2014 Draft Prospect Thread

[TradeDraft]

But they need to get ruck time to develop, hide one in the forward line a tall forward pocket and they will not develop as a ruck

True but going how the Game is going, Ruckman has to learn to play up Forward as well

 

[Seedsfan]

True but going how the Game is going, Ruckman has to learn to play up Forward as well

They do but first and foremost has to be to learn how to ruck, also we had 6 a couple of years ago and we had to move on 3

 

[TradeDraft]

They do but first and foremost has to be to learn how to ruck, also we had 6 a couple of years ago and we had to move on 3

Well Mason Cox would take awhile to come on so they might hold him back from the Ruck until he gets bigger

 

[Seedsfan]

Well Mason Cox would take awhile to come on so they might hold him back from the Ruck until he gets bigger

He won't do any better in the forward line when he is that skinny needs to bulk up to play either position

 

[TradeDraft]

He won't do any better in the forward line when he is that skinny needs to bulk up to play either position

So then keep him off the Field for a Year?

 

[jjsmitty8]

What ever happened to Elijah Edwards? (I think that was his name!?).

Apparently he was Cyril-esque.

 

[TradeDraft]

What ever happened to Elijah Edwards? (I think that was his name!?).

Apparently he was Cyril-esque.

Never Grew - Has Duck Disease

 

[Seedsfan]

So then keep him off the Field for a Year?

He is not going to learn the game that way, someone like Cox would't be bad to play him in VFL 2's we just don't have a side

 

[TradeDraft]

He is not going to learn the game that way, someone like Cox would't be bad to play him in VFL 2's we just don't have a side

Good Point and would be better if we sent to a Amateur Club 1st, Like we did with Keeffe

 

[Knightmare]

Not sure about 2 rucks on the rookie list, plus the more experienced back up we will have to meany rucks in the side a it will not be good for their development

My assumption is Grundy and Witts are the 1/2 punch in the 1s. If one misses White can come in and play the no.2 ruck role.

If Ben Hudson plays on beyond this year that's a bonus. If not with no clear veteran/mid career type no assumptions can be made. If someone does become available that's when you reconsider and re-assess whether they're an appropriate option.

Darcy Cameron is already a handy state leaguer and will continue his development - the advantage with him is that he can also play forward. Cox if he comes to Collingwood wouldn't play every week and would probably be used as needed at VFL level.

4-5 ruckmen is an ideal ruck situation and I would say with confidence it's not too tall with all capable up forward (Grundy/Witts/Hudson) with Cameron also capable in the front half.


My assumption is at seasons end Lynch and Hudson retire and Gault is delisted so adding Moore, Marchbank as an example of a key defender then Cameron and Cox as a ruckman who wouldn't play every week. It's pretty much replacing the height lost. So I'm not buying that my proposed draft template is too tall. I'd say with confidence it's the right balance with:

Ruck:
Grundy
Witts
D.Cameron (developing)
M.Cox (developing)

KPF:
Cloke
Reid
White (depth - as key forward and ruck coverage)
Marsh (developing)
Moore (developing)

KPD:
Frost
Keeffe
Brown (depth - key defence coverage)
Marchbank (developing)

 

[Seedsfan]

My assumption is Grundy and Witts are the 1/2 punch in the 1s. If one misses White can come in and play the no.2 ruck role.

If Ben Hudson plays on beyond this year that's a bonus. If not with no clear veteran/mid career type no assumptions can be made. If someone does become available that's when you reconsider and re-assess whether they're an appropriate option.

Darcy Cameron is already a handy state leaguer and will continue his development - the advantage with him is that he can also play forward. Cox if he comes to Collingwood wouldn't play every week and would probably be used as needed at VFL level.

4-5 ruckmen is an ideal ruck situation and I would say with confidence it's not too tall with all capable up forward (Grundy/Witts/Hudson) with Cameron also capable in the front half.


My assumption is at seasons end Lynch and Hudson retire and Gault is delisted so adding Moore, Marchbank as an example of a key defender then Cameron and Cox as a ruckman who wouldn't play every week. It's pretty much replacing the height lost. So I'm not buying that my proposed draft template is too tall. I'd say with confidence it's the right balance with:

Ruck:
Grundy
Witts
D.Cameron (developing)
M.Cox (developing)

KPF:
Cloke
Reid
White (depth - as key forward and ruck coverage)
Marsh (developing)
Moore (developing)

KPD:
Frost
Keeffe
Brown (depth - key defence coverage)
Marchbank (developing)

I think Hudson will have another year Lynch will go would like to see Gualt get another chance. But if your hypothetical happens then we would be supper light on for ruck or do you see Cameron as being able to play the Hudson back up role?

 

[TradeDraft]

I think Hudson will have another year Lynch will go would like to see Gualt get another chance. But if your hypothetical happens then we would be supper light on for ruck or do you see Cameron as being able to play the Hudson back up role?

I would only Keep Gault on Rookie List if he stays as a KFF

 

[Seedsfan]

Good Point and would be better if we sent to a Amateur Club 1st, Like we did with Keeffe

Never knew we did that, how meany years ago was that

 

[TradeDraft]

Never knew we did that, how meany years ago was that

Think he Started in the Amateurs and during that time went to play in the U-18 Champs for QLD and then shortly after that went to the VFL Side

 

[Knightmare]

I think Hudson will have another year Lynch will go would like to see Gualt get another chance. But if your hypothetical happens then we would be supper light on for ruck or do you see Cameron as being able to play the Hudson back up role?

White would be the guy who can come into the ruck and it would just mean if one of Grundy/Witts were to miss a game or a stretch of games they play greater ruck minutes with White playing more a relieving ruck role.

Cameron is still a developing young player. He's playing very well at state league level for a young ruckman and with so few good ruckmen in the VFL he'll go well there too. I like his long term potential to become AFL relevant but I wouldn't want to play him in his first year.

It's more a case of name a guy playing at any level at any age who is better. Seaby? Perhaps but does he want to move to Victoria only to go onto a rookie list? Maybe but I'm not convinced. If there was a 30 year old Ben Hudson running around. You'd take that as pairing a veteran with youth is the optimal solution. And if Hudson is ok with playing on you'd keep him another year and still add a Darcy Cameron as an extra young developing guy as the fourth option in the depth charts.

 

[Seedsfan]

White would be the guy who can come into the ruck and it would just mean if one of Grundy/Witts were to miss a game or a stretch of games they play greater ruck minutes with White playing more a relieving ruck role.

Cameron is still a developing young player. He's playing very well at state league level for a young ruckman and with so few good ruckmen in the VFL he'll go well there too. I like his long term potential to become AFL relevant but I wouldn't want to play him in his first year.

It's more a case of name a guy playing at any level at any age who is better. Seaby? Perhaps but does he want to move to Victoria only to go onto a rookie list? Maybe but I'm not convinced. If there was a 30 year old Ben Hudson running around. You'd take that as pairing a veteran with youth is the optimal solution. And if Hudson is ok with playing on you'd keep him another year and still add a Darcy Cameron as an extra young developing guy as the fourth option in the depth charts.

I can see adding one ruck to the list but not two, if Hudson goes I would like to see another man who could play the number one ruck role in our side

 

[Rorzza]

White would be the guy who can come into the ruck and it would just mean if one of Grundy/Witts were to miss a game or a stretch of games they play greater ruck minutes with White playing more a relieving ruck role.

Cameron is still a developing young player. He's playing very well at state league level for a young ruckman and with so few good ruckmen in the VFL he'll go well there too. I like his long term potential to become AFL relevant but I wouldn't want to play him in his first year.

It's more a case of name a guy playing at any level at any age who is better. Seaby? Perhaps but does he want to move to Victoria only to go onto a rookie list? Maybe but I'm not convinced. If there was a 30 year old Ben Hudson running around. You'd take that as pairing a veteran with youth is the optimal solution. And if Hudson is ok with playing on you'd keep him another year and still add a Darcy Cameron as an extra young developing guy as the fourth option in the depth charts.

Hello Mr Knightmare,

I find Collingwood’s Mason Cox interest baffling, obvious physical qualities astounding but at 23/24 before he starts training, does anyone think he will get a senior gig next year or the year after? Let’s say 3 years developing and then he would have to play better than Grundy/ Witts before he gets a shot. Both Grundy and Witts in three years’ time will be 23/24 and playing at the top of their game. Cox will be 26/27 and if he is good enough might play 3 or 4 seasons, is it worth it?

Cameron Conlon (198cm 03/07/1995) – where is he at with his injuries, is he another ruck/high forward prospect worth the punt developing on the rookie list??????? Wouldn’t he be a better option than Cox seeing that he has real proven talent playing our game? I also understand that he supports Collingwood and lives in Melbourne. Cox or Conlon? Conlon every day of the week!!!!!!!!!!

Does Collingwood rate big Witts, I ask because I do not believe that our list needs two 210cm (approx.) developing ruckmen? Is Collingwood developing Witts as trade bait, he might be attractive to GWS coming from NSW? What would we get for Witts and say a Blair or Fasolo type player as a package during trade period, enough for a power forward? Can you trade players that are under contract during the trade period too other clubs?

 

[regrundies]

Off:

Ball Ret
Maxwell Ret
Lynch Ret
Hudson Ret
Clarke Del
Armstrong Del
Gault Del
Yagmoor Del

Trade Bait: Lumumba Goldsack

Free agents: Frawley Mundy

On:
Moore

 

[Rorzza]

White would be the guy who can come into the ruck and it would just mean if one of Grundy/Witts were to miss a game or a stretch of games they play greater ruck minutes with White playing more a relieving ruck role.

Cameron is still a developing young player. He's playing very well at state league level for a young ruckman and with so few good ruckmen in the VFL he'll go well there too. I like his long term potential to become AFL relevant but I wouldn't want to play him in his first year.

It's more a case of name a guy playing at any level at any age who is better. Seaby? Perhaps but does he want to move to Victoria only to go onto a rookie list? Maybe but I'm not convinced. If there was a 30 year old Ben Hudson running around. You'd take that as pairing a veteran with youth is the optimal solution. And if Hudson is ok with playing on you'd keep him another year and still add a Darcy Cameron as an extra young developing guy as the fourth option in the depth charts.

Had a quick look at Darcy Cameron’s highlight package in AFL draft hub, he looks good. Looks extremely agile for a 203cm youngster. Can mark and kick, excellent developing ruckman prospect!

 

[TradeDraft]

Had a quick look at Darcy Cameron’s highlight package in AFL draft hub, he looks good. Looks extremely agile for a 203cm youngster. Can mark and kick, excellent developing ruckman prospect!

Video Highlight that I Uploaded:

 

[soreplums]

Cox commits to magpies

 

[blaze036]

Cox commits to magpies

Can he play VFL later this year?

 

[Knightmare]

Hello Mr Knightmare,

I find Collingwood’s Mason Cox interest baffling, obvious physical qualities astounding but at 23/24 before he starts training, does anyone think he will get a senior gig next year or the year after? Let’s say 3 years developing and then he would have to play better than Grundy/ Witts before he gets a shot. Both Grundy and Witts in three years’ time will be 23/24 and playing at the top of their game. Cox will be 26/27 and if he is good enough might play 3 or 4 seasons, is it worth it?

Cameron Conlon (198cm 03/07/1995) – where is he at with his injuries, is he another ruck/high forward prospect worth the punt developing on the rookie list??????? Wouldn’t he be a better option than Cox seeing that he has real proven talent playing our game? I also understand that he supports Collingwood and lives in Melbourne. Cox or Conlon? Conlon every day of the week!!!!!!!!!!

Does Collingwood rate big Witts, I ask because I do not believe that our list needs two 210cm (approx.) developing ruckmen? Is Collingwood developing Witts as trade bait, he might be attractive to GWS coming from NSW? What would we get for Witts and say a Blair or Fasolo type player as a package during trade period, enough for a power forward? Can you trade players that are under contract during the trade period too other clubs?

It's a good question Rorzza.

Keep in mind though Mike Pyke. He's 30 now (born in 1984). He came into the competition older than Mason Cox, starting his career in 2009. He's become a very handy playing and isn't nearly 211cm. So it's not entirely out of the question to come in so late and potentially make the grade with the ruck as with positions down back requiring relatively less footballing talent than with midfielders or forwards.

The other advantage with Cox relatively speaking is unlike if we were to pick up any other ruckman they're taking up a list spot, take Cox and he doesn't take up so much as a conventional rookie position.

Conlon is an interesting one to talk about. Keep in mind though he hasn't played since June 2012 and is continuing to have injury setbacks that are keeping him off the field. If you're looking at him you may as well retain Gault for another year who is probably a slightly better version and further progressed.
In 2012 Conlon particularly in his first two games of the season showed some encouraging signs but otherwise there are others looking more promising. Darcy Cameron is someone at the same age who I would prefer. If looking for someone who is more a forward at that height Cameron Loersch as another overager like Cameron and Conlon I'd also rate ahead of Conlon.

On where Conlon is at the hope is perhaps late season we get to see him but he's still getting healthy so until we see him again he's difficult to judge.

Collingwood rate Witts. He's playing as a regular now along with Grundy. They'll long term be our ruck combination. He's not trade bait and wouldn't be unless he attracted one of GWS' big three key forwards - Cameron, Patton or Boyd. So from here on in it's about finding the best ruck depth we can without trading or using a high draft selection for them. If we can find a veteran like Ben Hudson who is happy to be rookie listed that would be a perfect outcome but few veterans are willing, available or capable of playing which is the issue and why all options need to be explored in solving our what may at seasons end be ruck depth issues.

You can trade players under contract but ultimately it's up to the player to say yes/no. If they say no then they're not going anywhere.
Chris Dawes is an example of this happening. We traded him to Melbourne while contracted. That happened because Nathan told him to paraphrase that he has no future at the club and that we'd be looking for an alternative key forward to pair with Cloke.
It's just unusual while contracted for players to be traded with this one of the unusual cases.

If we want a power key forward Witts and a small isn't doing it. To get a Patton/Boyd we'd need to add Elliott and Frost to the deal for them to start talking.

Witts and Blair as an example might only be good for Tyrone Vickery which obviously is no good at all with clubs reluctant to trade their key forwards as that "most prized" asset on lists with good key forwards the hardest of all to find.

 

[Knightmare]

Cox commits to magpies

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-05-30/cox-commits-to-magpies

Great outcome!

Doesn't necessarily solve our ruck depth problems in the short term but as the tallest guy ever to feature on an AFL list and with his athleticism for a free shot - not taking up a list position. Sure.

 

[kelvarnsen]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-05-31/draft-prospect-runs-amok-in-win-over-wa