List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Discussion

[Kelvin31]

Also the draft is way too late after the combine / trade week. It should honestly be a month earlier and have it like 27th Oct. Still gives club plenty of time after trade week to sort out their draft plan and more time for the draftees to get to their clubs and get started. Any reason for the huge gap?

The reason is, because all the year 12 exams are finished by mid-end of Novmeber. Can't have kids getting drafted/not drafted a few weeks before or during exams. Wouldn't work.

So unless they changed the drafting age to 19, the draft date will never be moved.

.

 

[goodcop badcop]

re: heights...there isn't really a more useless stat in aussie rules football is there? surely what matters is a player's standing reach? if a KPF is 6'9" but has t-rex arms, what good is his height?

i'd be shocked if they didn't measure standing wingspan and standing vertical reach (in particular) at the combine...anyone got this data?

They do. I have the combine results from 3 years ago (happy to give them to you if you want them via PM). They test the arm length and hand span. Couple guys which might interest tested, Talia and Roberts. Talia's arm span tested in the bottom 37% which is a bit of a concern. Even Roberts' results weren't that great.

 

[Pannalstaroz]

Jake recently put a photo of himself at the beach on Instagram. I think he'll be fine for reach.

 

[wian]

Anyone know if redpath will be retained as a rookie or upgraded?

With Jones going I presume he is required

 

[Testekill]

Anyone know if redpath will be retained as a rookie or upgraded?

With Jones going I presume he is required

I'd presume that he's going to be upgraded. We have a lot of open spots on our senior list now.

 

[LukasTheGreat]

If Cordy was a 25ish rated pick how come Noone nominated him?

What happened to that Goddard fellow everyone was raving about last season? Did he retire??

 

[Dav1d]

If Cordy was a 25ish rated pick how come Noone nominated him?

What happened to that Goddard fellow everyone was raving about last season? Did he retire??

No Goddard didn't retire

He just had a quiet year, by his standards
last year as an underager he played real well, so it was expected he'd at least perform at a higher level
he didn't

& I can't say about Cordy, I just think he'll take some time to develop

 

[fronkalicious]

If Cordy was a 25ish rated pick how come Noone nominated him?

What happened to that Goddard fellow everyone was raving about last season? Did he retire??

Teams are very conservative re nominating their picks at father/son as they quite often need them for trade period. Geelong loved him for example but needed to hang onto their 2nd and 3rd rounders for the Clark trade.

 

[TempleKelvington]

They do. I have the combine results from 3 years ago (happy to give them to you if you want them via PM). They test the arm length and hand span. Couple guys which might interest tested, Talia and Roberts. Talia's arm span tested in the bottom 37% which is a bit of a concern. Even Roberts' results weren't that great.

lol....why is his arm span a concern?

Recruiter: "we really like little jonny, he's knocks up getting the ball he's clearly the best and most skillful player in the TAC but unfortunately his arm span test were in the bottom 20% and we won't be recruiting him. Most games are won and lost on arm span efficiency these days."

I think we should get rid of Talia and Roberts before it become obvious they don't have arm span.

 

[TempleKelvington]

If Cordy was a 25ish rated pick how come Noone nominated him?

What happened to that Goddard fellow everyone was raving about last season? Did he retire??

Well not like that never happened before.....plenty of people on here point out how we missed on Fyfe and any number of players who were selected much later in draft.

 

[TempleKelvington]

I'd presume that he's going to be upgraded. We have a lot of open spots on our senior list now.

It will depend on his arm span tests I believe.

 

[igloo dweller]

lol....why is his arm span a concern?

Recruiter: "we really like little jonny, he's knocks up getting the ball he's clearly the best and most skillful player in the TAC but unfortunately his arm span test were in the bottom 20% and we won't be recruiting him. Most games are won and lost on arm span efficiency these days."

I think we should get rid of Talia and Roberts before it become obvious they don't have arm span.

is reach more or less important than how far the top of a particular player's head is from the grass, temple?

 

[TempleKelvington]

I think these guys are the most likely to slide to our first pick. From most likely to least likely

1. Durdin - He's had a poor year by his standards. His champs were average and so was his SANFL form. He was played a lot in the ruck, but even when he was played in his preferred position across CHB he never dominated. He hasn't played anywhere near to his potential. I wouldn't spend a top 5 on him personally, though one club like GWS could take a risk early and pull the trigger due to his potential.

2. Lever - I've mentioned before about his injury. I'm no expert in the medical side of things, but from the articles I have researched the risk of him doing a second ACL is quite high. From a snippet in one article, Young, active individuals who return to sport after undergoing ACL reconstruction are at high risk for sustaining a second ACL injury—in the same or the opposite knee—as long as 2 years after surgery.
Clubs in the past are against taking a player who has done an ACL with a top 5 pick, see Selwood, Menzel. So for these reasons I remain unconvinced a club would take him with a top 5 pick.

3. Wright -While Wright says he's more of a forward, there's certainly rumours recruiters are not that sure whether he is more of a ruckman or forward (there's also rumours we are also one of these clubs that aren't exactly sure either). In the last couple years, clubs have gone well off taking a ruckman very early in the draft even though there was a very poor selection of ruckman available (see Grundy and Longer). Maybe a similar thing could happen this year, but I see differences. Wright at least has far more potential to play forward then either of Grundy, Longer. These types of player's aren't easy to come by.

4. Brayshaw - Only real reason he could slide is that he's a no frills type and they might want to go for a more exciting footballer. But he does everything well and is very consistent. A team like Melbourne I think would find him too good to pass up on.

5. McCartin - He's just too good ignore. His form last year was sensational. This year his form has only been solid, but he had injury troubles right throughout the year. Best forward in the draft.

6. Petracca - He's been the stand out player this year. Surprised if St Kilda don't take him if they have pick 1.


So in summing up I think Lever is every chance of being available at our pick. Durdin is the most likely, though I'm really sure if we would even take him. Wright is a chance, but I wouldn't be banking on it. I think these guys are the most likely to bolt.

1. Ahearn - Had a good championships and was very good in the Grand Final. He has a lot of speed and is a noted goal kicker. Clubs tend to like player's who have done it on the big stage

2. Leverde - His best is great, but I'm not sure he's been consistent enough. Even in the TAC he seems to have a good game and then back it up with an average one. He didn't test in the combine either. Hard one to read. I think his range is some where like 6 - 15

3. Weller- Don't think he's too dissimilar to O'Rourke in many ways, who went at pick 2. I wouldn't be picking him in the top 5, but you never know. He's one of the most well rounded footballers in the draft.

4. Marchbank - Up there with one of the best games that I've seen this year at the championships. He's still a bit unknown though, as he hasn't played much this year.

5. Goddard - He's a very good defender and he plays ok as a 2nd tall forward. Not really a dominant force like you'd probably hope for in a top 10 pick though.

Good summary. I agree on wright, could slip and I'm not even sure now that we'll take him. My gut says we really want Lever, just reading between the lines of the interviews I have heard from him and the club.

I wasn't as impressed by Durdin as you are and if we can't get one of the Lever, McCartin or Wright then I'd take Laverde. I reckon we can get Wright if we want him though. I have a feeling he will be really good or a bust. He's likely to be one of those players who doesn't quite find the best position to play.

 

[igloo dweller]

for those in the know - how does the CHF version of wright compare to matt kreuzer playing forward?

 

[Bazza Bulldog]

for those in the know - how does the CHF version of wright compare to matt kreuzer playing forward?

Who can we compare him too ... Kreuzer or Tippett (Sydney version)?

 

[igloo dweller]

i see kreuzer as a type that plays his role well up forward, but an unlikely type to kick 6 goals in a match-winning display. matty, injury-permitting is better off on-ball, linking up play and drifting forward.

tippett is a forward, who by virtue being a mountain of a man and freak athlete, can pinch in the ruck.

if wright is in between, what's his position? do you end up spending P6 on a role player CHF (like kreuzer) or a mobile rick type (like tippett).

 

[TempleKelvington]

i see kreuzer as a type that plays his role well up forward, but an unlikely type to kick 6 goals in a match-winning display. matty, injury-permitting is better off on-ball, linking up play and drifting forward.

tippett is a forward, who by virtue being a mountain of a man and freak athlete, can pinch in the ruck.

if wright is in between, what's his position? do you end up spending P6 on a role player CHF (like kreuzer) or a mobile rick type (like tippett).

This is the issue and the risk. It's why I expect him to slip. He would be a great pick up with later first rounder though. But with a top 6 or 7 pick you have to go for best available.....it's a massive call for the club if he slips and we pass, imagine if he then becomes the forward we would die for and we passed.....

 

[TempleKelvington]

is reach more or less important than how far the top of a particular player's head is from the grass, temple?

Well interestingly, I was reading a write up about Kyle Langford.

This from Bound for Glory:

"It’s also worth noting that he has a really, really long neck. This might not be considered important by many but when considering his height, it is. From ground to shoulder, Langford probably is only the same height as a 183-185cm player."

"It seems some are looking at his 190 cm height and assuming he can be the next great tall midfielder, when in reality his height is very misleading."

He actually wrote that, I didn't make it up. This guy has a long neck! He's actually not 190cm tall....if you take out his neck he's only 183cm tall.

I think these guys over analyse it.......a tad!

 

[igloo dweller]

This is the issue and the risk. It's why I expect him to slip. He would be a great pick up with later first rounder though. But with a top 6 or 7 pick you have to go for best available.....it's a massive call for the club if he slips and we pass, imagine if he then becomes the forward we would die for and we passed.....

i agree
we'll definitely go with lever (who then re-injures his ACL and fizzles / or goes onto to be the best rebounding CHB since The Chad).
or laverde (who remains consistently inconsistent and a turn-over machine / or irons this out and becomes Kouta Mk II).
or goddard (who doesn't become a gun, but is a serviceable CHB for 10 years / or who doesn't become a gun, but is a serviceable CHB for 10 years)

the club is going to cop it if the 'chosen one' doesn't come on, even though there are well-known risks for all likely available draftees. safe money for me is goddard - 14 years of solid, dependable athletic CHB don't come around very often. risk reward seems to be wright - a 203cm, 100kg St. Nick.

 

[Mutt]

This is the issue and the risk. It's why I expect him to slip. He would be a great pick up with later first rounder though. But with a top 6 or 7 pick you have to go for best available.....it's a massive call for the club if he slips and we pass, imagine if he then becomes the forward we would die for and we passed.....

Yep. Club staff are always on a hiding to nothing. Not an easy job being publicly ridiculed and humiliated if you make a mistake, or even if you make a good decision but not the best possible decision you could have made (eg drafting Griffen instead of Franklin.)

 

[goodcop badcop]

lol....why is his arm span a concern?

Recruiter: "we really like little jonny, he's knocks up getting the ball he's clearly the best and most skillful player in the TAC but unfortunately his arm span test were in the bottom 20% and we won't be recruiting him. Most games are won and lost on arm span efficiency these days."

I think we should get rid of Talia and Roberts before it become obvious they don't have arm span.

The extra length the arms have mean the defender can spoil with extra reach. Talia's arm length was listed at 79cm while the top reading was 91cm. That extra 10cm can make a difference and coupled with he doesn't have a great leap meaning he's probably going to struggle on the bigger guys like Danniher, Boyd etc who have about a 10cm extra reach on Talia.

Good summary. I agree on wright, could slip and I'm not even sure now that we'll take him. My gut says we really want Lever, just reading between the lines of the interviews I have heard from him and the club.

I wasn't as impressed by Durdin as you are and if we can't get one of the Lever, McCartin or Wright then I'd take Laverde. I reckon we can get Wright if we want him though. I have a feeling he will be really good or a bust. He's likely to be one of those players who doesn't quite find the best position to play.

I'm not sure I do rate Durdin that highly. I rate his potential highly, but he really hasn't shown a lot this year and he's been mostly played as the No 1 ruck (a position he's not going to play at the next level). He's going to take a while and I feel like he will frustrate supporters for years like Lachie Hansen has, before (or if) he comes good. I'm not sure we will pick him if available. Is he a McCartney/Dalrymple pick? I'm not sure he is.

My money is on Lever being available and we will go with him.

for those in the know - how does the CHF version of wright compare to matt kreuzer playing forward?

Wright's smarter on the lead, Kreuzer is possibly a little bit better at ground level. Wright has a lot more ability to kick goals IMO as well. He can have purple patches where he kicks 3 or 4 goals in a qtr. He kicked 6 goals against Cordy in a half.

 

[Wocka]

It will depend on his arm span tests I believe.

Walking past the Whitten Oval the other day and found this.

2014 WESTERN BULLDOG TRADE WEEK DRAFTING CONSIDERATIONS

Arm span - LONG or SHORT
Mouth breathers - YES or NO.

Each player should be assessed in one of four categories.

Arm span LONG and mouth breather NO - Mythical Beast not seen at the Whitten Oval since it was named Western Oval - RECRUIT AT ALL COSTS
Arm span SHORT and mouth breather NO - Possibly an inside mid - RECRUIT IF BEST AVAILABLE
Arm span LONG and mouth breather YES - It may be Heritier Lumumba - refer him to Paul Roos. If it's eating a banana, it's a chimpanzee - DO NOT RECRUIT
Arm span SHORT and mouth breather YES - If it's eating a banana, it's a in-bred chimpanzee - SHOOT. If it's wearing a Norf jumper, Boomer Harvey has wandered in - SHOOT TWICE.

 

[Mofra]

lol....why is his arm span a concern?

Recruiter: "we really like little jonny, he's knocks up getting the ball he's clearly the best and most skillful player in the TAC but unfortunately his arm span test were in the bottom 20% and we won't be recruiting him. Most games are won and lost on arm span efficiency these days."

I think we should get rid of Talia and Roberts before it become obvious they don't have arm span.

As an aside, isn't this why Daniel Rich slipped from a top 3 lock to a pick 7 and going to Brisbane?
I think they called him T-Rex around the club for his first season!

 

[TempleKelvington]

As an aside, isn't this why Daniel Rich slipped from a top 3 lock to a pick 7 and going to Brisbane?
I think they called him T-Rex around the club for his first season!

Yeah there are so many examples. For me, you want guys that just love getting the footy, love the contest, hate to lose. They want the ball in their hands, they want to take that set shot for goal.

The really good ones have all that plus once they get the ball they can use it well. I don't care if he's 4ft tall or 7ft, has a massive hand span, a long neck and short body all I want is guys who will almost kill to win and if they can use it well then they are super stars.

Caleb Daniel seems to me to be exactly that. He's have the wing span of a Bee.

 

[GreatSouthWest]

Yeah there are so many examples. For me, you want guys that just love getting the footy, love the contest, hate to lose. They want the ball in their hands, they want to take that set shot for goal.

The really good ones have all that plus once they get the ball they can use it well. I don't care if he's 4ft tall or 7ft, has a massive hand span, a long neck and short body all I want is guys who will almost kill to win and if they can use it well then they are super stars.

Caleb Daniel seems to me to be exactly that. He's have the wing span of a Bee.

Hopefully he gets drafted and starts a new dwarf throwing craze.