Opinion 2012 draft thread.

[Crippa#9]

For the last spot, I would imagine we will look at bringing in a more mature aged player. It seems Rogers is a fan of introducing a ready-made type player each year considering it has worked reasonably well in the last couple of years..
Any ideas if we are keen on anyone in this category?

 

[Azul]

Colquhuon officially back in Adelaide with Port confirming they will take him in PSD.

No surprises there, with Port's last choice in the national draft at pick 30.

Could've taken him at pick 69, so I guess the club are content with the young talent on our list in selecting two mature discards (Tippett and Collins) in the rookie draft. (Not my viewpoint, to be honest.)

 

[Azul]

For the last spot, I would imagine we will look at bringing in a more mature aged player. It seems Rogers is a fan of introducing a ready-made type player each year considering it has worked reasonably well in the last couple of years..
Any ideas if we are keen on anyone in this category?

See above. Joel Tippett as depth for injury prone Jamison, Henderson and Laidler.

 

[Windhover]

We know he can ruck, in that sense he has proved himself a number of times over the past couple of seasons. But what he's not shown is that he can contribute in other areas and ultimately the game is heading down a path where ruckmen who can't do much else are no longer particularly valuable.

As to the path the game is heading down I disagree completely. Mummy, Jacobs and Hudson (at least in seasons gone by) spring to mind as big logs who can win or hold their own in the ruck contest and are invaluable to their sides just for that. Mummy was so important to Sydney they played him injured in the GF - when he could not even ruck let alone move around the ground - just to give Pyke a chance for a breather.

If you have a big log winning in the ruck, you get to impose your game on the opposition. If you are losing in the ruck the other side get to impose their game on you. This has always been true. Wherever the "game is heading" it will remain true for the simple reason that it gives a side the first move.

He didn't have a huge impact in the Geelong game outside of the ruck contests, the contested mark at the end of the game was his only mark for the match.

He did not take the mark - he was rightly awarded a free. As to not having a huge impact I disagree. He is recorded as having had 31 hitouts (to Ottens 27) which accords with my memory of his game, which was that he performed impressively in the ruck.

He was good in the finals series, I'll certainly give him that but he was monstered against the Eagles.

Yep, he was monstered by 2 of the best working on him in tandem. He still got 31 hit-outs and gave a contest all day. His effort was outstanding in the circumstances.

 

[Windhover]

Versatile ruckmen go forward and kick goals.

Warnock sits on the bench for 5 minutes a quarter. With a 3-man interchange, clubs expect more.

No, they "hope" for more, they don't expect it. St Kilda went into the 2009 GF with Gardiner and King each able to play 50% game time. Sydney went into the GF this year hoping to get 1/2 a game out of Mumford (they didn't even get that much). How did that work out for them? 5 minutes on the bench a 1/4er is no problem at all.

Kreuzer has shown more as a KPP than Warnock ever will.

And your point is . . . ?

I can't recall a single time (perhaps 1 game returning from injury) that Kreuzer played in the VFL - which is what you're suggesting.

No, it is not what I was suggesting. I am a firm believer in having 2 ruckmen always (and W, K and H at a pinch in certain games). Kreuzer will never be as good a tap ruckman as Warnock is capable of being because he cannot jump high enough and is too short. It follows that Warnock is our best bet for first ruck. This leaves Kreuzer needing to improve his KPF play, not so that he is better than Warnock (which would not be hard) but so that he becomes the threat he promised to be in his first season. This would give us a ruck combo similar to King and Ottens circa 2007, which seemed to work ok.

 

[Kramer1]

No, they "hope" for more, they don't expect it. St Kilda went into the 2009 GF with Gardiner and King each able to play 50% game time. Sydney went into the GF this year hoping to get 1/2 a game out of Mumford (they didn't even get that much). How did that work out for them? 5 minutes on the bench a 1/4er is no problem at all.

No, it is not what I was suggesting. I am a firm believer in having 2 ruckmen always (and W, K and H at a pinch in certain games). Kreuzer will never be as good a tap ruckman as Warnock is capable of being because he cannot jump high enough and is too short. It follows that Warnock is our best bet for first ruck. This leaves Kreuzer needing to improve his KPF play, not so that he is better than Warnock (which would not be hard) but so that he becomes the threat he promised to be in his first season. This would give us a ruck combo similar to King and Ottens circa 2007, which seemed to work ok.

37 out of 90 something possible games since crossing to Carlton. I agree that all we have for Warnock is hope. Durability is a most under rated quality.

Kreuzer may not be as good a tap ruckman as Robert Warnock...or even Peter Street for that matter, but when he went it alone in the ruck this year (the last eight games or so?) I thought the quantity and quality of his tapwork very good, and all under some physical duress as we would later come to learn. Factoring in him being more influential at the contest, and in general play...I have him a long way a head of Warnock as first ruck.

Kreuzer never has and never will be a legitimate key position option.

 

[Windhover]

37 out of 90 something possible games since crossing to Carlton. I agree that all we have for Warnock is hope.

Who do you think you are agreeing with or do you know something about his medical circumstances that the rest of us don't know?

Durability is a most under rated quality.

Yep, those who didn't recruit Judd and Joel Selwood

Kreuzer may not be as good a tap ruckman as Robert Warnock...or even Peter Street for that matter, but when he went it alone in the ruck this year (the last eight games or so?) I thought the quantity and quality of his tapwork very good, and all under some physical duress as we would later come to learn. Factoring in him being more influential at the contest, and in general play...I have him a long way a head of Warnock as first ruck.

Peter Street? Really? You think Kreuzer is not already better than Street as a tap ruckman by, well, the length of a street? Street was hopeless as a tap ruckman.

never has and never will be a legitimate key position option.

You seem not to rate Kreuzer at all. Do you think he cannot play the forward role that Ottens played for Geelong when King was the first ruck? Or that Nicnat and Cox play for WC?

 

[Jimthegreat]

Hmmmm, not sure I agree with this. We have a fantastic 3rd tall in Andrew Walker (he's the same height as Jack Darling I believe). And we just drafted another potentially excellent 3rd tall forward in Menzel. Also, it is my personal belief that Hammer still holds the #1 position on the totem pole at FF. He'll have another preseason working on his skillset under his belt come season start.

Walker / Waite / Menzel
Betts / Hampson / Garlett

That forward line makes me salivate in anticipation.

Be alot happier if we put a key forward at FF, not a ruckman.

 

[Azul]

St Kilda went into the 2009 GF with Gardiner and King each able to play 50% game time. Sydney went into the GF this year hoping to get 1/2 a game out of Mumford (they didn't even get that much). How did that work out for them? 5 minutes on the bench a 1/4er is no problem at all.

You've cited 2 examples where two sides went into grand finals with half-fit rucks. On the flip side: David Hale, 1st ruck 2012 - 2 goals. That Roughead was completely useless is another story...

Cox and Naitanui each averaged a goal in 2012.

And your point is . . . ?

That Kreuzer's versatility around the ground and 48 career goals to 12 make him a more valuable contributor than Warnock than just pure tapwork.

No, it is not what I was suggesting.

You weren't suggesting that we drop Kreuzer for Warnock? Ok then, because Hampson is a better KPF than either and statistically a better ruckman to advantage than Kreuzer.

So if Warnock plays in the ruck for the majority of the game, then Hampson is a better choice for a KPF.

 

[Dramoth]

Small forward??

According to his wiki entry, he is 182cm tall and is a forward. Considering that our medium forwards are 187-191cm tall, wouldnt being 182cm tall make him a small forward?

Especially considering that Jeffy is 180cm...

 

[Kramer1]

Who do you think you are agreeing with or do you know something about his medical circumstances that the rest of us don't know?

I agreed with you when you stated that the club hope for more from Warnock. All I know of Warnock's medical circumstances is that he has the constitution of a wet noodle. I doubt this information is exclusively mine.

Yep, those who didn't recruit Judd and Joel Selwood

I don't know what this means. To clarify my point though I value durability very highly...like MK's effort in playing out the year under duress.

Peter Street? Really? You think Kreuzer is not already better than Street as a tap ruckman by, well, the length of a street? Street was hopeless as a tap ruckman.

Perhaps an exaggerated example...I really don't recall enough of Streety's work. He was very good at being tall though, as is Warnock...I don't think this alone is enough to lock down a first ruck role. When MK went at it solo in the ruck he averaged over 30 hit outs, did his thing at the stoppages and contributed off the ball. For mine this puts him a long way ahead of Warnock as first ruck.

You seem not to rate Kreuzer at all. Do you think he cannot play the forward role that Ottens played for Geelong when King was the first ruck? Or that Nicnat and Cox play for WC?

You seem far too switched on to miscomprehend me so. Sure Kreuzer can rest forward and he can play valuable cameos at times. With Warnock filling a first ruck role this would resign MK to longer periods in the forward line, which I do not think good for team balance. Kreuzer on ball and Hampson up forward works for me.

 

[Kramer1]

Back to the PSD/rookie draft...and I might be the only lonely figure still pushing this barrow...do we know if Surjan has nominated for the PSD?

 

[Jeremias]

Back to the PSD/rookie draft...and I might be the only lonely figure still pushing this barrow...do we know if Surjan has nominated for the PSD?

You most certainly aren't a lone figure there, I've been keen on him for months.

Not sure whether or not he has nominated, but even if he has, I can't see us taking him unfortunately.

We've recruited Temay who can play as a small defender but I would have thought that having an experienced player like Surjan around could help ease him into the system.

I can't trust AJ as a small defender. There's some merit to giving him a go further up the field but I would hope that we've just about seen the last of him being isolated in the defensive 50 as he's just not suited to that role.

 

[BlackGoanna]

The ruck debate....

Kruezer is our no/ 1 ruckman ..... Warnock is No/2

Hampson is our no/ 1 fwd ruckman ..... Casboult is no/2

I would play Kruezer as a predominate around the ground ruckman and use Hampson as the Fwd/ Ruck

If Kruezer is injured or out of form in comes Warnock. Ditto for Casboult and Hampson

Casboult could also play as a permanent forward in replacement of Waite or White. We also have the option of playing Waite as a high half froward if they are all firing.

 

[Kramer1]

You most certainly aren't a lone figure there, I've been keen on him for months.

Not sure whether or not he has nominated, but even if he has, I can't see us taking him unfortunately.

We've recruited Temay who can play as a small defender but I would have thought that having an experienced player like Surjan around could help ease him into the system.

I can't trust AJ as a small defender. There's some merit to giving him a go further up the field but I would hope that we've just about seen the last of him being isolated in the defensive 50 as he's just not suited to that role.

Agree on all points...but we have been very conservative so far, surely we can't play a straight bat for the entire 27 months of the draft period. I note a desire for the CFC to reach out and engage with members in the last day or two, perhaps they are listening.

 

[Stamos]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...and-the-afl-20121206-2axns.html#ixzz2EFPNbZxX

 

[mediumsizered]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...and-the-afl-20121206-2axns.html#ixzz2EFPNbZxX

Interesting turn of events given that Reimers stated in an interview on the AFL website that he had more to offer & his career was far from over in his eyes. I'm wondering where the truth lies in this whole Reimers saga.

 

[Sin City]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...and-the-afl-20121206-2axns.html#ixzz2EFPNbZxX

Thank god for that.

 

[coryne]

Yesterday AA "moved on" from his position in the AFL


Today Riemers "rejects" Carlton


There truly is a god !!!!!!!!!

 

[Kramer1]

Nice of Dr Niall to speculate that Menzel's knee will probably require surgery at some time...what a sh*tstain.

 

[Silvagnis]

Get Tipungwuti or someone who might be a long shot, but is desperate to play AFL.

 

[Blue Flame]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...and-the-afl-20121206-2axns.html#ixzz2EFPNbZxX

Ah... OK. Well all's well that ends well.
I do like the almost incoherent sentence where he tries to tie in Menzel 'maybe' needing surgery in the future...

 

[Blue Flame]

Reimers, rejects Carlton

What a poxymoron.

Edited for truth.

 

[Roy71]

Get Tipungwuti or someone who might be a long shot, but is desperate to play AFL.

I hope Shane Rogers takes a punt on Dale Wallam from WA.

Dale WALLAM (East Fremantle)
DOB: 12/7/93. Ht: 188cm. Wt: 73kg.
Pos: Medium midfielder.
"Dale is an exciting indigenous kid from Mullewa who is exceptionally quick, has silky skills and can break the lines as a forward. Goes in and out of the game a bit so needs to work on his consistency within games. He's eligible for another year of Colts next season." - East Fremantle football manager Damien Gaspar.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

So did we ask for Reimers to train with us, or vice-versa?

Bit strange he never even fronted.