a few with later picks, that previously ended up being used on players who would be lucky to get 20 games before being delisted, you can see why many here aren't happy to have someone complaining so much about the recruiting. This isn't even counting the use we've made from our rookie list recently as well, Golby, Crisp, Rocky and now the likes of Clarke and Michael. Again the point is, this is all very recent drafting, and they are still developing players. We won't win a flag with a team of 20-22 year olds, and on the back of our previous crap drafting, a full list rebuild is what we are looking at, which is why it is taking awhile.

Who says having a 1/4 of the team with tall utilities isn't going to win a premiership? The game is changing, and i'm pretty sure most of the premiers all have a nice balance of healthy talls in key positions, as well as players that can have an impact in more than 1 position. We can't win a premiership without a forward line or ruck division, just look at good Carlton go by having a team of mids with no quality talls.

In your opinion we didn't get a critical need of an inside midfielder, who is to say you are right though. It is fine to have that opinion, but flat out saying the recruiting staff, who do a good job, and actually do this for a living, got it wrong as it doesn't match your opinion is a reach. I share a similar opinion, i think we are 1 genuine inside on baller mid short still, but we also did bring in Moloney, an inside clearance specialist who will immediately make an impact on our team. Even if we drafted a mid, you would still be looking at 3-4 years before they are up to the level we would need, which brings me to your next point...

I'm not a richmond supporter, I can't wait another 8 years without success and there's not a lot the club is doing that makes me confident success is achievable this decade. How long do supporters tolerate the Kerr's recruiting strategies without anything to show for it other than jumping a couple of steps up the ladder? Another 5 years?

If you can't wait for success, you're going to be very disappointed. I don't think you have fully understood just how far back we are coming from with our list, and just how long it takes to rebuild via the draft. You say we should have drafted an inside mid, yet you don't seem to want to wait the time it would take for an 18 year old to develop. Perhaps it is this very reason that we got a player like Moloney in, someone who can come straight in, give us that boost on the inside and play for a good 2-4 years, buying us a bit more time to find the mids we want. Perhaps we have high hopes for Conway, and Moloney just buys us a couple of years. By the time Moloney is done, Redden, Rich, Rocky are all in their prime, Conway has 3-4 years of development, and who knows how the likes of Zorko, Green and Beams are going. That sounds like a potentially pretty strong midfield to me. Add a bit of class around the edges in Mayes ( a player we apparently shouldn't have drafted), Polec, Docherty, Golby, Hanley and you can start to see the possibilities of our future midfield. And make no mistake, we are looking 3-4 years ahead of time, as any good recruiting team should be.

Now do the same thing for our forward line. Brown is gone. To date, we don't have 1 other player who has stood up and taken a KPF spot on the list. Lisle looked promising the end of last year, but needs to follow that up this year with 22 solid games to take that spot. Sam Michael looks a decent prospect, but again, hasn't played a game yet, could be anything or nothing. What other KPF stocks do we have? Longer is there as a resting ruckman, but he isn't the KPF we need for the future. Ace is a 3rd tall, certainly not a KPF at AFL level. In 3-4 years, when our midfield will be on song, we won't have a forward line. This is why we have addressed the forward line in this draft. It is the reason why we wanted Hogan. Clearly we didn't like the top end KPF talent in the draft, so we went for the next best thing, someone in Close who has all the attributes that we can hopefully mold over the next few years into someone who can play a KPF post for us in the future. Even then, he isn't a sure thing, but unlike mids, you can't draft a KPF and expect them to make an impact within 2 years.

We need to start working on our entire KPF stocks because in 3 years we might not have any. I'm happy to keep discussing the merits of an inside mid, as i agreed above, i do think we need to get one, but the need for one isn't as pressing as our need to get some work done on our forward line, especially when you take development time into account for mids v KPF. It is unfair, and unreasonable, to bag out our recruiting guys simply because they don't match up with your opinion, likewise to blame them for our current woes. Rome wasn't build in a day, neither is a premiership team. You'll find plenty of people who agree with you on your choice of draftee, you'll find none who will tolerate you playing the blame game with our recruiting staff.

If it's a team of Mids you want, with no look in for talls, you'll find the Carlton board the next line down from the Brisbane board.

 

[Dan12]

So that's your idea of a good success rate? Absolutely baseline AFL talent? We've got no elite talent to show for our years of being at the bottom of the table and all we've got are guys capable of getting us 4 wins less than required to make the top 8. The pies have won a flag since 2002, sydney and west coast are at the top again since '06 I'm not happy seeing my team being satisfied with the subpar results the team achieved this year and the rapidly declining membership numbers suggest I'm not the only one.

Rockliff, Rich, Redden, Hanley and soon to be Polec and Karnezis are very high quality players and surely Lester, Green, Harwood, Beams will lock a spot in the best 22 in the next 2-3 years. That's as well as Staker, Maguire and Raines through trade. All these guys were drafted between 2008-2010. Seeing as this is such a poor result in your opinion, I assume you'll show us what we should have done by pointing to other clubs' players and who they got in this time and how they have gotten genuinely elite talent where we have not. You can't use top 3 picks as examples because we have been robbed of them thanks to the expansion teams. For your information, Beams was the only player in the AA team drafted between 2008 and 2010. That's ONE we and many clubs missed, taken at pick29.
There's also no one taken in the first round (except the top 3) in 2008 who I would genuinely rate above Rich and Dayne Beams is the only one taken in the second round that I'd rate above Redden, there's no rookies/sliders I'd rate above Rockliff and the only mistake I concede is we took Banfield at 41 and Sloane went at 44. And 2009 was bad list management but not poor drafting, which you'd assume was pushed by the football staff and list management and not the recruiters like Hadley and Farrell. They also picked up Golby, probably a ten-year defender, in the rookie draft. So 2010, well getting Polec, Lester, Karnezis and Green is good drafting to me. And Alex Johnson is the only elite player we've missed in there, at pick 57. Please show us what the current recruiting staff have done wrong, what you would have done, what other clubs have done that is so much better than us. And where are these elite players we've missed, discounting top 3 selections? Actually curious

 

[patfullfankezz]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/hammo-the-hack-is-at-it-again.258985/page-33#post-24174241

My post with all the wonderful picks between 02-07...........

Out of 35 players, only Joelly, Jeddy, Danny M, Leuey and Polks are still with us and made the grade. In fact, because I have no life, I am now going to check how many games these guys played.

2002
Jared Brennan - 119 for us, 39 for the Suns. Pass on games played, fail as a player though
Troy Selwood - 75. Fail
Danny Merrett - 125. Pass
Anthony Corrie - 53 for us, 3 for Collingwood. Fail.
Daniel Pratt - 3 games for us, 116 for North. Fail
Kevin Tandoga - 0 games, Fail

2003
Llane Spaanderman - 3 games for us, 0 for West Coast. Fail
Matthew Moody - 34 games. Fail
Jed Adcock - 141. Pass
Tom Logan - 3 for us, 89 for Port. Epic fail. Yes, I'm giggling right now.
Michael Rischitelli - 111 for us, 35 for the Suns. Fail

2004
Cameron Wood - 16 games for us, 48 for Collingwood. Fail
Pat Garner - 0 Games. Fail
Justin Sherman - 114 for us, 24 for the Dogs. Again, I'm giggling. FAIL.
Jayden Attard - 5 for us, 20 for St. Kilda. Fail
Luke Forsyth - 0 games from what I can find.

2005
Mitch Clark - 82 for us, 9 for Melbourne. Attitude problem to boot. Fail
Wayde Mills - 16 games. Fail
Rhan Hooper - 48 for us. 6 for the Hawks. Fail
Joel Patfull - 139 games...and is it worrying that I knew that off by heart? Epic Win.
Ben Fixter - 27 games for Sydney, 27 games for us. Fail
Jason Roe - 50 games for us. Fail
Leonard Clark - 0 games from what I can find
Cheynee Stiller - 100. Not sure whether a pass or not, he did his role I guess.

2006
Matthew Leuenberger - 66 games. Pass
Albert Proud - 29 games. Fail
Chris Schmidt - 2 games with us, 18 with Adelaide. Fail
James Hawksley - 32 games. Fail.
Matt Tyler - 0. Fail
Sam Sheldon - 43. Fail

2007
Lachie Henderson - 15 for us, 45 for Carlton. Pass for them I guess.
Tom Collier - 27 games. Fail
James Polkinghorne - 81 games. Pass
Bradd Dalziell - 15 for us, 11 for the Eagles. Fail
Matt Austin - 15 games. Fail

Note I'm only grading a pass or fail based on what we got out of them, which for some of these guys wasn't much at all. More knowledgeable heads will probably be able to correct me.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Every team has missed high quality players in the draft. And many so-called guns chosen with high picks have turned into duds. Neither scenario defines the recruitment performance. The only true measure is how the chosen players develop and perform over time. I'm personally very happy with how our list is developing and believe this is largely due to the current recruiting team. We are getting to the stage where we have multiple options for all positions and I can foresee that nest year, injuries permitting, the selectors will have many sleepless night fitting the available players into the "best" 22. I'm excited.

 

[Tassie4ever]

Watched a bit of the U18's and recall Paparone's name cropping up regularly. My recollection is he was a super-impressive big forward who ran non stop.

Re Polec: made a point of looking at his performance in the Fox replays and saw a bit of him in reserves performances last season.

First off, it is obviously way too early to write him off and I sincerely hope he makes the grade. However to my cynical eye he looks way too slow, far too one-sided and very much a receiver. No doubt the coaches will have passed on the message.

It is unfortunate that Polec has been lumped with the Pick 5 label and that he came to us as a supposedly well-finished senior footballer. He deserves neither tag.

 

[chopperduck]

I think the biggest thing with Polec is that many 'think' he was a well rounded senior experienced footballer, but this just wasn't the case. He played senior footy, but he was a very outside offensive styled wing/HF. He even said himself (saw if somewhere, don't have a link) that he was never coached the defensive side of the game, he was never expected to do it. Reality is, he is a very natural, gifted footballer, but he still has a lot of development to go before he can be a regular senior player. I think this is something that many don't realise, and simply see him as a lazy or effortless player. He will be a very classy player, but he needs time to round out his game. As good as he is, he is exposed at AFL level currently. It doesn't surprise me that we played him more through the middle at 2nds level, and it wouldn't surprise me if this continues next year to even the point of run with roles. I'm sure the coaching staff are very happy with his offensive abilities, he will be solely getting marked on the other aspects of his game, and when he hits some form doing that, he will get a few senior games. I think especially if you are a top 5 pick, your expected to be this complete footballer, ready to be a main stay at AFL level within 24 months. This just simply isn't true. The few mids that are able to do this are the exception, not the rule.

Good things come to those that wait. Polec also really needs a solid full preseason. Whilst he hasn't had any big injuries, he has had a few small niggles which have limited him. A complete preseason i think will do him wonders.

 

[chopperduck]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/hammo-the-hack-is-at-it-again.258985/page-33#post-24174241

My post with all the wonderful picks between 02-07...........

I did a similar post maybe a year ago, looking at the average age of our players, and why we are such a young and inexperienced team. I knew we didn't have much from the 02-07 period, but i didn't realise it was so grim until you actually put the effort in to have a look. Not only did we not get much from our 2nd and 3rd round picks, but the few good ones we managed to snag, the likes of Sherman (early days Sherman) and Riska, we lost. We also wasted nearly all of our first round picks. I think Bergs is the only 1st round pick players still on our list from that period. Whilst these might not have been super high picks, it's still a shocking strike rate. Not only were many of these players delisted, but hardly any of them really went close to being a solid lock in best 22 player.

Thank god for the few ones we managed to snag locally and recycled, Drummond, Merrett and Patfull. The reason we aren't that great now, is because we should have 4-6 players minimum from this period who are in the 24-27 age bracket who are in their prime and are best 22 players. We don't.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I think Polec will be a fine player once it all clicks. Desperately needs to stay fit for a long period to help it happen.

 

[whatboutbob]

Regardless of his own development, Polec will look a hell of a lot better once our clearances improve.

 

[Scubaveg]

Listening to Loyldy the other night he seemed to indicate Mayes doesn't get enough of it. Pepperoni seems a player on the Cloke category for mine. Of the three guys I think Close will surprise the most.

 

[matwt73]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/hammo-the-hack-is-at-it-again.258985/page-33#post-24174241

My post with all the wonderful picks between 02-07...........

Out of 35 players, only Joelly, Jeddy, Danny M, Leuey and Polks are still with us and made the grade.

Great work Kezz but I don't agree with some of your grading.

Most players never get to 100 games. It is a significant milestone and any player drafted who gets there must have been a 'recruiting pass'. I know that Sherman, Brennan and Mitch all had personality issues and perhaps the recruiters should have been aware of that but we still got something from them just on game volume. I'd make them all passes.

Rischa left In circumstances that may be tough to pin on our 'recruiters' too, it may be the whole football dept has to bate the blame for that, so i'd not call him a fail.

It does seem that there is a dearth of 'elite' talent, hindsight being a wonderful thing. But we didn't have many high picks in those years.

It's not great but on paper it could have been worse. Ie Melbourne

 

[pauldrc]

Also, some of those that are now gone can't necessarily be considered failures considering we received other players/picks who so far seem to have worked out ok....

 

[carnthemlions]

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/hammo-the-hack-is-at-it-again.258985/page-33#post-24174241

My post with all the wonderful picks between 02-07...........

Out of 35 players, only Joelly, Jeddy, Danny M, Leuey and Polks are still with us and made the grade. In fact, because I have no life, I am now going to check how many games these guys played.

2002
Jared Brennan - 119 for us, 39 for the Suns. Pass on games played, fail as a player though
Troy Selwood - 75. Fail
Danny Merrett - 125. Pass
Anthony Corrie - 53 for us, 3 for Collingwood. Fail.
Daniel Pratt - 3 games for us, 116 for North. Fail
Kevin Tandoga - 0 games, Fail

2003
Llane Spaanderman - 3 games for us, 0 for West Coast. Fail
Matthew Moody - 34 games. Fail
Jed Adcock - 141. Pass
Tom Logan - 3 for us, 89 for Port. Epic fail. Yes, I'm giggling right now.
Michael Rischitelli - 111 for us, 35 for the Suns. Fail

2004
Cameron Wood - 16 games for us, 48 for Collingwood. Fail
Pat Garner - 0 Games. Fail
Justin Sherman - 114 for us, 24 for the Dogs. Again, I'm giggling. FAIL.
Jayden Attard - 5 for us, 20 for St. Kilda. Fail
Luke Forsyth - 0 games from what I can find.

2005
Mitch Clark - 82 for us, 9 for Melbourne. Attitude problem to boot. Fail
Wayde Mills - 16 games. Fail
Rhan Hooper - 48 for us. 6 for the Hawks. Fail
Joel Patfull - 139 games...and is it worrying that I knew that off by heart? Epic Win.
Ben Fixter - 27 games for Sydney, 27 games for us. Fail
Jason Roe - 50 games for us. Fail
Leonard Clark - 0 games from what I can find
Cheynee Stiller - 100. Not sure whether a pass or not, he did his role I guess.

2006
Matthew Leuenberger - 66 games. Pass
Albert Proud - 29 games. Fail
Chris Schmidt - 2 games with us, 18 with Adelaide. Fail
James Hawksley - 32 games. Fail.
Matt Tyler - 0. Fail
Sam Sheldon - 43. Fail

2007
Lachie Henderson - 15 for us, 45 for Carlton. Pass for them I guess.
Tom Collier - 27 games. Fail
James Polkinghorne - 81 games. Pass
Bradd Dalziell - 15 for us, 11 for the Eagles. Fail
Matt Austin - 15 games. Fail

Note I'm only grading a pass or fail based on what we got out of them, which for some of these guys wasn't much at all. More knowledgeable heads will probably be able to correct me.

8 decent afl players in 6 years. Not a great success rate
I don't think even the list manager would approve

 

[patfullfankezz]

LOL, yeah, I didn't think my grading was all that accurate.

I just do super-sleuthing, I'll leave the analysis to you guys lol.

 

[knaf]

I am astounded that posters are still going on about our recruiting. My view is that is ok. I could go through to give examples, which in my uninformed opinion would be both positive and negative, but in general the current recruiting team is organised and thoughtful. This is all we can ask for. It is a far better approach than somehow expecting to pick a star out of every pick even if it is third round or higher.

Did anyone read The article in the age yesterday. I would put in alink if I understood how to do it. The basic message was that recruitment is the start of the process for both the club and the individual, not the end.

The unanswered question in my mind is has the current coaching team got the skills to get the most out of these edgy creative types like Polec, PK and maybe Mayes? Vossy seems very good at working with "blokey" footballs like Brown and Rocky. I think he hasn't demonstrated he can work across the range of personnality types that make up a team. I am reserving judgement on Polec and this aspect of Voss' coaching to the end of this year.

Recruiting is only part of building a successful team.

 

[Skoob]

Yeah I wish we had a recruiter that had a good success rate as well but alas, we're still nowhere near finals footy.

So that's your idea of a good success rate? Absolutely baseline AFL talent? We've got no elite talent to show for our years of being at the bottom of the table and all we've got are guys capable of getting us 4 wins less than required to make the top 8. The pies have won a flag since 2002, sydney and west coast are at the top again since '06 I'm not happy seeing my team being satisfied with the subpar results the team achieved this year and the rapidly declining membership numbers suggest I'm not the only one.

Just because the current recruitment team has drafted better than the last recruitment team doesn't automatically mean that they have drafted great. We are still a long way from finals football and filling a quarter of list spots with tall utilities and ruck/forwards won't land us a premiership especially when an inside midfielder (a critical, critical need) wasn't drafted. I'm not a richmond supporter, I can't wait another 8 years without success and there's not a lot the club is doing that makes me confident success is achievable this decade. How long do supporters tolerate the Kerr's recruiting strategies without anything to show for it other than jumping a couple of steps up the ladder? Another 5 years?

Yeah, don't know why you'd still support such a shit team.

What I find truly interesting about this (Lions) forum is mix of people posting here. By my estimation there is maybe 5 or 6 regular posters with elite intimate knowlege of reserves and under 18 football, including academy players and interstate comps who bring their wealth of knowlege to draft threads. Another tier down, of members who follow our own reserves and have a sound understanding of our young players' developments. Then a swag of people who love our senior team and post with passion, showing a true interest in all our club does.
There are a heap of young posters who love their footy and have a youthful excitement for where we're at and where we're going, with a keen interest in our youngest players, probably of similar age to themselves (this is a great thing as some of these people were'nt even watching footy when Brisbane dominated).

What doesn't interest me are the handful of posters who are rarely seen all year but are happy to pop in to tell us how shit we are. Draft night and the days after amazed me with the amount of expert traffic doomsaying. Where were these experts offering their draft tips before the draft? Where were they all year when we were winning?

Now I do not follow the reserves (though I enjoy reading the reserves thread here to see how some are tracking), and that is why I don't participate in phantom drafts and the like. I simply don't know these young kids vying for a shot at AFL. Also that is why I can't share an informed opinion on who we've picked up or how they fit.

There is a term used in footy of "list cloggers". Those who make up the numbers without much promise, add little to the team and have limited skill. They offer nothing.
It seems Big Footy too has its own "list cloggers".

 

[irel]

Yeah, don't know why you'd still support such a shit team.

What I find truly interesting about this (Lions) forum is mix of people posting here. By my estimation there is maybe 5 or 6 regular posters with elite intimate knowlege of reserves and under 18 football, including academy players and interstate comps who bring their wealth of knowlege to draft threads. Another tier down, of members who follow our own reserves and have a sound understanding of our young players' developments. Then a swag of people who love our senior team and post with passion, showing a true interest in all our club does.
There are a heap of young posters who love their footy and have a youthful excitement for where we're at and where we're going, with a keen interest in our youngest players, probably of similar age to themselves (this is a great thing as some of these people were'nt even watching footy when Brisbane dominated).

What doesn't interest me are the handful of posters who are rarely seen all year but are happy to pop in to tell us how shit we are. Draft night and the days after amazed me with the amount of expert traffic doomsaying. Where were these experts offering their draft tips before the draft? Where were they all year when we were winning?

Now I do not follow the reserves (though I enjoy reading the reserves thread here to see how some are tracking), and that is why I don't participate in phantom drafts and the like. I simply don't know these young kids vying for a shot at AFL. Also that is why I can't share an informed opinion on who we've picked up or how they fit.

There is a term used in footy of "list cloggers". Those who make up the numbers without much promise, add little to the team and have limited skill. They offer nothing.
It seems Big Footy too has its own "list cloggers".

You forgot the "Whipping Boys" tier Skoob.

 

[Skoob]

You forgot the "Whipping Boys" tier Skoob.

Yeah well, I daren't mention any cliques either