List Mgmt. 2014 Draft Trade FA Megathread

[aussierulesrules]

Boyd's issue in the NEAFL isn't so much underperforming, though I am not sure how you measure that, big guys do take time and the dude is a mountain..
His output is diluted by the fact that he is sharing fwd time with three trainee rucks, plus McCarthy, plus Lamb and at least 2 other small fwds.

When he has played AFL his delivery has been, questionable.

I know it generally takes time, but I was comparing him with Hogan, who you brought up, who at just 18yo and similarly "mountainish" won the B&F at Casey last year and dominated in that much stronger competition, despite being that year younger when playing in that competition than Boyd is this year, playing in the far weaker NEAFL. At the same age, Boyd was dominating in the juniors, while Hogan was dominating in the VFL seniors, after they were both playing at the same level the year before, at the same age!

There is no way Boyd gets traded for pick 1.
In what world would that make sense, he was the most hyped pick 1 for ages.

Oh yeah and I forgot, lets not forget the main reason why Boyd was seen as the clear no.1 choice in his draft. Just a little thing called a mini draft, the year before, which took Jack Martin and said Jesse Hogan out of the 2013 draft pool. It would have been like this year's draft, if there was no Petracca, or Wright, for instance, making it possibly look like 1: McCartin, 2: daylight, 3: Some more daylight, 4: OK, who's next?

Jack Martin has been hyped up possibly even more than Boyd and could have easily gone at pick 1 had he been in that draft (as he usually would have been) and the club with pick 1 rated him higher, or been more keen on someone with his attributes, and then there is Hogan, who looks to be at least as good as Boyd (in a similar role), as mentioned.

Had those two been in the mix as they usually would have been, Boyd could have easily enough been taken as low as pick 3, depending on circumstances and who had which picks. In which case, trading him for pick 1 this year wouldn't have been much different to GWS trading Dom Tyson last year (who they got at pick 3, two years prior) so that they could get pick 2 and Kelly, who they evidently preferred.

It is unlikely to happen, especially this year, while he's still contracted, but stranger things have happened in life, that's for sure. It's just something to talk about as we wait for the trade and draft period though, so there's no great need for anyone to get too excited about it, or write a post in all capital letters, if they don't agree with it!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Sheeesh there is crap going on here.
People are still rating Boyd as one of the best young forwards, but now a year after the draft when everyone here would have sold their children to get such a sure thing, he's suddenly worth less than pick one even though people are bagging the players likely to go at pick one.

I'm glad we have a professional drafting unit at the Saints and you lot aren't involved.
( PS GWS would not give away Boyd for less than he cost them, after one year ).

 

[Determinant]

I know it generally takes time, but I was comparing him with Hogan, who you brought up, who at just 18yo and similarly "mountainish" won the B&F at Casey last year and dominated in that much stronger competition, despite being that year younger when playing in that competition than Boyd is this year, playing in the far weaker NEAFL. At the same age, Boyd was dominating in the juniors, while Hogan was dominating in the VFL seniors, after they were both playing at the same level the year before, at the same age! Oh yeah and I forgot, lets not forget the main reason why Boyd was seen as the clear no.1 choice in his draft. Just a little thing called a mini draft, the year before, which took Jack Martin and said Jesse Hogan out of the 2013 draft pool. It would have been like this year's draft, if there was no Petracca, or Wright, for instance, making it possibly look like 1: McCartin, 2: daylight, 3: Some more daylight, 4: OK, who's next?

Jack Martin has been hyped up possibly even more than Boyd and could have easily gone at pick 1 had he been in that draft (as he usually would have been) and the club with pick 1 rated him higher, or been more keen on someone with his attributes, and then there is Hogan, who looks to be at least as good as Boyd (in a similar role), as mentioned.

Had those two been in the mix as they usually would have been, Boyd could have easily enough been taken as low as pick 3, depending on circumstances and who had which picks. In which case, trading him for pick 1 this year wouldn't have been much different to GWS trading Dom Tyson last year (who they got at pick 3, two years prior) so that they could get pick 2 and Kelly, who they evidently preferred.

It is unlikely to happen, especially this year, while he's still contracted, but stranger things have happened in life, that's for sure. It's just something to talk about as we wait for the trade and draft period though, so there's no great need for anyone to get too excited about it, or write a post in all capital letters, if they don't agree with it!

I brought them up as representative of their value to their club, not for direct comparison between their skill or value, though on that score, at least Boyd has found his way to an AFL ground.

At the end of the day, no club is likely to be able to buy last years pick 1, with pick 1, and I think that's especially true in this case, were he on the table for some obscure reason there would be a bidding war, it's unlikely to stop at pick 1.

I've said it before, if one of them goes I obviously want them to go to the saints, but Boyd for pick 1 is, as someone intimated before, fantasy.

 

[Determinant]

Sheeesh there is crap going on here.
People are still rating Boyd as one of the best young forwards, but now a year after the draft when everyone here would have sold their children to get such a sure thing, he's suddenly worth less than pick one even though people are bagging the players likely to go at pick one.

I'm glad we have a professional drafting unit at the Saints and you lot aren't involved.
( PS GWS would not give away Boyd for less than he cost them, after one year ).

Yup, that's my point..

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

Lol jus reading through the radical last few pages.
It really is silly season in bigfootyville isnt it.

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

Lol jus reading through the radical last few pages.
It really is silly season in bigfootyville isnt it.

 

[Highlander35]

How about:

Geary to Geelong for their first Rounder
Shenton to Carlton for their first Rounder
Stanley to Port for their First Rounder
Armitage to Brisbane for their first Rounder
Gwilt to Melbourne for their first rounder
Minchington to Collingwood for their First Rounder
Pierce to Fremantle for their first rounder.
Dunell to Essendon for their first rounder
Our Second rounder to GWS for Jaksch, JOR, and 2 of Boyd, Patton and Cameron

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Lol jus reading through the radical last few pages.
It really is silly season in bigfootyville isnt it.

Are you trying to get in on the act?
Are you trying to get in on the act?

 

[Periphery]

Delist the whole team. Burn Seaford to the ground.

 

[Kilroy]

Lol jus reading through the radical last few pages.
It really is silly season in bigfootyville isnt it.

Two posts to say the same thing? Isn't that like cracking a walnut with a sledgehammer?
Silly season indeed.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Sheeesh there is crap going on here.
People are still rating Boyd as one of the best young forwards, but now a year after the draft when everyone here would have sold their children to get such a sure thing, he's suddenly worth less than pick one even though people are bagging the players likely to go at pick one.

I'm glad we have a professional drafting unit at the Saints and you lot aren't involved.

I guess that is largely aimed at me. I'm very glad to have you here to put me in my place then. Thank you so much. You are so wise.

Wait a minute though, doesn't that all depend on whether those who are "saying he's worth less than pick 1" are also those "bagging the players likely to go at pick 1", not to mention how he has gone in the year since "everyone" supposedly would have "sold their children to get such a sure thing"?

Or are you like some others on here who frequently say that "everyone" is saying something, when only a certain percentage of those on here are saying that particular thing (and plenty of others oppose it) and as such try to lump everyone (except for themselves of course, who are obviously the only sane ones, amongst all the madness) into that same opinion? Which would of course mean that you too are responsible for posting "crap", making you no different to or better than them.

Because I for one really rate Petracca, for one, hence saying recently that he reminded me of Hodge, who went at pick 1 in the strongest draft ever and I also reckon Wright could be anything, and I also didn't say that I thought Boyd was worth less than pick 1 per say, I was saying that because we may have to pay him hundreds of thousands of dollars more per year than whoever we might otherwise pick at 1 this year, that he may not be worth trading pick 1 for, in a straight swap. It doesn't mean that he is not worth pick 1 if all it comes down to is who is better, but that 's not all that comes into it, unless he'd be prepared to move to another club for the base salary (which I'm going to suggest he wouldn't be).

Boyd on perhaps $400K PA or more for probably the next 4 years and then more from then on, if successful v say McCartin or Petracca on less than $100K PA for two years and then probably less than Boyd for the next few years after that would give a club plenty to think about and as such they may think that he is not worth trading pick 1 for. Because you not only get him, but also his huge salary.

Again, there is also the fact that Boyd would have just been one of 3 who were rated around the same mark last year, had it not been for the mini draft the year before, so whether you like it or not, that is also a factor. It doesn't mean that no-one wants him, or that he's suddenly no good, or any rubbish like that, but it's a fact that he went at pick 1 in compromised draft and that he hasn't exactly set the world on fire this year, so both of those things (especially the latter), on top of how much money he'd cost to get to their club and who is in this year's draft, would come into it, in the unlikely event that he was offered to a club in a trade.

What anyone on here thinks of anyone like McCartin and whether he's any good or not also means diddly squat, because it may be that our club reckons that he's more than adequate, when compared to someone like Boyd and as such may again only be willing to give up pick 1 if it meant that we got more than Boyd, especially as he'd likely come with a big price tag.

If you know for a fact that we rate Boyd higher than everyone in this year's draft pool though and that we'd be willing to also pay him much more than whoever we would otherwise take if we kept the pick, then fair enough, but you haven't said that that is the case.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Lets spend a million dollars to draft some rugby player who doesn't drink his own urine and "get friendly" with dogs. It would really help promote our club, and we could sack richo and get Kev Sheedy.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Lol jus reading through the radical last few pages.
It really is silly season in bigfootyville isnt it.

Yes well, many on here mocked me when I started to suggest around this time last year that it might be well worth trading Ben McEvoy and yet I didn't see too many continuing to do so when we eventually did so and got pick 18, Savage and an upgraded 2nd rounder as well for him and then grabbed Longer on the cheap, so bring the mocking on. Anything can happen.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Delist the whole team. Burn Seaford to the ground.

I was gonna press like but with our luck it just might happen so ill give you a instead.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I guess that is largely aimed at me. I'm very glad to have you here to put me in my place then. Thank you so much. You are so wise.

Wait a minute though, doesn't that all depend on whether those who are "saying he's worth less than pick 1" are also those "bagging the players likely to go at pick 1", not to mention how he has gone in the year since "everyone" supposedly would have "sold their children to get such a sure thing"?

Or are you like some others on here who frequently say that "everyone" is saying something, when only a certain percentage of those on here are saying that particular thing (and plenty of others oppose it) and as such try to lump everyone (except for themselves of course, who are obviously the only sane ones, amongst all the madness) into that same opinion? Which would of course mean that you too are responsible for posting "crap", making you no different to or better than them.

Because I for one really rate Petracca, for one, hence saying recently that he reminded me of Hodge, who went at pick 1 in the strongest draft ever and I also reckon Wright could be anything, and I also didn't say that I thought Boyd was worth less than pick 1 per say, I was saying that because we may have to pay him hundreds of thousands of dollars more per year than whoever we might otherwise pick at 1 this year, that he may not be worth trading pick 1 for, in a straight swap. It doesn't mean that he is not worth pick 1 if all it comes down to is who is better, but that 's not all that comes into it, unless he'd be prepared to move to another club for the base salary (which I'm going to suggest he wouldn't be).

Boyd on perhaps $400K PA or more for probably the next 4 years and then more from then on, if successful v say McCartin or Petracca on less than $100K PA for two years and then probably less than Boyd for the next few years after that would give a club plenty to think about and as such they may think that he is not worth trading pick 1 for. Because you not only get him, but also his huge salary.

Again, there is also the fact that Boyd would have just been one of 3 who were rated around the same mark last year, had it not been for the mini draft the year before, so whether you like it or not, that is also a factor. It doesn't mean that no-one wants him, or that he's suddenly no good, or any rubbish like that, but it's a fact that he went at pick 1 in compromised draft and that he hasn't exactly set the world on fire this year, so both of those things (especially the latter), on top of how much money he'd cost to get to their club and who is in this year's draft, would come into it, in the unlikely event that he was offered to a club in a trade.

What anyone on here thinks of anyone like McCartin and whether he's any good or not also means diddly squat, because it may be that our club reckons that he's more than adequate, when compared to someone like Boyd and as such may again only be willing to give up pick 1 if it meant that we got more than Boyd, especially as he'd likely come with a big price tag.

If you know for a fact that we rate Boyd higher than everyone in this year's draft pool though and that we'd be willing to also pay him much more than whoever we would otherwise take if we kept the pick, then fair enough, but you haven't said that that is the case.

You really rate Petracca. Who did you really rate a year ago? It just seems that every time there is a draft, all the prospects are supposedly better than all the guys in last year's draft, until a year later.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

Nice work ARR. Too many playing the man in a trade thread that of course includes hypotheticals!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Yes well, many on here mocked me when I started to suggest around this time last year that it might be well worth trading Ben McEvoy and yet I didn't see too many continuing to do so when we eventually did so and got pick 18, Savage and an upgraded 2nd rounder as well for him and then grabbed Longer on the cheap, so bring the mocking on. Anything can happen.

FWIW I was on the McEvoy trade. Too many people think you only trade players who a) you don't like , b) can't play.
I maintain you need to give up something good to get something. Getting the "right" trade is what's important.

 

[aussierulesrules]

You really rate Petracca. Who did you really rate a year ago? It just seems that every time there is a draft, all the prospects are supposedly better than all the guys in last year's draft, until a year later.

Please forgive me for not being perfect. I eagerly await your advice on to be so. I'm sure it will be right up there with your "everyone says such and such" post, when it's far from the case, or your complete misunderstanding of my previous post.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Lets not get shitty with each other on the trade thread.
When your a crap team the only excitement you get is talking about who you might get in the future. Don't make the trade thread crap as well

 

[Sheeza69]

I honestly believe GWS would currently see him as untradeable.
And despite constant perhaps hopeful rumours to the contrary he is pretty relaxed about Sydney, he and Josh Kelly practically live at the Lamberts..

Ask GC what JOM is worth... Or Melb about Hogan. It's the same question, with probably the same answer

Josh Kelly extended his contract earlier this year, unlike Boyd who is only committed for next year..
Patton & Cameron also have one year left, with the Dees showing significant interest of late in Cameron who is blushing..Surely the club have offered the trio contract extensions, without one yet to re-sign..Cameron is talking in Chinese whispers, because in an interview just over a week ago he was likely to re-sign..
As ARR just reminded us, Boyd's was about pick 3 in real draft terms, so Jaksch will have to packaged up with Boyd to get the deal done..
Unlike GWS, the Saints have got more space in our cap than we know what to do with it..

 

[Kilroy]

Yes well, many on here mocked me when I started to suggest around this time last year that it might be well worth trading Ben McEvoy and yet I didn't see too many continuing to do so when we eventually did so and got pick 18, Savage and an upgraded 2nd rounder as well for him and then grabbed Longer on the cheap, so bring the mocking on. Anything can happen.

Harsh call. Outrageous call.
Nice one, in hindsight.

 

[Sheeza69]

Lets not get shitty with each other on the trade thread.
When your a crap team the only excitement you get is talking about who you might get in the future. Don't make the trade thread crap as well

That's right.. For the Saint's supporters it's all we have left to look forward to, until we literally start raiding GWS of their talent..

 

[Defacto]

Yes well, many on here mocked me when I started to suggest around this time last year that it might be well worth trading Ben McEvoy and yet I didn't see too many continuing to do so when we eventually did so and got pick 18, Savage and an upgraded 2nd rounder as well for him and then grabbed Longer on the cheap, so bring the mocking on. Anything can happen.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Please forgive me for not being perfect. I eagerly await your advice on to be so. I'm sure it will be right up there with your "everyone says such and such" post, when it's far from the case, or your complete misunderstanding of my previous post.

Settle down ARR. You seem to be getting angry, and with that Lenny Hayes face looking at me while I read, I'm freaking out a bit.

I just don't think the Salary factors into it that much. If they don't spend it on Boyd they have to spend it on someone else. I think it sucks that there is such a narrow band between the Salary Cap minimum and maximum, but that's what it is.
With Lenny retiring who do we spend a chunk of cash on. Farren Ray? Dempster?

I'm actually dead set against giving the young players ( Including Boyd) too much too soon, it demotivates, and causes trouble down the track because no-one ever want's a pay cut.

 

[Determinant]

Josh Kelly extended his contract earlier this year, unlike Boyd who is only committed for next year..
Patton & Cameron also have one year left, with the Dees showing significant interest of late in Cameron who is blushing..Surely the club have offered the trio contract extensions, without one yet to re-sign..Cameron is talking in Chinese whispers, because in an interview just over a week ago he was likely to re-sign..
As ARR just reminded us, Boyd's was about pick 3 in real draft terms, so Jaksch will have to packaged up with Boyd to get the deal done..
Unlike GWS, the Saints we've got more space in our cap than we know what to do with it..

You have good weed