Review 2013 - Redo the 2013 AFL draft

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Ambrosia

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Kelly was voted the 3rd best player in the comp behind Dusty and Danger in 2017. Merrett is not at that level - the level he is at is still good but you can’t put him along side Kelly.
To me level and league arenta the same thing. Merrett was a top 10 mid in 2017. I'd say that puts him in the same league as Kelly .
 

Ambrosia

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It's all highly subjective. In my opinion, it's laughable to suggest Merrett is in their league. I'd have him no higher than 6th for this draft since Sicily and Brown would also be above him
When two neutral posters have put Merrett ahead of Bont just on the last page. I'd suggest it's your bias that has them leagues apart.
 

Virgin Dog

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When two neutral posters have put Merrett ahead of Bont just on the last page. I'd suggest it's your bias that has them leagues apart.
Oh you're right, two random Bigfooty posters have the same opinion, so it must be objective fact.

Let's even just ignore these facts:
- Bont polls better in Brownlow
- Bont has won 2 b+f vs Zach's 1, including in a premiership year
- Bont polled better in the rising star, coming second in one of the closest results ever
- ALFPA best first year was Bont in 2014
- AFLCA best young player was Bont in 2015
- Bont named in best 22 under 22 all 5 times he's been eligible vs Zach's 3
- Bont captained the best 22 under 22 the last 3 years in a row
- Bont is rated 20th in player ratings after an injury interrupted year. Zach is 41st

Please tell me more about how Zach is the better player
 

Wild Bill

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Oh you're right, two random Bigfooty posters have the same opinion, so it must be objective fact.

Let's even just ignore these facts:
- Bont polls better in Brownlow
- Bont has won 2 b+f vs Zach's 1, including in a premiership year
- Bont polled better in the rising star, coming second in one of the closest results ever
- ALFPA best first year was Bont in 2014
- AFLCA best young player was Bont in 2015
- Bont named in best 22 under 22 all 5 times he's been eligible vs Zach's 3
- Bont captained the best 22 under 22 the last 3 years in a row
- Bont is rated 20th in player ratings after an injury interrupted year. Zach is 41st

Please tell me more about how Zach is the better player
After having a down 2018 posters quickly forget how good he is.
 

Ambrosia

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Oh you're right, two random Bigfooty posters have the same opinion, so it must be objective fact.

Let's even just ignore these facts:
- Bont polls better in Brownlow
- Bont has won 2 b+f vs Zach's 1, including in a premiership year
- Bont polled better in the rising star, coming second in one of the closest results ever
- ALFPA best first year was Bont in 2014
- AFLCA best young player was Bont in 2015
- Bont named in best 22 under 22 all 5 times he's been eligible vs Zach's 3
- Bont captained the best 22 under 22 the last 3 years in a row
- Bont is rated 20th in player ratings after an injury interrupted year. Zach is 41st

Please tell me more about how Zach is the better player
Never said he was the better player. Just pointing it's out it's moronic to suggest there is a gulf between them .
 

Wild Bill

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I haven't forgotten. I'm still taking him at 1 (assuming he doesn't have a debilitating injury)

Those who have Cripps ahead of Kelly and Bont underrate the impact top being an elite kick .
Cripps other weapons more than make up for any deficiency’s in his kicking. Fyfe and Danger aren’t great kicks but are superstars.

Players voted Cripps the 2nd best player in the comp in 2018. He is an amazing player.
 

Ambrosia

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Cripps other weapons more than make up for any deficiency’s in his kicking. Fyfe and Danger aren’t great kicks but are superstars.

Players voted Cripps the 2nd best player in the comp in 2018. He is an amazing player.
Yeah Cripps is still a jet I just think the pure class of Kelly and Bont is hard to overlook
 

Alphonse_

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Yeah Cripps is still a jet I just think the pure class of Kelly and Bont is hard to overlook
That's a reasonable comment, in reality, you'd love to have any of the trio at your club, what I will say is that Cripps has had to shoulder a heavier work load then Jelly and Bont, mainly due to Carlton being cactus.

Amazing to think he fell to pick #13 (at the time, many draft experts thought he was a 'speculative/risky' pick)

Really hope The Bont can recapture his 2016 form, he was the most explosive and fun player to watch in the league during the Dogs premiership year.
 

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BJK#5

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That's a reasonable comment, in reality, you'd love to have any of the trio at your club, what I will say is that Cripps has had to shoulder a heavier work load then Jelly and Bont, mainly due to Carlton being cactus.

Amazing to think he fell to pick #13 (at the time, many draft experts thought he was a 'speculative/risky' pick)

Really hope The Bont can recapture his 2016 form, he was the most explosive and fun player to watch in the league during the Dogs premiership year.
Jeez it's scary to think how good Cripps will be when he gets more support. When he has the opportunity to pick and choose where to try and have an impact teams will be having nightmares on how to deal with him. If Carlton can develop a midfield that can hold up without him he is going to be a massive headache up forward. If he can get more damaging players around him to take advantage of the space given to them due to his dominant work in and around stoppages the Carlton forward line will start to get great service. So excited to see what he can become.
 

Prochard123

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It's all very tight. Personally I'm easily having Bontempelli ahead of Brown. Tall mids that go forward and can play anywhere are worth their weight in gold. I recon you have nailed the top 10 bar Sheed.

Personally

1. Kelly (not by much but I'd have him at 1)
2. Cripps
3. Bontempelli
4. Sicily
5. Brown
6. Merrett
7. Barasss
8. Fantasia
9. Crouch
10. Langdon or Cameron
25 year old KPF who has kicked 60 goals 2 seasons in a row and placed top 3 in coleman 2 seasons in a row is worth his weight in gold more like...

What has Bontempelli done? He's been just good at best both as a forward and as a mid. He's been more or less the same player for 3-4 seasons now, if anything I think he was much better 3 years ago.

Everyone else in the top 5 has shown an upwards trend for years and continue to improve.

I acknowledge Bont of being an efficient and capable player, but to justify having Brown below him ugh...
 
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Alphonse_

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25 year old KPF who has kicked 60 goals 2 seasons in a row and placed top 3 in coleman 2 seasons in a row is worth his weight in gold more like...

What has Bontempelli done? He's been just good at best both as a forward and as a mid. He's been more or less the same player for 3-4 seasons now, if anything I think he was much better 3 years ago.

Everyone else in the top 5 has shown an upwards trend for years and continue to improve.

I acknowledge Bont of being an efficient and capable player, but to justify having Brown below him ugh...
If we are judging it on 2018 input (only) than yes, BB is ahead of Bont, but if we are evaluating them for their entire careers to date, Bont has to be rated higher than Brown (whom i am a massive fan of)

I do agree that the general AFL community (esp the media) doesn't fully recognize the feats and talent of Ben Brown (small club syndrome sadly)
 

LukeParkerno1

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25 year old KPF who has kicked 60 goals 2 seasons in a row and placed top 3 in coleman 2 seasons in a row is worth his weight in gold more like...

What has Bontempelli done? He's been just good at best both as a forward and as a mid. He's been more or less the same player for 3-4 seasons now, if anything I think he was much better 3 years ago.

Everyone else in the top 5 has shown an upwards trend for years and continue to improve.

I acknowledge Bont of being an efficient and capable player, but to justify having Brown below him ugh...
One was a key ingredient to winning a premiership, without Bontempelli that year such was his importance, I doubt the Dogs win. He's performed in bigger games, and starred in them at times. Last year was a writeoff for Bontempelli too, he was barely half fit, and if anything the Bulldogs should have pulled the pin earlier. Such was his ability though is he can play forward even at half fitness. Personally I view performance in big games higher (not just finals but they help), and that will show with my list.
 

Bulldog1954

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What has Bontempelli done? He's been just good at best both as a forward and as a mid.
He's been the best player in a premiership team. He's won two best and fairests and came third in another. He has come top ten in the Brownlow twice. That seems like a fair bit to have "done" before the age of 23 and a little more then "just good at best".
 

Prochard123

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He's been the best player in a premiership team. He's won two best and fairests and came third in another. He has come top ten in the Brownlow twice. That seems like a fair bit to have "done" before the age of 23 and a little more then "just good at best".
Ok, fair, I see your point.

Maybe I should’ve rephrased it, what has bont done in the 2 most recent years?

The ranking was from today’s perspective, what Bont was 3 years ago doesn’t mean nearly as much as you think.

I suppose he did finish 8th in Brownlow last year, but Brayshaw finished top 3... and would you take Brayshaw ahead of any of Cripps/Brown/Kelly?

At best you could put Bont 4th in this draft, which is also where he was drafted. I'd even argue that Merrett and Sicily will both have a better 3 seasons to come but at the very least putting Bont in the top 3 is ridiculous.
 
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Suitcase

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1. Kelly
2. Cripps
3. Sicily
4. Bont
5. Merrett

The Lions drafted Aish, Gardiner, McStay, Taylor, Cutler and Robertson in this draft. All bar Aish are currently still on our list and are best 22 players. Great draft for us. Gardiner in particular is a ripper.
 

RedmanWasHere

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Top 7 is unmovable for me.

Bontempelli.
Brown.
Cripps.
Crouch.
Kelly.
Merrett.
Sicily.

If he continues his current trajectory, Barrass will sit comfortably alongside them.
Likewise Darcy Gardiner.

Wouldn't be surprised to see Billings, Aish, Boyd, Taylor and the recently delisted Hartung continue to slide.

Retrospectively, the 2013 Draft could be 30-40 names deep (RL included) and it will be fun trying to position them wherever.
 

carnthedons

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Top 7 is unmovable for me.

Bontempelli.
Brown.
Cripps.
Crouch.
Kelly.
Merrett.
Sicily.

If he continues his current trajectory, Barrass will sit comfortably alongside them.
Likewise Darcy Gardiner.

Wouldn't be surprised to see Billings, Aish, Boyd, Taylor and the recently delisted Hartung continue to slide.

Retrospectively, the 2013 Draft could be 30-40 names deep (RL included) and it will be fun trying to position them wherever.
Don’t think Fantasia can get to that top level if he can stay healthy?
 

RedmanWasHere

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Those 40+ names (rookies included) are:

  1. Acres.
  2. Aish.
  3. Ambrose.
  4. Barrass.
  5. Billings.
  6. Bontempelli.
  7. Boyd.
  8. Brown. (First time eligibility was 2010.)
  9. Byrne-Jones.
  10. Cameron.
  11. Cripps.
  12. Crouch.
  13. Cutler.
  14. Dumont.
  15. Dunstan.
  16. Fantasia.
  17. Gardiner.
  18. Harmes.
  19. Hartung.
  20. Hewett. (He debuted in 2016 and is already up to 71 games.)
  21. Hunt.
  22. Impey.
  23. Jones.
  24. Jake Kelly.
  25. Josh Kelly.
  26. Knight.
  27. Kolodjashnij's.
  28. Langdon.(First time eligibility was 2012.)
  29. Lobb.
  30. McCarthy.
  31. McDonald.
  32. McStay.
  33. Merrett.
  34. Nankervis. (First time eligibility was 2012.)
  35. Pearce.
  36. Robertson.
  37. Salem.
  38. Scharenberg.
  39. Sheed.
  40. Sicily.
  41. Taylor.
  42. Turner.
On name view, it bats deep.

Quality wise, definitely large gaps.

But, like many drafts, this top group is midfield heavy.
 

RedmanWasHere

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R.e. my list, I should've swapped Hartung with Aliir and Aish with Knight or Gray.

This is another interesting subplot.

Riley Knight vs Sam Gray vs Sam Lloyd vs Lang vs Holman vs Brady Grey vs Aish.
 
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